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Kevin Nolan

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Doug

Doug

Posted
Posted

Our two worst performances this season have occured with Nolan in the team.

Correct, that would be Blackpool and Stoke.

Also Tiote certainly does not need him alongside to play well. He certainly did not have a mare against Wigan whereas Perch and Williamson behind him did along with an off pace Guthrie and Barton on the day. This combined to make it hard for our "one man midfielder" who was only good instead of outstanding. To claim Nolans absence was the reason is beyond hilarious.

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polpolpol

polpolpol

Posted
Posted

Nolan's 'importance' is a symptom of a fundamental problem, namely our reliance on 'guaranteed' goals as the key to survival, rather trying to hone a system which focuses on the quality of possession and the creation of chances.

 

Selecting a player on the basis of his ability to pop up with a goal every other or third game (vast quantities of statistics evidence the otherwise inefficaciousness of his play) belies an attitude that the road to safety lies in a misguidedly conservative approach (hoping the past will repeat itself without considering the conditions which caused it). However:

 

1)It can go wrong: Selecting a team which statistically 'should get the job done' without any greater plan doesn't work (c.f. the relegation season), especially when you are carrying more than one of these players.

2)It lacks ambition. Nolan is never going to do more for us than score a few goals from inside the 18 yard box. Good players in the team should offer increasing benefits when combined with additional good players (i.e. all other players with skill off the ball will benefit from the ball being at the feet of a good player). In Nolan's case, he contributes nothing to play, and can only be considered a liability with the ball at his feet in the middle of the park (too slow, too negative with his passing).

3)It encourages unattractive football. Who would rather watch Bolton of Noaln's heyday than Coyle's current version?

 

 

Considering his captaincy, regardless of whatever short term gain he brings to the team, the long term damage he causes outweighs it. Having one of the 'old guard' as our figurehead delays the professionalization of the squad. The one thing Newcastle United desperately needs is a change in the attitudes of its staff. Application of North European-style sports science still offers improvements in the effectiveness of the team, but the truly significant contemporary revolution in football is the Mediterraneanization of player's personal lives. We are among the worst clubs in the Premier League in this respect. For almost two decades we've been acquiring young talent which is slowly squandered as it is introduced to our club culture. After frittering away their early twenties on the Quayside (or lately, on Osbourne Road, or the Diamond Strip) the sensible ones consider the position they are in in terms of their career, their longevity and their legacy, and move away. Those without ambition marry, move to Darras Hall, live the life at 50%, and enable the next generation to follow them.

 

(This is wildly drifting away from the topic of Nolan, but I think it is what he stands for, rather than what he does which causes the polarisation of attitudes towards him)

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tmonkey

tmonkey

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Posted

Thought he was poor yesterday, minus the goal. But then we know he's not really suited to central midfield duties anymore.

 

With Ben Arfa out of the picture, Routledge looking Championship standard so far, Lovenkrands being mediocre and Guthrie possibly being too average at this level, there's no real reason to drop him. Better to have someone getting a few goals here and there than to have a replacement in the side doing nothing at all for the team.

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Jayson

Jayson

Posted
Posted

People complain about the lack of goals in our team, then moan that one of the few that will get on the end of chances doesnt do enough else.

 

Some of you really need to get your heads around the idea, that perhaps we as a side dont have much better?

 

Just because it wont work everytime, doesnt mean it can be improved upon. It means you want it to be & nothing more.

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Stu

Stu

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Having one of the 'old guard' as our figurehead delays the professionalization of the squad. The one thing Newcastle United desperately needs is a change in the attitudes of its staff.

 

Nice post, except for the bit quoted above :facepalm: Kevin Nolan is the radical change in attitude from the 'old guard' - he's not one of them. For far too long we've had a collection of individuals, only brought together by the fact that the same company pays their wages. Nolan may not have embraced the 'European lifestyle' but he epitomises someone who is a TEAM player.

 

This is the point we've been alluding to/stating the obvious over the past couple of months.

 

No, Nolan isn't one of our 10 'best' players (on an individual study) but, for all of his glaring deficiencies, he has untangibles that go unnoticed by the majority. Which is why I find him worthy of a place in our team and definitely the club captain.

 

Long may he continue to score goals and shove two fingers up to the whingers.

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Stu

Stu

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If Lovenkrands was anything approaching mediocre, he'd be nailed-on to start.

 

:lol:

 

Just because there's nobody much better (the main alternative broke his leg as it happens) doesn't make Nolan immune from criticism. What a strange argument.

 

He certainly isn't, but he's also not worthy of being the 'poor result/performance scapegoat', it verges on the ridiculous at times. People almost seem to go out of their way to pooh-pooh his contributions.

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Jordan

Jordan

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Posted

His twitters quality

Andy just turned the TV on and Road Wars was on. Some long haired gypsy was getting nicked, he flicked straight over!

Might crack out the Prison Break box-set tonight, Andy might pick up a few tips. Only joking, more likely watch the Liverpool game

Some speculation that Andy did the graffiti on my garage door?! Out of the question though cos it was spelt correctly! Only kidding :-p

I'm currently winning Monopoly, Andy hasn't been to jail yet, but hasn't got any houses either. He did have one hotel.. ;-p just kidding!

