Alan Pardew

[Theregulars]

 

 

I have never said that and I don't think anybody else is. The point is that, while winning AND entertaining football is the ideal, the reality is we are not getting both, and for me/others winning>entertaining.

 

Not a single person is suggesting that winning isn't better than entertaining, some of us thinks we can play better without negatively affecting our results.

 

Exactly. Krul time wasting was embarrassing yesterday. We looked quite good for about the first half hour, but then just tried to shut up shop and win the game 1-0. Against teams who we are at least the equals of footballing wise, we should be trying to go on and kill the game.

 

Shutting up shop is a method of killing the game which can be just as effective as going for the jugular.

[Guest Deadmau5]

For those using our league position as the sole barometer to judge us on, don't you realise that we got to that position through a fantastic set of results that were achieved by playing the type of football that some of us are crying out for us to revert to? BEFORE we changed to hoofing it long? Since we changed to that approach we've had mid to lower table form, imo.

 

 

Didn't somebody point out that our form hasn't been mid to lower table form since the turn of the year?

 

P 10, W 5, D 2, L 3. = 17 pts (1.7 a game which averages to 64-65 points over a season)

 

And the 8 matches before that? Very selective statistics there.

 

since the turn of the year

 

 

 

Great post by Deadmau5 like.

 

 

It was in response to the "65 points a year"  while ignoring the fact that we had just come off an 8-game streak returning 5 points, hence the selective statistics comment.

[Guest BooBoo]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

[alpal78]

August - DWW - 7 points out of 9

September - DDW - 5 points out of 9

October - WDWW - 10 points out of 12

November - WLD - 4 points out of 9

December - LLDLWL - 4 points out of 18

January - WWL - 6 points out of 9

February - WWLD - 7 points out of 12

March (so far) - DLW - 4 points out of 9

 

Felt like putting the results for the season in one place.

 

Let me just put this up here instead of the usual battle for 7th thread. This uses the formula that Pip provided in the OP of that read where the suggestion is that to get top 7 (58 points), we need to i) beat all teams at home except for the top 6, ii) draw with those 6 teams at home and iii) draw with all teams away except the top 6. The last time we got less points then 'we should' was December. At other times, we have either got the points we should or exceeded it. Our cumulative difference (i.e. between what is expected and what is obtained throughout the season is also at an all time low). Anyone who can't see that our form in Feb & March has taken a dive is rather blind.

 

URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/809/footballmarch.jpg/]http://img809.imageshack.us/img809/6654/footballmarch.jpg[/url]

 

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[Parky]

It's like how graphite rackets destroyed tennis. Most PL football is all about running about now and intensity and fitness and hot zones and all that crap. It's fukin boring. Might as well not use a ball, just 11 v 11 long distance running.

[Guest Deadmau5]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

 

The point about simpson, ryan taylor and Williamson causing us to have to go turtlemode for 80 minutes every game is somewhat acceptable

 

 

 

 

 

 

had it not beenfor the small fact that

 

 

 

 

 

 

we are handing out new contracts to the very players dragging the entire team down?

[Mick]

 

 

A good point. Perhaps Pardew is going for the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' approach. I don't think it's a given that we wouldn't suffer if we played better football, and to be fair to the manager there is evidence to back it up. We got spanked by Fulham trying to pass it around, and Chelsea picked us apart on the counter. However, there are also examples where we likely would have got more points if we played more daring and attractive football, so the point is a circular one.

I also never said people were suggesting entertaining was better than winning, but people who bemoaned the lack of entertainment did not set sufficient stock in the fact that we are winning.

 

We were all over Fulham and we were 1-0 at half time, 2nd half we didn't play well and got slaughtered and weren't trying to pass it around in that half.

[SUPERTOON]

The most positive thing for me from yesterday was Pardew's post match interview. For the first time he actually said we are not playing well, and not creating enough for the strikers. Just glad that he admitted it, now i can see him trying to do something about it, wheras before, it seemed he just couldn't see how bad we where.

