NUSC - Good or Bad?

[ChezGiven]

More specifically though, you were privvy to the fact that they discussed details for 2 days before he made a decision? Well no, you werent, all you know is that it took 2 days between approach and decision.

 

"I can confirm I met Newcastle representatives," Venables told The Sun. "Those talks will continue in the morning [today] when, hopefully, I can give them a final decision."

 

Makes it sound like he slept on it not that they were locked in a room for 2 days thrashing out the minutae.

 

Anyway, if he did spend 2 days in talks, sort of rubbishes the theory that the obvious cluelessness and mismanagement of Ashley put him off. If you want to insist on the length of deliberation then what does that mean about how he viewed Keegan's departure? Cant have it both ways.

 

Its all irrelevant anyway, my personal view is that the turmoil put him off.

 

[NE5]

More specifically though, you were privvy to the fact that they discussed details for 2 days before he made a decision? Well no, you werent, all you know is that it took 2 days between approach and decision.

 

"I can confirm I met Newcastle representatives," Venables told The Sun. "Those talks will continue in the morning [today] when, hopefully, I can give them a final decision."

 

Makes it sound like he slept on it not that they were locked in a room for 2 days thrashing out the minutae.

 

Anyway, if he did spend 2 days in talks, sort of rubbishes the theory that the obvious cluelessness and mismanagement of Ashley put him off. If you want to insist on the length of deliberation then what does that mean about how he viewed Keegan's departure? Cant have it both ways.

 

Its all irrelevant anyway, my personal view is that the turmoil put him off.

 

 

A lot of managers simply wouldn't be prepared to risk their reputations by taking on a loser in the form of a board who wasn't going to give him the tools to succeed.

 

Kinnear had nothing to lose, he just wanted to get back into the game having been forgotten about for a few years.

 

 

[ChezGiven]

More specifically though, you were privvy to the fact that they discussed details for 2 days before he made a decision? Well no, you werent, all you know is that it took 2 days between approach and decision.

 

"I can confirm I met Newcastle representatives," Venables told The Sun. "Those talks will continue in the morning [today] when, hopefully, I can give them a final decision."

 

Makes it sound like he slept on it not that they were locked in a room for 2 days thrashing out the minutae.

 

Anyway, if he did spend 2 days in talks, sort of rubbishes the theory that the obvious cluelessness and mismanagement of Ashley put him off. If you want to insist on the length of deliberation then what does that mean about how he viewed Keegan's departure? Cant have it both ways.

 

Its all irrelevant anyway, my personal view is that the turmoil put him off.

 

 

A lot of managers simply wouldn't be prepared to risk their reputations by taking on a loser in the form of a board who wasn't going to give him the tools to succeed.

 

Kinnear had nothing to lose, he just wanted to get back into the game having been forgotten about for a few years.

 

 

Especially if they thought the supporters were not going to give them time.

 

I know its not a popular point of view but i just dont get where the 'supporters are beyond reproach' idea comes from.

 

From the wankers at Stamford bridge loudly complaining about london based part-timers, to the stupid cunt in front of me at SJP who indignantly responded to my joke about us having 'terrible ball-boys' with the fact that Shearer was one at Keegan's final match, i've met some fucking idiots supporting the toon and often the biggest ones have the loudest voices.

 

Ashley + Keegan + fan's reaction = Kinnear.

[Parky]

More specifically though, you were privvy to the fact that they discussed details for 2 days before he made a decision? Well no, you werent, all you know is that it took 2 days between approach and decision.

 

"I can confirm I met Newcastle representatives," Venables told The Sun. "Those talks will continue in the morning [today] when, hopefully, I can give them a final decision."

 

Makes it sound like he slept on it not that they were locked in a room for 2 days thrashing out the minutae.

 

Anyway, if he did spend 2 days in talks, sort of rubbishes the theory that the obvious cluelessness and mismanagement of Ashley put him off. If you want to insist on the length of deliberation then what does that mean about how he viewed Keegan's departure? Cant have it both ways.

 

Its all irrelevant anyway, my personal view is that the turmoil put him off.

 

 

A lot of managers simply wouldn't be prepared to risk their reputations by taking on a loser in the form of a board who wasn't going to give him the tools to succeed.

