Llambias Q&A with Chronicle: OP updated with Thursday's articles

[madras]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 TRUE; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget TRUE but who else was prepared to put ANY money towards the club,let alone transfer budgets ?, allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team MORE TO DO WITH THEY ARE DOING WELL AND WE ARN'T(Nothing at all to do with that - Lerner has been going since Day i). ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard THEY CAN ONLY BE JUDGED FROM WHEN THEY TOOK OVER...NOT WHERE NUFC WAS YEARS BEFORE THEY CAME IN[)They should be judged on WHAT ACTIONS THEY HAVE TAKEN TO IMPROVE THE CLUB - apart from Ashley 'covering' the debt, the rest has been dire.../color]- we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems THE FINANCES ARE MORE OF A PROBLEM THAN COMMUNICATION OR SOME FANS HAVING A PROBLEM WITH WISE....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'. I DON'T UNDERSTAND OFFERING KINNEAR A CONTRACT BUT THE CASH RAISER IDEA IS BIZZARRE CONSIDERING HOW MUCH HE'LL HAVE TO MAKE TO CLAW BACK WHAT HE'S PUT IN...IS IT A 30 YEAR PLAN ?...I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery. ANY IDEA WHO ?Perhaps there WOULD have been someone had Ashley not been arrogant and rude on his visit to Dubai and failed to keep an appointment with the Arabs....there WILL be someone, but not yet because this lot have left the club in such a mess on the field and in turmoil off it...

i wished you'd used a different colour....anyway,here goes.

 

point 1).....ie quietly supporting the team etc....what i meant was if we were top 6 no-one would be complaining about lack of communication etc.

 

2) we know what needs to be done ?----do we ? outside of appointing a better manager than kinnear few will agree will on anything apart from disliking wise and Llambias on a personal level without actually knowing what they do.

 

3) the bit about keeping an appointment with the arabs.................the ashley side of the story is that they already had a meeting and were offered a derisiory price. turned it down and went on the hoy. i have no reason to believe one story or the other..........do you know different ?

Do you know that its NOT the way things happened - why would they say it if it wasn't true ? If can't mak their chances of getting the club on the cheap any better..?In any case, as someone who has been in business for themselves, I know that I NEVER broke an appointment, nor did I expect others to do so with me.

 

As to point 2, yes, many of us DO know what needs to be done because its hardly rocket science - you appoint a DECENT MANAGER, agree a BUDGET with him, and provide him with a decent SCOUTING NETWORK to find future players...he then vets them and decides if they are HIS kind of player before signing them...you do NOT try to undermine him by appointing some guy who wasn't half the player that the manager was, or has nowhere near the managerial experience, over his head as so-called DOF ; NOR do you appoint someone who ran a Casino previously as your Chairman, esp if he has the charisma of a sideboard....

 

Had ANY of these things been done correctly, we would probably not have been in the dire position in which the club finds itself......and these points are just for starters.

a) i don't know but we have two conflicting stories with no evidence,therefore until i get evidence i'll believe neither.

 

b) i've said about kinnear aswell. as for the budget..how do you know they didn't. as for undermining keegan i'll await the court case to see if he was playing power games aswell (he has form)

c) we still don't know what the relationship between wise and keegan was.

d) appointing a casino boss as chairman.....why not ? take a look at most prem clubs chairmen and see if they are through and through football men ?

 

ashley and his team have made massive mistakes. kinnear long term being the biggest.

[merlin]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 TRUE; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget TRUE but who else was prepared to put ANY money towards the club,let alone transfer budgets ?, allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team MORE TO DO WITH THEY ARE DOING WELL AND WE ARN'T(Nothing at all to do with that - Lerner has been going since Day i). ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard THEY CAN ONLY BE JUDGED FROM WHEN THEY TOOK OVER...NOT WHERE NUFC WAS YEARS BEFORE THEY CAME IN[)They should be judged on WHAT ACTIONS THEY HAVE TAKEN TO IMPROVE THE CLUB - apart from Ashley 'covering' the debt, the rest has been dire.../color]- we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems THE FINANCES ARE MORE OF A PROBLEM THAN COMMUNICATION OR SOME FANS HAVING A PROBLEM WITH WISE....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'. I DON'T UNDERSTAND OFFERING KINNEAR A CONTRACT BUT THE CASH RAISER IDEA IS BIZZARRE CONSIDERING HOW MUCH HE'LL HAVE TO MAKE TO CLAW BACK WHAT HE'S PUT IN...IS IT A 30 YEAR PLAN ?...I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery. ANY IDEA WHO ?Perhaps there WOULD have been someone had Ashley not been arrogant and rude on his visit to Dubai and failed to keep an appointment with the Arabs....there WILL be someone, but not yet because this lot have left the club in such a mess on the field and in turmoil off it...

i wished you'd used a different colour....anyway,here goes.

