Joe the Man

[KaKa]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

Great post.  i've been reading through this thread and seen some good stuff, some not so great (imo).  This post is pretty much how I feel too.

I think the one really good point you make is that he does seem to learn.  Basing so much of our offense around counter attacks with Martins, now playing N'Zogbia instead of Duff, and hopefully won't slot Taylor straight back in there. 

 

I just don't think he should be permanent manager though, he can probably walk away a cult hero from Newcastle and go and get a decent job in the championship, probably even get somebody promoted.  I want to avoid another Roeder.  Plus I don't trust his ability in the transfer market, he's been out of the game way too long and this squad has needed some serious rebuilding for a few years now, I'd really like to see someone with European experience and a list of contacts he can rely on. 

 

http://www.magpieszone.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/08052008_kevin-keegan.jpg

 

Ironically Joe has actually been scouting for teams all over the world during his time away from management.

 

Keegan however was in the circus.

 

 

 

[hakka]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

Great post.  i've been reading through this thread and seen some good stuff, some not so great (imo).  This post is pretty much how I feel too.

I think the one really good point you make is that he does seem to learn.  Basing so much of our offense around counter attacks with Martins, now playing N'Zogbia instead of Duff, and hopefully won't slot Taylor straight back in there. 

 

I just don't think he should be permanent manager though, he can probably walk away a cult hero from Newcastle and go and get a decent job in the championship, probably even get somebody promoted.  I want to avoid another Roeder.  Plus I don't trust his ability in the transfer market, he's been out of the game way too long and this squad has needed some serious rebuilding for a few years now, I'd really like to see someone with European experience and a list of contacts he can rely on. 

 

http://www.magpieszone.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/08052008_kevin-keegan.jpg

 

Ironically Joe has actually been scouting for teams all over the world during his time away from management.

 

Keegan however was in the circus.

 

 

 

 

beat me to that post... 

[Thespence]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

Great post.  i've been reading through this thread and seen some good stuff, some not so great (imo).  This post is pretty much how I feel too.

I think the one really good point you make is that he does seem to learn.  Basing so much of our offense around counter attacks with Martins, now playing N'Zogbia instead of Duff, and hopefully won't slot Taylor straight back in there. 

 

I just don't think he should be permanent manager though, he can probably walk away a cult hero from Newcastle and go and get a decent job in the championship, probably even get somebody promoted.  I want to avoid another Roeder.  Plus I don't trust his ability in the transfer market, he's been out of the game way too long and this squad has needed some serious rebuilding for a few years now, I'd really like to see someone with European experience and a list of contacts he can rely on. 

 

http://www.magpieszone.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/08052008_kevin-keegan.jpg

 

Ironically Joe has actually been scouting for teams all over the world during his time away from management.

 

Keegan however was in the circus.

 

I am not sure if this scouting all over the world is really true, I mean who is going to fork money out of there own pocket to scout for players for errrrrrrrr no one.

[NE5]

He's Glen Roeder part 2. Good in the short term, probably a disaster in the long term. Joe himself said today we'd be nowhere without a good team. Watching us play the first thing you notice isnt tactics, its that the majority of the players we have are pretty damn good.

 

They weren't looking too clever when he first came in.

 

Aye, why was that again? Im sure something canny big had just happened.

 

Not the point. These good players were looking totally lost and lacked confidence, he's whipped them into shape and we look like a premiership football team again. Credit him for that.

 

Too right, I agree. Just like Roeder did. 

 

Some caretakers have done well, most don't, but its no reason to make a judgement either way. Every case is different.

 

 

 

My original point was that were doing well primarily because we have some very good players and Kinnears given them their confidence back imo, which he should be applauded for. Same as Roeder did in the short term and was applauded for. Long term I think tactics are going to have to come into it when our confidence is down and I dont think Kinnear has what it takes, again like Roeder. But like you say every case is different and time will tell.

