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Alan Pardew

JH

by JH
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quayside

quayside

Posted
Posted

One aspect that's always intrigued is the criticism of Pardew because he's a "b******/c***/devil".

 

Now I'm sure that reflects that we know he was tapped up prior to Hughton being sacked. However that's something that happens not all the time, but certainly frequently. Cast your mind back to 1991 and the news broke on the same day that Ossie Ardiles was sacked and KK was coming in as manager. Now I dont believe for a second that all that was conducted on one day- the board at the time will have been trying to persuade KK to come back for days if not weeks prior to Ossie getting the bullet. Does that mean KK is equally a snake for getting into bed with NUFC when a nice fella was also plugging away in the managers office?

 

It's simply the way business works, there's little room for pleasantries. It would be wonderful if everyone in football had the morals of Bobby Robson, but Bobby was the exception rather than the rule. Pardew was out of work and was offered the best job of his life. It's unreasonable in reality to expect him to say "thanks but I'm not talking until Chris goes." What if we turned round and said "right well sod off Alan we'll look elsewhere."? As I've said, he would have missed out on the biggest club he's ever likely to manage.

 

Hughton was a good guy who did a good job, but his employers thought he wasn't who they wanted. The decision to sack Hughton is a different argument. I don't think it's fair hammering Pardew for throwing his hat into the ring when asked if he was interested. When it comes to work/careers you quickly learn that you look after yourself first and foremost if you don't want to miss out.

 

 

 

As others have said that is a good post. And there are people (some post on here) who say they will never forgive him for being part of the conspiracy to sack Hughton. There is also the "casino buddy" theory for which no one has produced an ounce of evidence. He didn't make the decision to sack Hughton , he was offered a job and took it. And btw look at the consequences we have witnessed when this club has sacked a manager without having a replacement sorted out.

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Beren

Beren

Posted
Posted

ahahahaha Ashley == Gaddafi, internet's over folks, go home.

 

:lol: :lol: Yeah, because I was really making a legitimate comparison of their "levels of evil" - not illustrating a point about getting into bed with bad people.

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Guest Dontooner

Guest Dontooner

Posted
Posted

Still waiting for us to get a better manager ...

I still remember the petition for  Ottmar Hitzfeld...some years ago.

Martin Jol would be a manager i would have loved here....given there was a possibility of getting him.

AP isnt doing that bad, he will likely keep us in the league.......do rate his substitutions though

I actually got a interesting observation here.

 

Since we are stucked with AP which  couldnt coach particularly well. I was thinking of Sammy Lee as a number two.

I know i am going to get bashed here , but i notice he coaches to play good passing on the floor.

One of the reasons Liverpool changed from a shit team to a flowing team that nearly won in 2008-2009, personally i deduced it was because they employed Lee.

 

Another observation was when Fat ugly Sam managed us....we were now where near the standard of his previous regime: Bolton ..

Just constantly playing crappy hoof up hooligan football. However Sammy Lee became Bolton's No 1 and they play some Canny football....but they couldn't score and get enough points before he got sacked.

A bit like Zola at west ham or martinezz at wigan.

But he might get us flowing...

 

 

 

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Christmas Tree

Christmas Tree

Posted
Posted

Be nice in everyone could just draw a line over the mistakes of the past and concentrate on the excellent things now happening on and off the pitch.

 

We are in a much better position all round compared to 2007 and while we wont be kicking in the back doors of the top four any time soon, we are looking like having a team very capable of breaking Europe, (Particularly if those upstairs get their act together on a striker) and a team and manager that wants to play football the right way.

 

Surely it should be possible to not like some of the stuff that's gone on over the last few years but not let that taint everything going forward.

 

 

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quayside

quayside

Posted
Posted

Disagree, unsurprisingly.

 

Ossie got the boot because we were second bottom and on our way to sliding down a division. KK may well have been spoken to before Ossie was officially given his marching orders though, you are correct. I do differentiate the two situations because of the following:

 

Hughton was given the boot when we were 9th having taken a relegated side up from the Championship. The true reasons for his dismissal we can speculate about all day - from my perspective "getting someone in with more experience" isn't a real or valid reason. People without experience in all kinds of professions can flourish spectacularly. Furthermore, there was no reason to believe, from the evidence available, that Hughton wouldn't continue to do a fantastic job, or continue to grow and do better - or that Pardew was even capable of being anything other than a midtable/lower half manager.