 

point 1).....ie quietly supporting the team etc....what i meant was if we were top 6 no-one would be complaining about lack of communication etc.

 

2) we know what needs to be done ?----do we ? outside of appointing a better manager than kinnear few will agree will on anything apart from disliking wise and Llambias on a personal level without actually knowing what they do.

 

3) the bit about keeping an appointment with the arabs.................the ashley side of the story is that they already had a meeting and were offered a derisiory price. turned it down and went on the hoy. i have no reason to believe one story or the other..........do you know different ?

Do you know that its NOT the way things happened - why would they say it if it wasn't true ? If can't mak their chances of getting the club on the cheap any better..?In any case, as someone who has been in business for themselves, I know that I NEVER broke an appointment, nor did I expect others to do so with me.

 

As to point 2, yes, many of us DO know what needs to be done because its hardly rocket science - you appoint a DECENT MANAGER, agree a BUDGET with him, and provide him with a decent SCOUTING NETWORK to find future players...he then vets them and decides if they are HIS kind of player before signing them...you do NOT try to undermine him by appointing some guy who wasn't half the player that the manager was, or has nowhere near the managerial experience, over his head as so-called DOF ; NOR do you appoint someone who ran a Casino previously as your Chairman, esp if he has the charisma of a sideboard....

 

Had ANY of these things been done correctly, we would probably not have been in the dire position in which the club finds itself......and these points are just for starters.

a) i don't know but we have two conflicting stories with no evidence,therefore until i get evidence i'll believe neither.

 

b) i've said about kinnear aswell. as for the budget..how do you know they didn't. as for undermining keegan i'll await the court case to see if he was playing power games aswell (he has form)

c) we still don't know what the relationship between wise and keegan was.

d) appointing a casino boss as chairman.....why not ? take a look at most prem clubs chairmen and see if they are through and through football men ?

 

ashley and his team have made massive mistakes. kinnear long term being the biggest.

 

You are obviously happy with the status quo and the Board - I am NOT...

You have your view, I have mine and we'll NEVER agree..I hope, for your sake, you are right, because, assuming you are younger, you are going to have to live with the actions of Ashley & Co for a lot longer than I am ...!

[madras]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 TRUE; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget TRUE but who else was prepared to put ANY money towards the club,let alone transfer budgets ?, allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team MORE TO DO WITH THEY ARE DOING WELL AND WE ARN'T(Nothing at all to do with that - Lerner has been going since Day i). ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard THEY CAN ONLY BE JUDGED FROM WHEN THEY TOOK OVER...NOT WHERE NUFC WAS YEARS BEFORE THEY CAME IN[)They should be judged on WHAT ACTIONS THEY HAVE TAKEN TO IMPROVE THE CLUB - apart from Ashley 'covering' the debt, the rest has been dire.../color]- we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems THE FINANCES ARE MORE OF A PROBLEM THAN COMMUNICATION OR SOME FANS HAVING A PROBLEM WITH WISE....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'. I DON'T UNDERSTAND OFFERING KINNEAR A CONTRACT BUT THE CASH RAISER IDEA IS BIZZARRE CONSIDERING HOW MUCH HE'LL HAVE TO MAKE TO CLAW BACK WHAT HE'S PUT IN...IS IT A 30 YEAR PLAN ?...I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery. ANY IDEA WHO ?Perhaps there WOULD have been someone had Ashley not been arrogant and rude on his visit to Dubai and failed to keep an appointment with the Arabs....there WILL be someone, but not yet because this lot have left the club in such a mess on the field and in turmoil off it...

i wished you'd used a different colour....anyway,here goes.

 

point 1).....ie quietly supporting the team etc....what i meant was if we were top 6 no-one would be complaining about lack of communication etc.

 

2) we know what needs to be done ?----do we ? outside of appointing a better manager than kinnear few will agree will on anything apart from disliking wise and Llambias on a personal level without actually knowing what they do.

 

3) the bit about keeping an appointment with the arabs.................the ashley side of the story is that they already had a meeting and were offered a derisiory price. turned it down and went on the hoy. i have no reason to believe one story or the other..........do you know different ?

Do you know that its NOT the way things happened - why would they say it if it wasn't true ? If can't mak their chances of getting the club on the cheap any better..?In any case, as someone who has been in business for themselves, I know that I NEVER broke an appointment, nor did I expect others to do so with me.

 

As to point 2, yes, many of us DO know what needs to be done because its hardly rocket science - you appoint a DECENT MANAGER, agree a BUDGET with him, and provide him with a decent SCOUTING NETWORK to find future players...he then vets them and decides if they are HIS kind of player before signing them...you do NOT try to undermine him by appointing some guy who wasn't half the player that the manager was, or has nowhere near the managerial experience, over his head as so-called DOF ; NOR do you appoint someone who ran a Casino previously as your Chairman, esp if he has the charisma of a sideboard....