 

Kinnear had nothing to lose, he just wanted to get back into the game having been forgotten about for a few years.

 

 

Especially if they thought the supporters were not going to give them time.

 

I know its not a popular point of view but i just dont get where the 'supporters are beyond reproach' idea comes from.

 

From the wankers at Stamford bridge loudly complaining about london based part-timers, to the stupid cunt in front of me at SJP who indignantly responded to my joke about us having 'terrible ball-boys' with the fact that Shearer was one at Keegan's final match, i've met some fucking idiots supporting the toon and often the biggest ones have the loudest voices.

 

Ashley + Keegan + Darwin = Kinnear.

 

 

 

 

[UV]

More specifically though, you were privvy to the fact that they discussed details for 2 days before he made a decision? Well no, you werent, all you know is that it took 2 days between approach and decision.

 

"I can confirm I met Newcastle representatives," Venables told The Sun. "Those talks will continue in the morning [today] when, hopefully, I can give them a final decision."

 

Makes it sound like he slept on it not that they were locked in a room for 2 days thrashing out the minutae.

 

Anyway, if he did spend 2 days in talks, sort of rubbishes the theory that the obvious cluelessness and mismanagement of Ashley put him off. If you want to insist on the length of deliberation then what does that mean about how he viewed Keegan's departure? Cant have it both ways.

 

Its all irrelevant anyway, my personal view is that the turmoil put him off.

 

 

I guess he had to go home and watch SSN for a bit before he decided, then had to go back and meet with them the next day to tell them face to face he didn't want the job because of the protests. 

 

I see you snipped your 'meaning too much to too many people' quote from a larger piece originally in the Sun:

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/n/newcastle_united/7636504.stm

 

"There is one reason and one reason alone why I've turned down the chance to take temporary charge at Newcastle - time," he told The Sun newspaper.

 

"Newcastle United means too much to too many people to take the job on a short-term basis. It demands total commitment and dedication from a manager who is prepared to throw himself heart and soul into the club.

 

I didn't want the fans to think I'd gone up there just to pocket a few quid from Mike Ashley

 

"I didn't want to move up to Tyneside and find myself surplus to requirements before I'd even had the chance to get my teeth into the challenge.

 

"The way the job was offered to me meant that I might be working at St James' Park for two months, two years - or two weeks. There was far too much uncertainty involved."

 

He added: "The Newcastle supporters have suffered more than enough in recent years.

 

"I didn't want them to think I'd gone up there just to pocket a few quid from Mike Ashley and then wave 'cheerio' a couple of weeks later."

 

I don't think any reading between the lines is required here tbh.

[ChezGiven]

No idea what you're saying now.

 

Did he spend time thinking it over as it wasnt obvious to him there was an issue with the board?

 

Or did he just take a couple of days to think it over?

 

As for the last bit, read between the lines, he mentions the fans 4 times in a short statement about turning down a job due to the terms of a contract.

[Happy Face]

Wasn't Megson booed for his first game in charge of Bolton?

 

As fan's, we aren't to blame.  Name the last manager we got sacked?  I can't remember us giving any of them a real bollocking in the stadium.  Even Souness.

 

We don't put potential managers off.

 

If a manager is put off by 52,000 passionate fans turning up every week and voicing their feelings he's small time, insecure and not positive enough to lead a squad to victory.

[Syrette]

As fan's, we aren't to blame.  Name the last manager we got sacked?  I can't remember us giving any of them a real bollocking in the stadium.  Even Souness.

 

Allardyce to an extent.

 

We might not be the main culprit (that should always be results), but we may well make the decisions easier. 

[ChezGiven]

9th manager to go this weekend?

 

Plenty of alternatives for top managers these days.

 

No one is saying anythign about getting managers sacked HF.

[Parky]

Wasn't Megson booed for his first game in charge of Bolton?

 

As fan's, we aren't to blame.  Name the last manager we got sacked?  I can't remember us giving any of them a real bollocking in the stadium.  Even Souness.

 

We don't put potential managers off.

 

If a manager is put off by 52,000 passionate fans turning up every week and voicing their feelings he's small time, insecure and not positive enough to lead a squad to victory.

 

Agree with last bit.

[Happy Face]

9th manager to go this weekend?

