Sparks Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 You constantly hear people debate whether other clubs are "big" or not. So what defines a club as being big and which clubs come near the top of the list? I made this list last season so it includes the teams that have gone down, but I ranked each club and created 7 different tiers in terms of their club size. I ranked each club on following criteria. 1. Fixed Assests - Essentially your ground size and core fanbase that will always turn up. 2. Finances - The Money and Capital the club has. The ability to invest in new players and facilities. 3. Ability to attract players - It's fine having money or doing well on the pitch, but it needs to put it to use in buying new players. 4. Playing history - Important for the prestige of the club and bragging rights, but very limited in terms of what modern use it has. 5. Future potential - Can a club continue to improve or have they gone as far as they can, are there no new fans to attract or no better players they can attract. This is always going to be great debate as to who should be above one another, but I hope to get the tiers as accurate as possible. The clubs position within these tiers is where you can start a real debate. I welcome any thoughts or opinions on how to improve the criteria and list. 1. ============ Man Utd Liverpool Arsenal Chelsea 2. ============ Tottenham Newcastle Aston Villa 3. ============ West Ham Everton 4. ============ Manchester City Middlesbrough 5. ============ Blackburn Portsmouth Bolton 6. ============ Sheffield Utd Reading Charlton 7. ============ Fulham Wigan Watford Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearer9 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Why is Chelsea 1st tier? They only meet the 3rd criteria very well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrette Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Below Spurs? Say it ain't so... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Were in the same tier as Spurs, forget the Mackems or anybody else, right now they are our biggest rivals. Chelsea are in the top tier to because of their finances, their ability to attract players, and the fact they've won every domestic trophy in the last two years. Their fanbase isn't strong and their limited potential means they are behind the other three. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrette Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Were in the same tier as Spurs, forget the Mackems or anybody else, right now they are our biggest rivals. Ah, so the clubs in the tiers themselves are not in any order. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Very limited order, the tiers are where the clubs are really ranked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Toonie Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 everton should be higher, they have a great history. Man City should be below Blackburn and Bolton Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Everton do have a fine history, but what is more important is the state the club are in today. They don't fill their ground often, the ground itself is a dump. Financially they haven't been able to compete with any other of the clubs above them and you just need to look back two years when they qualified for the champs league, they couldn't get anybody to join them. Most of the players they wanted joined us or Spurs. Bolton and Blackburn are forever limited by the small sizes of the towns they play in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor Swift Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 This should be expanded to clubs outside the Premiership. Consider clubs like Forest or Leeds and you'll see that they meet criterion numbers 1, 4 and 5 pretty well. This way you can include all the 'sleeping giants' that exist in English football. Would be quite interesting to see where teams like Wolves, Sunderland etc. stack up against the rest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gray Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 boro should be in group 6. quite fancy them to go down too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Everton should be in Villas place Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Spectrum Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Man City should be below Blackburn and Bolton I hate these "big club" pissing contests and normally try to ignore them. But seriously. I ain't having that. I was insulted that we were originally so low (in the same bracket as Boro? Come off it) but that post is just silly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 I will define "Big Club" for you all. Club-"a group of persons organized for a social, literary, athletic, political, or other purpose." Therfore i believe the size of a club is down to how many people are part of that club, regardless of success or assets. When referring to football clubs, it's the fan base which decides the size of the club. Which is why the two biggest clubs in the world (real and man u) have the biggest fan bases. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokerprince2004 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 1. Manchester United Liverpool Arsenal Chelsea 2. Tottenham Newcastle Everton Villa 3. Manchester City Sunderland West Ham 4. Fulham Blackburn Bolton 5. Boro Portsmouth Birmingham 6. Derby Reading Wigan My opinion of course Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Why is Chelsea 1st tier? They only meet the 3rd criteria very well. And the first, and the second, and the 5th, oh... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Title contenders/Champions League places 1. Manchester United, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool. UEFA Cup contenders with potential of breaking top four 2. Tottenham, Newcastle, Everton, Aston Villa Mid-table with potential to finish top 6 3. Manchester City, Blackburn, Bolton, Portsmouth, West Ham Relegation battle with potential to push for top 10 4. Middlesbrough, Sunderland, Reading Relegation candidates 5. Fulham, Wigan, Derby, Birmingham Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest optimistic nit Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 nuts' seems on the money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manorpark Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Slight variation, accounting for the over-rating of Spurs. 1. Title contenders: Manchester United, Chelsea. 2. Champions League Places contenders: Liverpool, Newcastle United, Arsenal. 3. UEFA Cup contenders with potential of Champions League placing Everton, Aston Villa. 4. Mid-table with potential to finish top 6 Manchester City, Blackburn, Spurs, Bolton, Portsmouth, West Ham 5. Relegation battle with potential to push for top 10 Middlesbrough, Sunderland, Reading 6. Relegation candidates Fulham, Wigan, Derby, Birmingham Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Darth Toon Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Title contenders/Champions League places 1. Manchester United, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool. UEFA Cup contenders with potential of breaking top four 2. Tottenham, Newcastle, Everton, Aston Villa Mid-table with potential to finish top 6 3. Manchester City, Blackburn, Bolton, Portsmouth, West Ham Relegation battle with potential to push for top 10 4. Middlesbrough, Sunderland, Reading Relegation candidates 5. Fulham, Wigan, Derby, Birmingham Aye, I'd go along with that like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superior Acuña Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 I'd say Leeds should be above a good few of them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Spurs_from_Africa Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Slight variation, accounting for the over-rating of Spurs. 1. Title contenders: Manchester United, Chelsea. 2. Champions League Places contenders: Liverpool, Newcastle United, Arsenal. 3. UEFA Cup contenders with potential of Champions League placing Everton, Aston Villa. 4. Mid-table with potential to finish top 6 Manchester City, Blackburn, Spurs, Bolton, Portsmouth, West Ham 5. Relegation battle with potential to push for top 10 Middlesbrough, Sunderland, Reading 6. Relegation candidates Fulham, Wigan, Derby, Birmingham It's quite obvious that you absolutely hate spurs for whatever reason, but I will attempt to show you the light :lol:even if I'm wasting my time. I agree that only Chelsea and Man Utd are real title contenders. Some may say Liverpool but it is a myth they haven't spent big money before, they have been one of the biggest spenders the last few years. Mate, Newcastle finished 13th last season. What players exactly do you think you will sign that will magically move you up 9 places. It just isn't going to happen, especially as you basically need to buy a whole new defence. You will challenge, but in 2/3 seasons imo. Of course, Everton and Aston Villa are UEFA cup contenders but neither will push for the CL, as Everton don't have the finances and Villa don't have the team or Squad. Everyone talks about O'Neill as if he is some sort of God yet, up until the last few games, his points per game ratio were worse than O'leary's. Oh and comparing Spurs to the teams you have just shows your seemingly irrational hate. Let's just look at where all those teams finished the last 2 seasons. Spurs- 5th, 5th Man City- 15th, 14th Blackburn- 6th, 10th Bolton- 8th, 7th Portsmouth- 17th, 9th West Ham- 9th, 15th We are the only one of those teams that has got into UEFA cup twice in a row and the only ones outside of the top 4, including Newcastle, which can handle close to 60 games a season and still finish 5th. When was the last time a team qualified in 2 consecutive seasons for the UEFA cup? And according to you, we did it through luck. Yep, we must have had God himself playing for us seeing as we finished in the same position twice through luck. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alan Shearer 9 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 If Spurs can avoid relegation, who knows what the future could hold for them? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 This isn't about league positions it's about the size of the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manorpark Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Slight variation, accounting for the over-rating of Spurs. 1. Title contenders: Manchester United, Chelsea. 2. Champions League Places contenders: Liverpool, Newcastle United, Arsenal. 3. UEFA Cup contenders with potential of Champions League placing Everton, Aston Villa. 