manchester united

[Froggy]

2 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

Is Capology right or not?

 

Certainly appears to be fairly accurate for us. It doesn't factor in the CL clause but the base salaries appear to be spot on.

 

Assuming it's entirely wrong for every other club though, depending on the argument.

[KaKa]

1 minute ago, Froggy said:

 

All things equal we win the race 9/10 times. Although I assume you mean equal with just wages.

 

It's not romanticism. We are still a big draw, especially for players in their mid 20's. They likely grew up with us dominating. 

 

If we had another 10 years like the last 10 then the appeal will have diminished even further, but as of now there are still few clubs with a bigger draw.

 

If players like Mbeumo didn't want to come to us, I don't think swapping 30k extra a week for playing CL football would be that much of a sacrifice.

 

Well, I disagree. So we'll leave it at that.

 

I think you were more willing to push the boat out for the pair of them and that's largely why they went for it IMO. Particularly as they are both 25 years old coming from smaller clubs, and so it's pretty much their last chance to land as big a contract as they can before they hit their 30s.

 

Delap is younger, and had interest from other clubs that were willing to offer him just as much as you did, and he opted to go elsewhere even with a clear starting spot available as your number 9, to supposedly lead you back to the glory years.

 

The reports were that he was concerned about the state of your team and uncertainty over the manger's position too.

And so the magical aura didn't work there, when the other offer he had was just as attractive.

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, Froggy said:

 

Certainly appears to be fairly accurate for us. It doesn't factor in the CL clause but the base salaries appear to be spot on.

 

Assuming it's entirely wrong for every other club though, depending on the argument.

Cool, so if that's the case KaKa's original post wasn't really bullshit then.

[Froggy]

1 minute ago, KaKa said:

Well, I disagree. So we'll leave it at that.

 

I think you were more willing to push the boat out for the pair of them and that's largely why they went for it IMO. Particularly as they are both 25 years old coming from smaller clubs, and so it's pretty much their last chance to land as big a contract as they can before they hit their 30s.

 

Delap is younger, and had interest from other clubs that were willing to offer him just as much as you did, and he opted to go elsewhere even with a clear starting spot available as your number 9, to supposedly lead you back to the glory years.

 

The reports were that he was concerned about the state of your team and uncertainty over the manger's position too.

And so the magical aura didn't work there, when the other offer he had was just as attractive.

 

I don't blame Delap at all. He's young, and he's probably seen what happened with Hojlund with the pressure of being our starting #9 when you're not ready for it.

 

Again though, Chelsea are a big draw themselves who also offer Champions League and of course the wages are a factor. The argument wasn't Chelsea vs. us.

[Froggy]

1 minute ago, Kid Icarus said:

Cool, so if that's the case KaKa's original post wasn't really bullshit then.

 

Literally the first three names on the list were wrong. It even had Cunha on there when he's not even signed for us yet.

 

So aye, it was a bit. 

[Displayname]

17 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

All things equal we win the race 9/10 times. Although I assume you mean equal with just wages.

 

It's not romanticism. We are still a big draw, especially for players in their mid 20's. They likely grew up with us dominating. 

 

If we had another 10 years like the last 10 then the appeal will have diminished even further, but as of now there are still few clubs with a bigger draw.

 

If players like Mbeumo didn't want to come to us, I don't think swapping 30k extra a week for playing CL football would be that much of a sacrifice.

You probably will have an extra appeal with players growing up being Man Utd fans, and there is alot of them i guess.

Heard that Ronaldo were Mbeumo's favorite player so might be something there.

[KaKa]

13 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

I don't blame Delap at all. He's young, and he's probably seen what happened with Hojlund with the pressure of being our starting #9 when you're not ready for it.

 

Again though, Chelsea are a big draw themselves who also offer Champions League and of course the wages are a factor. The argument wasn't Chelsea vs. us.

 

Let me make this as clear as possible, so you fully understand what I'm saying.

