Cronky

It took me back to the 70's, that. Bad though it was to see a game end in that unsporting way, I don't like what Chelsea stand for and I'm glad they're out.

Chelsea are carving through Inter at will now. Inter have got to score in the second half, because I can't see them keeping Chelsea goalless.

It's a bit of a climbdown - from let's raise £100 million and buy the club to let's all put on spiderman masks.

I wish I could be sure that's a pisstake. It is sooooooooooooooo bad.

He's very like Cloughie, in that he uses that brash self-confidence and unorthodox spirit to instil confidence in his players. The message that he always gives to his team is - I'm not afraid therefore there's no need for you to be. I don't think the guy is particularly funny though. And unlike Clough, he doesn't always play fair.

As I said, I would have agreed provided SBR had a genuinely decent replacement lined up - Kluivert would NOT have counted as that replacement. Whatever your opinion on the footballing side of things, it was Robson's call to make. When a Chairman over-rules his manager on a football matter because of what the fans might think, the club is clearly not being run in the right way. That was the start of the slippery slope. From Shepherd's point of view, I think he was right in anticipating that there would be a backlash from most fans, but it's part of his job to back his manager when he comes under fire. We've had plenty of talk over the last 2 years about 'fan power' and the supposed desirability of getting some representation in the running of the club. Trouble is, the general collective opinion of the fans is sometimes dead wrong, and the position of the professionals who are going to be held responsible for results on the pitch has to be respected.

Agree with your observations. Beckham's value to England is more outside the field than on it (though he would have still played a part and maybe got 1-2 assists). I can see Beckham playing that mentor sort of role as a player who has seen it all before to calm the nerves of some of the young ones who might be nervous playing in the first WC. The latest news indicates that Capello does want Beckham to play a role (not as a player obviously) in the World Cup, the role is still vague, but for someone like Capello to make that invitation says it all on Beckham's value to the England camp. If that's true (and I doubt it), then it would be a mistake. Beckham should stay well away from the training camp. The players don't need the distraction of an injured colleague who will be having to deal with his own feelings at missing out. I've got to say that this idea that Beckham acts as a mentor to other players is a very, very recent idea. It only seems to have circulated after the prospect of him missing out has arisen, and looks like a kind of sympathy vote. Beckham doesn't look to me like a coach in the making.

There certainly needs to be unity between players, manager and owner for a club to succeed. In the later stages of Sir Bob's time here that unity was fractured and for me the crucial point was when Robson proposed to accept Liverpool's offer for Shearer and Shepherd over ruled him. The reason given was that the fans would not accept it, but I actually think Shepherd was one of those fans and was as starry eyed about the Geordie legend as anyone else. As a professional, it's no surprise that Sir Bob noticed the early signs of Shearer's decline that bit earlier than others, but the main point is that he was responsible for that kind of footballing judgment and Shepherd's job was to look after the financial side. He shouldn't have been over-ruled. Contrast that when Sir John backed Keegan's decision to sell Andy Cole, despite his misgivings. We come back to this not just because it was the turning point, but because there are lessons to be learned. Putting particular people on pedastals can cloud the judgement, and our club has a tendency to go down that route.

Yes, but it wasnt until he left that the rot started to really show. I know it was fashionable to knock shearer towards the end of his career, but all clubs need a figurehead. Somebody to set standards and command respect. Its no coincidence when he came back he stated that youre not going to take the piss out of this football club, for after he left there was nobody at the club of sufficient stature to keep the overpaid wasters we had on the books from taking the piss. Unfortunately it wasn't fashionable to knock Shearer towards the end of his career. Even when he looked like he was running through treacle, most fans still supported him and it was that hero status that kept him in the first team for two seasons too long. The failure to deal with Shearer's retirement properly cost us our best manager and started our decline.

Adam Johnson I hope. That would be a quite amazing turnaround. In the Championship in the autumn, in the World Cup by summer. He's never got a callup, however, will Capello put in the squad a player that he's never worked with? It's a big ask. But I'd like to think Capello will judge him purely on his form in the next 8 weeks. My concern is he won't get enough game time to impress. What struck me yesterday was Johnson's composure. He got into the game right away, didn't make any silly, headstrong decisions, kept the ball well and was effective. That kind of temperament is what you need for the pressure of international football. SWP and Walcott have more experience at that level, but their decision-making is still a bit suspect. That might tip things in Johnson's favour, in that with SWP and Walcott you have a similar package - quick players who are good at getting past the full back but not very reliable in other aspects. Johnson offers something different on the right.

I think that's the situation she was hoping to rectify.

Everything he's done for the past 3 years has been geared towards ££££££££££££££££££ tbh. whereever he goes, he's gonna be loaded for life. its obvious how much he loves playing for his country, even if its only 10 minutes. he comes across as a really good person. with his final chance gone for england, does anyone think he might retire now? That only makes his decision to go to America & chase the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ even stranger. He had this weird messianic vision of making football popular in the US, he isn't paid anything he wouldn't have got in other places when he left Real imho. (6,5 million dollars a season I think). He has indeed brought exposure to the game there and abroad, but I think he overrated himself a tad too much. I've always thought that decision was driven by his wife, and her desire to join the Hollywood celebrity circuit. I think she's the one who wears the trousers.

Well, with Beckham out and Lennon doubtful, things are opening up for SWP, Walcott and AN Other. I was quite impressed with Adam Johnson today. He looked like a player that won't freeze on the big occasion. Maybe it's too late for him, but if I were Capello I'd give him a chance. And I won't pretend I'm sorry that Beckham's not going.