 

Had ANY of these things been done correctly, we would probably not have been in the dire position in which the club finds itself......and these points are just for starters.

a) i don't know but we have two conflicting stories with no evidence,therefore until i get evidence i'll believe neither.

 

b) i've said about kinnear aswell. as for the budget..how do you know they didn't. as for undermining keegan i'll await the court case to see if he was playing power games aswell (he has form)

c) we still don't know what the relationship between wise and keegan was.

d) appointing a casino boss as chairman.....why not ? take a look at most prem clubs chairmen and see if they are through and through football men ?

 

ashley and his team have made massive mistakes. kinnear long term being the biggest.

 

You are obviously happy with the status quo and the Board - I am NOT...

You have your view, I have mine and we'll NEVER agree..I hope, for your sake, you are right, because, assuming you are younger, you are going to have to live with the actions of Ashley & Co for a lot longer than I am ...!

typical response of the anti-ashley brigade.

 

i'm not happy but i'm not blaming either. a) they took over from a shitty position.

 

b) i'm not happy about kinnears appointment either

 

c) i haven't got a clue about the remit of wise or Llambias so can't really make a judgement.

 

i can't be right or wrong as what i've said all along is people are jumping in and making conclusions based on sod all and i'm not prepared to do that. if somebody does well i'll praise (i did with fred and hall) if somebody does poorly i'll criticise (as before unfortunatly).

 

the biggest mistake they've made is kinnear. i could understand bringing him in for 6 weeks or so till the club was sold but oncde it became clear there was no sale he should've been thanked and replaced. in my view that was bigger than keegan leaving.

[NE5]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 ; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget , allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard - we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'....I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery.

 

 

 

nailed.

 

Nobody has responded to my genuine question I made last night either. I wonder why, I suspect its because they would all be happy to be backing Keegan or attempting to make progress but won't admit it because it doesn't fit with their "prudency" and "debts" angle ....... or any old stick to beat the old board with. Nowt changes.

 

 

 

 

[NE5]

According to Doug Ellis Lerner looked at Newcastle and Everton but was put off by the clubs debts, quite clearly Llambias wasn't talking about being an exact copy of Villa though and was talking about being able to push on up the league like they have and try and crack the top 4, I'm sure Ashley would like to be in the position that Lerner is in and any money he puts into the club can go into strengthening the first team rather than helping pay for the day to day running of the club but we will get there soon enough.

 

The clubs annual loses are slowly coming down from £34m in 2007 to £20m in 2008 and a predicted loss of £7m in 2009 so they are turning it around.

that projected loss relies on the big gamble of avoiding relegation.

 

 

personally i think ashley would have been better served releasing a bit to help the chances of staying up in order to protect his initial investment.

 

we are getting somewhere here.

 

 

[NE5]

According to Doug Ellis Lerner looked at Newcastle and Everton but was put off by the clubs debts, quite clearly Llambias wasn't talking about being an exact copy of Villa though and was talking about being able to push on up the league like they have and try and crack the top 4, I'm sure Ashley would like to be in the position that Lerner is in and any money he puts into the club can go into strengthening the first team rather than helping pay for the day to day running of the club but we will get there soon enough.

 

The clubs annual loses are slowly coming down from £34m in 2007 to £20m in 2008 and a predicted loss of £7m in 2009 so they are turning it around.

 

The only thing Llambias meant when he was talking about "being an Aston Villa" was that their owner didn't spent very much at all in their first two seasons, helped balance the debt, and then slowly moved forward.  But, if you hate Ashley you're not really willing to look at that anyway.  Ashley won't make money until we are challenging in the league, why can't anyone see that?  The past regime pocketed over 150 millions pounds while Ashley has pocketed ZERO so far.  He's not penny pinching for the sake of lining his own pockets, he's making sure the club is on an even keel before we push forward and make our moves up the table.   It has been almost three years since Lerner bought the Villains and they are just now moving up the league.  Cut Ashley some slack and let him balance the books before we start calling for his head.  In the next year or two we're going to have one of the best academies producing youngsters in the country and we'll be making our way up the table.  That's what their "five year plan" is all about; keep us in the Prem, funnel through very useful youngsters, and slowly invest in the team in a competent and responsible manner.

 

keep this until next year when we are either playing in the next league down, or fighting another relegation battle, which will be 3 years into the "plan"

 

 

[NE5]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

[NE5]

Get back in your own thread NE5.

 

nowt to say then ?

 

 

Just joking man, I'm pretty bored, we all know spending money improves your chances of doing well, but it's not a given, you need the right manager, the right scouts and the right amount of money but you can do well without spending massive amount if you have the right manager e.g. Moyes and Everton.

