Jonas Gutierrez

[UV]

Last season he got 3 or 4 assists (something like that anyway), Lampard got the most in the PL with 10.  The likes of Ronaldo and Modric only got 6.  This season he has 2 already despite already having an injury and missing a few games.  So, no, not the worst ratio in football.

ouch stats don't lie.

 

That easily replaceable lad we sold who's really slow, can't get past a man, and can't cross or shoot got 7 goals & 9 assists last season.

 

You mean the one that did not want to be here? the one who never did that for us?

 

No, I mean the one who was frustrated he didn't get the postponed raise he'd been promised after he got 4 goals & 11 assists in 06-07.

[Skirge]

Last season he got 3 or 4 assists (something like that anyway), Lampard got the most in the PL with 10.  The likes of Ronaldo and Modric only got 6.  This season he has 2 already despite already having an injury and missing a few games.  So, no, not the worst ratio in football.

ouch stats don't lie.

 

That easily replaceable lad we sold who's really slow, can't get past a man, and can't cross or shoot got 7 goals & 9 assists last season.

 

You mean the one that did not want to be here? the one who never did that for us?

 

No, I mean the one who was frustrated he didn't get the postponed raise he'd been promised when he got 4 goals & 11 assists in 06-07.

Aye thats the fella, the one who wanted to leave, for whatever reason it was, his stats mean nothign to us now. I agree we should not have been sold and was sold to cheap also but he is gone Jonas is here.

[Elliottman]

This thread is f*cking annoying.  I'm absolutely f*cking astounded that there are people on here who defend the indefensible.  Gutierrez is f*cking HOPELESS.  I've seen people use words on here to describe him as CLASS, GREAT PLAYER & SKILLFUL. These people want to pull their disillutioned heads from their ar*es and see that Jonas is nothing but a one-dimensional, clueless excuse for a midfielder/winger (Whatecver you want to call him) who has ZERO end product.  He has had one memorable game of note - Man U, opening day of last season.  Now tell me, what the f*ck has this great player done in the 50 or so games since then?  Score a hatful of goals? No. Put is some blinding, in fact no, some 'basic' crosses? No? Try really hard to help us get out of the Championship with some very good displays against 'lesser' calibre of player? No. Has he ran into yet another blind alley, beaten by yet another defender, lost posession far to easily? YES. 

But hey, give him his due, he's won a couple of free-kicks....

 

The man is PITIFUL and WEAK.  He has no heart.  He is basically...HILLARY SWANK.

 

I bet you like Nicky Butt because "he tries" dont you??

[colinmk]

Probably my favourite player of ours last season(not saying much) but this season he has been shocking. The thing about him we know from last season is that when he plays he plays with 100% effort and determination and i haven't seen that once this season. I know he has ambitions higher than the championship and so should everyone but that doesn't excuse him. If he carries on like this then get him to fuck.

[Guest]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

[Ronaldo]

Didn't Lee Clark play there once or twice? It was Kevin Sheedy initially if memory serves.

[Tooj]

Franz Carr>Jonas.

[Guest toonlass]

Franz Carr>Jonas.

 

He came onto the pitch at Forest

 

Ooooh Ahhhhh Franz Carr, say Oooh Ahhhh Franz Carr!

[Guest BooBoo]

Stephen Glass > Jonas.

[Guest toonlass]

Stephen Glass > Jonas.

 

Oh that is harsh!

[Guest BooBoo]

No it's not really. Glass chipped in with a few goals and occasionally looked a canny player.

[Guest Geordiecunny]

I thought Glass complemented Speed well back then.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I thought Glass complemented Speed well back then.

 

As in 'great pass Garry' or 'nice shot Garry'.

[Guest toonlass]

I thought Glass complemented Speed well back then.

 

As in 'great pass Garry' or 'nice shot Garry'.

 

[geordiedean]

have to agree on the stephen glass comment myself infact theres lots of left sided players we have had in the last 17 years that completely outshine jonas

 

Ginola,Sellars,Glass,Robert,Nzogbia,Milner hell id even say wayne fucking fereday

[merlin]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

[TRon]

No it's not really. Glass chipped in with a few goals and occasionally looked a canny player.

