Alan Pardew

[TRon]

I honestly believe that you could take any manager of reasonable intelligence and just flat out refuse to sack them for several years, and they'd turn out to be decent just as a function of experience and knowing the club better than anyone else. This is, of course, assuming that you don't get relegated in the mean time.

 

Aside from a few genius-level exceptions like Mourinho, I just don't think there's a whole lot of difference in aptitude for the vast majority of professional managers. The ones who survive longer in the game whom we tend to think of as "decent managers" are just the ones who produce better short-term results.

 

If it were up to me, the only cases where I would sack a manager would be completely losing the dressing room (Souness), complete inability to work with management (in which case they'll probably just walk anyway), or blatant insanity (Kinnear).

 

I understand what you're saying but it's like looking at a car from 50 yards away and saying it looks fine to me. It's only when you get up close and look under the hood that you see the real problems. Playing poor formations and making crazy substitutions aren't something that can be explained by inexperience. It's a failure to read the game which is more worrying. I haven't even touched on playing a style which is not suited to the players we have, but on that maybe you could argue he doesn't have good enough players yet. Again, not something I accept, as for me there's been no sign after a year that we've even attempted to coach a more fluid passing style. We'll see.

 

 

[The College Dropout]

I honestly believe that you could take any manager of reasonable intelligence and just flat out refuse to sack them for several years, and they'd turn out to be decent just as a function of experience and knowing the club better than anyone else. This is, of course, assuming that you don't get relegated in the mean time.

 

Aside from a few genius-level exceptions like Mourinho, I just don't think there's a whole lot of difference in aptitude for the vast majority of professional managers. The ones who survive longer in the game whom we tend to think of as "decent managers" are just the ones who produce better short-term results.

 

If it were up to me, the only cases where I would sack a manager would be completely losing the dressing room (Souness), complete inability to work with management (in which case they'll probably just walk anyway), or blatant insanity (Kinnear).

 

I understand what you're saying but it's like looking at a car from 50 yards away and saying it looks fine to me. It's only when you get up close and look under the hood that you see the real problems. Playing poor formations and making crazy substitutions aren't something that can be explained by inexperience. It's a failure to read the game which is more worrying. I haven't even touched on playing a style which is not suited to the players we have, but on that maybe you could argue he doesn't have good enough players yet. Again, not something I accept, as for me there's been no sign after a year that we've even attempted to coach a more fluid passing style. We'll see.

 

But you learn. Reading of the game can be improved, so can substitutions.

 

I'm pretty sure Fellaini scored something like 15 goals playing behind the striker in his 2nd season. Tim Cahill came back and played that role for the followed 2 season despite not scoring for long stretches. Moyes only brought Fellaini back into that position after they lost the FA Cup semi-final. He's got it together now.

 

I'm sure Pardew will improve with time. Time i'm sure he'll get if we avoid relegation this year.

[TRon]

I honestly believe that you could take any manager of reasonable intelligence and just flat out refuse to sack them for several years, and they'd turn out to be decent just as a function of experience and knowing the club better than anyone else. This is, of course, assuming that you don't get relegated in the mean time.

 

Aside from a few genius-level exceptions like Mourinho, I just don't think there's a whole lot of difference in aptitude for the vast majority of professional managers. The ones who survive longer in the game whom we tend to think of as "decent managers" are just the ones who produce better short-term results.

 

If it were up to me, the only cases where I would sack a manager would be completely losing the dressing room (Souness), complete inability to work with management (in which case they'll probably just walk anyway), or blatant insanity (Kinnear).

 

I understand what you're saying but it's like looking at a car from 50 yards away and saying it looks fine to me. It's only when you get up close and look under the hood that you see the real problems. Playing poor formations and making crazy substitutions aren't something that can be explained by inexperience. It's a failure to read the game which is more worrying. I haven't even touched on playing a style which is not suited to the players we have, but on that maybe you could argue he doesn't have good enough players yet. Again, not something I accept, as for me there's been no sign after a year that we've even attempted to coach a more fluid passing style. We'll see.

 

But you learn. Reading of the game can be improved, so can substitutions.

 

I'm pretty sure Fellaini scored something like 15 goals playing behind the striker in his 2nd season. Tim Cahill came back and played that role for the followed 2 season despite not scoring for long stretches. Moyes only brought Fellaini back into that position after they lost the FA Cup semi-final. He's got it together now.

 

I'm sure Pardew will improve with time. Time i'm sure he'll get if we avoid relegation this year.

 

How do you learn common sense? Basic things like when you are losing you bring on a forward, not another defensive midfielder. Or when you are up against a side with very attacking left flank players, you don't put a centre forward in there up against them?

 

Sorry, I'd love to believe, but I just don't see it.

