Jonas Gutierrez

[Guest palnese]

Kevin Nolan in that CM role must be our least effective player. How many goals has he scored from that position?

[Dave]

Kevin Nolan in that CM role must be our least effective player. How many goals has he scored from that position?

 

All of them?

[Ronaldo]

All but one has come with 2 or more strikers on the pitch, bit of a daft comment Palnese.

[Jayson]

Nolan isnt more effective in his position atall. He gets goals at this level because its a crap level. He provides little to us as a team.

Guthrie wouldnt get the time he has on the ball, or the ball atall half the time if not for Jonas.

Shola is a similar argument to the above two together, except he plays much less part in build up play.

Smith is useful at breaking things up to an extent, he doesnt do it as much as Jonas is on the ball.

Taylor/Colo constantly break up play, atleast as much or more than Jonas is on the ball. So they are equally/ perhaps more effective.

Enrique is similar except he does it slightly less than the above two.

Harper Does well with what comes at him, would probably do the same at a higher standard.

 

When you balance up what they give us vs what the poor side of their game takes away from us, id still say that yes Jonas is one of our most effective players.

[Guest palnese]

I was thinking more about the 4-4-2 vs 4-4-Nolan-1 thingy. How many goals has he got to his name when played with Smith in the middle and two strikers in front of him?

[Dave]

I was thinking more about the 4-4-2 vs 4-4-Nolan-1 thingy. How many goals has he got to his name when played with Smith in the middle and two strikers in front of him?

 

Nearly all of them.

[Ronaldo]

9 league goals.

[madras]

Nolan isnt more effective in his position atall. He gets goals at this level because its a crap level. He provides little to us as a team.

Guthrie wouldnt get the time he has on the ball, or the ball atall half the time if not for Jonas.

Shola is a similar argument to the above two together, except he plays much less part in build up play.

Smith is useful at breaking things up to an extent, he doesnt do it as much as Jonas is on the ball.

Taylor/Colo constantly break up play, atleast as much or more than Jonas is on the ball. So they are equally/ perhaps more effective.

Enrique is similar except he does it slightly less than the above two.

Harper Does well with what comes at him, would probably do the same at a higher standard.

 

When you balance up what they give us vs what the poor side of their play takes away from us, id still say that yes Jonas is one of our most effective players.

hang on, joans is playing at the same level you are slagging off players for doing ok at...surely it must count for him aswell.

 

then the bit about colo'talor and enrique is just bizzarre as they are defenders and only an idiot would try to force a view that defenders can't be effective. tell you what jonas is crap defensivly, gets huge cheers every fifth game or so for chasing a man which is his job.

[Guest palnese]

Fair enough..

[Jayson]

hang on, joans is playing at the same level you are slagging off players for doing ok at...surely it must count for him aswell.

 

then the bit about colo'talor and enrique is just bizzarre as they are defenders and only an idiot would try to force a view that defenders can't be effective. tell you what jonas is crap defensivly, gets huge cheers every fifth game or so for chasing a man which is his job.

 

I expect Jonas would do the same at a higher level, its a sidepoint anyway. Jonas makes our football as a whole better than most of them do, itd be the same at this level or the next. Simply because the way he plays makes us keep it on the floor, drives us foward and gives space to others. They make us a side who can score goals at a poor level with a team that would play very poor attacking football without Jonas - whilst also having far less possession. At a higher level, a team that plays good football is going to do better than one who plays rubbish football but can finish against Championship sides.

 

I didnt say anything about Colo/taylor/enrique not being effective, i said theyre all atleast as or more effective than Jonas.

[Guest firetotheworks]

I would say he's equally as effective as all of the back four defensively, in a the best form of defence is attack sense. He almost always provides an outlet to get forward and then either win a free kick, pass it square or lose it higher up the pitch. He's one of the most peculiar footballers Ive ever known.

[GuyP]

hang on, joans is playing at the same level you are slagging off players for doing ok at...surely it must count for him aswell.

 

then the bit about colo'talor and enrique is just bizzarre as they are defenders and only an idiot would try to force a view that defenders can't be effective. tell you what jonas is crap defensivly, gets huge cheers every fifth game or so for chasing a man which is his job.

 

I expect Jonas would do the same at a higher level, its a sidepoint anyway. Jonas makes our football as a whole better than most of them do, itd be the same at this level or the next. Simply because the way he plays makes us keep it on the floor, drives us foward and gives space to others. They make us a side who can score goals at a poor level with a team that would play very poor attacking football without Jonas - whilst also having far less possession. At a higher level, a team that plays good football is going to do better than one who plays rubbish football but can finish against Championship sides.

 

I didnt say anything about Colo/taylor/enrique not being effective, i said theyre all atleast as or more effective than Jonas.

 

Like last season when people complained about his lack of end-product?...we've seen him at a higher level so if people werent happy, what makes you think they will be next season?

[Guest toonlass]

Nolan isnt more effective in his position atall. He gets goals at this level because its a crap level. He provides little to us as a team.

Guthrie wouldnt get the time he has on the ball, or the ball atall half the time if not for Jonas.

Shola is a similar argument to the above two together, except he plays much less part in build up play.

Smith is useful at breaking things up to an extent, he doesnt do it as much as Jonas is on the ball.