[Ronaldo]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

 

The point about simpson, ryan taylor and Williamson causing us to have to go turtlemode for 80 minutes every game is somewhat acceptable

 

 

 

 

 

 

had it not beenfor the small fact that

 

 

 

 

 

 

we are handing out new contracts to the very players dragging the entire team down?

 

What the hell are you talking about?

[Jayson]

Seems to me a lot more dissatisfaction for performances from some than credit given to Pardew for being efficient at picking up points. Who has achieved both solid performances & gotten the most from their squad this season anyway. The top 3 & Swansea? The level of criticism for not achieving it isnt really balanced is it.

[SEMTEX]

P 10, W 5, D 2, L 3. = 17 pts (1.7 a game which averages to 64-65 points over a season)

 

And the 8 matches before that? Very selective statistics there.

 

since the turn of the year

 

 

 

Great post by Deadmau5 like.

 

 

It was in response to the "65 points a year"  while ignoring the fact that we had just come off an 8-game streak returning 5 points, hence the selective statistics comment.

 

His post was a direct response to:

 

Didn't somebody point out that our form hasn't been mid to lower table form since the turn of the year?

 

He posted the results since the turn of the year. Seems like an open-and-shut case to me...

[Mole_Toonfan]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

 

Yh agree with that, if we dont get a marked improvement with the quality football after a New CB, LB, Midfield Depth and Taylor, Marveaux, Sammy and a full season of HBA, Ba and Cisse upfront i'll be very disappointed.

[Theregulars]

 

 

A good point. Perhaps Pardew is going for the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' approach. I don't think it's a given that we wouldn't suffer if we played better football, and to be fair to the manager there is evidence to back it up. We got spanked by Fulham trying to pass it around, and Chelsea picked us apart on the counter. However, there are also examples where we likely would have got more points if we played more daring and attractive football, so the point is a circular one.

I also never said people were suggesting entertaining was better than winning, but people who bemoaned the lack of entertainment did not set sufficient stock in the fact that we are winning.

 

We were all over Fulham and we were 1-0 at half time, 2nd half we didn't play well and got slaughtered and weren't trying to pass it around in that half.

 

Bigger picture. We tried to play decent, passing football with a high-line - the warning signs that we'd be pinged on the counter were there before half-time (Santon should have been sent off for hauling down cueball Johnson). We were brutally exposed on the counter-attack by playing that style of football, lending total credence to Otter's post at the top of this page.

[Mick]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

 

If that was the case then why didn't we bring somebody in during the January transfer window when we spent £10 million on a forward?

[SUPERTOON]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

 

If that was the case then why didn't we bring somebody in during the January transfer window when we spent £10 million on a forwward?

 

Maybe they couldn't get the right players, i mean it took a year to replace Carroll.

[Mick]

Seems to me a lot more dissatisfaction for performances from some than credit given to Pardew for being efficient at picking up points. Who has achieved both solid performances & gotten the most from their squad this season anyway. The top 3 & Swansea? The level of criticism for not achieving it isnt really balanced is it.

 

Give over, every person who is saying we could play better are saying that the points total and league position is better than expected.

[Guest BooBoo]

Mick I think it's long been established that under this regime, the managers input into transfers is limited. Pardew publically said we wanted a centre back, but those above him refused to stump up for the lad from Watford.

 

 

[Parky]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

 

Not just the engine room though is it? We all know he's hysterical about protecting the back 4, but we're saying against teams like Norwich he's overdoing the caution.

[eliassenfredrik]

 

 

I have never said that and I don't think anybody else is. The point is that, while winning AND entertaining football is the ideal, the reality is we are not getting both, and for me/others winning>entertaining.

 

Not a single person is suggesting that winning isn't better than entertaining, some of us thinks we can play better without negatively affecting our results.

 

A good point. Perhaps Pardew is going for the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' approach. I don't think it's a given that we wouldn't suffer if we played better football, and to be fair to the manager there is evidence to back it up. We got spanked by Fulham trying to pass it around, and Chelsea picked us apart on the counter. However, there are also examples where we likely would have got more points if we played more daring and attractive football, so the point is a circular one.

I also never said people were suggesting entertaining was better than winning, but people who bemoaned the lack of entertainment did not set sufficient stock in the fact that we are winning.

