TheBrownBottle

Christ, that last one. I always wondered what happened to the ‘Magic Bike Ride’ radgie

They aren’t too knackered then - and that’s the point. You don’t wait until they are to start rotating them. You avoid them becoming fatigued by rotating when they are fresh

He started with the same XI in the first five league games. It took knocks and injuries to start moving the team around. We’re not going to agree on this one by the looks of it madras - I think Howe is an excellent manager and I don’t want to see anyone else in charge, but I think he’s made errors this season and they’re catching up with us. We’ve had bad luck with some injuries, but our playing style has contributed to others. We’ve won one league away game in the last fourteen; if we lose at Anfield we’ve lost as many games as we’ve won this season, and there has been serious investment on the playing side. Howe isn’t immune from criticism - those calling for him to get the chop are being daft, but he’s not blameless for what’s happening. He can’t be given credit for when we’re winning and playing well but it’s nowt to do with him when we’re not.

Yep - they went up well beyond inflation. They didn’t come back down, even if they tapered off

I’m one of those who thought it was a really good window - so far I’m badly wrong. Not sure that Tonali loving a punt, Barnes seeing the shittest specialist in medicine or Hall being miles away could have been predicted mind

I agree re playing a weakened team in a QF - I’d rather rest players in a league game - but ‘mong’ isn’t necessary; it’s a horrible word mate.

No, I don’t think it is hindsight at all - I believe you were saying precisely that at the time. I’m one of those who hates seeing reserve XIs start cup games - if anyone is looking for those who hop up and down on the spot for that stuff, it’s me. I think Howe’s rotation has been insufficient in that it isn’t an all-or-nothing move. Swapping your right back one match, then a centre mid the next is how sensible rotation normally operates. We played the same starting XI in the first five league games of the season - the only time we had a full squad available. I doubt that will happen again.

NUFC crowds have a tendency to turn on their ‘own’ before others - not sure BDB would be immune to that tradition

I thought Howe’s management of that LC game was masterful tbh. He rotated, could see that there were issues, changed at HT and we looked like a different side second half. Perfect. Rotation doesn’t mean changing the entire XI for me, though. It means swapping out one or two players game by game. I still think we’ll see Howe doing that from now on - the man learns from his mistakes.

I agree the lad gets more pelters than some others, but trying is a minimum requirement really. A professional footballer putting some effort in really shouldn’t be particularly praiseworthy

They’re expensive vs average income; far more expensive than they were pre-1992, which is what I was driving at. The average age of a PL crowd is now mid-40s. No chance it was that pre-1992. They not cheap - they’re not as expensive as some other PL clubs.

No, he’s never been quick. He’s got a good ‘engine’, but he’s not fast. I’d also like to see him pushed further forward again. I’d like to see someone like Kalvin Phillips come in, and allow Bruno to be further forward / rested from time to time.

Yeah, when KK left the whole ‘chequebook manager’ shite was ongoing, but he brought in £20m in sales as well as £60m in signings (and the squad he left was definitely worth more than £40m). It was nearly impossible to cover for all positions back then - and the intensity of play reflected it. I do think that Gillespie’s injury bollocksed our season that year - we were never the same again. Funnily enough, I do think some of the criticism that could be levelled at KK could be levelled at Howe - Keegan wouldn’t drop Lee or Beardsley even when they were completely out of form, even though the likes of Watson and Huckerby were able to come in for a game or two. Howe and KK are very similar in that I always want to hear them talk. Robson and Benitez are the only other NUFC managers where I can say that. Howe isn’t super charismatic, but he’s likeable and level-headed.

Given Tonali isn’t likely to have suitors at present, it would be Joelinton - if only for the fact that he’d be likely to bring in the most money, and he’s free of amortisation at this point. Longstaff, Miles and Anderson are HG, you don’t want to be shifting those players. NB I don’t want us to sell Joelinton at the moment. Just answering the hypothetical.

ASM and Wood aren’t good enough for where NUFC want to be. You can keep the penny

Howe has said himself that he doesn’t like changing a team which won the game before. Then Benitez is the other end of the scale, and never saw a team he couldn’t change the week after. I think Howe’s too smart not to have learned from this experience. I don’t think he’ll go down the Benitez path, but I think once we have the majority of players back we’ll start seeing starting players shuffled around a bit more week by week

100%. That’s where I am with this.

Completely different era in fairness. KK doesn’t sell Ruel Fox the previous summer if he’s allowed more than a three man bench with one sub. No-one thought of squad rotation in 1995 other than Ferguson, who first started doing it in the League Cup the year before.

Part of the issue is cost. If you’re charging prices on a par with a decent west end production, then your ‘customers’ demand entertainment - they don’t make their own fun. The clubs willing took middle class money and betrayed the working class fan bases decades ago now. It’s why I get hacked off when I hear Klopp whining about atmosphere, or when Keane went on about ‘prawn sandwiches’. As if they can’t quite equate their exorbitant salaries requiring ticket prices which price out those more likely to create atmospheres. Football took the recommendations of Taylor Report to squeeze more money and change its supporter base. Atmospheres which are flatter than a witch’s tit are a consequence

The atmosphere changed the moment it went all-seater, and the final nail was the lop-sided extension in 2000. This is compounded by an ageing ST cohort sitting on their hands and day trippers. Large groups of young lads going together are usually what builds atmospheres. But they can’t attend as a block due to the impossibility of getting large number of tickets together, and the exorbitant cost means that many are priced out. Neither of these are likely to be fixed - in fact, they’re only likely to get worse. I’ve heard the same complaints re the atmosphere for decades; it isn’t going back to how it was, it isn’t going to be fixed. Safe standing won’t fix it because the places will still be mainly ST holders and not groups together; a ‘singing section’ is unlikely to fix it as those in there will age and not want to give up their seat. The entire ground is now what the West / Milburn seating was when I was a kid. The lower Leazes etc is now where many disabled supporters sit - you can’t just whack standing back wherever you want without causing issues to those who are there already.

Yeah, I think he’s played pretty well too. Off today today.

He literally used it as an excuse in his post match interview. Otherwise why raise it?

I’m going to just hop off this thread. People are getting far too defensive. I never said it’s all on the manager - it isn’t. I have seen the bench in recent weeks - which is why I wrote that he hasn’t now got much of a choice. That doesn’t mean that the manger is completely blameless. He has a footballing approach which is likely to lead to fatigue and injuries, and he didn’t develop either an amended plan A (and no plan B). It’s not all bad luck

I don’t think Howe has a choice but to do what he’s doing now - and yes, I’m well aware of how long this has been going on. Just saying that he overplayed players when he had a choice - even in October we had multiple options at FB, for example, and he wouldn’t drop / rest Trippier or Burn until they were completely fucked. Don’t take it as me saying that Howe is 100% to blame or responsible for an injury crisis; I do though think he isn’t blameless

The back line are clearly missing him as sweeper-keeper. It’s chaotic without him in there