 

What difference does it make, it's not like we've got a Stephen Glass sitting on the bench who can replace Jonas. the only alternative is Lovenkrands and he's worse. Of course you could always think outside the box and move Kadar to left back and push Enrique forward. Not sure it would achieve much different at the end of the day though, other than satisy the calls to dump Jonas.

[Guest]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

 

Course I'm not, just picking up on the goalscoring midfielder comment.

 

And I completely disagree on the Championship being weaker than Division One back then.

[Jayson]

No it's not really. Glass chipped in with a few goals and occasionally looked a canny player.

 

Because the quality of teammates would have nothing to do with anything obviously.

[merlin]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

 

Course I'm not, just picking up on the goalscoring midfielder comment.

 

And I completely disagree on the Championship being weaker than Division One back then.

 

You are entitled to your opinion  but I disagree - the last 15 years have led to the syndrome of the cream rising to the top even MORE than it did back then because the Prem has become more powerful and wealthy ; there are NO good teams in this years' Championship and that INCLUDES NUFC.

 

If any of the CCC sides currently in the promotion positions go up, they will be relegated unless they have massive surgery to their sides and most can't afford it.

Back in 93, KK added just a couple of players to his promotion side and finished 3rd ; I say again, they were STREETS ahead of this or any other CCC side today .

 

 

[Guest Pie]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

 

Course I'm not, just picking up on the goalscoring midfielder comment.

 

And I completely disagree on the Championship being weaker than Division One back then.

 

You are entitled to your opinion  but I disagree - the last 15 years have led to the syndrome of the cream rising to the top even MORE than it did back then because the Prem has become more powerful and wealthy ; there are NO good teams in this years' Championship and that INCLUDES NUFC.

 

If any of the CCC sides currently in the promotion positions go up, they will be relegated unless they have massive surgery to their sides and most can't afford it.

Back in 93, KK added just a couple of players to his promotion side and finished 3rd ; I say again, they were STREETS ahead of this or any other CCC side today .

 

 

As did Forest a little later. The trouble with it is that the pool of players then came from a population of 60m now its global pool to pick from.

Our side from 92/93 would struggle in the Premier league now tbh. They mght not get relegated but they wouldnt touch the top half.

The Championship is prob stronger now but I know what you mean about squad players. Back in 92/93 an England International was a big thing to have in your team, now several of them struggle to make squads.

The whole make up has changed in the game since then.

92/93 were streets ahead of the current squad football wise. The current lot are a much stronger/bigger set of lads but there is little doubt that that side would beat this one.

 

 

[jimmymag]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

 

Course I'm not, just picking up on the goalscoring midfielder comment.

 

And I completely disagree on the Championship being weaker than Division One back then.

 

You are entitled to your opinion  but I disagree - the last 15 years have led to the syndrome of the cream rising to the top even MORE than it did back then because the Prem has become more powerful and wealthy ; there are NO good teams in this years' Championship and that INCLUDES NUFC.

 

If any of the CCC sides currently in the promotion positions go up, they will be relegated unless they have massive surgery to their sides and most can't afford it.

Back in 93, KK added just a couple of players to his promotion side and finished 3rd ; I say again, they were STREETS ahead of this or any other CCC side today .

 

 

 

We've seen with our own eyes how poor the "Championship" is. We are leading at the moment and we are shite, that in itself tells you the quality of this division.

[relámpago blanco]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

 

Course I'm not, just picking up on the goalscoring midfielder comment.

 

And I completely disagree on the Championship being weaker than Division One back then.

 

You are entitled to your opinion  but I disagree - the last 15 years have led to the syndrome of the cream rising to the top even MORE than it did back then because the Prem has become more powerful and wealthy ; there are NO good teams in this years' Championship and that INCLUDES NUFC.

 

If any of the CCC sides currently in the promotion positions go up, they will be relegated unless they have massive surgery to their sides and most can't afford it.

Back in 93, KK added just a couple of players to his promotion side and finished 3rd ; I say again, they were STREETS ahead of this or any other CCC side today .

