The College Dropout

Is this Darren Bent stuff serious?

Disagree with the first statement nearly as much as I disagree about Brazils strikers being better than Germany and Spain's. Fabregas has become very underrated recently too. I'm going to be honest, I only made the first statement as a conversation starter for the rest of you to discuss to my enjoyment. I'm weak at the knees for big, physical midfielders, I know. It can't be helped at this point. I think Javi Martinez is a more complete player in a vacuum (outside of the Barca-created midfield of Spain) than Busquets and can slide into the same role without much fuss at all. Fabregas played a very different role in England in Mata, but I still think what the little boy at Chelsea accomplished the past two seasons is above anything Fab did, even at the height of his powers. He hasn't shown that form for three years anyway. I'd echo the sentiment of wanting to see him back in central midfielders. He's not a striker, #10, or a winger despite where he's been playing. Javi Martinez always strikes me as very one paced... Thought he was massively overpriced... Hard to argue against the season he's had though... If he's one paced, what is Busquets? Or Alonso? Or Xavi?# IMO Barca should've signed him and stuck him at CB. That's what I thought Song was for.

The problem is Fabregas doesn't have a position in this team.... the AM role he performed so fantastically in for Arsenal doesn't exist and he never has been and never will be a controlling CM in the mould of Xavi. Disagree with this. He was developing that way for most of his time at Arsenal. Wasn't until the last 2 maybe 3 seasons he was made into Arsenal's Gerrard/Lampard. His game became more about goals and assists rather than controlling the match. What he brings in that regard is unique for Barca and it's why they won't sell him. He's still only 26. I can see him going further and further back into a more Xavi-like position as time goes on.

Yeah Ligue 1, I mean the French national side.

I've never seen Sissoko play CM tbh. When I saw him for France he was wide.

Alonso is really more Xavi and Pirlo than Martinez and Busquets. Under Morinho he's become more combative but that's not really his game. Although Alonso plays behind Xavi for Spain they really have 2 players trying to control te tempo of the game.

I'm sure they'll go back to a double pivot. Even if not Alonso it should be Martinez or Pardo.In his last few seasons at Arsenal, Fabregas really become much more of a Gerrard/Lampard than one of the Spanish masters.

I pointed out your fallacies in another thread regarding this. Juve have Pirlo then Vidal and Marchisio in midfield. They are immense defensively, strong in the tackle. They do get forward but in essence they are battlers. Moussa Sissoko is not, and has never been a battler. Javi Martinez is not a box-to-box player stop it. He's a fabulous player with many attributes but for Bayern, he's a more combative and ambitious Busquets. Sissoko - i'm not sure about him tbh. He was great for 2-3 games but very poor since other than Benfica away. He's not a link man. The most worrying thing is how often his passing is bad. IIRC it's the lowest in completion of any player in our side.

Of all January signings' Sissoko is my biggest concern.

Aye, Sissoko is an attacking player. No good in the air, doesn't put a foot in. That's another big issue for me. All our central midfielders suck in the air. Tiote's pretty decent. Think Siss may do better defensively in that regard. With people wanting a Mbiwa - Colo CB partnership - i'd say we have the weakest first XI in the air, in the division.

Shame that they very rarely do.... as shown by Barca and Arsenal's defensive record. Also this myth that Tiote is athletic needs to stop.... Athleticism =/= Strength. Also the physical crap is getting very tiresome.... Liverpool has Lucas and Gerrard, Arsenal has Arteta and Ramsey, Everton has Osman and Gibson, Man Utd has Carrick and Cleverly, Swansea has Britton and De Guzman and many more. Yet we play with a load of "defensive midfielders" and have less points and more goals conceded than all of them. Plus with Sissoko in the midfield we are hardly lacking in the physical department there is no reason to play another physically strong player who offers nothing offensively. You're just agreeing with me. It rarely happens because they sit right in front of the defence and their teams mostly have the ball. Gerrard - Lucas = lots of legs, energy and strength. Gerrard doesn't make as many forward runs but he's always been strong as owt. Arsenal's midfield needs a huge upgrade. That's the worst CM they've had in a decade. The best? Vieira and Petit/Silva. Strength, legs, tackle, bite. Everton & Man United, while Carrick has been immense. Their central midfields are helped out a huge amount because so much of both teams attacks comes from wide players providing width (and Carrick's the best at what he does in the division). Our midfield pattern is Tiote > Cabaye > Sissoko *lose ball*. Or at best to Santon or something. Width provides an easy outlet. These are not great examples good central midfields. Look at Juve or Bayern. Currently, we don't have anyone "sitting" in front of the defence, they just do as they like. I haven't mentioned defensive midfielders today, i'm simply talking about sitting in front of the day shielding it. Tiote can get around laterally better than any of our midfielders. Sissoko is an attacking player man. He's pretty poor defensively. He requires a proper sitter behind him, not Yohan bloody Kebab. City have always played a proper sitting midfielder alongside Yaya because defensively, he's not very effective. Turn him and he's not very interested, same with Sissoko.