 

Plenty of alternatives for top managers these days.

 

No one is saying anythign about getting managers sacked HF.

 

So what puts them off?  The blind support the fans gave to a manager that did well?

 

I don't see how the fans coming out in support of Keegan without knowing all the facts would put off a future manager likely to get similar backing if he performs.

[David Icke - Son of God]

As fan's, we aren't to blame.  Name the last manager we got sacked?  I can't remember us giving any of them a real bollocking in the stadium.  Even Souness.

 

Allardyce to an extent.

 

We might not be the main culprit (that should always be results), but we may well have make the decisions easier. 

 

Bollocks. I can remember a lot of fans still belting out chorus' of 'Big Sam's Black and White Army' up until he went. The Liverpool game was the only one where tensions really boiled over and rigtly so.

[Happy Face]

As fan's, we aren't to blame.  Name the last manager we got sacked?  I can't remember us giving any of them a real bollocking in the stadium.  Even Souness.

 

Allardyce to an extent.

 

We might not be the main culprit (that should always be results), but we may well have make the decisions easier. 

 

I was at Allardyce's last game in the cup away to stoke and the fans applauded him off the pitch.

 

.coms match report...

 

"Certainly the contributions of their elders and supposed betters in midfield and attack did little to raise the sprits of a travelling crowd who were resolutely vocal and supportive of their side and manager (witness the Big Sam chants) but who got precious little back in return."

 

http://www.nufc.com/html/2007-08html/2008-01-06stoke-a.html

[Syrette]

As fan's, we aren't to blame.  Name the last manager we got sacked?  I can't remember us giving any of them a real bollocking in the stadium.  Even Souness.

 

Allardyce to an extent.

 

We might not be the main culprit (that should always be results), but we may well have make the decisions easier. 

 

Bollocks. I can remember a lot of fans still belting out chorus' of 'Big Sam's Black and White Army' up until he went. The Liverpool game was the only one where tensions really boiled over and rigtly so.

 

I wasn't referring to a majority. You can't tell them that all fans were 100% behind him can you?

 

I'm not so much referring to chants and that sort of thing anyway. I'm on about Ashley standing with the fans and all that jazz and hearing first hand what they were saying and how they felt about Allardyce.

[Guest The Libertine]

9th manager to go this weekend?

 

Plenty of alternatives for top managers these days.

 

No one is saying anythign about getting managers sacked HF.

 

So what puts them off?  The blind support the fans gave to a manager that did well?

 

I don't see how the fans coming out in support of Keegan without knowing all the facts would put off a future manager likely to get similar backing if he performs.

 

does this include the 45k exodus at the wolves match? or the booing of robson at the end of his last few matches here?

[ChezGiven]

9th manager to go this weekend?

 

Plenty of alternatives for top managers these days.

 

No one is saying anythign about getting managers sacked HF.

So what puts them off?  The blind support the fans gave to a manager that did well?

 

I don't see how the fans coming out in support of Keegan without knowing all the facts would put off a future manager likely to get similar backing if he performs.

 

So not only do you not read the thread you sidetrack it with an issue not even under discussion.

[Baggio]

I was at Allardyce's last game in the cup away to stoke and the fans applauded him off the pitch.

 

No they didn't, the fans were on his back all of the second half for the negative style of football.

 

The only people applauded at the end was Taylor and Smith because they bothered coming over to the fans.

[Happy Face]

9th manager to go this weekend?

 

Plenty of alternatives for top managers these days.

 

No one is saying anythign about getting managers sacked HF.

So what puts them off?  The blind support the fans gave to a manager that did well?

 

I don't see how the fans coming out in support of Keegan without knowing all the facts would put off a future manager likely to get similar backing if he performs.

 

So not only do you not read the thread you sidetrack it with an issue not even under discussion.

 

Sorry I thought...

 

Our fans were outside SJP with badly spelt banners by lunchtime of September 2nd 2008 on hearing the news that Keegan was leaving.

 

No facts were known then about why he was leaving. All blame had already been assigned in a vacuum of accurate information on the basis of an emotional reaction and (so far) unfounded beliefs about what had happened.

 

The protests at the Hull game were based on the same level of information and the same emotion as those outside the ground the day he left.

