Foreign Youngsters - is there a strong support network at Newcastle United?

[sicsfingeredmong]

I seriously have my doubts.

 

For an N'Zogbia, or a Martins there's two alternatives these days, and this has been the case since Speed left the club.

 

1. Enveloping oneself into the fold of the upstart Bling Brigade led by Dyer.

 

or

 

2. Having to be accepted by the club's 'old guard' or the final remnants of the Keegan Era, that being Shearer/Mcdermott for example.

 

We lost an outstanding 'go-between' in Gary Speed who imo was a listening/understanding ear for those foreigners who were serious about their football, and you could extend that Robert and Bellamy with respect to Speed's off-field influence - players who according to some stories didn't see eye-to-eye with/rubbed the captain - ie. a pivotal 'old guard' figure within the club - up the wrong way with their abrasive personalities or 'big egos'.

 

Another thing which has gone against us, and i'll take my argument to a slightly different transient here, deals with the club's recruiting. IMO the key to having these kids settle-in comes form recruiting these young lads in clusters based on their racial heritage - whether it be the French African Quarter, Brazilian, or Dutch Surinese for example. Not only does this come from extensive scouting which according to Roeder is non-existent at this club, but it also comes from establishing ties with 'feeder clubs' on the continent. In this way these young lads quickly build up a support network within the playing group itself, based on racial lines and ties they've built up within their previous & current youth ranks whether it be at National U'21 and club levels. Arsenal are a prime example with respect to this type of recruiting, and Chelsea have followed suit recently.

 

There's a definite trend when it comes to these type of players wanting to jump ship so to speak, when they do lose direction here for off-field and on-field reasons, or when it begins to go pear shaped. Foreign youngsters at Arsenal are prepared to stay for the long haul, Alidiere fits into this category. N'Zogbia is the current example.

 

Although from a different age bracket Domi, who was a very handy attacking fulback imo, due to his religious beliefs had a bar of the 'bling/pisshead' culture at the club. He just didn't fit in fullstop.

 

N'Zogbia's days are numbered, and even though i rate him highly as a player i have a feeling that Martins' days are also numbered. A strong support network isn't there, and the club unlike those listed above hasn't put in the hard yards in this area imo. Perhaps the club's line has been something along the lines of "they're adults, they can deal with it", and this equates from attitudes of previous managers & their respective footballing front offices.

 

Somethings amiss here, perhaps i've touched upon some reasons why................ but then again based on one drunkard reporter's fear of all things foreign such youngsters' are most likely not worth the effort....... it's preferable to give a nice lad from Whitley Bay first crack at a footballing future on Tyneside.

 

 

[johnnypd]

there's solano too, who has helped out spanish speaking players in the past and is a mature head serious about his football. i think he is a bit more of a private and intense character, whereas speed was more open and laidback. what we could do with is a mature player dedicated to constantly improving, a real football lover, someone with an outside perspective who has his own ideas about the game and someone the younger players can follow and learn from. i'm thinking of Cantona and Di Canio as the prime examples, both players who would stay behind after training and matches, holding their own impromptu skill sessions with the young lads. under the guidance of those two you had the likes of cole, lampard, scholes, beckham come to the fore, and inherit their drive for improvement, the ability to go the extra mile on the training ground.

[sicsfingeredmong]

there's solano too, who has helped out spanish speaking players in the past and is a mature head serious about his football. i think he is a bit more of a private and intense character, whereas speed was more open and laidback.

 

Fair point, and without underestimating Solano's attitude & influence, hence the reason why some clubs like those mentioned tend to recruit such players in clusters because there are differing character types - as you've pointed out re: Solano & Speed - who in accordance to their personalty traits will naturally adopt a leadership role to varying degrees.

 

 

[Lloydie]

It's a fair point. There's definately a lack of infrastructure at this club for that kind of thing. I think Gullit tried to take a run at this problem as well, and wanted our youth setup to be more like that at Ajax, but he was moved on before he could finish the job.

