Cronky Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Ashley made a bad job of it over the first two years, which he's held his hand up to. A lot of people feel that he'll continue to blunder, but I don't see it that way. I think he's more committed and more confident than he's been before, and he now has that experience under his belt. He has continued to blunder though - sacking Hughton was one, hiring Pardew was another. Both pointless and reckless things to do. Way too early to judge that decision, surely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minhosa Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 The 5.5 year contracts indicate to me that he'll be looking to sell the couple actively within two years. He'll market it as a 'stable, mid table premiership club, with finances in good order, big fan base and sustainable squad with long contracts on low-ish wages giving potential buyers time to decide how to take the business forward without having to invest heavily in the playing side initially'. I reckon a big part of why it didn't sell last time around was the fear from buyers over the quality/sustainability of the playing squad. I think that's why he's dishing out 5.5 year contracts and that he's got a plan to bail out soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Ashley made a bad job of it over the first two years, which he's held his hand up to. A lot of people feel that he'll continue to blunder, but I don't see it that way. I think he's more committed and more confident than he's been before, and he now has that experience under his belt. He has continued to blunder though - sacking Hughton was one, hiring Pardew was another. Both pointless and reckless things to do. Way too early to judge that decision, surely. I don't think so. Even if Pardew does take us further (which i think he will because Ashley will back him with the cash he didn't back Hughton with), he still sacked a manager who had the full backing of the players and (most of) the full backing of the fans . He was doing a decent job and looked like he was getting better (albeit incredibly slowly). We were doing alright and we had a good team/club spirit, were spending very little money and getting alot of value for money in return - regardless of who he replaced him with, surely randomly sacking him in the middle of the season is a bad decision? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisMcQuillan Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Our finances aren't in good order though. Just cause we owe to Ashley rather than to other companies doesn't mean we're not in debt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Yeah, the Hughton sacking was a bad decision under any logic, but I think Jonny meant it was too soon to say the same about the Pardew appointment. Treating them as two separate incidents, obviously. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Our finances aren't in good order though. Just cause we owe to Ashley rather than to other companies doesn't mean we're not in debt. Owing money to your owner is a normal business practice though, and surely much better than paying for expensive overdrafts and debts to external creditors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Yeah, the Hughton sacking was a bad decision under any logic, but I think Jonny meant it was too soon to say the same about the Pardew appointment. Treating them as two separate incidents, obviously. But taking the decision purely as a single incident, it's a total blunder? Yes, Pardew could be a success here (like I said in that post, I think he will be moreso than Hughton because Ashley will back him because he's a mate), but at the time, he was still appointing a man who had recently been sacked from a League One club, had Charlton relegated and led West Ham to their worst run of defeats in over 70 years - he couldn't have possibly known at the time he'd be a decent choice of manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Yeah, the Hughton sacking was a bad decision under any logic, but I think Jonny meant it was too soon to say the same about the Pardew appointment. Treating them as two separate incidents, obviously. But taking the decision purely as a single incident, it's a total blunder? Yes, Pardew could be a success here (like I said in that post, I think he will be moreso than Hughton because Ashley will back him because he's a mate), but at the time, he was still appointing a man who had recently been sacked from a League One club, had Charlton relegated and led West Ham to their worst run of defeats in over 70 years - he couldn't have possibly known at the time he'd be a decent choice of manager. Yeah, Hughton was clearly a mistake by normal football criteria. I don't think you can argue that Ashley didn't think Pardew would be decent though... he obviously did as he gave him the job. FWIW I don't think Pardew's reputation as a manager is really as bad as some of us are making out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sugoinufc Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 actually i think we or ashley have been doing ok since the beginning of last season. Ashley have spent ok on new players...most of them ok....Chris made a few mistakes....perch and best! This season have been really enjoyable....but was really gutted to see chris get sacked....felt it was time to take the club to another level with a proven (international) manager. The presentation of Pardew still bothers me....hope me proves me wrong! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning_Linguist Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 actually i think we or ashley have been doing ok since the beginning of last season. Ashley have spent ok on new players...most of them ok....Chris made a few mistakes....perch and best! This season have been really enjoyable....but was really gutted to see chris get sacked....felt it was time to take the club to another level with a proven (international) manager. The presentation of Pardew still bothers me....hope me proves me wrong! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Ashley has made progress, but then he dropped an atomic bomb when he sacked Hughton. Which basically undid the progress he made in repairing the rifts between the board/ownership & fans. The only way he'll get the fans back completely is by giving NUFC success on the field. I've always said the relegation was a blessing in disguise as it allowed the club to build a new team and go in a new direction. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Ashley has made progress, but then he dropped an atomic bomb when he sacked Hughton. Which basically undid the progress he made in repairing the rifts between the board/ownership & fans. The only way he'll get the fans back completely is by giving NUFC success on the field. I've always said the relegation was a blessing in disguise as it allowed the club to build a new team and go in a new direction. How is it the 'Atomic Bomb' act you state when Pardew has seemingly initiated an evolution from the Hughton book rather than a revolution, no player has walked (in fact one notable player, Ben Arfa, has been brought in despite many not even believing we ever had a plan to buy him or that he would under Pardew), and there has been no drop in the efforts on the pitch? Barely a nudge to the kidneys in the scheme of things. Hope it turns out to be a positive move for the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bealios Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Not wanting to tempt fate, but we're probably just back at the level we were when Ashley took over - not quite good enough to make Europe, not quite bad enough to go down or seriously get caught up in the relegation scrap. The difference is that we're on a sounder financial footing, and the composition of the squad is moving away from highly paid mercenaries, to