:lol:

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Jayson

Jayson

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Posted

Just because there's nobody much better (the main alternative broke his leg as it happens) doesn't make Nolan immune from criticism. What a strange argument.

 

You taking my post to be arguing that players shouldnt be criticised is stranger really. I said it doesnt mean it can be improved upon, obviously some still think it can be. I dont much see solid reasoning behind that.

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Mick

Mick

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Posted

His twitters quality

Andy just turned the TV on and Road Wars was on. Some long haired gypsy was getting nicked, he flicked straight over!

Might crack out the Prison Break box-set tonight, Andy might pick up a few tips. Only joking, more likely watch the Liverpool game

Some speculation that Andy did the graffiti on my garage door?! Out of the question though cos it was spelt correctly! Only kidding :-p

I'm currently winning Monopoly, Andy hasn't been to jail yet, but hasn't got any houses either. He did have one hotel.. ;-p just kidding!

:lol:

 

:lol:

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Frazzle

Frazzle

Posted
Posted

post

 

I'm not Nolan's biggest fans but I've got to disagree with a lot of this.

 

Nolan's 'importance' is a symptom of a fundamental problem, namely our reliance on 'guaranteed' goals as the key to survival, rather trying to hone a system which focuses on the quality of possession and the creation of chances.

 

How are we relying on 'guaranteed' goals?  To get these 'guaranteed' goals (not entirely sure what these even means) you have to create chances.  Playing possession football is just one style and generally not suited to most players in our league.  Stoke have stayed up for 3(?) years now without playing possession football.  Our aim this season is just to stay up, let's just do that first of all.

 

Selecting a player on the basis of his ability to pop up with a goal every other or third game (vast quantities of statistics evidence the otherwise inefficaciousness of his play) belies an attitude that the road to safety lies in a misguidedly conservative approach (hoping the past will repeat itself without considering the conditions which caused it).

 

It's a bit shortsighted to say Nolan only contributes a goal every other of every three games (which is a quality statistic anyway!).  He keeps the ball for the most part, despite not being totally creative, only gave the ball anyway two times yesterday (and scored a goal).  Playing a conservative style is the way to go, Burnley went down going for the jugular, Hull as well and Blackpool will do the same.  If you haven't got the players you can't play that style of football.  If we keep getting 11 or so every 9 games with Nolan in the team I'd be pretty happy.

 

1)It can go wrong: Selecting a team which statistically 'should get the job done' without any greater plan doesn't work (c.f. the relegation season), especially when you are carrying more than one of these players.

2)It lacks ambition. Nolan is never going to do more for us than score a few goals from inside the 18 yard box. Good players in the team should offer increasing benefits when combined with additional good players (i.e. all other players with skill off the ball will benefit from the ball being at the feet of a good player). In Nolan's case, he contributes nothing to play, and can only be considered a liability with the ball at his feet in the middle of the park (too slow, too negative with his passing).

3)It encourages unattractive football. Who would rather watch Bolton of Noaln's heyday than Coyle's current version?

 

Again, our aim is to stay up and therefore out of the relegation zone, we're doing this at the moment, we do have a game plan (especially away from home) even isn't carpet football all the time.  As I mentioned above, only two misplaced passes against West Ham, less than Tiote.

 

I've never really watched Coyle's Bolton but Nolan's Bolton got into Europe I can't see Coyle's doing that.  One one hand you're talking about ambition and then saying you would settle for more attractive football.

 

I think Nolan is a really good captain and the best we've had in a while.  As Stu says he has improved the club by helping to cultivate a team spirit that has improved the current team and has seemingly helped new signings to bed in easily (I remember one interview where the players said they regularly go out for meals and bowling these days which they didn't before).  The team spirit seems amazing these days that's the third game this season we've came from behind to get a result.  To say Nolan is sending the club backwards in his captaincy is rubbish IMO.

 

Look at the most cosmopolitan squad in the PL, Arsenal.  Surely they would be the best example of the "Mediterraneanization" of a squad, doesn't stop Bendtner coming out of clubs with his pants down his ankles.  Spurs players always seem to be coming out of clubs drunk and have massive parties, they seem typically 'English' in that respect especially with someone like 'Arry, from the 'old guard' at the helm, didn't stop them making Europe though...

 

If Ben Arfa was fit I wouldn't have Nolan in the team but I think he's probably good enough for a team of our level (i.e. attempting to avoid relegation) and the stuff about being the wrong type of captain is, as I say, rubbish IMO.  I was sceptical about players last season saying the team spirit was amazing and thought it would be severely tested this season with us losing more games, doesn't seem to have been broken as easily as expected and Nolan is a massive part of that IMO.  If he gets Carroll on the straight and narrow we will have more to thank him for as well.

 

As I say, not the greatest player but I think 10 years down the line we'll be looking back at Nolan (and a few others) and praising him for playing a massive part in helping to turn the club around

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