Eddie Howe

[KaKa]

3 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

We can’t debate those same signings forever man, come on. If we didn’t have Tonali now we would be saying we’re desperate for a midfielder, and same with Barnes and someone who can score us a goal. They were great signings. 

 

Good players, sure.

 

In my opinion though, they were inappropriate signings for where we were at the time.

 

The squad planning has been poor and the balance of the team has suffered for it.

[hakka]

I still think it's ridiculous with £60m/£70m to spend in the last window we couldn't find a player better than Longstaff, Burn, Kelly, Murphy, Hall or Almiron to join. With decent scouting you could find 3 players better than those. 

 

I'm being harsh on Hall as he is one for the future, but rest are just not good enough for weekly play at this level. Burn I have a lot of time for, but he should be a cover player now. He was a short term signing only.

[janpawel]

We had a headstart with the managers compared to Villa, since we got Howe a year or so before they got Emery 

 

But their club was way ahead of us in terms of the academy, selling Grealish, others etc which has helped FFP

 

They have also managed the FFP situation way better than us, flipping players, more dodgy deals etc

 

They also sold their best midfielder and opted to recruit an array of players, giving them depth, again something we don't and haven't done, we prefer to add a backup / future signing, or an expensive one 

 

They've also recruited well from lower placed teams / champo teams, Archer and Duran look quality and will no doubt be valued highly if they want to sell them 

 

As for Howe V Emery. I really rate Howe, and maybe blind bias but I always refer to the first 1.5 seasons as what he does for us, and think it will get better. Though Villa do play a more sustainable style of football, and don't need to overpower teams to win. That can only help over the long term, plus managing injuries etc

[KaKa]

4 minutes ago, janpawel said:

We had a headstart with the managers compared to Villa, since we got Howe a year or so before they got Emery 

 

But their club was way ahead of us in terms of the academy, selling Grealish, others etc which has helped FFP

 

They have also managed the FFP situation way better than us, flipping players, more dodgy deals etc

 

They also sold their best midfielder and opted to recruit an array of players, giving them depth, again something we don't and haven't done, we prefer to add a backup / future signing, or an expensive one 

 

They've also recruited well from lower placed teams / champo teams, Archer and Duran look quality and will no doubt be valued highly if they want to sell them 

 

As for Howe V Emery. I really rate Howe, and maybe blind bias but I always refer to the first 1.5 seasons as what he does for us, and think it will get better. Though Villa do play a more sustainable style of football, and don't need to overpower teams to win. That can only help over the long term, plus managing injuries etc

 

100%.

 

Don't forget they also added Kamara and Tielemans as free signings.

 

They haven't even had Kamara available, and him coming back will only make them stronger.

 

They actually make me feel sick.

[ilikenewcastle]

I'm not denying the excellent job Emery has done at Villa, but if many of our fans were Villa fans they'd be panicking about why the manager needs late comebacks to beat bad teams, and their poor Conference League exit would have raised questions such as has he taken us as far as he can? Is he really elite?

[Cronky]

12 minutes ago, janpawel said:

We had a headstart with the managers compared to Villa, since we got Howe a year or so before they got Emery 

 

But their club was way ahead of us in terms of the academy, selling Grealish, others etc which has helped FFP

 

They have also managed the FFP situation way better than us, flipping players, more dodgy deals etc

 

They also sold their best midfielder and opted to recruit an array of players, giving them depth, again something we don't and haven't done, we prefer to add a backup / future signing, or an expensive one 

 

They've also recruited well from lower placed teams / champo teams, Archer and Duran look quality and will no doubt be valued highly if they want to sell them 

 

As for Howe V Emery. I really rate Howe, and maybe blind bias but I always refer to the first 1.5 seasons as what he does for us, and think it will get better. Though Villa do play a more sustainable style of football, and don't need to overpower teams to win. That can only help over the long term, plus managing injuries etc

 

Excellent post, if I may say. Villa's academy has been way, way more productive than ours. We have some catching up to do.