decent committed players, and a bit of youth/potential. We still have highly paid players of course, but they tend to be on the pitch performing, rather than on the bench sitting out their contracts. So if you take the emotion out of it and forget Ashley, I personally think as a club we are slightly better of than when he arrived, but miles away from where I hoped we would be when it was announced a billionnaire was taking over! As others have said though, a lot depends on whether we can hold on to our performing on demand players - Carroll, Enrique, Colocinni, Barton - one thing that Ashley hasn't done yet is sell any star players under our noses. If we can keep top players despite Spuds etc. unsettling, and we start 2011/2012 with those players, then I'm optimistic. If we cash in, I'm less so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Not wanting to tempt fate, but we're probably just back at the level we were when Ashley took over - not quite good enough to make Europe, not quite bad enough to go down or seriously get caught up in the relegation scrap. The difference is that we're on a sounder financial footing, and the composition of the squad is moving away from highly paid mercenaries, to decent committed players, and a bit of youth/potential. We still have highly paid players of course, but they tend to be on the pitch performing, rather than on the bench sitting out their contracts. So if you take the emotion out of it and forget Ashley, I personally think as a club we are slightly better of than when he arrived, but miles away from where I hoped we would be when it was announced a billionnaire was taking over! As others have said though, a lot depends on whether we can hold on to our performing on demand players - Carroll, Enrique, Colocinni, Barton - one thing that Ashley hasn't done yet is sell any star players under our noses. If we can keep top players despite Spuds etc. unsettling, and we start 2011/2012 with those players, then I'm optimistic. If we cash in, I'm less so. Pretty much my view. Ashley has done some things that observers consider mistakes, and quite big ones. But either by luck or judgement, those things haven't effected us too badly on the pitch. As long as he realises our true position (still in danger of going back down if we don't strengthen) and doesn't gamble too much then we should keep moving in the right direction. Debatable how many wonder transfers like HBA and Tiote we can keep finding, but Ashley's pig-headedness and unwillingness to play the game with clubs and agents asking over the odds for average players might turn out to be a benefit to us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Not wanting to tempt fate, but we're probably just back at the level we were when Ashley took over - not quite good enough to make Europe, not quite bad enough to go down or seriously get caught up in the relegation scrap. The difference is that we're on a sounder financial footing, and the composition of the squad is moving away from highly paid mercenaries, to decent committed players, and a bit of youth/potential. We still have highly paid players of course, but they tend to be on the pitch performing, rather than on the bench sitting out their contracts. So if you take the emotion out of it and forget Ashley, I personally think as a club we are slightly better of than when he arrived, but miles away from where I hoped we would be when it was announced a billionnaire was taking over! As others have said though, a lot depends on whether we can hold on to our performing on demand players - Carroll, Enrique, Colocinni, Barton - one thing that Ashley hasn't done yet is sell any star players under our noses. If we can keep top players despite Spuds etc. unsettling, and we start 2011/2012 with those players, then I'm optimistic. If we cash in, I'm less so. Pretty much my view. Ashley has done some things that observers consider mistakes, and quite big ones. But either by luck or judgement, those things haven't effected us too badly on the pitch. As long as he realises our true position (still in danger of going back down if we don't strengthen) and doesn't gamble too much then we should keep moving in the right direction. Debatable how many wonder transfers like HBA and Tiote we can keep finding, but Ashley's pig-headedness and unwillingness to play the game with clubs and agents asking over the odds for average players might turn out to be a benefit to us. probably about the same level but far.far better to watch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 A thousand times better to watch, nae Duff! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdckelly Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 the signing of barfa does show some ambition from ashley, like with all things hes not the savior we all hoped he would be after he overthrew the original fat dictator however hes not pure horrendous either, we as football supporters tend to get carried away on things. Yes he cocked up several major times in first 2 years, hiring keegan in retrospect for the system he wanted to use at the time was a bad idea, having jfk anywhere near the club was a horrendous idea and gambling it all on a shearer lift in the final 8 games was a bad idea in retrospect, however in the last 18 months there has been an upturn in sense with the occasional major lapse. While he stumbled on hughton more than anything he still decided to give him a go after he earned a real shot at the job in his role as caretaker, he did back his manager sensibly enough in last jan and the summer. Sacking hughton i can't agree with at any level but if i had to play devils advocate i think it would be down to not beating relegation rivals, iirc out of sides who are realistically in the relegation fight we only beat wolves (i'm open to correction here) and with home losses to stoke blackpool etc it didn't look good. We'll have to wait and see if he really has learned his lesson but thus far we do seem to be on a slight upward trajectory Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 World's longest sentence. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 A thousand times better to watch, nae Duff! TBF, slowly watching your mother sodomised by Mike Ashley would be better than watching us in the relegation season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdckelly Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 World's longest sentence. got on a thought run and it sort of spewed out tidied Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStar Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Can't see us doing more than treading water at best (always knowing disaster may be round the corner) for as long as Ashley's in charge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpal78 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 A thousand times better to watch, nae Duff! TBF, slowly watching your mother sodomised by Mike Ashley would be better than watching us in the relegation season. completely unnecessary Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 A thousand times better to watch, nae Duff! TBF, slowly watching your mother sodomised by Mike Ashley would be better than watching us in the relegation season. completely unnecessary No shit. All he had to do was invest a little and back his original manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpal78 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 A thousand times better to watch, nae Duff! TBF, slowly watching your mother sodomised by Mike Ashley would be better than watching us in the relegation season. completely unnecessary No s***. All he had to do was invest a little and back his original manager. I was referring to the sodomy analogy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 No shit... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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