 

Roeder + Shearer got results.

 

Roeder on his jack, didn't. It was obvious he lost the dressing room.

 

Has Kinnear lost the dressing room? The players seem to be responding well from what we've seen. Even the shit players.

 

The two aren't even remotely comparable other than the fact they were both appointed on temporary contracts initially.

 

Completely shoehorned argument trying to make out that they're one and same.

 

I don't disagree with what firetotheworks says, but I certainly agree with the bit in bold. I thought at the time that shearer looked completely at ease when he stood next to Roeder in that dugout. Doesn't mean he will be a good manager though, good managers need to spend money well, but he certainly appeared to have a big influence.

 

 

 

the problem with roeder was he didn't get any money

 

shepherd bought him duff for 5 million when malbranque was the one roeder wanted

 

and we had to buy martins as we didn't have any other strikers

 

you're contradicting yourself.

 

Never mind. I'm sure if I expand on it I'll be accused by someone of ruining the thread, simply because they won't accept the truth.

 

I don't know where you think that Roeder wanted Malbranque, for one thing, Duff turned down Liverpool for us. You tell me the last time any player did that ? One of our greatest left us for Liverpool ........

 

 

[David Icke - Son of God]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

Great post.  i've been reading through this thread and seen some good stuff, some not so great (imo).  This post is pretty much how I feel too.

I think the one really good point you make is that he does seem to learn.  Basing so much of our offense around counter attacks with Martins, now playing N'Zogbia instead of Duff, and hopefully won't slot Taylor straight back in there. 

 

I just don't think he should be permanent manager though, he can probably walk away a cult hero from Newcastle and go and get a decent job in the championship, probably even get somebody promoted.  I want to avoid another Roeder.  Plus I don't trust his ability in the transfer market, he's been out of the game way too long and this squad has needed some serious rebuilding for a few years now, I'd really like to see someone with European experience and a list of contacts he can rely on. 

 

http://www.magpieszone.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/08052008_kevin-keegan.jpg

 

Ironically Joe has actually been scouting for teams all over the world during his time away from management.

 

Keegan however was in the circus.

 

I am not sure if this scouting all over the world is really true, I mean who is going to fork money out of there own pocket to scout for players for errrrrrrrr no one.

 

I think scouting all over the world basically means he got the dodgy Arab channels in and stayed up watching Erdivise highlights until 4 in the morning.

 

 

[Baggio]

Kinnear was doing some work for Arsenal wasn't he?

[David Icke - Son of God]

Kinnear was doing some work for Arsenal wasn't he?

 

Lets fucking hope so.

[Thespence]

Kinnear was doing some work for Arsenal wasn't he?

 

He used to chat to his neighbor Mr Wegner about football.

[NE5]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

 

good post mate. I said quite early on that Kinnear was restoring some morale, no mean feat, having seen this sort of scenario before my early thoughts were that we would have only a slim chance of pulling through, but he came in and did what was needed.

 

Fair do's in fact very well done. Very well done indeed to him. Just goes to show, you don't always have to be the big name, he's an old style tracksuit manager prepared to get his hands dirty and and appears to understand that players are different and need treating differently, no mean feat especially when you compare him to the likes of the fuckwit Souness. In fact, a lad I worked with at that time, who has now retired, said to me a few times that he thought Kinnear was a decent manager and he wouldn't mind him at the club at all. He's restoring stability at the club like Arthur Cox did. Whether he is long term, I don't know. A good manager has to do what he is doing, and also the biggest part of all, which is to spend money well and persuade the best players that the club is a progressive one.

 

As for Owen, I share these sentiments. Everything comes from results, a winning club is a happy club, and allied to a manager who players respect and relate to, there is a chance that Owen might see us as his best bet for the next few years.

 

 

[TRon]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

 

good post mate. I said quite early on that Kinnear was restoring some morale, no mean feat, having seen this sort of scenario before my early thoughts were that we would have only a slim chance of pulling through, but he came in and did what was needed.