 

on the other hand, if you are lucky enough to get a decent manager, and it IS a lottery, and don't back him, he'll be off. Like Moyes, unless Everton are taken over or it all suddenly goes tits up for him.

 

When you say "do well", how well do YOU want to do ?

 

 

 

It's a lottery getting a good manager?

 

No it's a skill, not an easy one but it is definately a skill.

 

is it now ?

 

We'll see how easily Arsenal replace Wenger and ManU replace Ferguson.

 

Or Everton replace Moyes ..........

 

 

 

Even a "good manager" isn't necessarily the "right manager", which I suppose adds credence to NE5's "lottery" theory.

 

Bit simplistic on the whole though, as usual.

 

you mean "realistic", as usual. Which also, as usual, too many people fail to grasp.

 

 

were you happy with the kinnear appointment ?

 

hey getting a good manager is a lottery right,surely theres as much chance getting a s*** one to turn out good results as there is a good one turning out bad to your thinking or maybe you are piffling again in anattempt to detect any criticism from the your beloved fred ?

 

(conversly it must work with players aswell...shevchenko,veron,woodgate at real,keane at liverpool......good players who didn't do it so surely it means it's pointless spending big as these players prove it works)

 

 

i'll stop you in your tracks........."back your manager"............what with ? where was the money going to come from......at this point you mention the debt of others and as always i mention the debt of the top 4 is different to ours as they are making money aside from those with sugar daddies where as we have consistently made losses (not a good scenario when begging to the banks with few assets left to hock). look at the other clubs who,like us have lived beyond their means,they are all cutting right back and ask yourself what liverpools or arsenals spending would be like if they missed out on the champs league for 3 or 4 years ?

 

often on here you have alluded to others having thir heads in the sand but it is clear the one one doing an ostrich is yourself in relation to the position fred left us in.

 

silly.

 

Especially when there are still people hell bent on defending Ashley to the bitter end, and I mean bitter end = relegation and with little chance of coming back.

 

Pleased for you that you still appear to write off all those european qualifications and champions league appearances and the manner in which they were achieved.

 

Still, nobody is "embarrassing us" any more, right ?

 

 

BORING !

 

we've covered the euro qualifications to death as that has little to do with the position we were in spring 2007.

 

defending ashley to the bitter end......like you defending fred ?

 

i never mentioned being embarassed by fred's utterences.

 

 

nice to see you keep your head in the sand re our position when fred left.

 

you mentioned Shepherd, not me, with a silly childish comment.

 

Yep, I will "defend" anybody who gave me the only 15 years out of 45 that tried to compete at the levels this club should always compete at, and thus gave me the best most consistent and highest league positions as a result.  As I've said before. 

 

 

 

Then you should be happy that your season ticket money is going towards paying the bills he racked up in the process.

 

The alternative is of course, only supporting the club when they are winning, as you did when the Halls and Shepherd took over [if you even did that]

 

 

Was that the Hall/Shepherd era where we were nearly relegated from the 1st division? Or the Hall/Shepherd era where we were finishing 13th in the league despite the big spending?

 

nah, the Hall/Shepherd who took over a club days from bankruptcy, getting 15000 gates and couldn't be sold for 1.25m quid, that became a club filling a 52000 all seater stadium, playing in the champions league, qualifying for europe more than anybody but 4 clubs, and was valued at anything between 100m and 200m quid.

 

I am sorry you feel the need to scorn the big spending that did all of that, what a shame you would have preferred solvency and 2nd division obscurity instead of beating Barcelona and playing in the San Siro.

 

 

 

You really are one blinkered old man aren't you. Who said I didn't appreciate the wonderful football we have experienced, but you paint the Hall/Shepherd days with such rose-tinted spectacles. You fail to see what it has cost this club to get these things. You know I wouldn't prefer to be in the 2nd division, but a happy medium of the club not being whored out to pay for the fabulous football we saw would have been nice, do you not think? As for the £100-£200 million quid. Are you happy that Sir John Hall and Fred Shepherd pocketed over £180 million between them when this club was sold, especially since Sir John Hall stood on the steps of St James when he first bought the club and stated he wasn't in it for the money! YEAH RIGHT!

 

oh dear. Resorting to insults. How old are you ? I'm not old you daft bugger, and I'm in good health too. If you don't want to listen to others who have seen things [without meaning to sound patronising] then you really do have a serious problem, and are talking like a naive teenager.

 

I don't believe you saw the mediocrity of the 1970's and 1980's if you think the souness, Roeder and Allardyce league positions were mediocre league positions.

 

Sorry like, but I don't. I believed you at first but your own comments have gave me the impression I now have.

