afar

The resignation and disappointment at the idea of McClaren is slowly being replaced by the horror of them actually giving the job to Carver. In many ways I would actually prefer it to be Carver. Guaranteed unmitigated disaster. Would plunge us immediately into a relegation fight, the hand sitters at SJP, even they would be up in arms, crowds will plummet. Ashley and Co. would be even more vilified. With McClaren it will be more of the same, picking up our "participated" ribbons, with the only excitement being the potential of a relegation fight. The hand sitters will join with the "at least it's not carver" crowd to be placated and all is well in the world of of "Sports Direct United, presented by Wonga ".

He's not who I wanted but it's not the worst appointment we could make. I mean he is an actual manager which is more than can be said for the last four appointments we've made. I think people are going way over the top in dismissing McClaren out of hand. Under this regime it's probably as good as it's going to get. Dismissing McClaren is what his last 4 employers have done.

I don't think it's a case of "if" anymore it's "when". And I think you are being wildly optimistic. Sacked at Wolfsburg, Sacked on return to Twente, Sacked at Championship clubs Forest and Derby County ! That's stellar.

Not when this arsehole is the manager it doesn't. What makes Carr this "super" scout ? because we got a bargain in Cabaye, brought in Sissoko on the cheap before his contract ran down and a few promising youngsters in Haidara and Perez ? There's really not much else of note on his resume, remember the team he's helped to build has finished 16th, 10th and 15th in the last 3 season (under awful management but still there has been an acknowledgment that the squad has simply not been good enough). Is this really better than the scouting they have at clubs like Southampton, Swansea, Crystal Palace or any other club that finished way above us last year. "Jobs for the boys" very rarely if ever works. Carr isn't going anywhere though, so you might as well bring in someone that will work with him, surely?! IMO Carr has done a good job getting players in, and it's a damn shame they haven't been used properly for the most part. A chief scout is far less important than a good manager. If needs be peddle him and get a chief scout in who is willing to work for the good of the club rather than getting his mates a job. Absolutely, madness having a structure where the manager has to get on with the chief scout in order to be in consideration for the role.

I have defended Carr plenty in the (even recent) past, but I agree his role in this charade is quite contemptible. With his knowledge of European football you would have expected him to be able to pinpoint an up and coming manager that fits the profile, rather than a past it mate of his. Smacks of putting his personal priorities above that off the club, something I was confident he off all people in charge at the club was not interested in. Agreed

Not when this arsehole is the manager it doesn't. What makes Carr this "super" scout ? because we got a bargain in Cabaye, brought in Sissoko on the cheap before his contract ran down and a few promising youngsters in Haidara and Perez ? There's really not much else of note on his resume, remember the team he's helped to build has finished 16th, 10th and 15th in the last 3 season (under awful management but still there has been an acknowledgment that the squad has simply not been good enough). Is this really better than the scouting they have at clubs like Southampton, Swansea, Crystal Palace or any other club that finished way above us last year. "Jobs for the boys" very rarely if ever works.

This is a freakin disgrace tbh. Why is this guy even in consideration, all because of bloody Carr, and people insist on giving him a free pass !! If they think this appointment is going to sell season tickets they are sadly mistaken, mind you they probably don't give a damn.

One thing we shouldn't discount about Vieira is the fact that players will be drawn to sign for us much more than they would for Carver or McClaren. I put Vieira into my acceptable bucket, in terms of an appointment. Charver and McClaren are firmly in the unacceptable bucket. I have Clement in the unacceptable bucket too, because I don't buy the hype on him right now, until I know a little bit more about him, he's a potential Charver/Alan Irvine type of appointment.

Give it up, it's never going to catch on. Awful. I know

The fact that also McCrapren didn't have the courage to take on the job with 3 games left in a time of need, would have precluded his name from any short list in any sane club. He bottled that opportunity. He lacked the foresight too, to see that it as a better bet for him to be rolling a dice on a big club in the prem rather that staying a a championship club where he would ultimately be sacked, is not a good sign for a manager. No bottle or foresight not good things for a manager to lack.

