Senderos Vs Taylor

[chicago_shearer]

Are there really any 21 or 22 year old central defenders that are any good?  Or that you would have playing regularly in the Premiership?  At a minimum, they should have been kept in the reserves or out on loan for 3 or 4 years time.  Both are now in the difficult position of thinking they are "it" well before their prime, and probably won't accept a step back down. 

 

I can understand how it happened at Newcastle because of 1) injuries and 2) a complete lack of any sort of forward thinking or planning under previous management.  But how exactly did a 22 year old defender become a regular at Arsenal?  What was Wenger thinking?

 

 

[Parsley]

Are there really any 21 or 22 year old central defenders that are any good?  Or that you would have playing regularly in the Premiership?  At a minimum, they should have been kept in the reserves or out on loan for 3 or 4 years time.  Both are now in the difficult position of thinking they are "it" well before their prime, and probably won't accept a step back down. 

 

I can understand how it happened at Newcastle because of 1) injuries and 2) a complete lack of any sort of forward thinking or planning under previous management.  But how exactly did a 22 year old defender become a regular at Arsenal?  What was Wenger thinking?

 

 

 

Micah Richards.

[Dokko]

Are there really any 21 or 22 year old central defenders that are any good?  Or that you would have playing regularly in the Premiership?  At a minimum, they should have been kept in the reserves or out on loan for 3 or 4 years time.  Both are now in the difficult position of thinking they are "it" well before their prime, and probably won't accept a step back down. 

 

I can understand how it happened at Newcastle because of 1) injuries and 2) a complete lack of any sort of forward thinking or planning under previous management.  But how exactly did a 22 year old defender become a regular at Arsenal?  What was Wenger thinking?

 

 

 

Micah Richards.

 

Steam rolls Taylor in every possible way. Need to be comparing Richards with the top stars. One thing Richards has had is Dunne & Distin next to him, has certainly had an impact for sure.

 

Massive massive talent, think Taylor should be compared with the other lad they've got who was class in the u21s.

 

 

[Tooj]

Are there really any 21 or 22 year old central defenders that are any good?  Or that you would have playing regularly in the Premiership?  At a minimum, they should have been kept in the reserves or out on loan for 3 or 4 years time.  Both are now in the difficult position of thinking they are "it" well before their prime, and probably won't accept a step back down. 

 

I can understand how it happened at Newcastle because of 1) injuries and 2) a complete lack of any sort of forward thinking or planning under previous management.  But how exactly did a 22 year old defender become a regular at Arsenal?  What was Wenger thinking?

 

 

 

Micah Richards.

 

Steam rolls Taylor in every possible way. Need to be comparing Richards with the top stars. One thing Richards has had is Dunne & Distin next to him, has certainly had an impact for sure.

 

Massive massive talent, think Taylor should be compared with the other lad they've got who was class in the u21s.

 

 

 

Onohua is it? Fuck knows I can't spell his name!

[Dokko]

Are there really any 21 or 22 year old central defenders that are any good?  Or that you would have playing regularly in the Premiership?  At a minimum, they should have been kept in the reserves or out on loan for 3 or 4 years time.  Both are now in the difficult position of thinking they are "it" well before their prime, and probably won't accept a step back down. 

 

I can understand how it happened at Newcastle because of 1) injuries and 2) a complete lack of any sort of forward thinking or planning under previous management.  But how exactly did a 22 year old defender become a regular at Arsenal?  What was Wenger thinking?

 

 

 

Micah Richards.

 

Steam rolls Taylor in every possible way. Need to be comparing Richards with the top stars. One thing Richards has had is Dunne & Distin next to him, has certainly had an impact for sure.

 

Massive massive talent, think Taylor should be compared with the other lad they've got who was class in the u21s.

 

 

 

Onohua is it? Fuck knows I can't spell his name!

 

 

Why i said 'the other lad', but aye that's him.

 

His pace does him a lot of favours.

