macbeth

From the club accounts ... William Frederick Shepherd: Appointed director of the football club in November 1991 and subsequently as chairman in July1998. Appointed as Non-executive director of Newcastle United PLC in December 1998, became a full time Executive Director in August 2001 ands was appointed Chairman in 2002. (NE5 will disagree with me on this as I've taken it from a club publication, but you can probably assume it is okay) So in other words, while he was chairman: Dodgy Dalglish transfers Appointment of Gullit Start of decline under Robson commenced shortly after his second spell as chairman commenced Sacking of Bobby Robson Appointment of Souness Signing of Owen and others. Accused by both Souness and Robson as the man actually in charge of transfers. Appointment of Roeder Appointment of Allardyce And while he was at the club, but not chairman: Appointment of Keegan Signing of Shearer 2nd in the league Appointment of Dalglish Appointment of Robson Champions League Qualification. No-one disagrees with any of the statements here then? majority of them are facts, as opposed to opinions, so they just have to be accepted

or just keep Lua Lua .....

I like the comparison with Waddle. At the same age there is absolutely no comparison between the abilities of Waddle and Milner. Waddle didn't play in the top division till he was 24, and at the comparable age to Milner now he scored 7 goals in 42 2nd division league games. He was nothing special at all. Any one saying otherwise now really is making it up. Milner has so much more potential than Waddle ever had. Milner also has a superb attitude, something that Dyer will never be accused of. Dyer can't pass, can't tackle, can't head, can't shoot and can do it at very high pace all over the pitch. Annually - "Next year he may come good"

They used to pointedly separate the runnign of the football club, from the running of the umbrella organisation that was Newcastle United. So the group included all the Hall fantasies of the rugby, ice-hockey etc. The football club was just one of those. To begin with Shepherd was only as member of the football club board. Then in late 98 he moved to the group (PLC) board. This happened when the whole group board resigned en-masse at the way the major shareholders were acting. After this mass resignation there was only Hall and Shepherd left. In 2001 the then CEO David Stonehouse "resigned" and Shepherd took over complete day-to-day control.

From the club accounts ... William Frederick Shepherd: Appointed director of the football club in November 1991 and subsequently as chairman in July1998. Appointed as Non-executive director of Newcastle United PLC in December 1998, became a full time Executive Director in August 2001 ands was appointed Chairman in 2002. (NE5 will disagree with me on this as I've taken it from a club publication, but you can probably assume it is okay)

Wish I'd got here a bit earlier haven't had a good laugh at NE5 in a while. Over last 10 years we have finished 14, 7, 14, 5, 3, 4, 11, 11, 13, 13. To achieve that greatness we have had to borrow £23m more than we have taken in to buy and pay players. We have also borrowed a further £35m to give away to the shareholders. That the people running the club are financially incompetent at running a football club is without doubt. That they are fantastically good at borrowing money to give away to shareholders is also without doubt. They have shown that when they concentrate on something they can be brilliant at it. That Ashley is better is a hope. the has no football experience. The people he is replacing have shown that football experience does not really help when that experience always comes second to personal financial gain. Ashley looks to be a ruthlessly efficient money man, who will not need to take money out of the club the way the Halls and Shepherds have done so. If this is the case we should be better off as a club.

I love it when people come up with really really accurate numbers like £827,092, makes yuo feel confident they've worked things out very very carefully. Except it was the boys at Thompson House so they got it wrong. Hall and Shepherd are on 2 year's notice, so they get two year's worth of salary from our club. Last year the club changed their accounts which meant it was only a 11-month year. Because of that Douglas was only reported as getting 11/12ths of his £450,000 salary, or £413,546. If you take that figure and double it you get the figure quoted of £827,092. Sadly for all but one, concerned Hall will actually get £900,000 as a pay off. It is widely believed he will do a much work in the next two years as he has in the previous 5, so he is probably justified in the amoutn paid. He will also received about £90,000 in payments in to his pension fund. Shepeherd's numbers are £500k per year. They always put the club first, and never, ever took a penny out that wasn't totally deserved. Just keep in your head that from the season ticket money paid in for next season from roughly 1000 fans will be paying it straight to Shepherd, another 1000 paying it straight to Douglas Hall. Don't ever forget their true legacy.

Jeff Stelling, who asked the question, expected Sam to take the opportunity to robustly defend himself, instead he flounced off. Stelling was mortified, as he has known Sam for years and they (used to) get on really well.

the evening game at Forest during the miners strike was the worst atmosphere I've been. It was 90 minutes of abuse from each set of supporters to the other. After the game the police were beating up Newcastle supporters as they left the ground. I'd never seen anything like it.

Derby to Nottingham is 15 miles, 30 minutes, on a good day. Rivalry picked up when Cloughie went (via Leeds and Brighton) from winning the league with Derby to doing the same with Forest. Quite bitter rivalry but in a small town sort of way. Derby always somehow felt a bigger club, despite the later Forest successes. The Forest-County rivalry is liek the Boro-Hartlepool one

I lived in Nottingham in the mid 80s. Went to quite a few games, including the Uefa semi-final against Anderlecht in 84. Lovely spring evening and they got 28,000. Cloughie was livid. As with all the E.Midlands clubs they can fill their smaller grounds when things are going very very well, the rest of the time there is little desire. 50,000 is a daft size for them

Pre-Sky there was no opportunity to have any real interest in any club but your own. Pre-Sky games weren't as overhyped but they were still dull. Watching Liverpool win 1-0 with Hansen and Lawrenson passing the ball back to Brucie was the definition of tedius. As for the level of players, they were distinctly poorer 20 years ago, but that may just be better training and athleticism, not really a SKy outcome.