[Erikse]

24 minutes ago, janpawel said:

We had a headstart with the managers compared to Villa, since we got Howe a year or so before they got Emery 

 

But their club was way ahead of us in terms of the academy, selling Grealish, others etc which has helped FFP

 

They have also managed the FFP situation way better than us, flipping players, more dodgy deals etc

 

They also sold their best midfielder and opted to recruit an array of players, giving them depth, again something we don't and haven't done, we prefer to add a backup / future signing, or an expensive one 

 

They've also recruited well from lower placed teams / champo teams, Archer and Duran look quality and will no doubt be valued highly if they want to sell them 

 

As for Howe V Emery. I really rate Howe, and maybe blind bias but I always refer to the first 1.5 seasons as what he does for us, and think it will get better. Though Villa do play a more sustainable style of football, and don't need to overpower teams to win. That can only help over the long term, plus managing injuries etc

 

But is you argument that they have been able to spend more due to the reasons you mention? If we look at money spent on transfer fees since 21/22, and exclude all sales (in which they obviously have generated way more):

 

Newcastle: 538m euros

Villa: 519m euros

 

Again, I'm excluding all the fees from sales here, this is not net spent. They've also lost better players through sales than us, which again is not part of the numbers.

 

 

Edited September 22 by Erikse

[hakka]

I do worry Howe's system is too predictable now, or at least teams have been finding ways to counter it. Intensity is no longer our indenity, and it seems we're just a sit back and counter team. Very odd, because we are pretty pants at the moment soaking up pressure. We are so uncomfortable in possession when that used to be our strength. I have full faith in Howe to fix the problem, but he had a summer to get what he wanted and he decided to stick. So he has to own the performances so far. It's not all doom and gloom - results other than Fulham are OK and if we quickly get going again then great. I am a little concerned about what is he actually going to do differently? I don't think he has the squad to change it beyond what he keeps doing. It's always 433. We only have 1 decent full back in Tino, our centre backs lack pace, keeper can't kick for shit and Isak will always be isolated on his own feeding on scraps if you focus on keeping supply to him limited.

 

The names on the team sheet yesterday should have been able to do better than what it did. I think Bruno as a deep playmaker is wrong decision long term. When we were really hurting teams he was sat middle of opposition half picking out loads of runners. Why is he now on edge of our box trying to make things happen? It's daft to me. He should be finding the killer pass, not releasing it from edge of our box.

 

Howe should have found a decent athletic DM to protect the defence and keep it simple and allow Bruno and Tonali to roam forward and be creative.

 

Hoping we start to play better with the ball but our fortune this season seems to be moments magic from players like Barnes than punishing teams with our style of play.

[Thumbheed]

Get the press right/going and it'll all fall back into place.

[The College Dropout]

1 hour ago, TRon said:

 

Why would you expect him to finish 4th? Liverpool, Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea and City all have squads far more expensive than ours. I think 6th/7th is probably as good as you could reasonably expect given the squad we've got.

Yeh I agree. But ppl are talking about ‘since he’s been here he’s collected the 4th most points’ and my thought is - so what does that mean for us going forward? Nobody expects us to finish 4th this season.  I don’t anyway. 

[Erikse]

3 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Yeh I agree. But ppl are talking about ‘since he’s been here he’s collected the 4th most points’ and my thought is - so what does that mean for us going forward? Nobody expects us to finish 4th this season.  I don’t anyway. 

 

If you look back at the threads from the day that Man Utd took our Europe spot, most people were saying with high confidence that we will probably get top 4 with no Europe.

 

 

Edited September 22 by Erikse

[janpawel]

11 minutes ago, Erikse said:

 

But is you argument that they have been able to spend more due to the reasons you mention? If we look at money spent on transfer fees since 21/22, and exclude all sales (in which they obviously have generated way more):

 

Newcastle: 538m euros

Villa: 519m euros

 

Again, I'm excluding all the fees from sales here, this is not net spent.

 

 

 

I should have explained more, but they spent more before we got took over. What Emery inherited was way better than What howe inherited 

 

There squad was better than ours to start, then we spent equally once we got took over based on what you provided 

[TRon]

19 minutes ago, ilikenewcastle said:

I'm not denying the excellent job Emery has done at Villa, but if many of our fans were Villa fans they'd be panicking about why the manager needs late comebacks to beat bad teams, and their poor Conference League exit would have raised questions such as has he taken us as far as he can? Is he really elite?