 

IMO if Newcastle, Spurs, Villa offer the package you did, and a spot in their first team, I highly doubt they join you instead.

 

You are out of Europe, you finished 15th, your PR off the pitch is terrible, your owners are "worse than Mike Ashley", there's holes in your roof, the stadium is rat infested, the staff are only allowed soup and bread on the premises, Rashford, Antony, Sancho and Garnacho are still moping around the place and killing the vibe, Onana is still clowning about in goal and no one is sure about your manager still.

 

This is not a sound career move. Unless the financial compensation is extremely attractive over the others.

 

 

 

Edited June 4 by KaKa

[Kid Icarus]

9 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

Literally the first three names on the list were wrong. It even had Cunha on there when he's not even signed for us yet.

 

So aye, it was a bit. 

Being at most 7% out from what you swear by doesn't strike me as bullshit like, you sure you didn't just dismiss it because it was The Sun, not knowing that Capology's figures pretty much match?

 

Not important like, Man United's wages are daft regardless.

[PRL]

23 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

Literally the first three names on the list were wrong. It even had Cunha on there when he's not even signed for us yet.

 

So aye, it was a bit. 

I thought you said yesterday that if you got rid of Rashford and Sancho you would be saving £150m over 5 years which would basically cover the fees and some wages for Cunha and Mbeumo? That would put them both on £300k per week. You quote the higher figures in one thread to justify huge outlay, then in another thread you say they’re bullshit and way too high, seemingly reframing in each topic to suit your chosen argument. 

 

 

Edited June 4 by PRL

[Froggy]

6 minutes ago, PRL said:

I thought you said yesterday that if you got rid of Rashford and Sancho you would be saving £150m over 5 years which would basically cover the fees and some wages for Cunha and Mbeumo? That would put them both on £300k per week. You quote the higher figures in one thread to justify huge outlay, then in another thread you say they’re bullshit and way too high, seemingly reframing in each topic to suit your chosen argument. 

 

Eh? I never said anything about Sancho's wage today and yes Rashford is on £300,00 a week. The image says £325,000, i.e. wrong. So yes, we'd be saving £150m over 5 years in the hypothetical scenario I gave yesterday (context is also required on that one), and yes the image shared by KaKa is wrong.

 

Hope that helps.

[Froggy]

29 minutes ago, Displayname said:

You probably will have an extra appeal with players growing up being Man Utd fans, and there is alot of them i guess.

Heard that Ronaldo were Mbeumo's favorite player so might be something there.

 

KaKa can probably confirm this as well, but we're very well supported in Africa. Not unlikely Mbeumo is a Man United fan.

[PRL]

So, using the Capology image with Sancho on £150k a week, that makes a total of £450k a week saving if both him and Rashford leave, making a total saving over 5 years of £118m, not even covering the fees of Cunha and Mbeumo, meaning your numbers yesterday were BS. 
 

Hope that helps

[Froggy]

Although he grew up in France so who knows.

[Froggy]

Just now, PRL said:

So, using the Capology image with Sancho on £150k a week, that makes a total of £450k a week saving if both him and Rashford leave, making a total saving over 5 years of £118m, not even covering the fees of Cunha and Mbeumo, meaning your numbers yesterday were BS. 
 

Hope that helps

 

Chelsea are currently paying half of Sancho's wages.

 

Hope that helps.

[SweMag]

1 hour ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

There's barely any difference

Some crazy wages on that list 

 

Sancho is on £250k/w + bonuses though, according to David Ornstein. Hoijlund is on 120k/w + bonuses according to reliable media in Denmark who’s close to Anders Hojlund (his father) and SEG.

[Froggy]

3 minutes ago, SweMag said:

Some crazy wages on that list 

 

Sancho is on £250k/w + bonuses though, according to David Ornstein. Hoijlund is on 120k/w + bonuses according to reliable media in Denmark who’s close to Anders Hojlund (his father) and SEG.

