Unbelievable

I loved when Valencia challenged for the tile in the early noughties and actually won La Liga twice. Shame these days are now almost certainly over, in the same way we will never be able to compete with the likes of Chelsea and City unless we get a sugar daddy owner. I fail to see why anybody would WANT this situation to arise. Much rather have a situation like in Germany, France and Holland where there are about 4 or 5 teams each season fighting it out for the title and where your dark horse (AZ Alkmaar, Twente, Lille, Montpellier) can actually win the damn thing once in a while.

Huh? What is it?

Our forgotten man is currently our fourth choice centre forward as it stands, so wouldn't be surprised to see him feature occasionally if we don't get another striker in. Has he featured in any preseason game for the reserves at all, just wondering what his fitness level is in case of an emergency? As for the poll, looks like it will have to be option number 3

Oooh, should have been 2-2

2-1!

Not a bad shout tbf, didn't Twente sign him to replace De Jong btw? They did indeed.

Luc Castaignos

On 14 million man Fletcher: Read more: http://www.readytogo.net/smb/showthread.php?t=724931#ixzz24UGw7IQZ

Jack Colback is actually a decent Premiership midfield player, which is as good as it gets for them (in the centre of midfield).

Having finished fifth and then seen the teams in third and fourth lose several of their best players (although Chelsea should improve), seventh would be considered a disappointment imo. You are right, fourth may not be completely unrealistic, but that is the case for quite a few clubs at the moment: Arsenal, Spurs, Liverpool and Everton. We're in that bracket of clubs now, and last season we were ahead of some of them (and Chelsea) because they had a disappointing season and we had a terrific one. I am not about to take it as a given that we will be above at least two of that list again, which is what you need to be to better seventh, and even that is disregarding the possibility of a surprise package like us last season to enter the fray. The aim should be fourth, because you need to aim high, but it certainly shouldn't be the expectation if you will, which is what it seems to be for some of you.

Or else?

What does "falling behind" entail might I ask? Would you qualify this new season as a failure if we "only" managed to finish, say, in seventh? I know I wouldn't, especially considering the top teams don't think twice about spending over 100 million in one transfer window these days. We've made huge steps forward in the last 3 years or so, but we shouldn't feel a sense of entitlement when it comes to qualifying for Europe. It will be very hard work if we want to achieve it again this year, just like it was last year.

Got some stick for this, worth a bump, Aye, still wouldn't say he's quicksilver, but certainly looks more useful than I expected him to be based on his first preseason outings. Well done, hope he keeps it up and becomes an important player for us.

Disagree with your Dutch mates about Douglas but the rest is pretty much spot on. Ideally I would want an owner (be it Ashley or somebody else) who is willing to invest in us to challenge for that next step (and I think it wouldn't take hundreds of millions either with the correct setup, which we seem to have), but at the same time I'm perfectly happy at this point in time to even be challenging for Europe again, let alone be in it. If you'd told me this 3 years ago I would probably have had you institutionalised.

Confident he will play. As other have said, we wouldn't have played Anita for the full 90 minutes the other night if he was a question mark.

Still got 7 goals in his last two seasons despite being a bit part player for Man City. Also has more pace than you give him credit for.

Also rumours he'll be their best ever paid player. Now he would improve them significantly, but they would be paying well over the odds again. Imagine what we could have done with the 30 million they're shelling out on Fletcher and Johnson.. Thing is, that's what they have to do to get decent to good players to go there. I really like both Fletcher and Johnson and while I don't want either here, I think they'll be two of their best players (if Johnson signs) this season and for the next couple. The problem is, when you're signing at such a premium, you're hurting the club financially and stopping it from moving forward properly. The only model that could make Sunderland a top football club would be one where they had an incredibly good scouting system and picked up young players like we're doing. Unfortunately, they have Marty who likes to blow his load all over the place Agreed. For a club like them to attract relatively established players they simply have to pay over the odds, especially in terms of wages, for the player to even consider the move. The alternative, spending sensibly and trying to develop younger players doesn't seem to be on the agenda, which has only been aggravated by bringing MON in. They have been reporting operating losses of 30 odd million per year for a few seasons now. The next set of accounts will be absolutely horrific unless they manage to sell one of their players to Liverpool again.

Also rumours he'll be their best ever paid player. Now he would improve them significantly, but they would be paying well over the odds again. Imagine what we could have done with the 30 million they're shelling out on Fletcher and Johnson..

Why? You have to ask why paying £14m for Fletcher isn't moronic? £14m... Ah sorry, thought that was about Johnson. Apologies.

I'd rather have Johnson than Obertan tbh. This is isn't football manager, Johnson wouldn't be any more than a squad player for us. To be fair, I think he wouldn't look out of place in our first 11. We don't need him as we have other, comparable options, but if we were looking for a winger I wouldn't mind him. As for the mackems, he's much better than anything they've got, so definitely a good signing for them.

Why?

Fletcher is a decent signing for them, albeit they've hugely overpaid. If they can somehow get Adam Johnson as well they look quite good going forward. A solid midtable season beckons.

Up against YoCab's Dreamboat in the H2H