 

And Hughton was doing doing a fantastic job - fans who had been disenchanted with the club had fallen in love with the players and the manager all over again and all was well on that side of things. To displace someone in that situation essentially by virtue of being chummy with the owner is akin to nepotism in my book.  Also, Pardew wasn't scouted/spoken to because they thought he could do a better job, he was scouted because he would kowtow to Ashley, sell players assets, and take gambles on their replacements. That we've done well since is by the by (and largely down to Hughton's signing of Leon Best!).

 

Also, to voluntarily get in bed with characters such as Ashley/Llambias (irrespective of the golden opportunity Newcastle United presented to his career) in my book makes him a morally dubious and complicit arsehole. If Gaddafi offered you a position on his cabinet, would you take it? You'd be running (whatever it is you happen to do) at a national level on an international stage afterall.

 

Now that he's here, fine. The team are doing well - very well actually. Since the real problems are above him, campaigning against him to leave the club is silly/pointless. I'm still not obliged to either like or trust the guy though. He's as much a part of the regime as the new Sports Direct lettering IMO.

 

The timing of your post is good though, Otter. Would've like to see the reception it got if you posted it after the transfer window closed without a new striker, or after we sold Enrique, instead of after our unbeaten start.

 

I liked and respected Hughton, he did a really good job in what, to start with, must have been an incredibly difficult situation. His achievement was to  got us promoted with the best and most expensive squad the Championship has ever seen.  A manager and a side that comes first in its division is easy to fall in love with.

 

Ashley is a business man and I defy you to produce any evidence that he's not running this club as a business. Your take on the Hughton sacking is that Pardew would "kowtow" to Ashley and Llambias and let them sell who they like. Utter crap imo - this means that you think Hughton was some sort of iron character who would stand up to Ashley and stop him selling Carroll and Enrique? Or maybe you think that Hughton's sheer charisma would have persuaded them to stay? Hughton is a far less outspoken character than Pardew, when did Hughton ever say anything of any consequence in an interview? I thought everyone knew that managers don't have the final say on decisions like the Carroll and Enrique sales anyway.

 

Ashley appointed Pardew because he thought he would do a better job of protecting his asset, that's why businessmen make decisions like that.

 

Love the point about our success to date being mainly down to Hughton's signing of Leon Best  :lol:  Apart from the complete dismissal of other players who have played a part (and let's not forget Kinnear's signing Ryan Taylor btw) this is the same Leon Best who couldn't hit a barn from the inside until Pardew took over.

 

Hey it's early days, the fixture list so far has helped us get a start and I'm not carried away with what's happened so far But Pardew is one of the things I like about our set up right now. I certainly would rather he was here than plenty of the other managers in the Premiership (as well as the high profile, big ego managers in the Championship).

 

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Beren

Beren

Posted
Posted

Disagree, unsurprisingly.

 

Ossie got the boot because we were second bottom and on our way to sliding down a division. KK may well have been spoken to before Ossie was officially given his marching orders though, you are correct. I do differentiate the two situations because of the following:

 

Hughton was given the boot when we were 9th having taken a relegated side up from the Championship. The true reasons for his dismissal we can speculate about all day - from my perspective "getting someone in with more experience" isn't a real or valid reason. People without experience in all kinds of professions can flourish spectacularly. Furthermore, there was no reason to believe, from the evidence available, that Hughton wouldn't continue to do a fantastic job, or continue to grow and do better - or that Pardew was even capable of being anything other than a midtable/lower half manager.

 

And Hughton was doing doing a fantastic job - fans who had been disenchanted with the club had fallen in love with the players and the manager all over again and all was well on that side of things. To displace someone in that situation essentially by virtue of being chummy with the owner is akin to nepotism in my book.  Also, Pardew wasn't scouted/spoken to because they thought he could do a better job, he was scouted because he would kowtow to Ashley, sell players assets, and take gambles on their replacements. That we've done well since is by the by (and largely down to Hughton's signing of Leon Best!).

 

Also, to voluntarily get in bed with characters such as Ashley/Llambias (irrespective of the golden opportunity Newcastle United presented to his career) in my book makes him a morally dubious and complicit arsehole. If Gaddafi offered you a position on his cabinet, would you take it? You'd be running (whatever it is you happen to do) at a national level on an international stage afterall.

