Vinny Green Balls Posted May 10, 2013 Share Posted May 10, 2013 Clearly, the cleverest man in the thread is bimpy for bowing out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucaAltieri Posted May 10, 2013 Share Posted May 10, 2013 I remember having the same type of arguments with people on here when we got relegated. It wasn't about our manager so much as about how the club was being run. I argued that in principle Ashley was on the right path but the execution was flawed, but he was learning from his mistakes and getting better. Then too, I was shouted down about how obviously bad it was, how he was actively destroying the club, and that it was only going to get worse. We bounced back to the premier league, we've made some terrific signings under Ashley's transfer policy, we shot back into Europe again after having been out of those competitions for years, and for a brief moment there we were all happy again. He made another error in not recruiting well enough ahead of a longer season with European commitments, and mid-way through the season he appears to have learned his lesson again. All this applies to the Pardew situation too. It's easy to have a shit spell and start screaming to "get the fucker oot. Not good enough." But sometimes it takes a steady nerve to just stick with it, allow people to make their mistakes and learn from them, and improve in the long run. I don't think Pardew is a world beater or a tactical genius. But under our current setup our options are limited. Not many people want to work with Ashley and co. In terms of the harmony we've had recently between manager and board, I think Pardew has fit in well. At times we've played good football, at times we've played bad football. Sometimes it has been elegant, some times it has been shit. This last season, mostly shit. But they all know that too. Throwing it all out and starting again with unknown variables isn't the answer. The answer is to keep our heads again, keep on course, let's see where it takes us. We can always take action later if it all turns to shit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted May 10, 2013 Share Posted May 10, 2013 and hence why I said his track record was abysmal. On the verge of the abyss with this squad...there is no decent excuse out there for that. If we were comfortably mid-table, then maybe. But we are on match 37. There isn't. I'm not disputing it, either. The debate is over whether or not we'd make the right improvement to move forward, and some people's (including me) struggle to accept that this is what would absolutely happen. I can certainly see where you are coming from there, given that these fools employed JFK. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRD Posted May 10, 2013 Share Posted May 10, 2013 His admission of his failings may have just bought him some time next season. The interview has somehow put him in a better light. Some fans will buy into his sale pitch and there is a higher chance of Pardew being sacked by Ashley had he continued with blaming everything but himself. Need the crowd to turn against him during the Arsenal match but can't see it happening. Some people are already advocating giving him more time ('it's a start') based on him holding his hands up. To me he's a tumor that shouldn't be given time of the day that we will do well to remove immediately. Hope I'm wrong but sadly I think he's here to stay now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElDiablo Posted May 10, 2013 Share Posted May 10, 2013 I think Pardew deserves another crack at it. Even if you don't agree, it's still the most reasonable option in terms of our finances and our limited recruiting potential. I think this just perfectly encapsulates the downgrade in expectation Ashley has sought to cultivate. We shouldn't be as accepting of this situation, it's the owner's responsibility to improve the club in every possible way, including making the money available for situations like this, even if it comes from his personal wealth. That's what comes with committing to buying a football club. Football clubs aren't traditional businesses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted May 10, 2013 Share Posted May 10, 2013 stability is there to benefit the club. But it doesn't necessarily mean sticking with a dreadful manager for 8 seasons. That's the appearance of stability, a fucking phantasm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Some people seem to think it's a bad time for a new manager to come in for some reason. I'd say it's the perfect time. Pardew has set the bar so low that for an attack minded manager with a team of internationals, it would be impossible (I mean that in a very literal sense) to do a worse job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 We can always take action later if it all turns to shit. The Shepherd solution. Great. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Luca, it pretty much turned to shit. It reminds me of some people in Libya during the revolution saying, "Yes, Gaddafi is a monster, and he killed my uncle, but this country can't afford a revolution. We should just hope that things improve." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucaAltieri Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Luca, it pretty much turned to shit. It reminds me of some people in Libya during the revolution saying, "Yes, Gaddafi is a monster, and he killed my uncle, but this country can't afford a revolution. We should just hope that things improve." Totally the same thing and not at all offensive to anyone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 To my knowledge, Pardew has yet to kill anyone. This may change if Vurnon Anita is not spotted again any time soon. I understand the comparison, btw. Just a tad heavy handed is all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Canny harsh on Gaddafi that, like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucaAltieri Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 We can always take action later if it all turns to shit. The Shepherd solution. Great. I'd say sacking a manager that under performed without thought to stability was more the "Shepherd solution." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Putting off important decisions Making decisions based on fear What a terribly negative mindset some fans have. The same mindset as our woefully inept manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Colonel Pardaffi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 We can always take action later if it all turns to shit. The Shepherd solution. Great. I'd say sacking a manager that under performed without thought to stability was more the "Shepherd solution." No, the Shepherd solution was to carry the wrong man into a season and then sack him when it went to shit and write yet another season off, which is exactly what you're advocating. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 17th position with two games to go is the footballing definition of instability. We're said to have put our summer transfer plans on hold because we don't know what division we'll be playing in. That's stability apparently. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 I'd say sacking a manager that under performed without thought to stability was more the "Shepherd solution." Stability is no bastard good with a failing manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElDiablo Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Not to mention the players seem to have given up on him. If he stays I really can't see Cabaye or Coloccini staying, possibly add Ben Arfa to that too. All logical signs point to bringing someone new in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucaAltieri Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 17th position with two games to go is the footballing definition of instability. We're said to have put our summer transfer plans on hold because we don't know what division we'll be playing in. That's stability apparently. You're talking short term. I'm not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucaAltieri Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Not to mention the players seem to have given up on him. If he stays I really can't see Cabaye or Coloccini staying, possibly add Ben Arfa to that too. All logical signs point to bringing someone new in. Cabaye is battling depression, Colo has family issues and wants to be back in Argentina, and Ben Arfa is happy but crocked. Which of those things does a new manager change? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 The only reasons I ever see for keeping Pardew is "stability", "the players/board like him" and "Ashley can't appoint a good manager". I don't recall one person saying we'll actually improve on the pitch if he stays. That should be the first reason people give for him staying as that's the most important thing but alas... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucaAltieri Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 The only reasons I ever see for keeping Pardew is "stability", "the players/board like him" and "Ashley can't appoint a good manager". I don't recall one person saying we'll actually improve on the pitch if he stays. That should be the first reason people give for him staying as that's the most important thing but alas... Fair point. But... last season he was decent. The football was decent too. I know this season has been awful but none of us know which way next season would go under Pardew. We can't know. Since we can't know what kind of football we'll have until we're playing it, the only stuff that matters are the external factors like stability and relationships in the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 A few people have said, a few times, that, with the right investment in the summer and reduced fixtures next season, we could conceivably go on to have a similar season to last year. That'd be an improvement, for me. I'd be more than happy to have to endure another season like that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted May 11, 2013 Share Posted May 11, 2013 Fair point. But... last season he was decent. The football was decent too. I know this season has been awful but none of us know which way next season would go under Pardew. We can't know. Since we can't know what kind of football we'll have until we're playing it, the only stuff that matters are the external factors like stability and relationships in the club. The football was decent at times last season but he ditched what worked for us as soon as he could. The football was also shit at times last season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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