 

IMO The fans reaction made it impossible to find the requisite standard of team manager to replace Keegan. I dont think you can argue that the events had no bearing on the subsequent appointment without looking really stupid. Kinnear's appointment (the maker or breaker of the season) came about because of the over-reaction of the fans to the situation.

 

was a suggestion that "the fans reaction made it impossible to find the requisite standard of team manager to replace Keegan".

 

My bad.

[ChezGiven]

So you asked me my opinion on what puts them off and then quoted my opinion on what puts them off.

 

Trying to be clever but failing.

[Happy Face]

I was at Allardyce's last game in the cup away to stoke and the fans applauded him off the pitch.

 

No they didn't, the fans were on his back all of the second half for the negative style of football.

 

The only people applauded at the end was Taylor and Smith because they bothered coming over to the fans.

 

http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/78793300.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193A1D0B67C5DCBA3CF5B03BC88D1F278A7

 

Look like he's been handed his arse?

[Happy Face]

So you asked me my opinion on what puts them off and then quoted my opinion on what puts them off.

 

Trying to be clever but failing.

 

I'm asking why you think supporters backing a manager fanatically should put off a potential manager?

 

You seem to be suggesting the backing is the reason, but I don't get your logic.

 

Sorry for being really stupid.

 

[Baggio]

I was at Allardyce's last game in the cup away to stoke and the fans applauded him off the pitch.

 

No they didn't, the fans were on his back all of the second half for the negative style of football.

 

The only people applauded at the end was Taylor and Smith because they bothered coming over to the fans.

 

http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/78793300.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193A1D0B67C5DCBA3CF5B03BC88D1F278A7

 

Look like he's been handed his arse?

 

And from the same game...

 

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/5306/78793092k.th.jpg

 

I was there and Allardyce was not applauded off by the fans, the only people getting applauded were Smith and Taylor because they came over to the away stand on their way to the tunnel.

[ChezGiven]

So you asked me my opinion on what puts them off and then quoted my opinion on what puts them off.

 

Trying to be clever but failing.

 

I'm asking why you think supporters backing a manager fanatically should put off a potential manager?

 

You seem to be suggesting the backing is the reason, but I don't get your logic.

 

Sorry for being really stupid.

 

 

I wouldnt characterise the events last september like that.

[timnufc22]

Tim, not sure why Ashley would have put a statement out in reaction to the events at the Hull game before the Hull game? How does that one work?

 

Our league position (the only thing that matters imo) is down to the club's inability to appoint a top class manager. I feel that the chaos at the club made that impossible. I'm not pointing the finger at anyone as being 'to blame' but i am saying the fans reaction was a factor, which i've backed up by using the only public information we have on why one target turned us down.

 

He could have come out before the Hull game with a statement in reaction to Keegan leaving. A statement similar to the one I'm talking about; re-enforcing his vision for the club. There was nothing apart from the 'FACT' statement, which had no name to it. It was crazy really; anger was allowed to build up during that week because zero leadership was shown by the people at the club.

 

Yes, the chaos/unrest did not help the team, but there were allegations of foul play towards a legend of this club & during this time there was no communication from someone at the club. It was mis-managed so badly & the reaction was in part a result of that.

[indi]

i wonder if the same idiots who thought nusc destabilised the club will now give them credit for forcing a 9% reduction in season ticket prices.

 

in reality neither is true but it would be nice to have some consistency on the part of those who criticise an insignificant volunteer ran amatuer fan's club while giving the professional board of the football club an easy ride.

 

Why mention it then?

 

I won't be giving NUSC credit for the price reduction, because there's no evidence it's anything to do with them. And I will criticise the fans that caused chaos after KK left, because I don't agree with what they did.

 

because a bunch of people on here got all hot and bothered that 'the fans' are to blame for the state we are in, really laughable stuff like 'the banner made us lose' on one occasion. people are more than willing to point out how much damage an insignificant fan club are doing (and how badly run they are whilst giving the professional club board lots of slack). nusc must be very influential if they can cause such damage!

 

so i just wondered if the same people would also dish out the credit for putting pressure on the board to try and win fans round. you do both or you do none.

 

So you're arguing that fans can have no effect upon the club at the same time as arguing in favour of an organisation whose relevance and reason for existing is based entirely upon the opposite being true.