 

 

I agree and I think in general Championship/Div1 sides back then were either much stronger or the Prem is much stronger as the gap is much bigger now than it was then, I can't understand this bollocks the media come out with saying the gap is closer than ever.  It is bollocks.  If a side from the championship finished 3rd in the prem now it'd be a miracle even if they had 500M to spend.

[TRon]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

 

Course I'm not, just picking up on the goalscoring midfielder comment.

 

And I completely disagree on the Championship being weaker than Division One back then.

 

You are entitled to your opinion  but I disagree - the last 15 years have led to the syndrome of the cream rising to the top even MORE than it did back then because the Prem has become more powerful and wealthy ; there are NO good teams in this years' Championship and that INCLUDES NUFC.

 

If any of the CCC sides currently in the promotion positions go up, they will be relegated unless they have massive surgery to their sides and most can't afford it.

Back in 93, KK added just a couple of players to his promotion side and finished 3rd ; I say again, they were STREETS ahead of this or any other CCC side today .

 

 

 

We've seen with our own eyes how poor the "Championship" is. We are leading at the moment and we are shite, that in itself tells you the quality of this division.

 

Amen to that. We have wingers who can't cross a ball without falling over, midfielders who can't string two passes together and strikers who make Michael Chopra look like Gary Lineker. Apart from the actual football though we're ok.

[ChezGiven]

as said Earlier the last time we got promotoed we tore into teams with wingers and goalscorers and Scott Sellars was way way better and more gifted than this waster of an argentinian will ever be..Come to that matter 99% of that promotion side are streets ahead of what we have now and that includes the likes of kelly,quinn,peacock,bracewell and clark

 

This is totally correct - the 92/93 side would easily destroy this lot. I would be surprised if they failed to score at least 3 times without reply. Sellars created far more danger than Jonas EVER will, and as for scoring goals, Rob Lee would make him look like an amateur. Kelly, Peacock and Andy Cole would have had a field day against the current side's defence.....

 

Nolan this season will outscore Lee from that season.

 

Who played LW most of that season anyway? Didn't sign Sellars until later on. Can't think.

 

IF Nolan outscores Lee from that season(and its a big if), it will be because of 2 things ;

 

1.The current league is crap compared to the 92/93 League

2. Nolan has been in the side since AUGUST - Lee didn't join the club until late October 92.

 

You are surely not trying to put Nolan in the same category as Lee are you ?

If so, then either your memory is very short, or you can tell the rest of us what it is you are drinking - must be a new brew and very strong....!

 

As for the wing, we had Sheedy on the left and Franz Carr on the right for most of the early games and even Carr was more effective than Jonas..

Sheedy was at the end of his career, which is why KK signed Sellars.

 

Course I'm not, just picking up on the goalscoring midfielder comment.

 

And I completely disagree on the Championship being weaker than Division One back then.

 

You are entitled to your opinion  but I disagree - the last 15 years have led to the syndrome of the cream rising to the top even MORE than it did back then because the Prem has become more powerful and wealthy ; there are NO good teams in this years' Championship and that INCLUDES NUFC.

 

If any of the CCC sides currently in the promotion positions go up, they will be relegated unless they have massive surgery to their sides and most can't afford it.

Back in 93, KK added just a couple of players to his promotion side and finished 3rd ; I say again, they were STREETS ahead of this or any other CCC side today .

 

 

 

That argument is nonsense, if the prem is more powerful, it becomes more attractive to be in because of the money, making the entry division even more competitive. Thats basic economics.

 

There is sense in saying that the relative difference between the leagues has got wider because of the increased money to the top league.  That relative difference has been caused by the influx of the best players in the world into the top clubs, this doesnt affect the standard of championship football.

 

Further, newly promoted clubs are doing better at staying in the top flight, with last year this being the case particularly. Financial lessons have been learnt etc.

 

Also, fitness has moved on to such an extent that time on the ball has reduced massively, the pace of the game has increased dramatically making any meaningful comparison of the abilities of players across nearly 20 years as utterly redundant. Most players look better when given space and time on the ball.

 

For a few of our players back then, you could argue that if they were plying their trade in the modern game, they'd be better than the current squad members. Then again, we never saw them with less time on the ball, playing more organised teams, so in reality its hard to tell.