 

Fair do's in fact very well done. Very well done indeed to him. Just goes to show, you don't always have to be the big name, he's an old style tracksuit manager prepared to get his hands dirty and and appears to understand that players are different and need treating differently, no mean feat especially when you compare him to the likes of the fuckwit Souness. In fact, a lad I worked with at that time, who has now retired, said to me a few times that he thought Kinnear was a decent manager and he wouldn't mind him at the club at all. He's restoring stability at the club like Arthur Cox did. Whether he is long term, I don't know. A good manager has to do what he is doing, and also the biggest part of all, which is to spend money well and persuade the best players that the club is a progressive one.

 

As for Owen, I share these sentiments. Everything comes from results, a winning club is a happy club, and allied to a manager who players respect and relate to, there is a chance that Owen might see us as his best bet for the next few years.

 

 

 

It might be optimistic but if we make a couple of decent signings to beef up the squad and can get some form going, we might end up looking at Europe or pretty close. That's our one big chance of keeping Owen here for me, if we look like a team going places. But for that to happen it is over to Mr Ashley.

[Baggio]

Joe's been spending time with Wenger down the Arsenal training ground.

 

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=578482&&cc=5739

 

I've seen another article (in the guardian I think) where it said Wenger was that impressed with Kinnear's eye for a player that he was going to offer him a scouting job before we came in.

[TRon]

Joe's been spending time with Wenger down the Arsenal training ground.

 

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=578482&&cc=5739

 

I've seen another article (in the guardian I think) where it said Wenger was that impressed with Kinnear's eye for a player that he was going to offer him a scouting job before we came in.

 

Quality quote from Wenger in that article:

 

"Joe is an optimist and he thinks, 'Okay, I have the job for a short time, but if I do well, I might stay in there'.

 

"For somebody who has been out of a job for such a long time, you cannot deny that opportunity to him.

 

"I believe he has done the right thing and he has the quality and the strengths to maybe turn people around and change their opinion about him."

 

 

[KaKa]

Joe's been spending time with Wenger down the Arsenal training ground.

 

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=578482&&cc=5739

 

I've seen another article (in the guardian I think) where it said Wenger was that impressed with Kinnear's eye for a player that he was going to offer him a scouting job before we came in.

 

Quality quote from Wenger in that article:

 

"Joe is an optimist and he thinks, 'Okay, I have the job for a short time, but if I do well, I might stay in there'.

 

"For somebody who has been out of a job for such a long time, you cannot deny that opportunity to him.

 

"I believe he has done the right thing and he has the quality and the strengths to maybe turn people around and change their opinion about him."

 

 

 

Wow ... that is so eerie.

[NE5]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

 

good post mate. I said quite early on that Kinnear was restoring some morale, no mean feat, having seen this sort of scenario before my early thoughts were that we would have only a slim chance of pulling through, but he came in and did what was needed.

 

Fair do's in fact very well done. Very well done indeed to him. Just goes to show, you don't always have to be the big name, he's an old style tracksuit manager prepared to get his hands dirty and and appears to understand that players are different and need treating differently, no mean feat especially when you compare him to the likes of the fuckwit Souness. In fact, a lad I worked with at that time, who has now retired, said to me a few times that he thought Kinnear was a decent manager and he wouldn't mind him at the club at all. He's restoring stability at the club like Arthur Cox did. Whether he is long term, I don't know. A good manager has to do what he is doing, and also the biggest part of all, which is to spend money well and persuade the best players that the club is a progressive one.

 

As for Owen, I share these sentiments. Everything comes from results, a winning club is a happy club, and allied to a manager who players respect and relate to, there is a chance that Owen might see us as his best bet for the next few years.

 

 

 

It might be optimistic but if we make a couple of decent signings to beef up the squad and can get some form going, we might end up looking at Europe or pretty close. That's our one big chance of keeping Owen here for me, if we look like a team going places. But for that to happen it is over to Mr Ashley.