 

 

[Parsley]

Are there really any 21 or 22 year old central defenders that are any good?  Or that you would have playing regularly in the Premiership?  At a minimum, they should have been kept in the reserves or out on loan for 3 or 4 years time.  Both are now in the difficult position of thinking they are "it" well before their prime, and probably won't accept a step back down. 

 

I can understand how it happened at Newcastle because of 1) injuries and 2) a complete lack of any sort of forward thinking or planning under previous management.  But how exactly did a 22 year old defender become a regular at Arsenal?  What was Wenger thinking?

 

 

 

Micah Richards.

 

Steam rolls Taylor in every possible way. Need to be comparing Richards with the top stars. One thing Richards has had is Dunne & Distin next to him, has certainly had an impact for sure.

 

Massive massive talent, think Taylor should be compared with the other lad they've got who was class in the u21s.

 

 

 

Onohua is it? f*** knows I can't spell his name!

 

Yeah that's a decent shout. Did well against Anelka at the weekend.

[Guest K9]

Taylor mackems.gif

 

People still rate Taylor?

[Baggio]

I don't rate either of them, Senderos makes more errors but he seems more involved in games than Taylor, who often leaves the dirty work to Faye.

[David28]

Senderos is better

[fredbob]

Why the f*** do people hate Taylor so much around here

 

I dont think anyone hates him, i personally dont like the treatment he gets, he;s performed no worse of better than alot of defenders in the past 3-4 years yet somehow there are a lot fo people who seem to think that he still has something to offer.

 

I personally dont understand that view to be honest, he's responsible for his own performances and so far in 130 games he hasnt shown anywhere near a decent level of improvement.

 

Id like to see him do well, id love him to be the next terry but for the life of me i cant draw that last bit of optimism out of me, its been drained by the past 4 years of chronically insipid performances.

[Conjo]

Arsenal: Gallas, Toure, Senderos, Djorou

A.Villa: Mellberg, Laursen, Davies, Knight

B.Ham: Taylor, Ridgewell, Jaidi

B.Burn: Ooijer, Samba, Nelsen, Khizanishvili, Mokoena

Bolton: Meite, O'Brien, Cahill

Chelsea: Carvalho, Terry, Alex, Ben haim

Derby: Stubbs, Todd, Nyatanga

Everton: Yobo, Gardner, Jagielka, Lescott

Fulham: Bocanegra, Stefanovic, Hangeland, Baird, Hughes, Christanval

Liverpool: Agger, Skrtel, Carragher, Hyypia

Man City: Dunne, Richards, Onuoha, Corluka

Man Utd: Ferdinand, Vidic, O'Shea, Brown, Pique

Boro: Wheater, Pogatetz, Huth

Portsmouth: Campbell, Distin, Primus, Hreidarsson

Reading: Ingmarsson, Sonko, Bikey, Duberry

Sunderland: McShane, Nosworthy, Anderson, Evans

Tottenham: King, Woodgate, Dawson, Kaboul, Rocha

W.Ham: Gabbidon, Ferdinand, Upson, Collins, Tomkins

Wigan: Scharner, Bramble, Hagen, Granqvist, Boyce

 

 

If I've done my research properly now, this is all 1st team centre halves in the premiership bar the ones on our books. That's 79 centrehalves. Out of all these centrehalves, I would only prefer Upson, King, Woodgate, Campbell, Distin, Ferdinand, Vidic, O'Shea, Brown, Dunne, Richards, Agger, Skrtel, Carragher, Yobo, Lescott, Carvalho, Terry, Alex, Ben haim, Samba, Nelsen, Laursen, Davies, Gallas and Toure. That's 26 out of 79 in the premiership. Clearly above average then in my books. That's not shit, crap etc as some people say. Shit is what you fint in lower divisions. It took me some while to gather this info, so I kind of forgot where I was going with all this.

 

But Taylor isn't shit, crap, poor etc. Hes a little better then average in PL standards. Ok?