4. Mid-table with potential to finish top 6 Manchester City, Blackburn, Spurs, Bolton, Portsmouth, West Ham 5. Relegation battle with potential to push for top 10 Middlesbrough, Sunderland, Reading 6. Relegation candidates Fulham, Wigan, Derby, Birmingham It's quite obvious that you absolutely hate spurs for whatever reason, but I will attempt to show you the light :lol:even if I'm wasting my time. I agree that only Chelsea and Man Utd are real title contenders. Some may say Liverpool but it is a myth they haven't spent big money before, they have been one of the biggest spenders the last few years. Mate, Newcastle finished 13th last season. What players exactly do you think you will sign that will magically move you up 9 places. It just isn't going to happen, especially as you basically need to buy a whole new defence. You will challenge, but in 2/3 seasons imo. Of course, Everton and Aston Villa are UEFA cup contenders but neither will push for the CL, as Everton don't have the finances and Villa don't have the team or Squad. Everyone talks about O'Neill as if he is some sort of God yet, up until the last few games, his points per game ratio were worse than O'leary's. Oh and comparing Spurs to the teams you have just shows your seemingly irrational hate. Let's just look at where all those teams finished the last 2 seasons. Spurs- 5th, 5th Man City- 15th, 14th Blackburn- 6th, 10th Bolton- 8th, 7th Portsmouth- 17th, 9th West Ham- 9th, 15th We are the only one of those teams that has got into UEFA cup twice in a row and the only ones outside of the top 4, including Newcastle, which can handle close to 60 games a season and still finish 5th. When was the last time a team qualified in 2 consecutive seasons for the UEFA cup? And according to you, we did it through luck. Yep, we must have had God himself playing for us seeing as we finished in the same position twice through luck. You couldn't be more wrong mate, in my years living in North London (in Hornsey and then Wood Green) I came to know a lot of Tottenham supporters, and developed a strong affection for the club, which I will always retain. The thing I do dislike (though 'hate' is far too strong a word) is that this particular club have suddenly become this years "universally over-rated" / "oft quoted as the next big thing" , football club. It is such a shame, as it is just ridiculous. It only usually happens to London clubs. A London club (could be any of them) only has to do 'reasonably well' and the NATIONAL media grab it and repeatedly EXAGERATE, until it (by repitition) it gets accepted as fact! The best example was in the 70s or 80s when a club called Crystal Palace won two or three games on the trot - and were classed (for YEARS) as the "club of the future" - nationally. You see, parochial idiocy does not just exist down in London, but the difference is that when it happens down there it does not get restricted to 'local media' (eg, Evening Standard, or whatever) it gets broadcast nationally (as that is where the national papers, etc, are based). So, I object to my favourite London club being so universally 'hyped' that it will look such a sad joke in about nine months time! As I have said before, the current Spurs team is nothing much. About two months before the end of last season, we moved ahead of them in the league and neither looked likely to pull away from the other. Now, that was in one of our most 'rubbish' seasons for years, and I know we then went on to lose ground, but really, I cannot believe the hype that has ensued and 'taken over' many peoples thinking about them. It is all just so exagerated. They are not a rubbish side, they are just not that good a side. In nine months time that will be very clear, as lightening does not strike three times!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate End Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 It's quite obvious that you absolutely hate spurs for whatever reason, but I will attempt to show you the light :lol:even if I'm wasting my time. I agree that only Chelsea and Man Utd are real title contenders. Some may say Liverpool but it is a myth they haven't spent big money before, they have been one of the biggest spenders the last few years. Mate, Newcastle finished 13th last season. What players exactly do you think you will sign that will magically move you up 9 places. It just isn't going to happen, especially as you basically need to buy a whole new defence. You will challenge, but in 2/3 seasons imo. Of course, Everton and Aston Villa are UEFA cup contenders but neither will push for the CL, as Everton don't have the finances and Villa don't have the team or Squad. Everyone talks about O'Neill as if he is some sort of God yet, up until the last few games, his points per game ratio were worse than O'leary's. Oh and comparing Spurs to the teams you have just shows your seemingly irrational hate. Let's just look at where all those teams finished the last 2 seasons. Spurs- 5th, 5th Man City- 15th, 14th Blackburn- 6th, 10th Bolton- 8th, 7th Portsmouth- 17th, 9th West Ham- 9th, 15th We are the only one of those teams that has got into UEFA cup twice in a row and the only ones outside of the top 4, including Newcastle, which can handle close to 60 games a season and still finish 5th. When was the last time a team qualified in 2 consecutive seasons for the UEFA cup? And according to you, we did it through luck. Yep, we must have had God himself playing for us seeing as we finished in the same position twice through luck. You have just "archived" top 7 twice consecutively for the first time in your Premiership history and will be playing Uefa Cup football for the 2nd time in 12 years and your on some wa*k session! The "Big Club" list category is of Premiership history (playing history) and (fixed assets) - Size of club Our (Playing history) top 5 positions archived in the Premiership is 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th. And yours? And our fixed assets are far greater then yours. Newcastle United have been/are a bigger Premiership club but your in around the same category of the list above. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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