 

I have no idea what makes you think I am happy with money going out of the club. All I have said is that the Halls and Shepherd are by far the best owners we have had in 50 years, in fact, the ONLY good owners in that time. To that extent, they deserved something, for the job they did and the initial risks they took, taking over the club in the state it was in.

 

And don't compare the state of the club in 1991 to now, because believe me, it was miles apart.

 

 

 

but we're in the same league position now as we were when shepherd left, so its not the league positions you care about? but how much money we spend? seems weird.

 

I don't ever remember us being in such a relegation scrap under Shepherd's tenure though.

 

point taken, but remember we're always only one or two results away from being out of it (just as much as the opposite is true i understand). but to criticise ashley on current league position while stating that the souness roeder allardyce finishes were not mediocre is hypocritical, whereas to criticise ashley on financial grounds is at best naive and at worst a blatant agenda.

 

I really don't know how many times this has to be said. A board that backs their manager and shows ambition will always be better than one who choose not to.

 

 

i agree, however i feel thats over simplifying the issue somewhat, dont you? in light of the clubs current financial status?

 

You mean seeing 2 of our best players, one of whom has been a fabric of the club and couldn't wait to get away, and our captain to follow soon, is over-simplifying ? I don't think so. In fact, its frightening.

 

 

 

no thats not what i mean because thats not what i said. i dont really think thats relevant to backing the manager? as it opens a whole load of other issues regarding whether jfk wanted given and n'zogbia to stay, what the club did to keep them etc, so lets not side track. i agree with you that boards should back their managers financially, but given the clubs finances at present, how should the board be providing more than they currently are?

 

I'm not sure either, but maybe Shay Given could shed some light on it ? As well as Keegan and Owen ? Don't you find their actions tell you something ?

 

 

i reckon they'd tell you they left cos the club aint going to be challenging anytime soon (and i would say it it was down to the financial mess we are in)

 

you would say we should have kept on borrowing to keep these players ,cross your fingers and hope we find success before the banks say "no" or "err can we have our money back please"

 

I understand what you and the others are saying. You wish we hadnt' played in the Champions League rather than aim for a relegation and solvency, and you think every club except us is successful, always appoint the right man, and make profits at the same time

 

 

oh we know that trick,the one where you try to make out someone said something they didn't.

 

 

what i am saying (and you well know it) is that after dropping out the champs league you can gamble a bit to get back in,but if you fail and you keep on gambling and failing.....you end up like all other gamblers who fail.

 

still awaiting your answer by the way of where the money would come from year on year when making losses year on year and do you understand that you can't keep borrowing for ever.

 

Simple difference is, I don't believe Ashley has a clue about football, or how to succeed, nor the desire to do what it takes even if this belief is incorrect. Whereas I have no doubt whatsoever that the Halls and Shepherd would have re-grouped and had another go, and probably had some success too.

 

 

do you feel you can draw a fair comparison at this point? given that ashley has only had the club for a small fraction of time compared to the last lot? the challenges he faces are different to the ones they faced when taking over, wouldnt you say?

 

Aye, Ashley is in a far better position.

 

In some ways and in other ways not.

 

The club is in far superior position now than it was in the early 90's.

 

It's true that there are loads of things that are better about the club and the situation it finds itself in now than in the early 90s:

 

Bigger, better SJP; better league position; better squad; higher profile; larger crowds; more TV money; more revenue full-stop; improved training facilities; and so-on.

 

However there are a number of things about the club and the current situation that are worse:

 

Bigger debt; higher supporter expectations (therefore increased demand for success, less patience, etc); huge wage bill; players are much more powerful when it comes to contracts, etc meaning it is harder to get rid of players you don't want and bring in players you do; hugely inflated transfer fees and player wages; bigger, stronger opposition, some with money's-no-object budgets; much less room for improvement, especially relative improvement compared to other Premiership clubs; the global "Credit Crunch"; a somewhat tarnished reputation; less obvious ways of improving things, and so-on.

 

So, I don't think it's true that Ashley's in a far better position, some things are better, others are worse, which is easier or more difficult is hard to judge, the problems are different, but there are still problems.

 

not a single thing is worse than in 1991. Nothing.

 

 

[fredbob]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 ; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget , allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard - we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'....I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery.

 

 

 

nailed.

 

Nobody has responded to my genuine question I made last night either. I wonder why, I suspect its because they would all be happy to be backing Keegan or attempting to make progress but won't admit it because it doesn't fit with their "prudency" and "debts" angle ....... or any old stick to beat the old board with. Nowt changes.

 

 

 

 

 

Amazing how many people fail to realise that the teams who are able to pour funds into the first team all started out in a much better financial situation than us. You cant just add to an inflated wage bill and debt level and hope for a form of finance to pay it off (ie CL).