[johnnypd]

there's also a tactic of recruiting in pairs in order to help new arrivals settle, though i think this can cause more problems than it solves when the two players simply become insular. we even got in that Turkish bloke on a trial basis for the period that Emre was going through a tough time. that's a bit amatuerish but there's no suprise that Roeder would go down that route - he himself was brought to Lazio for a short time to help Gazza settle in Rome. Wham got Tevez and Mascherano, Coventry got Chippo to help Hadji settle while villa also got Kachloul and Hadji a little while later. those didn't seem to work out, Tevez only shone once Mascherano had left the club and he was given a chance to open up and shine.

[sicsfingeredmong]

there's also a tactic of recruiting in pairs in order to help new arrivals settle, though i think this can cause more problems than it solves when the two players simply become insular. we even got in that Turkish bloke on a trial basis for the period that Emre was going through a tough time. that's a bit amatuerish but there's no suprise that Roeder would go down that route - he himself was brought to Lazio for a short time to help Gazza settle in Rome. Wham got Tevez and Mascherano, while villa also got Kachloul and Hadji at around the same time. those didn't seem to work out, Tevez only shone once Mascherano had left the club and he was given a chance to open up and shine.

 

Hence 'cluster recruiting' seems to be quell the problems you've mentioned in this area ie. Arsenal raiding Holland's U'21 ranks recently, and their continual unearthing of players from the French/African quarter..

[James]

Missing a couple of key facts in my opinion:

 

Martins was linked up with Shola when he joined, who knows the city's Nigerian contingent.

 

Also, there was a period when Speed had left that senior French/African Amady Faye had taken Zoggy under his wing. So there have been periods when there have been players to llok after theyoungsters, but youare right in saying that it is not too great at the moment.

[Guest NIToon]

Good thread and I mostly agree with Shaman's comments, for the moment it appears that our opportunity to bring in a few South American players has been dashed with the guys being pulled back from the airport following Rodent's departure.

[Northern Monkey]

Good thread and I mostly agree with Shaman's comments, for the moment it appears that our opportunity to bring in a few South American players has been dashed with the guys being pulled back from the airport following Rodent's departure.

 

Yeah, i was really hopeful that the mouth-breathing judas twat Clak would use his immense scouting skills to unearth some gems.

[Skirge]

Hugo seemed to suffer the same thing as Zoggy but I suppose Zoggy has performed on the pitch, Vianna never did so his troubles came from not getting games from pretty early on in his time here.

Its a very good point though, if your going to sign young players from abroad, even young lads from other parts of this Country you need a good support network for them, it must be a priority to the club to help these lads settle as soon as they can.

[Tooj]

Hugo seemed to suffer the same thing as Zoggy but I suppose Zoggy has performed on the pitch, Vianna never did so his troubles came from not getting games from pretty early on in his time here.

Its a very good point though, if your going to sign young players from abroad, even young lads from other parts of this Country you need a good support network for them, it must be a priority to the club to help these lads settle as soon as they can.

 

That's a myth Skirge, Viana performed fine in his first season here. It was only then in his 2nd year after being out of the team for so long and performing shockingly in an unfamiliar role when he came back people decided to say he couldn't settle.

[sicsfingeredmong]

Missing a couple of key facts in my opinion:

 

Martins was linked up with Shola when he joined, who knows the city's Nigerian contingent.

 

Also, there was a period when Speed had left that senior French/African Amady Faye had taken Zoggy under his wing. So there have been periods when there have been players to llok after theyoungsters, but youare right in saying that it is not too great at the moment.

 

 

The scenario you've painted out, re- Shola and Faye, revolves around just one figure providing a comparable level of support to lets say the support network at Arsenal for example where they recruit youngsters in clusters based on age & nationality.The danger with this is that once that single 'support figure' leaves, and Shola & Faye's respective futures are/were never set in concrete, an N'Zogbia is naturally going to be isolated.

[Raconteur]

 

The scenario you've painted out, re- Shola and Faye, revolves around just one figure providing a comparable level of support to lets say the support network at Arsenal for example where they recruit youngsters in clusters based on age & nationality.The danger with this is that once that single 'support figure' leaves, and Shola & Faye's respective futures are/were never set in concrete, an N'Zogbia is naturally going to be isolated.

 

I think it follows that this support provider should not be a current player but an ex-player or something similar - on the payroll specifically to support young foreign lads. One man earning a year what Owen earns in four days is one hell of an investment if it cuts down on lonliness, alienation and estrangement.