 

 

We still have to see how Villa cope with a CL campaign yet.

[Cronky]

I think it's significant that we only have three players now who other clubs seem to want - Isak, Gordon and Bruno. Of those, I think Isak is the only one who by sheer talent alone could be described as world class.

 

Gordon is a decent player who Eddie is getting to play at his max. When we bought him, he couldn't get a game for Everton and was nowhere near the England squad. Bruno has been great for us, partly because the team has been built around him and his particular gifts. If either player was to move to another club, I think they'd struggle to reach their current standard. Eddie's coaching and drive has lifted them to another level.

 

A club that is seeking to improve would be looking to trade up on their less important players, but no-one seems to want to spend significant money on Targett, Murphy, Almiron, Longstaff, Willock etc  Trippier has been linked, but we wouldn't get a fee for him.

 

I would say that it's a shame that we couldn't bring in just one player this window who was already of top Premiership standard. Apart from anything else, a signing like that can give the squad a lift. Maybe it was a question of chasing two hares and catching neither, as the saying goes.

 

And just a word on yesterday - the player that I was disappointed to see in the starting XI was Willock. He shows no enthusiasm for defending and it was no surprise to me that he got hooked at half time when we were 2-0 down. 

 

 

Edited September 22 by Cronky

[Erikse]

12 minutes ago, janpawel said:

I should have explained more, but they spent more before we got took over. What Emery inherited was way better than What howe inherited 

 

There squad was better than ours to start, then we spent equally once we got took over based on what you provided 

 

We also had Joelinton, ASM, Longstaff, Willock, Schär, Wilson, Almiron, Murphy etc. when Howe took over. Not saying that all of these are world beaters, but it wasn't too bad. Bruce was just trash. I agree that they have a better academy, but I don't think our squad was that for off of theirs.

 

 

Edited September 22 by Erikse

[The College Dropout]

3 hours ago, STM said:

 

There haven't been any low times. 

We were awful at times last season. Worst defence in the league or close at points.  Got as low as 10th or close.  We recovered well. 

 

4 hours ago, r0cafella said:

I think we have no option but to go back to the high intensity high press, it does look like we’ve tried to be more possession oriented but we simple haven’t build a squad with that in mind so naturally it doesn’t really suit us. 
 

and to be fair @The College Dropout banged on relentless about our lack of technical quality since basically Eddie’s appointment. 

Last summer we doubled down on pressing with the players we bought and gave new contracts too. If we wanted a more patient style we should’ve got Tielemans over Tonali.  We should have got a playmaker wide man that wants the ball to feet rather than Barnes. We gave Joelinton a new contract.   We don’t have the players for the possession stuff to really work. It’s a squad built for high press so we need to go and do it.  
 

 

I have my doubts about that style. But it’d Howe’s style and it has largely worked. 

[TRon]

1 minute ago, Cronky said:

I think it's significant that we only have three players now who other clubs seem to want - Isak, Gordon and Bruno. Of those, I think Isak is the only one who by sheer talent alone could be described as world class.

 

Gordon is a decent player who Eddie is getting to play at his max. When we bought him, he couldn't get a game for Everton and was nowhere near the England squad. Bruno has been great for us, partly because the team has been built around him and his particular gifts. If either player was to move to another club, I think they'd struggle to reach their current standard. Eddie's coaching and drive has lifted them to another level.

 

A club that is seeking to improve would be looking to trade up on their less important players, but no-one seems to want to spend significant money on Targett, Murphy, Almiron, Longstaff, Willock etc

 

I would say that it's a shame that we couldn't bring in just one player this window who was already of top Premiership standard. Apart from anything else, a signing like that can give the squad a lift. Maybe it was a question of chasing two hares and catching neither, as the saying goes.

 

And just a word on yesterday - the player that I was disappointed to see in the starting XI was Willock. He shows no enthusiasm for defending and it was no surprise to me that he got hooked at half time when we were 2-0 down. 