 

We need to get our wage bill down to a sensilbe level and then look to invest like Villa have done, like Spurs have done like Sunderland have done, its interesting that Wigan and Everton (teams in similar dire situation to our regarding wages and debt) havent really spent the going amount either, coincidence?

 

Its such a simple point. 

[Mick]

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

 

You can't find links to what I say so you now claim to read minds. 

[maze]

NE5: You didn't respond to my post back at pg. 21. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

Don't see why that's a stupid point of view, I certainly thought Ashley would be a great owner, as did many people.

 

It doesn't seem to be ridiculed now everyone is saying anything would be better than Ashley, even though they haven't got any idea who it might be.

[maze]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

Don't see why that's a stupid point of view, I certainly thought Ashley would be a great owner, as did many people.

 

It doesn't seem to be ridiculed now everyone is saying anything would be better than Ashley, even though they haven't got any idea who it might be.

 

Got to agree with you Ian W.  At first I honestly thought Ashley would be a great owner. Although it became pretty clear from the very start he wasn't a 'Roman calibre' in term of money, I really expected a lot more from him.

 

He's made so many stupid mistakes since taking over. For instance, Mort disappeared in came Llambas (!!) Jimenez left the club, and I really rate Jimenez. It looks like Wise is doing a great job at getting in young players, but why is he appointed DOF? Why isn't he just name head scout?

 

We need a good manager, well... look no further than Sven G. Eriksson.  He's having a hard time in Mexico, and seriously, why wouldn't he be interested in the newcastle job, when he (according to the sun - to what ever degree you can take their shit for real), doesn't reject the prospect of managing Portsmouth ?!

[AyeDubbleYoo]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

Don't see why that's a stupid point of view, I certainly thought Ashley would be a great owner, as did many people.

 

It doesn't seem to be ridiculed now everyone is saying anything would be better than Ashley, even though they haven't got any idea who it might be.

 

Got to agree with you Ian W.  At first I honestly thought Ashley would be a great owner. Although it became pretty clear from the very start he wasn't a 'Roman calibre' in term of money, I really expected a lot more from him.

 

He's made so many stupid mistakes since taking over. For instance, Mort disappeared in came Llambas (!!) Jimenez left the club, and I really rate Jimenez. It looks like Wise is doing a great job at getting in young players, but why is he appointed DOF? Why isn't he just name head scout?

 

We need a good manager, well... look no further than Sven G. Eriksson.  He's having a hard time in Mexico, and seriously, why wouldn't he be interested in the newcastle job, when he (according to the sun - to what ever degree you can take their shit for real), doesn't reject the prospect of managing Portsmouth ?!

 

The biggest tragedy of the Ashley era is how brilliant it promised to be.

 

I know he's fucked up a few decisions, Llambias and Kinnear being two of them... but I'm getting the feeling that he's made his mind up to sort things out now.

 

I'm not ready to write off the Ashley era yet, I suppose that's why I always end up defending him on here.

[NE5]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 ; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget , allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard - we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'....I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery.

 

 

 

nailed.

 

Nobody has responded to my genuine question I made last night either. I wonder why, I suspect its because they would all be happy to be backing Keegan or attempting to make progress but won't admit it because it doesn't fit with their "prudency" and "debts" angle ....... or any old stick to beat the old board with. Nowt changes.

 

 

 

 

 

Amazing how many people fail to realise that the teams who are able to pour funds into the first team all started out in a much better financial situation than us. You cant just add to an inflated wage bill and debt level and hope for a form of finance to pay it off (ie CL).

 

We need to get our wage bill down to a sensilbe level and then look to invest like Villa have done, like Spurs have done like Sunderland have done, its interesting that Wigan and Everton (teams in similar dire situation to our regarding wages and debt) havent really spent the going amount either, coincidence?

 

Its such a simple point. 

 

the mackems ?

 

don't make me laugh.

 

this is what an expert in finance did for them.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Murray

 

 

 

[NE5]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

Don't see why that's a stupid point of view, I certainly thought Ashley would be a great owner, as did many people.

 

It doesn't seem to be ridiculed now everyone is saying anything would be better than Ashley, even though they haven't got any idea who it might be.

 

Considering only 4 clubs qualified for europe more than we did under the Halls and Shepherd, automatically assuming "anyone" - or Ashley - would be better, is a stupid point of view.

 

 

[NE5]

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

 

You can't find links to what I say so you now claim to read minds. 

 

so are you prepared to accept that the Halls and Shepherd have been by far the best owners in 50 years or not ?

 

 

[Mick]

 

so are you prepared to accept that the Halls and Shepherd have been by far the best owners in 50 years or not ?

 

 

 

I've answered that before and pointed that out many times, you know the answer.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

Don't see why that's a stupid point of view, I certainly thought Ashley would be a great owner, as did many people.