 

[Cronky]

I think there's a question mark about Taylor's temperament. He's had the experience now to develop confidence as a defender, but if anything he seems more nervous and indecisive than ever.

[Luc]

Add Wheater, Huth and Mellberg.

[Martin Lol]

Arsenal: Gallas, Toure, Senderos, Djorou

A.Villa: Mellberg, Laursen, Davies, Knight

B.Ham: Taylor, Ridgewell, Jaidi

B.Burn: Ooijer, Samba, Nelsen, Khizanishvili, Mokoena

Bolton: Meite, O'Brien, Cahill

Chelsea: Carvalho, Terry, Alex, Ben haim

Derby: Stubbs, Todd, Nyatanga

Everton: Yobo, Gardner, Jagielka, Lescott

Fulham: Bocanegra, Stefanovic, Hangeland, Baird, Hughes, Christanval

Liverpool: Agger, Skrtel, Carragher, Hyypia

Man City: Dunne, Richards, Onuoha, Corluka

Man Utd: Ferdinand, Vidic, O'Shea, Brown, Pique

Boro: Wheater, Pogatetz, Huth

Portsmouth: Campbell, Distin, Primus, Hreidarsson

Reading: Ingmarsson, Sonko, Bikey, Duberry

Sunderland: McShane, Nosworthy, Anderson, Evans

Tottenham: King, Woodgate, Dawson, Kaboul, Rocha

W.Ham: Gabbidon, Ferdinand, Upson, Collins, Tomkins

Wigan: Scharner, Bramble, Hagen, Granqvist, Boyce

 

 

If I've done my research properly now, this is all 1st team centre halves in the premiership bar the ones on our books. That's 79 centrehalves. Out of all these centrehalves, I would only prefer Upson, King, Woodgate, Campbell, Distin, Ferdinand, Vidic, O'Shea, Brown, Dunne, Richards, Agger, Skrtel, Carragher, Yobo, Lescott, Carvalho, Terry, Alex, Ben haim, Samba, Nelsen, Laursen, Davies, Gallas and Toure. That's 26 out of 79 in the premiership. Clearly above average then in my books. That's not s***, crap etc as some people say. s*** is what you fint in lower divisions. It took me some while to gather this info, so I kind of forgot where I was going with all this.

 

But Taylor isn't s***, crap, poor etc. Hes a little better then average in PL standards. Ok?

 

 

You've included Brown as being better than Taylor? 

 

Brown looks respectable because of the players around him, not his ability.  If it were a choice of Taylor or Brown, I would be far happier having Taylor in the centre of my defence.  Incidentally, the comments about Brown can also apply to Senderos except Gallas looks after his own zone and not Senderos' as well.  Taylor is better and also has greater potential to improve than Senderos imho.

[Guest POWNATS]

There's only one way to find out! 

 

I'm asking this as a lot of people seem to have a problem with Taylor, some are founded, others are just plain twattish; and i remember it was put to me once Taylor wouldn't get the chance of playing in a winning team if he came through one of the big fours academy. (i know Senderos didn't)

 

Well imo (which in no uncertain doubt will be verbally abused for) Taylor would be playing for Arsenal right now, the games Senderos plays (25-30 already this season), and i'd think he'd be doing a much better job at it too.

 

On the other side, if i had Senderos at NUFC, there is no way he'd start over Taylor, even if Taylor was a bought player.

 

Just a thought, is Taylor really as bad as him?

 

 

PS: They are basically the same age, and Senderos has played around the same amount of league games (in a winning top 4 team) nevermind his CL games and NT caps.

 

if you honestly believe Taylors a quality defender you just dont know what your looking at

 

trying to compare him to another dodgy defender to make him better in your your own mind is pointless

 

Taylor should be one of the summer casualtys.....we got far too many average players and he could be captain of that side

[Dokko]

There's only one way to find out! 