Taylor/Colo constantly break up play, atleast as much or more than Jonas is on the ball. So they are equally/ perhaps more effective.

Enrique is similar except he does it slightly less than the above two.

Harper Does well with what comes at him, would probably do the same at a higher standard.

 

When you balance up what they give us vs what the poor side of their play takes away from us, id still say that yes Jonas is one of our most effective players.

hang on, joans is playing at the same level you are slagging off players for doing ok at...surely it must count for him aswell.

 

then the bit about colo'talor and enrique is just bizzarre as they are defenders and only an idiot would try to force a view that defenders can't be effective. tell you what jonas is crap defensivly, gets huge cheers every fifth game or so for chasing a man which is his job.

 

Was just thinking that. How anyone can think that Jonas is more effective than Shola or Nolan this season is just laughable. And you cannot criticise the level they are at saying it makes them look good, because Jonas is playing at the same level. Its is only the last few games that Jonas has looked anything but ineffective tbh. His goal seems to have sparked his interest in the game again, and he looks like he is more interested. Saying that he had a complete off day at Sheffield Wednesday.

[Jayson]

Its the idea behind the word effective that confuses things, makes it harder to explain than it needs to be.

 

Which player improves our quality of football more than any other? Which player is in possession the most for us? Which player does most of our attacking play go through? So which player not being there would result in us both having the ball less & creating less? Which player takes more pressure of the defence because of the above than any other? etc

 

Thats why i call him our most "effective" player. He does more for us as a team on his own, than any of the others. Our standards as a whole would drop more without him than any other. Whether he'd do it at a higher level is a sidepoint as i say, i think he would. Hes just very underated on here for what he gives us. If he doesnt score or set up a goal each game people think hes near useless or lazy/uninterested.

[ponsaelius]

Second highest assists total for us this season. That's pretty effective.

[Guest toonlass]

Its the idea behind the word effective that confuses things, makes it harder to explain than it needs to be.

 

Which player improves our quality of football more than any other? Which player is in possession the most for us? Which player does most of our attacking play go through? So which player not being there would result in us both having the ball less & creating less? Which player takes more pressure of the defence because of the above than any other? etc

 

Thats why i call him our most "effective" player. He does more for us as a team on his own, than any of the others. Our standards as a whole would drop more without him than any other. Whether he'd do it at a higher level is a sidepoint as i say, i think he would. Hes just very underated on here for what he gives us. If he doesnt score or set up a goal each game people think hes near useless or lazy.

 

I actually thought he had one of his better games on Monday night, and he didn't set up or score a goal. And personally I think as a team we look weaker when Enrique is having an off day more than anyone else.

[madras]

Its the idea behind the word effective that confuses things, makes it harder to explain than it needs to be.

 

Which player improves our quality of football more than any other? Which player is in possession the most for us? Which player does most of our attacking play go through? So which player not being there would result in us both having the ball less & creating less? Which player takes more pressure of the defence because of the above than any other? etc

 

Thats why i call him our most "effective" player. He does more for us as a team on his own, than any of the others. Our standards as a whole would drop more without him than any other. Whether he'd do it at a higher level is a sidepoint as i say, i think he would. Hes just very underated on here for what he gives us. If he doesnt score or set up a goal each game people think hes near useless or lazy.

 

I actually thought he had one of his better games on Monday night, and he didn't set up or score a goal. And ersonally I think as a team we look weaker when Enrique is having an off day more than anyone else.

aye. steven taylor was similar early on in the season.

[Wullie]

His through ball for Ryan Taylor was absolutely lush.

[madras]

His through ball for Ryan Taylor was absolutely lush.

to be fair taylors run to open it up was fantastic aswell.

 

 

 

how longs it been since we had someone look to get round the beck from a pass ?

[Wullie]

Yeah the way Taylor ran along the line until the ball was played was superb, fair play to the linesman actually watching the game too, would have been easy to flag with him being so clear. Pity about the very poor finish.

[buzza]

Holds the ball up well

Passes well

runs rings round defenders

works hard when motivated

50/50 that his final ball is good

 

**Contribute a hell of a lot to the team, without him we are much worse. Has his minuses tho**

[madras]

Yeah the way Taylor ran along the line until the ball was played was superb, fair play to the linesman actually watching the game too, would have been easy to flag with him being so clear. Pity about the very poor finish.

it wasn't just the run (stopping onside) it was the vision to see the possibility. he's not feet quick but a little nouse can go a long way and a great spot by nolan aswell.

 

it's funny to me when everyones goes on about pace when you think of our better players in the premier era only gillespie and bellamy had pace to burn, all the rest had guile,nouse, technique and intelligence.

[Chris_R]

 

it's funny to me when everyones goes on about pace when you think of our better players in the premier era only gillespie and bellamy had pace to burn, all the rest had guile,nouse, technique and intelligence.

 

Dyer and Cole were quite nippy.

[madras]

 

it's funny to me when everyones goes on about pace when you think of our better players in the premier era only gillespie and bellamy had pace to burn, all the rest had guile,nouse, technique and intelligence.

 

Dyer and Cole were quite nippy.

dyer was over 10 yards (and many will point out thats where he'd brake down)and cole wasn't as quick as many thought, he had very quick footwork like beardsley.

[Skirge]

Jonas is getting better on the creation front, great work rate as always but we are starting to see a bit of movement now so he has passing options.