 

It doesn't seem to be ridiculed now everyone is saying anything would be better than Ashley, even though they haven't got any idea who it might be.

 

Considering only 4 clubs qualified for europe more than we did under the Halls and Shepherd, automatically assuming "anyone" - or Ashley - would be better, is a stupid point of view.

 

 

I know we had some success on the pitch, everyone accepts that... it's impossible to argue against.

 

Don't want to start another massive argument about the merits of each board, but my opinion is that by the end of the Shepherd regime they had become a laughing stock and a disaster for the club, and I had every right to expect Ashley to be a better owner.

 

Edit: By the way, if you can only judge a board over a period of 10+ years then how come Ashley is due so much stick from you already?

[Guest toonlass]

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

 

You can't find links to what I say so you now claim to read minds. 

 

so are you prepared to accept that the Halls and Shepherd have been by far the best owners in 50 years or not ?

 

 

 

In terms of football on the field yes, in terms of managing to line their own pockets yes, in terms of landing us with crippling debts yes.

 

So the answer there is yes.

[BottledDog]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

Don't see why that's a stupid point of view, I certainly thought Ashley would be a great owner, as did many people.

 

It doesn't seem to be ridiculed now everyone is saying anything would be better than Ashley, even though they haven't got any idea who it might be.

 

Got to agree with you Ian W.  At first I honestly thought Ashley would be a great owner. Although it became pretty clear from the very start he wasn't a 'Roman calibre' in term of money, I really expected a lot more from him.

 

He's made so many stupid mistakes since taking over. For instance, Mort disappeared in came Llambas (!!) Jimenez left the club, and I really rate Jimenez. It looks like Wise is doing a great job at getting in young players, but why is he appointed DOF? Why isn't he just name head scout?

 

We need a good manager, well... look no further than Sven G. Eriksson.  He's having a hard time in Mexico, and seriously, why wouldn't he be interested in the newcastle job, when he (according to the sun - to what ever degree you can take their shit for real), doesn't reject the prospect of managing Portsmouth ?!

 

Jiminez resigned, the papers running with the story that he saw no point in continuing in his role as the club was for sale.

And I'm pretty sure Mort always said he would be going to go back to Freshfields.

Not a fan of Llambias and he is paying for his lack of communication but no doubt he has the experience to run the comercial side.

As for wise, I don't think he can be called a scout, he has a lead role in negotiations with clubs and players according to Llambias for a start.

 

I think calls for a figurehead on the footballing side are spot on by the way. Leave Llambias to sort the pies and Wise to bring in the kids and deal with player negotiations and get someone in to tie it all up with experience to help with the big footballing decisions such as managerial appointments, and who is comfortable talking to the press and supporters.

 

A pretty good role for Shearer or maybe even Moncur (sadly not Robson now).

 

 

 

/Don't even think about Beardsley or MacDonald...

[fredbob]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 ; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget , allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard - we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'....I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery.

 

 

 

nailed.

 

Nobody has responded to my genuine question I made last night either. I wonder why, I suspect its because they would all be happy to be backing Keegan or attempting to make progress but won't admit it because it doesn't fit with their "prudency" and "debts" angle ....... or any old stick to beat the old board with. Nowt changes.

 

 

 

 

 

Amazing how many people fail to realise that the teams who are able to pour funds into the first team all started out in a much better financial situation than us. You cant just add to an inflated wage bill and debt level and hope for a form of finance to pay it off (ie CL).

 

We need to get our wage bill down to a sensilbe level and then look to invest like Villa have done, like Spurs have done like Sunderland have done, its interesting that Wigan and Everton (teams in similar dire situation to our regarding wages and debt) havent really spent the going amount either, coincidence?

 

Its such a simple point. 

 

the mackems ?

 

don't make me laugh.

 

this is what an expert in finance did for them.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Murray

 

 

 

 

Are you kidding me? The Mackems have spent shit loads. Why is that hard to understand? The biggest spenders sice the Tv money came in have all been previously financilly prudent, (at the sake of ambition, true) Im glad we didnt sacriice ambition to be prudent in the past- Im glad we acheived all those CL qualifications but one thing for sure, I recognise the need (like many) to hold back now becasue of the financially precarious situation we're in at presnt.

 

If you want to equate that to a scarifice of ambition in the short term to build on ambition in the long term then thats fine.

[NE5]

 

Did you think that before Keegan-gate? When things seemed to be going along nicely and we'd made a good start to the season?

 

 

He thought we'd finish above Arsenal last season when we had Allardyce.

 

 

and you thought Ashley - or anybody - would be better than the Halls and Shepherd.

 

 

Don't see why that's a stupid point of view, I certainly thought Ashley would be a great owner, as did many people.

 

It doesn't seem to be ridiculed now everyone is saying anything would be better than Ashley, even though they haven't got any idea who it might be.