 

Now that he's here, fine. The team are doing well - very well actually. Since the real problems are above him, campaigning against him to leave the club is silly/pointless. I'm still not obliged to either like or trust the guy though. He's as much a part of the regime as the new Sports Direct lettering IMO.

 

The timing of your post is good though, Otter. Would've like to see the reception it got if you posted it after the transfer window closed without a new striker, or after we sold Enrique, instead of after our unbeaten start.

 

I liked and respected Hughton, he did a really good job in what, to start with, must have been an incredibly difficult situation. His achievement was to  got us promoted with the best and most expensive squad the Championship has ever seen.  A manager and a side that comes first in its division is easy to fall in love with.

 

Had much more to do with his demeanour, dignity and respect he engendered amongst the place IMO. He had a good squad, but plenty of Premiership squads have sunk without a trace. A pejorative take on things^

 

Ashley is a business man and I defy you to produce any evidence that he's not running this club as a business.

 

No shit :lol: I don't know why you say that with such pride, tbh. I made a lengthy post somewhere on why that's not something to be proud of, so I won't go into it again.

 

Your take on the Hughton sacking is that Pardew would "kowtow" to Ashley and Llambias and let them sell who they like. Utter crap imo - this means that you think Hughton was some sort of iron character who would stand up to Ashley and stop him selling Carroll and Enrique? Or maybe you think that Hughton's sheer charisma would have persuaded them to stay? Hughton is a far less outspoken character than Pardew, when did Hughton ever say anything of any consequence in an interview? I thought everyone knew that managers don't have the final say on decisions like the Carroll and Enrique sales anyway.

 

You seem to be conflating the issues of a manager having decision-making powers (which I didn't mention in my post) and a manager accepting a regime he did not agree with. Hughton would obviously not have been able to stop the sales of any of our players, and I suspect the real reason he isn't here - and the reason Pardew is - is because Hughton wasn't willing to participate fully with Ashley's cost-cutting pissing-in-the-faces-of-fans regime.

 

Ashley appointed Pardew because he thought he would do a better job of protecting his asset, that's why businessmen make decisions like that.

 

Again no arguments from me, but again - not sure why you're proud of this. As long as we're both in agreement it wasn't for footballing reasons in the conventional sense of the phrase.

 

Love the point about our success to date being mainly down to Hughton's signing of Leon Best  :lol:  Apart from the complete dismissal of other players who have played a part (and let's not forget Kinnear's signing Ryan Taylor btw) this the same Leon Best who couldn't hit a barn from the inside until Pardew took over.

 

Fair point, you've got me there (although I would stress my point was somewhat tongue in cheek). A lot of players contributed very well to the second half of our season, but with the exception of Jonas and Colo, none was more invaluable than Best after Carroll's sale (even though Carroll was injured for the rest of it)

 

Hey it's early days, the fixture list so far has helped us get a start and I'm not carried away with what's happened so far But Pardew is one of the things I like about our set up right now. I certainly would rather he was here than plenty of the other managers in the Premiership (as well as the high profile, big ego managers in the Championship).

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Interpolic

Interpolic

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Posted

Good point there. And I think most of us can agree that sacking Hughton was the correct decision.

 

100% agree.

 

I don't, whatsoever.

 

And why is that? :rant:

 

I don't get what people see in him at all.  He's done a better job than I expected but how people can go on like he's a categorical upgrade on Hughton is beyond me.

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Ronaldo

Ronaldo

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Posted

Good point there. And I think most of us can agree that sacking Hughton was the correct decision.

 

100% agree.

 

I don't, whatsoever.

 

And why is that? :rant:

 

I don't get what people see in him at all.  He's done a better job than I expected but how people can go on like he's a categorical upgrade on Hughton is beyond me.

 

I don't know. Results, perhaps?

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Interpolic

Interpolic

Posted
Posted

I said up there!!  Fuck it, back in a bit.

 

http://www.toontastic.net/stokoe/1315381734.jpg

 

Courtesy of Happy Face. Doesn't include the Forest win.

 

Not a dig at Pardew as such but doesn't Forest go down as a draw?  We've drawn A LOT of games under Pardew and sometimes this has papered over the cracks a bit imo.

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