McClaren has failed at pretty much everywhere he's been, apart from one dutch title and a league cup at Boro over 10 years ago, I'm not sure where this "he's won trophies across Europe" comes from. Bloody hell Graeme Souness has a way way better trophy collection record that McCrapren.

Why? Zero experience is a major concern. Compared with someone who has domestic,European and International experience. Would love Vieira to be a top manager for us but it just doesn't feel right. Another huge gamble when we have so many proven managers out there willing to take the job. KK had zero experience, hell he hadn't even coached reserves before. Take a chance on Vierra over the known crap factor of McLaren or Charver any day of the week.

I don't know about this match in particular, but I do know that it was actually reasonably common in the 80s when English clubs played abroad, for there to be a lot of English fans there, who didn't support the team, but were after trouble. Also, at the time, we had tens of thousands of soldiers stationed in Germany, and it was quite well known for a lot of them to go to matches when English teams played nearby. We played at Anderlecht in the European Cup semi final in 1982, and there was s*** loads of trouble. So much we were worried about getting kicked out for a while. It is pretty much an accepted truth amongst our fans that, although yes, of course it was our idiots causing most of the trouble, there were a lot of p*ssed up squaddies there who were up for it. When the Anderlecht fans started chanting "Argentina" (this was while the Falklands war was going on), it got particularly nasty. Not saying that there were a lot of non Liverpool fans involved at Heysel, as I don't know, just saying that back in the day it was quite common for outsiders to get involved. Culturally it was a completely different time as well. When English teams played in Europe, no matter who they were the bulk of the country were behind them. These hooligans saw it a a case for national pride, and attached themselves to any English club competing in Europe.

If he signs you get a squad player for peanuts, no doubt, I'll be surprised if he signs the deal unless there is just no market for him. We did exactly the same thing with Inman, think we got a couple of thousand for him, that could pay off Charvers contract !!

Thought Charver was on a beach someplace, I'm not buying this.

Scroll up guys, compensation.

Their fans gave it Billy Big Bollocks because their team was so good and they didn't like anyone saying otherwise or challenging their best fans tag. I had trouble at Anfield in the KK cup game and even up here in his Farewell game. Great side they had, they were followed by some right toe rags. They've been trying to rewrite large parts of their history. Not met a single good humoured Lpool fan, met some who've given it the jolly scouser routine as a prelude to bother. Had a car load of them trying to flag us down on the A69 looking for a fight. s*** Houses. No doubt, I remember one game at SJP, I think it was the one we drew and Frank Pingle scored off the back of his head. I was sat in the old wooden west stand and a couple of Liverpool fans were sat right behind me. They spent the whole game taking the piss out of Miradihna, some of it was humour today we would be shocked at but they were pretty funny, we had a good banter going back and forth with them. But got to remember where they come from, one of the poorest cities in the country with some sectarian influence too at a troubled time. Like a fair few in the Gallowgate Corner, there was a lot of undesirables in their support. Every club had that element to them tos ome degree, only Liverpool seemed to think and the media seemed to portray them as different, Hysell changed all that.

Sad that after all this shit, this man is re-elected tells you all you need to know about that organisation.

I don't dispute that but they certainly did not have a reputation for a hooligan element in Europe, like the national team certainly had and they played in Europe much more than anyone else back then. Anyway the point I was making was that they went from a perceived (whether that was self only is open to debate) good reputation, to being the epitome of an era of shame for English football and they didn't like that one bit, so naturally have attempted to push it under the carpet for so long.

See ya. Don't let the door hit you n the way out !!

Left on a high, best of luck to him and thanks so much for you passion for playing in the Black White stripes, if only everyone had the same amount of passion we would have had a great team.

Absolutely, he's been offered a new contract because of the compensation rule. I would bet it will be a seriously low contract, if he signs it fine, we have some squad cover for next to nothing, if not we get compensation from whatever team signs him. It's a smart move.

Agreed he would have to be the worst scout in the world to have recommended Riv over the likes of PEA and Lacazette. He clearly identified those and the Owner and MD clearly failed to get them "over the line".