 

Considering only 4 clubs qualified for europe more than we did under the Halls and Shepherd, automatically assuming "anyone" - or Ashley - would be better, is a stupid point of view.

 

 

I know we had some success on the pitch, everyone accepts that... it's impossible to argue against.

 

Don't want to start another massive argument about the merits of each board, but my opinion is that by the end of the Shepherd regime they had become a laughing stock and a disaster for the club, and I had every right to expect Ashley to be a better owner.

 

Edit: By the way, if you can only judge a board over a period of 10+ years then how come Ashley is due so much stick from you already?

 

rubbish.

 

I've told you why Ashley is getting stick from me, because I don't think he knows what he is doing and because I don't think he cares enough about the club to want genuine success on the pitch.

 

 

 

 

[NE5]

 

so are you prepared to accept that the Halls and Shepherd have been by far the best owners in 50 years or not ?

 

 

 

I've answered that before and pointed that out many times, you know the answer.

 

I don't. All I have seen is a load of fudged nonsense, skirting the issue, and then ending up back to making excuses for Ashley.

 

Why not answer my quite genuine question about Keegan from last night. Would you be happy if he had been backed and we were doing better, or would you be saying he shouldn't be doing this because of the debt ? You WERE happy when Keegan was re-appointed I take it ? And if so, then you must have expected him to be backed by Ashley which would be part of you being pleased about it ?

 

 

[NE5]

Having looked at the first 3 pages of response to Llambias's interview comments on nufc.com(its always good to try to see what other boards are thinking), it is clear that the vast majority of fans there are NOT convinced by the Club's owner/board and their policy - and I have to agree.

 

There are far too many anomalies in his statements ; things like trying to 'become an Aston Villa' are ludicrous because Villa run their club in an entirely different way to this lot ; they have a proven manager & coaches who have made progress with the team since day 1 ; they have an owner who most other fans will have forgotten about because he simply provides MON with a decent budget , allows him to get on with it, and turns up quietly to support the team ; in any event , we have already BEEN where Villa are , and even past that by playing CL Football in recent years, so Llambias is showing lack of ambition by implying that we have to use them as a standard - we KNOW what needs to be done but the Board and owner clearly DON'T ; they believe that appointing someone like Wise as DOF and a complete novice like Llambias as Chairman who then try to operate some supposedly-iconic system like the Continentals is going to be the answer to all the club's problems....this is the charitable version...the less charitable view is that they are cynically using the club as a cash-raising device by selling players with talent and replacing them with journeymen whilst making it up as they go along with such decisions as offering Kinnear an extended contract on the grounds that he is 'what they need'....I'll BET he is - I remember Stan Seymour saying that after the Board went up to Hibs and bought Ralph Callachan back in 1977 after Richard Dinnis and Gordon Lee said they DIDN'T want the player....

They have compounded this mistake by keeping the coaches in charge now that Kinnear is out of action, maybe for good ; instead of decisively going for a new, preferably younger manager(for the long term), or an experienced proven guy until the season's end, they have gambled on the club's future, probably out of parsimony...

 

These guys are a joke and their lack of know-how and penny-pinching will return to haunt them big-style.

I am NOT convinced and the sooner the club is sold to people who may approach Randy Lerner's outlook, the better for all concerned, otherwise we are all in for a few years of misery.

 

 

 

nailed.

 

Nobody has responded to my genuine question I made last night either. I wonder why, I suspect its because they would all be happy to be backing Keegan or attempting to make progress but won't admit it because it doesn't fit with their "prudency" and "debts" angle ....... or any old stick to beat the old board with. Nowt changes.

 

 

 

 

 

Amazing how many people fail to realise that the teams who are able to pour funds into the first team all started out in a much better financial situation than us. You cant just add to an inflated wage bill and debt level and hope for a form of finance to pay it off (ie CL).

 

We need to get our wage bill down to a sensilbe level and then look to invest like Villa have done, like Spurs have done like Sunderland have done, its interesting that Wigan and Everton (teams in similar dire situation to our regarding wages and debt) havent really spent the going amount either, coincidence?

 

Its such a simple point. 

 

the mackems ?

 

don't make me laugh.

 

this is what an expert in finance did for them.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Murray

 

 

 

 

Are you kidding me? The Mackems have spent shit loads. Why is that hard to understand? The biggest spenders sice the Tv money came in have all been previously financilly prudent, (at the sake of ambition, true) Im glad we didnt sacriice ambition to be prudent in the past- Im glad we acheived all those CL qualifications but one thing for sure, I recognise the need (like many) to hold back now becasue of the financially precarious situation we're in at presnt.

 

If you want to equate that to a scarifice of ambition in the short term to build on ambition in the long term then thats fine.

 

have you actually clicked on that link, never mind read it ?