Dunno. Would you expect our defence under Allardyce to improve, or would you expect it to be as bad as Bolton's. His side conceded 5 more goals than us, this is us with Bramble, Carr, Babayaro, Ramage, Huntington, Moore. So they were collectively better than what Sam created at Bolton ?? We know our defence is crap, cos we can see it, and we keep getting told it. We also know Allardyce's is better cos again we keep being told it. Beware what you read in the papers, it doesn't always make sense.

says every team in the Premiership

means he's mad, and has too much money to play with mackems.gif

If Dyer was good enough we wouldn't be discussing it. No one asks whether Shay should be shipped out. No one is saying get rid of Owen. They are just good enough, withotu any great question to be raised. That Dyer after 8 years is still a player we hope will be good enough "next season" shows he's not

Is Dyer a forward ? No. He cannot finish consistently. Is Dyer a winger ? No, not really. Can play wide but doesn't really beat his man and rarely gets a telling ball in to the box. Is Dyer a central midfielder ? No, too light, cannot tackle, cannot see a great pass Is Dyer a full back ? Completely unknown. Only logic in this is a success as an emergency against Villa once, and that Solano, a completely different type of player has moved there successfully. Is Dyer a good substitute ? Absolutely. Is second best in lots of positions, can cover everywhere, can introduce a change of pace/style. Is Dyer worthy of being a key member of our squad solely to impress as a late-on sub ? Not for me. Any amount of money would do but over £5m and I'm delighted

I won't take it away, it's just that it won't be updated again, hopefully

The www.nufc-finances.org.uk has come to the end of its useful life. I'd like to thank those of you who helped me with it, those who spotted the odd error that needed corrected, and especially those who argued against every single word in it, without even looking at it I'd like to hope that it made a few people aware of what we had in the board room. I hope that no one will have to try and do the same exercise again in 15 years time.

Great evening out. Stayed at pals flat in Skem for the weekend, which was an eye-opener. Not really sure how I missed all the trouble, maybe because I was gong somewhere local and not the usual places trying to get away from the city. Game was demoralising. We were as good as we'd been for years and we were just taken apart. Made me nervous about promotion.

Newcastle United .... http://www.nufc-finances.org.uk/payrol4.gif

There used to be a guy on here who liked to tell us how well we were doing under the stewardship of the current board. One of the things quoted was our "average" finishing position. Of much debate was how you defined "average" finishing position. One way if to take all the finishing positions and divide it by the number of years. This one is shown below, and covers the last 10 seasons. We are now dead equal with Villa, a side most of us would view as being nothing special at all. Under the present board we have been the equivalent of Villa in the league. We have hugely underachieved in the last 10 years. 6 times in the bottom half of the league, twice in the top 4. Hopefully the mediocrity that the departing chairman has overseen while trying to bankrupt the club has now passed. It cannot happen too soon Man Utd 1.8 Arsenal 2.1 Chelsea 3.4 Liverpool 3.9 Aston Villa 9.4 Newcastle 9.4 Tottenham 9.9 Everton 12.0 Middlesbrough 13.2 West Ham 13.9 Blackburn 14.7

he didn't splash the cash,he took risks with borrowing that previous boards wouldn't.the only money he put in was in buying shares,story goes the only cash they put in was lady hall's £250,000 for kilcline. and if you turn full circle you end up exactly where you were in the first place Exactly, he loaned the club a small amount. I admire the bloke for seeing an oppurtunity and going for it. People seem to work on the assumption that if Hall hadnt come along there wouldnt have been anybody else around. We wouldnt have got Keegan, we wouldnt be sitting in a massive stadium. Try telling that to Chelsea, Man U, Reading, Wigan, Portsmouth, Man C, L'pool, Villa, Arsenal, Boro, South'ton, S'land, even Darlo ffs........loads of clubs with new owners/grounds etc. It's totally inconcievable that we'd be still lying in the old 3rd division with the same crappy board and don't quote Leeds thats a different case. The Halls and the Sheppards have bought the club for f*** all, put no money in, except to purchase more shares when they were cheap, and used it as a cash cow. Massive salaries, massive dividends ( from a bussiness that aint ever made a profit ). As I say, I admire their shrewd judgement but they're parasites. I only wish I had the cash. John Hall would not be Life President and he deffo wouldnt have a stand named after him. And his son would be punched till my hand dropped off That's very big on hindsight. The logic of others having new grounds etc is fair, they do. If we'd dropped to the old third division we wouldn't have had any of the fun of the Keegan years. We would be a Man City or a sunlun. Getting there, in an up and down sort of way. Sir John kick-started it all. He invested well when no on eelse would. He made his money back by the tie the share lauch came in 1997. Everythign up to then is faulless. After that he left two incomptetents to run the place. They leeched every penny they could and ran the place abysmally.

Roy Aitken's was a pretty exciting game. 4-1 down with 15 minutes left and won 5-4. It'd be nice to say Aitken was key to this, but he wasn't

sadly my dad does, regularly