What's bothered me often is the opposite to be honest, the amount of free passes Carr has been getting, while as the club has stated he is part of the Trifecta making decisions on the resources within the club. He's part of the decision making process to put Carver in charge of the club for a 5 month period where we went from 9th to needing to win our last game in order to secure survival. He's also part of the decision making process that has twice apparently courted a coach that's just been sacked from a Championship club for failing to get them up, a coach whose very limited success was well in the past. The truth is though none of us know, how much of a influence Carr is on the "Football Board" and how much power he wields, or how much his advice is heeded or ignored. Is it a simple majority vote on who to bring in between the 3 or does a person with zero background in the game make the final decision, and does that decision then go to the owner for approval ? But what we do know is that he is in a position of power to a football club which is under performing to a ridiculous degree.

They ran towards a neutral area of the ground, which was mostly filled with Juve fans, those "neutral" fans were completely innocent victims no doubt about that and the guilt lies firmly with the Liverpool fans who did as you say run towards them. The wall itself was not fit forpurpose, but that wouldn't have been an issue had the Liverpool fans not behaved in the way they did. There were however a hell of a lot Juve hooligans as well, they were located at the other end of the stadium though well away from the Liverpool fans, those pictures of them masked and running onto the field were clearly shown on the TV, it was just a long way for them to get to the Liverpool fans. I remember watching it vividly. The Juve fans rioting at the other end of the pitch was after the wall had collapsed, it was in response to what had happened at the Liverpool/Neutral end, they had nothing to do with the disaster itself which was caused by a couple of hundred Liverpool fans in a crowd of almost 60K. The banners they had with them, the masks they used to conceal their faces, clearly showed they had premeditated something, if the roles had been reversed and these Juve fans had been located in the area the Liverpool hooligans had been with that ridiculous wall separating them from multitudes of Liverpool fans. I would not have been surprised if the situation would have happen again only in reverse. There was clearly ill feeling between the two sets of fans for some years, Liverpool were the kings of Europe while Juve were busy buying the best players on the continent to dethrone them.The rivalry had spilled over to violence and tension building throughout the day. Both teams had the hooligan element though, whether Juve fans were reacting to what happened or not, Juve fans just didn't turn into hooligans because of the tragedy, it was very much there and they were both looking for a fight. Anyone who went to see ourselves play in inter in the San Siro in the Champs League will testify that Italian football fans are no angels and apparently Liverpool fans had been subjected to some pretty awful treatment in the previous years final which had been ridiculously held in Rome against Roma. Again not exonerating Liverpool here, but trying to strike some balance. Good post. But the bit in bold is exactly what I was referring to when scousers make excuses about Heysel. What's that got to do with the price of fish? Hooliganism was common place in those times, hooligans from a different team, in a different city gave you a bit of a hiding. So you use that as some kind of excuse to kick off? Not buying it. You're right, nothing really, just trying to show how the two parties viewed one another. There was definitely an England versus Italy thing going on back then, England were the dominant country in terms of club football back then, there was a stretch where English clubs only won the European Cup. England believed they had the best league in the world and results in Europe proved that with Liverpool being the dominant club. Italy though was at the beginning of it' own dominance of the club game. Their league was the place to be for much of the world's talent. Naturally the nationalists from both countries saw this as a banner to fight behind and that fed into the hooliganism we saw during the period. Liverpool fans were seen as the good guys in this era really, they were never really tarnished with the hooligan brush that many London based clubs or the national team were. It's easy though to be good fans when you win everything, I guess!! Anyway they had obviously felt that sense of injustice from the previous final, some groups like the NF had infiltrated their ranks and all this led to the disaster of the 1985 final. I think they are so happy to sweep this under the carpet as a club, because firstly none of their own died in the stadium and secondly they were so outraged that anyone could find fault with their support, they felt they were beyond criticism and it hit them suddenly that they were just part of the problem like every other team in the country. There is definitely a sense of shame there, the Hillsborough disaster a couple of years later in a sense helped them push Hysell under the carpet as they were the victims this time.