 

nothing changes in football. The best players always want to play for progressive clubs, and happy clubs. FWIW I think if Keegan had been backed, then he would maybe have either signed now or the whole situation wouldn't even be questioned by now he'd be well on the way to signing. Kinnear may rescue the situation, hopefully he will, through looking after him and doing well.

 

The best way to keep your best players, has always been to sign other quality ones, and always will be.

 

 

[KaKa]

I was very meh when he was appointed, but he's had my support since that day. I simply couldn't be arsed to get too angry about it, and for me the season was damage limitation when KK walked away again. Got some funny old results under his belt, has managed to get the defence playing the best i've seen easily this decade, which is crazy talk i know, but this lot look more solid than ever i can recall, beaten by single goals when we do lose and playing as a unit not one player carrying the back line ala Woodgate. While doing that playing some nice attacking football and lifting the morale in the stands, in the club and most certainly in the players, even Zoggy is smiling and getting back to the player we loved a while ago.

 

The man could even be persuading Ashley to bolster the squad in January and for me, its just a hunch but Owen is closer to signing a contract with us than ever before. I mean Owen won't leave the Country again as he can kiss goodbye to playing for England if he does, out of sight out of mind, the top 4 don't want him, most clubs cant afford him and the two that possibly do are below us in the table, and he won't be captain there.

 

If it wasn't for two equalizers from former defenders i'd say his spell in charge would have been top notch. He's made poor decisions, but it really does seem the guy picks up on it and learns, not too afraid to makes decisions and not too stubborn to see that he can get it wrong, i've not seen any manager like that here, ever, inc SBR who was as stubborn as a day is long.

 

He does however need to clam down and stop getting banned. Its beyond a joke. Not only has he a dodgy ticker, but obviously we need him there because whatever he says to the players, it works.

 

Maybe the experience he's built over the years, and the timing of the club's demise is perfect for Kinnear. Maybe right now he is what we need? I'm hoping more than anything the big job for him has come at the right time in his career, and this unexpected series of events sees us benefiting for a change, and we got the right man, it just happens it's not the type we usually go for.

 

With all this in to account, its a very difficult question of whether should he be made permanent? The players seem to get on with him, and the owner loves him and he can get on in this set up, and we've seen what happens when that doesn't go, managers lose the dressing room (Allardyce) or the owner and system doesn't fit (Keegan) can we afford to gamble for another man to come in only to have another unseen problem arise, or one of old take us back to 4 months ago?

 

As long as the guy keeps getting results, and can add to the squad then i'm happy for him to be here. There's no rush in replacing him unless the club is sold, and a world class manager is brought in and will get 5+ years to change the club around for life. otherwise, you'll do Joe.

 

Great post.  i've been reading through this thread and seen some good stuff, some not so great (imo).  This post is pretty much how I feel too.

I think the one really good point you make is that he does seem to learn.  Basing so much of our offense around counter attacks with Martins, now playing N'Zogbia instead of Duff, and hopefully won't slot Taylor straight back in there. 

 

I just don't think he should be permanent manager though, he can probably walk away a cult hero from Newcastle and go and get a decent job in the championship, probably even get somebody promoted.  I want to avoid another Roeder.  Plus I don't trust his ability in the transfer market, he's been out of the game way too long and this squad has needed some serious rebuilding for a few years now, I'd really like to see someone with European experience and a list of contacts he can rely on. 

 

http://www.magpieszone.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/08052008_kevin-keegan.jpg

 

Ironically Joe has actually been scouting for teams all over the world during his time away from management.

 

Keegan however was in the circus.

 

I am not sure if this scouting all over the world is really true, I mean who is going to fork money out of there own pocket to scout for players for errrrrrrrr no one.