 

I'm asking this as a lot of people seem to have a problem with Taylor, some are founded, others are just plain twattish; and i remember it was put to me once Taylor wouldn't get the chance of playing in a winning team if he came through one of the big fours academy. (i know Senderos didn't)

 

Well imo (which in no uncertain doubt will be verbally abused for) Taylor would be playing for Arsenal right now, the games Senderos plays (25-30 already this season), and i'd think he'd be doing a much better job at it too.

 

On the other side, if i had Senderos at NUFC, there is no way he'd start over Taylor, even if Taylor was a bought player.

 

Just a thought, is Taylor really as bad as him?

 

 

PS: They are basically the same age, and Senderos has played around the same amount of league games (in a winning top 4 team) nevermind his CL games and NT caps.

 

if you honestly believe Taylors a quality defender you just dont know what your looking at

 

trying to compare him to another dodgy defender to make him better in your your own mind is pointless

 

Taylor should be one of the summer casualtys.....we got far too many average players and he could be captain of that side

 

Did i call him 'quality' in that?

 

No Taylor shouldn't be one of the 'casualtys' in the summer, there is half a squad that needs to go before him.

 

The point was made by some else (if you read this properly) that Taylor wouldn't get into a top four side, my point was he's better than Senderos and he would have.

 

 

[James]

Arsenal: Gallas, Toure Senderos, Djorou

A.Villa: Mellberg, Laursen, Davies, Knight

B.Ham: Taylor, Ridgewell, Jaidi

B.Burn: Ooijer, Samba, Nelsen, Khizanishvili, Mokoena

Bolton: Meite, O'Brien, Cahill

Chelsea: Carvalho, Terry, Alex, Ben haim

Derby: Stubbs, Todd, Nyatanga

Everton: Yobo, Gardner, Jagielka, Lescott

Fulham: Bocanegra, Stefanovic, Hangeland, Baird, Hughes, Christanval

Liverpool: Agger, Skrtel, Carragher, Hyypia

Man City: Dunne, Richards, Onuoha, Corluka

Man Utd: Ferdinand, Vidic, O'Shea, Brown, Pique

Boro: Wheater, Pogatetz, Huth

Portsmouth: Campbell, Distin, Primus, Hreidarsson

Reading: Ingmarsson, Sonko, Bikey, Duberry

Sunderland: McShane, Nosworthy, Anderson, Evans

Tottenham: King, Woodgate, Dawson, Kaboul, Rocha

W.Ham: Gabbidon, Ferdinand, Upson, Collins, Tomkins

Wigan: Scharner, Bramble, Hagen, Granqvist, Boyce

 

 

Those in bold are either better than Taylor, or will become better than Taylor within the next five years.

[Baggio]

There's only one way to find out! 

 

I'm asking this as a lot of people seem to have a problem with Taylor, some are founded, others are just plain twattish; and i remember it was put to me once Taylor wouldn't get the chance of playing in a winning team if he came through one of the big fours academy. (i know Senderos didn't)

 

Well imo (which in no uncertain doubt will be verbally abused for) Taylor would be playing for Arsenal right now, the games Senderos plays (25-30 already this season), and i'd think he'd be doing a much better job at it too.

 

On the other side, if i had Senderos at NUFC, there is no way he'd start over Taylor, even if Taylor was a bought player.

 

Just a thought, is Taylor really as bad as him?

 

 

PS: They are basically the same age, and Senderos has played around the same amount of league games (in a winning top 4 team) nevermind his CL games and NT caps.

 

if you honestly believe Taylors a quality defender you just dont know what your looking at

 

trying to compare him to another dodgy defender to make him better in your your own mind is pointless

 

Taylor should be one of the summer casualtys.....we got far too many average players and he could be captain of that side

 

Did i call him 'quality' in that?

 

No Taylor shouldn't be one of the 'casualtys' in the summer, there is half a squad that needs to go before him.

 

The point was made by some else (if you read this properly) that Taylor wouldn't get into a top four side, my point was he's better than Senderos and he would have.

 

 

 

Jesus wept.