 

 

Willock is not really a defensive midfielder tbh, he does track back but it doesn't come naturally. I was more disappointed in Joelinton and Bruno in that regard.

 

But you make a good point about lack of interest in our players. I think that's the issue when you buy at peak value.

[The College Dropout]

Just now, Erikse said:

 

We also had Joelinton, ASM, Longstaff, Willock, Schär, Murphy etc. when Howe took over. Bruce was just trash. I agree that they have a better academy, but I don't think our squad was that for off of theirs.

Murphy struggled in championship loans.  
 

Howe’s greatest strength is getting the best out of most our lads. Managers with greater reputations would complain about a few of them. Rafa didn’t really trust Schar in a 2. Few of our lads are genuine top quality that would work on any circumstance. 

[Erikse]

5 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Murphy struggled in championship loans.  
 

Howe’s greatest strength is getting the best out of most our lads. Managers with greater reputations would complain about a few of them. Rafa didn’t really trust Schar in a 2. Few of our lads are genuine top quality that would work on any circumstance. 

 

I agree, but if you look at the team Emery took over, he didn't have that much either. I'd say similar. Bruce was getting the worst out of these players, so you can't really judge them based on the Bruce era either.

 

 

Edited September 22 by Erikse

[The College Dropout]

Our players are on good money too which is a big issue. And the squad is old. And the players are more valuable to us than the fees we would get.  

[The College Dropout]

1 minute ago, Erikse said:

 

I agree, but if you look at the team Emery took over, he didn't have the best cards either. I'd say similar. Bruce were getting the worst out of these players.

 

 

 

Nah Villa had a better squad and a better academy. 
 

The GK

Cash

Konsa

Mings

Digne

mcGinn

Ramsey

Coutinho

the main striker 

Bailey was there 

Douglas Luiz

 

 

Come on man that’s a talented squad.  Way better than the one Howe took over. 
 

All of those players are better than Longstaff, Almiron and many others. Like talent wise for their position. Gerrard was a TERRIBLE manager.  I keep saying it - Bruce wasn’t. Bruce had over 10 years in the PL and like 3 Champ promotions. Gerrard won’t do that. 

[Hanshithispantz]

I think Villa had, and still have, a better squad. The issue is that they've maintained steady form and Emery's style is always being realised. Currently we're unable to implament Howe's.

 

I genuinely believe we're a far more dangerous team than them, regardless of playing staff, when on song, but we're a bit fucked if we're having to scrap our plan A against every side in the league away from home.

 

 

Edited September 22 by Hanshithispantz

[janpawel]

2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Nah Villa had a better squad and a better academy. 
 

The GK

Cash

Konsa

Mings

Digne

mcGinn

Ramsey

Coutinho

the main striker 

Bailey was there 

Douglas Luiz

 

 

Come on man that’s a talented squad.  Way better than the one Howe took over. 
 

All of those players are better than Longstaff, Almiron and many others. Like talent wise for their position. Gerrard was a TERRIBLE manager.  I keep saying it - Bruce wasn’t. Bruce had over 10 years in the PL and like 3 Champ promotions. Gerrard won’t do that. 

Then add 500m spend to this squad, if anything there expectations should be way higher than ours 

[The College Dropout]

Without Trippier, Burn, Targett, Wood, Bruno - Howe struggles to keep that team up. 
 

That Gerrard team was top 10 quality. 

[janpawel]

1 minute ago, Hanshithispantz said:

I think Villa had, and still have, a better squad. The issue is that they've maintained steady form and Emery's style is always being realised. Currently we're unable to implament Howe's.

 

I genuinely believe we're a far more dangerous team than them, regardless of playing staff, when on song, but we're a bit fucked if we're having to scrap our plan A against every side in the league away from home.

 

 

 

Yeah, I think Villa are a 'high floor' team, especially considering the way they recruited in the summer. Whereas we have had some outstanding games and blew teams away in impressive manner

 

Then again, I remember watching Villa vs Man City last season and I thought that was the best I'd ever seen a team play against City, absolutely dominated them