Of all the midfielders - Jonas is the biggest problem. At least Obertan knew what was expected of him and provided width and an outlet. Sign a real wide man please.

Agreed. especially in a Pardew team. I don't know whether Anita can be like Brittain but i'm on the fence about whether he can cope physically. His best games for us came in matches we got thumped in. For someone like Marveaux a creator, you can say at least in those games we can see what he offers going forward. But Anita? He needs to be a strong factor the other way for us imo.

Every good team has a midfield player who sits and largely plays "behind the ball" in attack and in front of it in defence. If you get the other side of Busquets or even Arteta in attack, they are in deep trouble.

That wouldn't just be a waste of his best attributes, it would also be asking him to do something he's not very good at (bit like Pardew does with absolutely everyone). Plus, chipped passes have never worked in this team. Especially with our total lack of wingers. Cabaye needs to be the furthest midfielder forward. Anita or Sissoko should be the deepest. Tiote should be nowhere near the side. Cabaye's best attributes are his vision and passing. The deeper midfield role is perfect for him in the PL - when (as you've alluded to) we find ourselves with 2 good wide players. i agree. deep role like pirlo. sissoko and anita box to box would be an interesting midfield. i hope pardew will see this as our strongest combination in central midfield for next season. doubt it though Don't think we are strong/good enough for that unless we went with a diamond in midfield. Cabaye moving laterally as a DM is asking for trouble.

Disagree. When Spain play with Alonso, they're tough as hell to break down as they'll have 4 players behind the ball at all times. Spain are better defensively than Barca, have way more depth and are less reliant on an individual (okay the best player of his generation) but this means they are less likely to lose because someone has had an off day. IMO Spain are better than Barca. They have less glaring weaknesses.

Yeah but there's a huge difference.... ( which you tend to neglect everytime) most teams have a midfielder who is reliable positionally, passing, ability to get forward and winning the ball. Tiote is none of these things and never has been. For 2 years Tiote has been reliable position wise, wins the ball, his pass completion has dropped but its still the highest of all our midfielders in the high 80's although its unambitious. Busquets can't get forward. Mikel doesn't get forward. Luiz is bad position wise in that role. Carrick isn't much of a ball winner and if by going forward you mean goals and assists, nope. Parker's poor position wise, passing is nothing to shout about and he's poor going forward. Sandro's better but would hardly list "going forward" as a strength. Gareth Barry probably fits the description best and he's the worst player i've listed. Javi Martinez too but he's a natural libero and a phenomenal talent. Before him Bayern deployed Gustavo who is a pure DM. I think Arteta's lack of mobility and bite is an issue for Arsenal despite what anyone says. At our level, the players we have in central midfield are good enough imo. They just need to play to their strengths. Our midfield as a whole needs a simpler structure. I wouldn't mind 2 deep players (one primarily tacking and engine - the other starting attacks with passing), one box to box. Wide players who main focus is to attack, one supplying width, the other cutting in. Or even more simple. 2 sitting in midfield. 2 wide players providing width. 2 strikers with one coming a bit deeper.

Most teams play with a midfielder who sits. Tiotes played well for 2 out of 3 years. Not going to write him off just yet

Disagree. But signing Bent would be a needless sideways step.

Agreed with you up to Colo. He was poor for the majority of last season. Only consistent player is Timmy

I do like the way Rodgers moves in the transfer market since December. Seems like he's playing FM with the flair and attacking players coming in.

Yes. But technique isn't the main reason he's such a great player at CM/DM. He's there primarily to break stuff up, win headers, tackle and to get moves started. Previously they started Gustavo who had a similar role but isn't as good. You look at their midfield and its full of height, strength, power and a lot of tackle.

So annoying when people say a tackler/combative midfielder isn't needed anymore. While Martinez is a much better footballer in every way. He's a hard tackle in the middle of the pitch.

Supporting a football team is kinda like loving a child.

I like any of the lads that seem like they go to bed by 11pm 6 days a week. And when they do go out, it's a few quiet drinks at a club. The steady, calm type. That kinda calm presence in the dressing room. S'why I can never haul abuse at Jonas/Harper/Willo. Not that they should be playing or anything but they seem like decent blokes. As much as I thought Simpson was a decent professional. His love of "living it big" and going out with celebs made me question where his head was at, at times.