[Dokko]

Arsenal: Gallas, Toure Senderos, Djorou

A.Villa: Mellberg, Laursen, Davies, Knight

B.Ham: Taylor, Ridgewell, Jaidi

B.Burn: Ooijer, Samba, Nelsen, Khizanishvili, Mokoena

Bolton: Meite, O'Brien, Cahill

Chelsea: Carvalho, Terry, Alex, Ben haim

Derby: Stubbs, Todd, Nyatanga

Everton: Yobo, Gardner, Jagielka, Lescott

Fulham: Bocanegra, Stefanovic, Hangeland, Baird, Hughes, Christanval

Liverpool: Agger, Skrtel, Carragher, Hyypia

Man City: Dunne, Richards, Onuoha, Corluka

Man Utd: Ferdinand, Vidic, O'Shea, Brown, Pique

Boro: Wheater, Pogatetz, Huth

Portsmouth: Campbell, Distin, Primus, Hreidarsson

Reading: Ingmarsson, Sonko, Bikey, Duberry

Sunderland: McShane, Nosworthy, Anderson, Evans (manu player)

Tottenham: King, Woodgate, Dawson, Kaboul, Rocha

W.Ham: Gabbidon, Ferdinand, Upson, Collins, Tomkins

Wigan: Scharner, Bramble, Hagen, Granqvist, Boyce

 

 

Those in bold are either better than Taylor, or will become better than Taylor within the next five years.

 

For me.

 

Butt: Hyypia, Campbell, King are on their last legs, i'd rather have Taylor.

 

 

[Dokko]

There's only one way to find out! 

 

I'm asking this as a lot of people seem to have a problem with Taylor, some are founded, others are just plain twattish; and i remember it was put to me once Taylor wouldn't get the chance of playing in a winning team if he came through one of the big fours academy. (i know Senderos didn't)

 

Well imo (which in no uncertain doubt will be verbally abused for) Taylor would be playing for Arsenal right now, the games Senderos plays (25-30 already this season), and i'd think he'd be doing a much better job at it too.

 

On the other side, if i had Senderos at NUFC, there is no way he'd start over Taylor, even if Taylor was a bought player.

 

Just a thought, is Taylor really as bad as him?

 

 

PS: They are basically the same age, and Senderos has played around the same amount of league games (in a winning top 4 team) nevermind his CL games and NT caps.

 

if you honestly believe Taylors a quality defender you just dont know what your looking at

 

trying to compare him to another dodgy defender to make him better in your your own mind is pointless

 

Taylor should be one of the summer casualtys.....we got far too many average players and he could be captain of that side

 

Did i call him 'quality' in that?

 

No Taylor shouldn't be one of the 'casualtys' in the summer, there is half a squad that needs to go before him.

 

The point was made by some else (if you read this properly) that Taylor wouldn't get into a top four side, my point was he's better than Senderos and he would have.

 

 

 

Jesus wept.

 

Excellent answer, top of the class, now go put your pants on Robbie.

[Baggio]

There's only one way to find out! 

 

I'm asking this as a lot of people seem to have a problem with Taylor, some are founded, others are just plain twattish; and i remember it was put to me once Taylor wouldn't get the chance of playing in a winning team if he came through one of the big fours academy. (i know Senderos didn't)

 

Well imo (which in no uncertain doubt will be verbally abused for) Taylor would be playing for Arsenal right now, the games Senderos plays (25-30 already this season), and i'd think he'd be doing a much better job at it too.

 

On the other side, if i had Senderos at NUFC, there is no way he'd start over Taylor, even if Taylor was a bought player.

 

Just a thought, is Taylor really as bad as him?

 

 

PS: They are basically the same age, and Senderos has played around the same amount of league games (in a winning top 4 team) nevermind his CL games and NT caps.

 

if you honestly believe Taylors a quality defender you just dont know what your looking at

 

trying to compare him to another dodgy defender to make him better in your your own mind is pointless

 

Taylor should be one of the summer casualtys.....we got far too many average players and he could be captain of that side

 

Did i call him 'quality' in that?