 

I think scouting all over the world basically means he got the dodgy Arab channels in and stayed up watching Erdivise highlights until 4 in the morning.

 

 

 

Don't be daft he said he was doing it while working for clubs not just out of some longing for doing so.

 

[midds]

Joe's been spending time with Wenger down the Arsenal training ground.

 

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=578482&&cc=5739

 

I've seen another article (in the guardian I think) where it said Wenger was that impressed with Kinnear's eye for a player that he was going to offer him a scouting job before we came in.

 

Quality quote from Wenger in that article:

 

"Joe is an optimist and he thinks, 'Okay, I have the job for a short time, but if I do well, I might stay in there'.

 

"For somebody who has been out of a job for such a long time, you cannot deny that opportunity to him.

 

"I believe he has done the right thing and he has the quality and the strengths to maybe turn people around and change their opinion about him."

 

 

 

Mr Wenger clearly hasn't encountered some of the fuckers on here though.

[Baggio]

Joe's been spending time with Wenger down the Arsenal training ground.

 

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=578482&&cc=5739

 

I've seen another article (in the guardian I think) where it said Wenger was that impressed with Kinnear's eye for a player that he was going to offer him a scouting job before we came in.

 

Quality quote from Wenger in that article:

 

"Joe is an optimist and he thinks, 'Okay, I have the job for a short time, but if I do well, I might stay in there'.

 

"For somebody who has been out of a job for such a long time, you cannot deny that opportunity to him.

 

"I believe he has done the right thing and he has the quality and the strengths to maybe turn people around and change their opinion about him."

 

 

 

Here's the article from the Guardian.

 

http://www.buzzle.com/articles/238442.html

[KaKa]

Kinnear's appointment was decried by some on the grounds that he was a dinosaur who had been out of the game for so long he should be considered extinct. This criticism now looks asinine, which shouldn't come as a surprise, especially since he was never really out of the game. Unlike Keegan, who admitted to rarely even watching football during his own long absence from the dugout, Kinnear had kept his finger on the pulse, regularly, for example, attending Arsenal training sessions on the invitation of his friend and neighbor Arsène Wenger.

 

Word is Wenger, impressed by the astuteness of Kinnear's observation at those sessions, was planning to offer the Irishman a scouting role with Arsenal before the Newcastle gig came up.

 

So we've basically lucked into the Irish Wenger.

 

Sign him up now!

 

 

Jokes aside though ... that really was a brilliant use of his time while he was out of the game, and he couldn't have picked a better club to take an inside look at.

 

If he actually turns out to be brilliant the rest of the season and succeeds in getting some really good players in, this could turn out to be one of the jammiest hires ever. And wouldn't it just be typical that this would be the one that worked out.

[Consortium of one]

Kudos to Kinnear for steadying the ship.  He walked into an impossible situation:  the club was in turmoil and he had nearly faded from memory.  If you remember, after Keegan left, the players were pissed off because no one cared enough to come up and talk to them face to face.  Instead, Wise and Llambas were texting the players.  The players may have been near revolt.  I would think that in a situation like that, if I were a player, I wouldn't trust anyone, let alone a manager that had been out of the loop for a number of years.  And yet, here comes Joe Kinnear, and he apparently got the players to trust him and settled the team.

 

I would think a simple list of priorities would be too:

 

1) settle the team, begin to gain trust

 

2) install a simple tactical approach

 

3) evaluate players

 