Said this a few pages back but then context is usually a casualty in these type of debates. The horrendous decision making of Ashley since buying the club has absolutely nothing at all to do with the previous Board, to suggest otherwise is a nonsense imo. There has been a litany of errors committed by Ashley that have nothing to do with the previous Board: For 2 seasons causing stagnation and uncertainty within the club. Demotivating the players by putting them all up for sale. Appointing Keegan, a manager unsuited to his plan.When attempting to implement his plan, making a poor appointment in Wise. Bringing in Kinnear on a temporary basis, resulting in yet more stagnation and uncertainty. Replacing Kinnear with a coach. Replacing that coach with Shearer, a temporary manager of a sort. Replacing Shearer with a coach, Hughton. No significant improvement in playing staff in preparation for the current season. A lack of direction from the top undermining preparation. Failing to really appoint a proven manager at all since the departure of Keegan. Complaining about the wage bill yet being responsible for much of it by calling the shots when the club signed the likes of : Viduka, Barton, Rozenhal, Geremi, Smith, Cacapa, Beye, Coloccini, Enrique, Xisco, Gutierrez, Gonzalez. Undermining himself by sitting with fans in the stands and by going around with "Smith" on the back of a Newcastle top. Creating the environment in which the likes of apparently previously settled players such as Milner, N'Zogbia, Given, Martins and Bassong all wanted to leave. Some of those were probably not on a massive take home, comparatively speaking and would have probably been of some assistance in the quest to retain PL status, lost by 1 point. Willingness to blame the supporters for everything. Appointing first Mort and then Llambias to an important role. There will be other blunders to add to this list but I've got something to do right now and this is all pretty much off the top of my head. Sorry if some of these are incorrect, I'm sure someone will point it out as a part of any debate. From the day Ashley took over the club until ~2 months ago he's been taking the club backwards and that is of concern regardless of whether he has recently decided to attempt to reverse that trend. Since the turn of 2010 Ashley appears to be steering the club in the right direction by allowing the manager to boost the numbers in the squad. Big Deal! All blunders pale into insignificance beside that one. So many of the other decisions stemmed from it.

That sense of communal optimism and well being. The last six years have been like one extended grumble.

He does have a sense of humour, but I suspect not that kind (ie a sense of the surreal)

The big problem is we got relegated, and doesn't Keegan and his little flounce bear at least some of the blame there? A lot boils down to how you see that particular episode. While Ashley made some mistakes, we could have expected a bit more of Keegan. If you think Keegan had absolutely no choice in the situation, then you'll blame Ashley entirely, I know. I'd say he was looking for a way out and didn't care what mess he left behind.

Man, it is just that sort of contribution that earned you the worst poster award.

Not quite sure what the thread is asking for, but this is my XI of players who really didn't look like they wanted to be there - Hooper Domi Halliday Boumsong Pistone Hodges Bassedas Maric Luque Xisco Andersson Glyn Hodges man of the match. To those not familiar with the name, we bought him from Wimbledon in the 1980's, and right from the start he seemed to be a man with a problem. We sold him back down south after about 6 weeks.

It wasn’t the ability to get past an opponent like Messi that I was thinking of here. After all, the other three aren’t known for that either. What the other three can do is get forward, exchange quick passes around the penalty box, take chances when time and space is limited – all the things that demand instant, close control of the ball under pressure. Beckham plays – or tries to play – like a quarterback, where everything’s in front of him and he has time to pick his cross or his pass. He even plays like that when he’s out wide. Effectively, he hides from the things he’s not good at, and we can all look good if we play like that. It means that the rest of the team has to fit in around his needs, and that’s not always to the benefit of the team. The really best midfield players are all-rounders who can adapt to whatever’s going on round them and damage the opposition in all sorts of different situations. The other three can do that, but Beckham can’t.

I'm genuinely surprised at the level of support for Beckham. He's good at what he does do well (ie crossing, dead balls) but there's quite a few gaps in his range of skills. Even at his peak, he rarely got behind a defence or got on the end of chances in the box like the other three. He's a player that likes to play behind the crowded areas and spray passes. He's not good at keeping the ball under pressure and tends to avoid those tight situations.

Absolutely top ref, and it's great to see him back. He always seemed to have a good rapport with the players, and didn't take himself too seriously. I always remember a Leeds - Arsenal game a few years ago, where the lead-up was really explosive, with so much speculation of players settling scores. He did a superb job of keeping the lid on the pace and mood of the game, and that created a lasting impression with me.

What you haven't mentioned is that Beckham had spent the previous 89 minutes of that game, rushing around like a headless chicken, trying to do everybody's job except his own. He rescued the team from a bad overall performance, but he did much to create the poor performance himself. Getting over-involved and mucking up the formation is a fault that has largely gone from his game, but it nearly cost us dearly on that occasion. So you would have preferred he stayed in his nice little right midfield box while everyone else fucked up our chances of qualification? Beckham ran the show that day, and rightfully too. Bit of a cause and effect debate. My point was that his running the show nearly fucked up our chances of qualification. He ended up running into Lampard and Gerrard's space, crowding them out and leaving us with no outlet on the right. I know the general theory is that Beckham was a hero that day, but I'm not the only one who sees it a bit differently. A similar thing happened in that later qualifying game against Northern Ireland, only in that instance we didn't get away with it and ended up getting beaten 1-0. We had two of the best midfield players in Europe in Gerrard and Lampard, but then employed an idiot to bang the ball over their heads. Thankfully, Eriksson never made the same mistake again.

What you haven't mentioned is that Beckham had spent the previous 89 minutes of that game, rushing around like a headless chicken, trying to do everybody's job except his own. He rescued the team from a bad overall performance, but he did much to create the poor performance himself. Getting over-involved and mucking up the formation is a fault that has largely gone from his game, but it nearly cost us dearly on that occasion.

In the last 5 years we've been in danger of being relegated more than once to be honest Following Sir Bob's departure, it was every year.