 

No Taylor shouldn't be one of the 'casualtys' in the summer, there is half a squad that needs to go before him.

 

The point was made by some else (if you read this properly) that Taylor wouldn't get into a top four side, my point was he's better than Senderos and he would have.

 

 

 

Jesus wept.

 

Excellent answer, top of the class, now go put your pants on Robbie.

 

Perhaps you should go to the top of the class for the most pathetic reason for starting a thread this week, well done.

 

I'd take Ridgewell over Senderos so does that mean he should be proud of himself because it means he could get into a top 4 team?

 

 

[1878]

I think they're both pretty rubbish tbh.

 

Taylor thinks he's far better than he actually is and makes daft, sloppy mistakes that could be avoided quite easily if someone give him a kick up the arse.

 

Senderos is bullied far too often for a big guy and just generally looks in a constant state of bewilderment. He's got one of those faces.

[Guest Spurs_from_Africa]

Can I ask, what has Taylor done for your opinions of him to fall so low? Just last year, there was a poll about whether he would turn out better than King. To my complete amazement ( and I have just found the thread), most said that he would become better than King.

 

http://www.newcastle-online.com/nufcforum/index.php?topic=41851.0

 

There seemed to be daily threads about how good he could be yet now, many of you want to sell him. What has happened?

[Guest sicko2ndbest]

Arsenal: Gallas, Toure Senderos, Djorou

A.Villa: Mellberg, Laursen, Davies, Knight

B.Ham: Taylor, Ridgewell, Jaidi

B.Burn: Ooijer, Samba, Nelsen, Khizanishvili, Mokoena

Bolton: Meite, O'Brien, Cahill

Chelsea: Carvalho, Terry, Alex, Ben haim

Derby: Stubbs, Todd, Nyatanga

Everton: Yobo, Gardner, Jagielka, Lescott

Fulham: Bocanegra, Stefanovic, Hangeland, Baird, Hughes, Christanval

Liverpool: Agger, Skrtel, Carragher, Hyypia

Man City: Dunne, Richards, Onuoha, Corluka

Man Utd: Ferdinand, Vidic, O'Shea, Brown, Pique

Boro: Wheater, Pogatetz, Huth

Portsmouth: Campbell, Distin, Primus, Hreidarsson

Reading: Ingmarsson, Sonko, Bikey, Duberry

Sunderland: McShane, Nosworthy, Anderson, Evans (manu player)

Tottenham: King, Woodgate, Dawson, Kaboul, Rocha

W.Ham: Gabbidon, Ferdinand, Upson, Collins, Tomkins

Wigan: Scharner, Bramble, Hagen, Granqvist, Boyce

 

 

Those in bold are either better than Taylor, or will become better than Taylor within the next five years.

 

For me.

 

Butt: Hyypia, Campbell, King are on their last legs, i'd rather have Taylor.

 

 

 

i would also put Upson, Wheater and Huth in that category as better or more potential than

[Mowen]

Can I ask, what has Taylor done for your opinions of him to fall so low? Just last year, there was a poll about whether he would turn out better than King. To my complete amazement ( and I have just found the thread), most said that he would become better than King.

 

http://www.newcastle-online.com/nufcforum/index.php?topic=41851.0

 

There seemed to be daily threads about how good he could be yet now, many of you want to sell him. What has happened?

 

The silent majority always stick up for their own players in polls of this ilk. I'm sure it happens to all sites, I think there was an equally ludicrous one on GG a while back where Dawson was proclaimed better than Carragher.

 

I think the fact he hasn't really shown any noticable improvement in his 100+ first team games has led to a lot of people growing frustrated with him. He looked a real talent when he broke in at first, but hasn't ironed any of his mistakes out yet. I think a lot of people see him as very egotistical as well, due to comments from his/his dad (also his agent) in the local papers which can grate.