 

Well, I'd say things looked pretty broke against Tottenham, Wolves, Sunderland and Arsenal. In different ways. Tottenham, fair enough, we were without our midfield. Wolves and Arsenal convincingly closing the shop and pretty much surrender. Sunderland in the end was saved by Pardew and the players realizing; "hey, let's try to play some football for a change".

[Jayson]

Seems to me a lot more dissatisfaction for performances from some than credit given to Pardew for being efficient at picking up points. Who has achieved both solid performances & gotten the most from their squad this season anyway. The top 3 & Swansea? The level of criticism for not achieving it isnt really balanced is it.

 

Give over, every person who is saying we could play better are saying that the points total and league position is better than expected.

 

Actions louder than words and all that. If you valued it moreso as you said earlier, your satisfaction would outweight your dissastisfaction. It clearly doesnt as you post criticism of Pardew on here daily.

[Theregulars]

For me, Pardew doesn't trust the defence enough (with good cause!) and has instructed the engine room to stay deep resulting in his having minimal threat from midfield and isolating our strikers.

 

Next year, if we have a decent pair of fullbacks and Saylor back with Colo, then I would expect a marked improvement.

 

If that was the case then why didn't we bring somebody in during the January transfer window when we spent £10 million on a forward?

 

Because nobody of the requisite quality was available at a reasonable price? This is a transfer strategy which has been proved to have serious merit on the basis of this season. Also, they probably didn't think Williamson would be as suspect as he has been based on how solid, if unspectacular, he was last year.

[Guest]

P 10, W 5, D 2, L 3. = 17 pts (1.7 a game which averages to 64-65 points over a season)

 

And the 8 matches before that? Very selective statistics there.

 

since the turn of the year

 

 

 

Great post by Deadmau5 like.

 

 

It was in response to the "65 points a year"  while ignoring the fact that we had just come off an 8-game streak returning 5 points, hence the selective statistics comment.

 

His post was a direct response to:

 

Didn't somebody point out that our form hasn't been mid to lower table form since the turn of the year?

 

He posted the results since the turn of the year. Seems like an open-and-shut case to me...

 

We could do something equally ridiculous and average our points we've achieved in a season (ie, that thing we've played in from August), and we're still averaging over 61 points.

[Mick]

Mick I think it's long been established that under this regime, the managers input into transfers is limited. Pardew publically said we wanted a centre back, but those above him refused to stump up for the lad from Watford.

 

 

 

He must have some say in transfers, even if it's only in saying where he wants strengthening and not who comes in.

[Parky]

....and why did he do COMPLETELY THE WRONG THING  away to Spurs? None of it makes sense I tells ya!

[Theregulars]

 

 

I have never said that and I don't think anybody else is. The point is that, while winning AND entertaining football is the ideal, the reality is we are not getting both, and for me/others winning>entertaining.

 

Not a single person is suggesting that winning isn't better than entertaining, some of us thinks we can play better without negatively affecting our results.

 

A good point. Perhaps Pardew is going for the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' approach. I don't think it's a given that we wouldn't suffer if we played better football, and to be fair to the manager there is evidence to back it up. We got spanked by Fulham trying to pass it around, and Chelsea picked us apart on the counter. However, there are also examples where we likely would have got more points if we played more daring and attractive football, so the point is a circular one.

I also never said people were suggesting entertaining was better than winning, but people who bemoaned the lack of entertainment did not set sufficient stock in the fact that we are winning.

 

Well, I'd say things looked pretty broke against Tottenham, Wolves, Sunderland and Arsenal. In different ways. Tottenham, fair enough, we were without our midfield. Wolves and Arsenal convincingly closing the shop and pretty much surrender. Sunderland in the end was saved by Pardew and the players realizing; "hey, let's try to play some football for a change".

 

That's a good point, too. My point was more aimed at the overall picture in relation to the whole season, but you are right, there is plenty of evidence to suggest that his system could use a tweaking, but not enough to suggest that it's rubbish/spineless/cowardly/gutless etc as many have levelled. However your point is valid.