Obviously, he did #1 and #2.  The third was much harder, given the number of injuries.  So , he did a fine job gaining the trust of his players.  They want to play for him.  This team could have easily gone in the tanl and been lost for the year.  He gave them a simple framework to play in which helped them regain a little confidence.  And despite the squad being ravaged with injuries, I think he did quite well evaluating talent.  He was also decisive when he has needed to be.  I remember him saying that he was shocked how Xisco didn't know where he should be playing in the box when attacking.  Ameobi showed a better understanding and Shola won the job.  Duff is more experienced and more fundamentally sound than Zogs so Duff won the job.  Taylor was more of a known quantity than Bassong so Taylor was paired with Colo.  All three of those moves spoke to the same philosophy: settle the ship and play conservatively.  Once the ship is settled, then, based on your observations you can then make the necessary changes and open up your approach a little more.  Hence, Bassong over Taylor and Zogs getting more play over Duff.  Shola eventually lost his spot to Owen but I think it was well played by JFK to make a point of moving Owen in very slowly.  Perhaps he was making Michael win the job rather than just handing it over to him.  I think central midfield is still very unsettled and is Kinnear's top priority.  I'm interested to see where he goes (if allowed to) in January.

 

So I think as a caretaker, he has done quite well.  He looked to be a rising star at Wimbledon but never seemed to recapture the magic after his heart attack.  Sometimes when I see his interviews, I can't help but think that being a full time, long term manager will eventually take it's toll on him.  If I were the owner, I would say that he's done a wonderful job to this point and say that I would be willing to discuss longer terms after the season ( instead of adding pressure by saying, "He can get us to Europe!").  Then if he has shown that he could maintain a consitent level of improvement through out the season.  I would sit down with him.  My first priority at that point would be to focus on his health and happiness.  I would have to be 100% sure that he wasn't going to succumb to health issues again; a situation that would put us back in a similar position as when Keegan bolted.  If and only if I was 100% sure he could maintain his health would I consider something long term.

 

So, to sum up: he has to prove it on the pitch and convince me he can handle the stress and stay healthy.  I mean it may very well be that Joe Kinnear can be a fine manager, just that it is better it be a place out of the limelight.

[OzzieMandias]

Kudos to Kinnear for steadying the ship.  He walked into an impossible situation:  the club was in turmoil and he had nearly faded from memory.  If you remember, after Keegan left, the players were pissed off because no one cared enough to come up and talk to them face to face.  Instead, Wise and Llambas were texting the players.  The players may have been near revolt.  I would think that in a situation like that, if I were a player, I wouldn't trust anyone, let alone a manager that had been out of the loop for a number of years.  And yet, here comes Joe Kinnear, and he apparently got the players to trust him and settled the team.

 

I would think a simple list of priorities would be too:

 

1) settle the team, begin to gain trust

 

2) install a simple tactical approach

 

3) evaluate players

 

Obviously, he did #1 and #2.  The third was much harder, given the number of injuries.  So , he did a fine job gaining the trust of his players.  They want to play for him.  This team could have easily gone in the tanl and been lost for the year.  He gave them a simple framework to play in which helped them regain a little confidence.  And despite the squad being ravaged with injuries, I think he did quite well evaluating talent.  He was also decisive when he has needed to be.  I remember him saying that he was shocked how Xisco didn't know where he should be playing in the box when attacking.  Ameobi showed a better understanding and Shola won the job.  Duff is more experienced and more fundamentally sound than Zogs so Duff won the job.  Taylor was more of a known quantity than Bassong so Taylor was paired with Colo.  All three of those moves spoke to the same philosophy: settle the ship and play conservatively.  Once the ship is settled, then, based on your observations you can then make the necessary changes and open up your approach a little more.  Hence, Bassong over Taylor and Zogs getting more play over Duff.  Shola eventually lost his spot to Owen but I think it was well played by JFK to make a point of moving Owen in very slowly.  Perhaps he was making Michael win the job rather than just handing it over to him.  I think central midfield is still very unsettled and is Kinnear's top priority.  I'm interested to see where he goes (if allowed to) in January.