 

It was Ornstein and Laurie Whitwell who reported Hojlund's wage. Whitwell is Man United's most reliable reporter. 

[PRL]

2 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

Chelsea are currently paying half of Sancho's wages.

 

Hope that helps.

Okay great, this brings me back to the question I asked yesterday - let’s assume Rashford and Sancho don’t agree to move to Saudi, do you really think another team will pay a significant transfer fee and match wages for either player? Or are you going to have to reduce fee, subsidise wages or be stuck with them? If a 5 year commitment to each player is £75m and neither of them have shown anything to indicate they would be worth an investment close to that amount, I think the assumption you made of a £60m+ windfall for them both is some way off. 

[Kid Icarus]

7 minutes ago, SweMag said:

Some crazy wages on that list 

 

Sancho is on £250k/w + bonuses though, according to David Ornstein. Hoijlund is on 120k/w + bonuses according to reliable media in Denmark who’s close to Anders Hojlund (his father) and SEG.

Dare you question Capology?

[Froggy]

2 minutes ago, PRL said:

Okay great, this brings me back to the question I asked yesterday - let’s assume Rashford and Sancho don’t agree to move to Saudi, do you really think another team will pay a significant transfer fee and match wages for either player? Or are you going to have to reduce fee, subsidise wages or be stuck with them? If a 5 year commitment to each player is £75m and neither of them have shown anything to indicate they would be worth an investment close to that amount, I think the assumption you made of a £60m+ windfall for them both is some way off. 

 

They're not on five year contracts. The argument was hypothetical because people were guessing Mbeumo's wage and transfer fee before we've even opened talks. I included the wages of Lindelof, Evans and Eriksen into that conversation also.

 

I think £60m in transfer fees for Rashford and Sancho of them is realistic. Of course removing their wages entirely from the books will be a challenge. Well this is where our upper management have to prove their worth isn't it? 

[Lish007]

Don't think people can argue that man u are a big draw..they've won the league 20 times and had the most successful manager in history pretty much. Froggys right that if Man Utd dont stop the rot for the next 10 years, it might be a slightly different story in the future but then you can look to Liverpool who have clawed it back.

 

Its no slight on us that man u attract players still. We can get there too. We just need the years behind us to make our own successful history. We are slowly doing it but Rome wasn't built in a day. 

 

We can't look petty poo pooing other clubs successes. Makes us look small time! 

 

[The Prophet]

Capology is nonsense.

 

Both Stefan Borson and Kieran Maguire have Tweeted about it recently. The annual accounts pretty much debunk it alone.

[Froggy]

3 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

Dare you question Capology?

 

Kaizero also claimed to know agents in Scandinavia who had information about our club. It was incredibly wrong.

 

I'll trust our own reporters.

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, The Prophet said:

Capology is nonsense.

 

Both Stefan Borson and Kieran Maguire have Tweeted about it recently. The annual accounts pretty much debunk it alone.

Always has been.

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, Froggy said:

 

Kaizero also claimed to know agents in Scandinavia who had information about our club. It was incredibly wrong.

 

I'll trust our own reporters.

We know Capology is wrong Froggy, it's something everyone has been trying to tell you for a long time when you were citing it as gospel.  Glad that you've finally come around to see sense.

[PRL]

But they’ll want 5 year contracts on similar wages wherever they go, certainly sounds that way with Sancho turning down Chelsea and Rashford having 3 years left and sending out similar msging. That’s either close to or in excess of £100m total packages for each player. I just cannot see any club outside Saudi (or maybe MLS with a heavy weighting to commercial / image variables) being willing to offer that. If Sancho goes back to Dortmund for example it’ll need heavy subsidies or basically a free transfer with a write off of what you still owe them. 
 

Suppose we have the summer to see what happens, but I think £60m with clubs taking them onto balance sheet with no subsidy or pay off on the manc side would represent incredible business for you and doesn’t feel likely.