[oldtype]

I honestly believe that you could take any manager of reasonable intelligence and just flat out refuse to sack them for several years, and they'd turn out to be decent just as a function of experience and knowing the club better than anyone else. This is, of course, assuming that you don't get relegated in the mean time.

 

Aside from a few genius-level exceptions like Mourinho, I just don't think there's a whole lot of difference in aptitude for the vast majority of professional managers. The ones who survive longer in the game whom we tend to think of as "decent managers" are just the ones who produce better short-term results.

 

If it were up to me, the only cases where I would sack a manager would be completely losing the dressing room (Souness), complete inability to work with management (in which case they'll probably just walk anyway), or blatant insanity (Kinnear).

 

I understand what you're saying but it's like looking at a car from 50 yards away and saying it looks fine to me. It's only when you get up close and look under the hood that you see the real problems. Playing poor formations and making crazy substitutions aren't something that can be explained by inexperience. It's a failure to read the game which is more worrying. I haven't even touched on playing a style which is not suited to the players we have, but on that maybe you could argue he doesn't have good enough players yet. Again, not something I accept, as for me there's been no sign after a year that we've even attempted to coach a more fluid passing style. We'll see.

 

But you learn. Reading of the game can be improved, so can substitutions.

 

I'm pretty sure Fellaini scored something like 15 goals playing behind the striker in his 2nd season. Tim Cahill came back and played that role for the followed 2 season despite not scoring for long stretches. Moyes only brought Fellaini back into that position after they lost the FA Cup semi-final. He's got it together now.

 

I'm sure Pardew will improve with time. Time i'm sure he'll get if we avoid relegation this year.

 

How do you learn common sense? Basic things like when you are losing you bring on a forward, not another defensive midfielder. Or when you are up against a side with very attacking left flank players, you don't put a centre forward in there up against them?

 

Sorry, I'd love to believe, but I just don't see it.

 

First, the part in bold is completely untrue.

 

Second, the manger has access to more information than any of us will ever be privy to. When he makes selections that seem crazy to us it may just be because there are other reasons we're not aware of. Regardless of whether he's incompetent relative to others in his trade, Alan Pardew knows infinitely more about football, tactics, and the personality, form, and physical state of every single one of our players than all of us. So when doesn't do something that seems obvious perhaps it's not as obvious as you think.

 

(That said, the manager also has the weakness of being personally connected to the situation, which means he may make bad decisions based on things like personalities, friendships, or pride. I often find that it's much easier to explain puzzling tactical decisions in these terms rather than "he's an idiot.")

[alpal78]

My issue with him is that after a quiet transfer window, he would come out peddling excuses for the owners. His comments last summer that we indeed have a strong squad and that we supporters should be happy that nobody left was not only disgraceful but extremely condescending. Then halfway during the season when injuries hit (as they usually do in any football team), he paddles out excuses that the reason we are doing so poorly is because of the injuries and that we don't have good players to replace them. Someone should scream into his face, "that's right Pards, that's why we needed to strengthen in the summer and our team/squad wasn't good enough, idiot!"

[Darth Crooks]

He's crap; probably not as crap as some make out but he has definite crapness.

[Dan Gleebals]

My issue with him is that after a quiet transfer window, he would come out peddling excuses for the owners. His comments last summer that we are indeed have a strong squad and that we supporters should be happy that nobody left was not disgraceful but extremely condescending. Then halfway during the season when injuries hit (as they usually happens in any football team), he paddles out excuses that the reason we are doing so poorly is because of the injuries and that we don't have good players to replace them. Someone should scream into his face, "that's right Pards, that's why we needed to strengthen in the summer and our team/squad wasn't good enough, idiot!"

 

This.

[hakka]

My issue with him is that after a quiet transfer window, he would come out peddling excuses for the owners. His comments last summer that we are indeed have a strong squad and that we supporters should be happy that nobody left was not disgraceful but extremely condescending. Then halfway during the season when injuries hit (as they usually happens in any football team), he paddles out excuses that the reason we are doing so poorly is because of the injuries and that we don't have good players to replace them. Someone should scream into his face, "that's right Pards, that's why we needed to strengthen in the summer and our team/squad wasn't good enough, idiot!"

 

This.

 

While it's very true, I have a feeling Pardew believed a little too much in our younger players being ready to fill in for the senior ones and it's backfired a bit.

[AlanSkÃrare]

My issue with him is that after a quiet transfer window, he would come out peddling excuses for the owners. His comments last summer that we are indeed have a strong squad and that we supporters should be happy that nobody left was not disgraceful but extremely condescending. Then halfway during the season when injuries hit (as they usually happens in any football team), he paddles out excuses that the reason we are doing so poorly is because of the injuries and that we don't have good players to replace them. Someone should scream into his face, "that's right Pards, that's why we needed to strengthen in the summer and our team/squad wasn't good enough, idiot!"