 

So I think as a caretaker, he has done quite well.  He looked to be a rising star at Wimbledon but never seemed to recapture the magic after his heart attack.  Sometimes when I see his interviews, I can't help but think that being a full time, long term manager will eventually take it's toll on him.  If I were the owner, I would say that he's done a wonderful job to this point and say that I would be willing to discuss longer terms after the season ( instead of adding pressure by saying, "He can get us to Europe!").  Then if he has shown that he could maintain a consitent level of improvement through out the season.  I would sit down with him.  My first priority at that point would be to focus on his health and happiness.  I would have to be 100% sure that he wasn't going to succumb to health issues again; a situation that would put us back in a similar position as when Keegan bolted.  If and only if I was 100% sure he could maintain his health would I consider something long term.

 

So, to sum up: he has to prove it on the pitch and convince me he can handle the stress and stay healthy.  I mean it may very well be that Joe Kinnear can be a fine manager, just that it is better it be a place out of the limelight.

 

Good post. I don't think it's possible for anyone to be "100% sure that he wasn't going to succumb to health issues again," though.

[Consortium of one]

Kudos to Kinnear for steadying the ship.  He walked into an impossible situation:  the club was in turmoil and he had nearly faded from memory.  If you remember, after Keegan left, the players were pissed off because no one cared enough to come up and talk to them face to face.  Instead, Wise and Llambas were texting the players.  The players may have been near revolt.  I would think that in a situation like that, if I were a player, I wouldn't trust anyone, let alone a manager that had been out of the loop for a number of years.  And yet, here comes Joe Kinnear, and he apparently got the players to trust him and settled the team.

 

I would think a simple list of priorities would be too:

 

1) settle the team, begin to gain trust

 

2) install a simple tactical approach

 

3) evaluate players

 

Obviously, he did #1 and #2.  The third was much harder, given the number of injuries.  So , he did a fine job gaining the trust of his players.  They want to play for him.  This team could have easily gone in the tanl and been lost for the year.  He gave them a simple framework to play in which helped them regain a little confidence.  And despite the squad being ravaged with injuries, I think he did quite well evaluating talent.  He was also decisive when he has needed to be.  I remember him saying that he was shocked how Xisco didn't know where he should be playing in the box when attacking.  Ameobi showed a better understanding and Shola won the job.  Duff is more experienced and more fundamentally sound than Zogs so Duff won the job.  Taylor was more of a known quantity than Bassong so Taylor was paired with Colo.  All three of those moves spoke to the same philosophy: settle the ship and play conservatively.  Once the ship is settled, then, based on your observations you can then make the necessary changes and open up your approach a little more.  Hence, Bassong over Taylor and Zogs getting more play over Duff.  Shola eventually lost his spot to Owen but I think it was well played by JFK to make a point of moving Owen in very slowly.  Perhaps he was making Michael win the job rather than just handing it over to him.  I think central midfield is still very unsettled and is Kinnear's top priority.  I'm interested to see where he goes (if allowed to) in January.

 

So I think as a caretaker, he has done quite well.  He looked to be a rising star at Wimbledon but never seemed to recapture the magic after his heart attack.  Sometimes when I see his interviews, I can't help but think that being a full time, long term manager will eventually take it's toll on him.  If I were the owner, I would say that he's done a wonderful job to this point and say that I would be willing to discuss longer terms after the season ( instead of adding pressure by saying, "He can get us to Europe!").  Then if he has shown that he could maintain a consitent level of improvement through out the season.  I would sit down with him.  My first priority at that point would be to focus on his health and happiness.  I would have to be 100% sure that he wasn't going to succumb to health issues again; a situation that would put us back in a similar position as when Keegan bolted.  If and only if I was 100% sure he could maintain his health would I consider something long term.

 

So, to sum up: he has to prove it on the pitch and convince me he can handle the stress and stay healthy.  I mean it may very well be that Joe Kinnear can be a fine manager, just that it is better it be a place out of the limelight.

 

Good post. I don't think it's possible for anyone to be "100% sure that he wasn't going to succumb to health issues again," though.

 

Yeah, I couldn't quite find the right words to express it the way I wanted.  Maybe beyond reasonable doubt would be a better way to put it.