Odear

Shelvey has been a passenger all game, Saivet doesn't know when to pass a ball, Mbemba looks drunk, Colo back to his usual "couldn't give a toss" mode, Sissoko doing his sulking when he can't out muscle the opposition, Aarons... wants to play for Arsenal? Good luck with that kid.. they don't exactly like giving the ball away.. Mitrovic just not at the races and Wijnaldum is probably wondering why everyone around him are so sh*t.

Aarons is doing my head in. Balls that he could easily get to and he waits for the Watford player to get on the ball.

They couldn't be any worse in the 2nd than the first, Watford are awful also. It really won't take much to beat them. Down to you Shteve. You tried a line up which we all thought would be ok, it's not. Players either not fit or not up to speed with the league. With no natural left back we are totally off balance, Mbemba even looks shaky. I'd prefer to see Coloccini playing there. Lascelles did ok apart from one mistake which was almost punished. Aarons has to go off. For who I don't know.

Getting worse as the half goes on.

Agreed, not prepared to get stuck in at all. Perez will be on for him at half time

Too many mistakes. We should be winning this

Saivet has looked a bit wreckless so far

Lascelles towers over all of them.

I still hate the dippers with a passion, but they did us a favour there. Norwich are in the shit now, probably more so than Swansea. Villa are down. I have a feeling the mackems will scrape enough points by end of season, if they win today it brings Bournemouth right into the mix. We could easily go either way. Today is a must win, especially while teams around us are playing each other.

Madness! What a game.

I would say it's purely tactical. Perez can't play as a winger, doesn't have the pace. Aarons has it to burn (depending on how long he stays on the pitch) Really just shows how little McClaren trusts Thauvin if he can't get on the pitch in place of a player who probably isn't match fit.

Happy with that. Lots of pace around Mitrovic. And Wijnaldum plays that position better than Perez.

He was Monaco's leading goalscorer the season before he came here if I remember correctly. Also very hard to judge a player who came into the colossus of a goat f*%k that was last season

Is Berahino any better than Lua Lua was? (similar players imho) And would Lua Lua be worth around 20m in todays market?

Tottenham are rarely silly with money... they certainly wouldn't do a deal that was not in their best interest. Modric, Berbatov, Bale etc.. the only time I can remember them being done was when Sol Campbell left in his prime. They would have sold him a year or two earlier if they had any idea he'd go to Arsenal. That's why i'm suspicious about the whole Townsend thing, if he's 14m quid worth of winger and they are going for a top 4, why not keep him? Definitely not like they have to sell before they can buy either.

Would be disappointed if we let Perez go, he's a classy player. Bit short on pace at times but his skill makes up for that. If he ever goes back to La Liga (or when) he will play his best football. Could easily see Madrid coming in for him at some stage in the next few years. Would be a mistake for him to move to Spurs. Latest is that the Tiote deal appears to be off so that could well stall everything. I wonder if the smog levels in Shanghai caused his mind to snap and he believed he was being tricked into signing for Middlesborough

Am not doubting that Berahino is a good player, my only reservations are about what sort of character he is. The club have already taken a risk with Shelvey (one that could well pay off) but if things don't go well we could end up with a couple of very expensive bad eggs, anyone old enough to remember Dyer and Bowyer's handbags will remember what a low point that was. However, everyone deserves their chance. If he does come here, he'll be given as much of a chance as the next player to prove things.

There's nee debate, it's all history. The facts are in the stats, but the context depends entirely on how you feel about it. There's no argument to be won. I look back on HBA's time at the club with what if's. Parsnip takes a huge chunk of blame for that but the player isn't without some blame.

I think you're taking my original point well out of context, I made a comparison of Ben Arfa and Berahino based purely on attitude. Anyone who thinks HBA didn't cause problems is deluded. He was overweight at various points, is that something we should expect from a professional footballer? I am in no way disagreeing with you about his talent, him and Wijnaldum are the best players to have been at this club since the mid 90's on pure talent. But in the case of HBA, is the whole football world wrong about him? Think of all the clubs screaming out for a player of that talent, Man Utd, Chelsea etc.. why did they never show any interest in him? And I stand by my comment on the French league, some of the defending makes Mike Williamson look like Franco Baresi

So he had as many inept performances as he did good/class performances? That's just bullshit, unless you care to list the inept performances It's getting totally off point, but can you list the ones where he was class?

Like me? Someone who remembers a player being gash as often as they were brilliant? A realist perhaps then. Oh and whoever keeps posting links of him, he's doing that in a league where defending is practically non existent. Think back to how good Cabella and even Thauvin looked while they were still playing there. How often did he do it for us at PL level? Or for Hull City for that matter. I'm not saying it was because of a lack of talent, more down to his attitude. If he was prepared to work harder, he'd have played more and could well still be here.

Ben Arfa is a genius on his day but for every wonder goal like the one against Blackburn in the league cup, he'd have a game like he did against Brighton in the FA cup, anyone remember that one?

Regarding Shelvey, I still haven't made my mind up about him. Is he a good player and what the team have been missing? Yes of course. But am aware of the hatred some of the Swansea fans had towards him, that doesn't come out of thin air. I'll be open minded and support any player putting in an honest shift for us. Berahino wanted his spurs move, now they don't seem to be in for him any more, why is that? Spurs should easily be able to afford that. Or are they waiting for us to stump up 14 million for Townsend, that would cover most of any Berahino bid.

Tony Pulis (who is a more than decent manager) isn't playing Berahino because he's a disruptive git with a terrible attitude. The kid can be as talented as anyone, it doesn't matter though, it'll be the same as Ben Arfa. The first sign of it not going well, he'll be sulking and going on strike. No thanks. For that sort of money the club should stick a cheeky bid in for Vardy (am not assuming he'd want to come here, just that Leicester might listen to an offer of that size), quickest player in the league. Would be a perfect partner for Mitrovic. My word you are thick. Quite the opposite pal. Making a bid for Berahino is as out there as a bid for Vardy, the only difference being that West Brom want to sell because Berahino is a disruptive git. So what exactly is so thick with the statement? Or are you going to blame dyslexia on not reading my post properly? I should clarify, I did not suggest Ben Arfa went on strike but he did have a bad attitude, trained poorly and was inept in many games he played in. My comparison to Berahino is based purely on attitude.

How many Newcastle forums are still going? I came here from TOTT