 

This.

 

He's been very open and honest about the fact that himself and the board made mistakes last summer though.

 

However, talking about "one more senior player" is still not comprehending where we stand as a squad in my opinion.

[ExiledGeordie]

 

His problem is fans aren't thick and we have good memories. Coming out and saying how much we needed to fill certain positions in the summer and then moving the goal posts by saying "the fans should feel lucky we didn't sell anyone" when we barely signed anyone was an insult and patronising. He knows the drill and he knows the rules from MA/DL which had been set when he took the job but coming out with statements like that one just make him look weak.

[Mick]

 

 

First, the part in bold is completely untrue.

 

Second, the manger has access to more information than any of us will ever be privy to. When he makes selections that seem crazy to us it may just be because there are other reasons we're not aware of. Regardless of whether he's incompetent relative to others in his trade, Alan Pardew knows infinitely more about football, tactics, and the personality, form, and physical state of every single one of our players than all of us. So when doesn't do something that seems obvious perhaps it's not as obvious as you think.

 

(That said, the manager also has the weakness of being personally connected to the situation, which means he may make bad decisions based on things like personalities, friendships, or pride. I often find that it's much easier to explain puzzling tactical decisions in these terms rather than "he's an idiot.")

 

Can you think of some examples of what information Pardew has that we don't, which might suggest that any of the following is a good idea when everybody else can see it failing during an actual match:

 

Moving to 4-4-2 at the begining of this season.

Bypassing midfield.

Cisse is better on the wing than through the middle.

Shola up front is a good idea.

Cabaye is a better footballer when the ball is launched over his head.

Jonas is going to perform during a match when everybody can see that he's not doing it.

Williamson is good enough to play half the season in central defence.

Spending 4 out of 5 days a week on defence is improving performances.

We should restrict a Championship team for 70 minutes before trying to get something from the game.

Virtually playing 2 teams a week then complaining that we have no continuity.

Virtually playing 2 teams a week then complain that out players are tired.

 

I know I've cherry picked a few examples but the list could go on and on and on.  We are where we are for a reason and the main reason is that this season, Pardew hasn't been up to the job.

 

You've claimed that "Alan Pardew knows infinitely more about football, tactics, and the personality, form, and physical state of every single one of our players than all of us."

 

I've seen nothing at all to suggest that he knows any more about football, tactics, form and physical state of our players than your average fan.  Our game play and results suggest that he hasn't got a clue and I would think that most fans could have come up with a more effective plan than Pardew has, especially this season.

 

Basically, he is an idiot.

 

We can bring in new players and they will give Pardew more options but he's had options for most of the season and more often than not he's got them wrong.  As far as I'm concerned the biggest improvement we could get this season would be to get rid of him and bring in somebody with fresh ideas, somebody who can get the best out of the players he has at his disposal.

 

The only way Pardew will be a success here is if he stumbles across something that works and actually sticks to it because I have absolutely no faith in him devising a style of play of his own that works.

 

I don’t even think our transfer policy has held us back with him because he doesn’t know how to get the best out of what he’s got.

[AlanSkÃrare]

Didn't we play Leon Best on the wing last season as well.

 

He had us playing to our strengths for a brief spell during the spring, it was about grinding out results for extremely long periods besides of that.

 

I think that period was a coincidence rather than a sign of how he wants us to play.

[Heake]

- An average manager who was in the right place at the right time with the right people when he landed the gig.

 

- used up his quota of luck last season & has arguably been "found out" tactically.

 

- Will probably get the boot this summer when we get relagated (Which we will if we dont get enough good bodies in this January).

 

 

 

 

[merlin]

 

His problem is fans aren't thick and we have good memories. Coming out and saying how much we needed to fill certain positions in the summer and then moving the goal posts by saying "the fans should feel lucky we didn't sell anyone" when we barely signed anyone was an insult and patronising. He knows the drill and he knows the rules from MA/DL which had been set when he took the job but coming out with statements like that one just make him look weak.

 

This - and he IS weak...wouldn't be in the job otherwise as the terrible twosome don't do strong managers - puppets only allowed.

 

We have no evidence from his past record that he will start learning and he's in his 50s now.

 

[Guest bimpy474]

 

 

First, the part in bold is completely untrue.

 

Second, the manger has access to more information than any of us will ever be privy to. When he makes selections that seem crazy to us it may just be because there are other reasons we're not aware of. Regardless of whether he's incompetent relative to others in his trade, Alan Pardew knows infinitely more about football, tactics, and the personality, form, and physical state of every single one of our players than all of us. So when doesn't do something that seems obvious perhaps it's not as obvious as you think.

 

(That said, the manager also has the weakness of being personally connected to the situation, which means he may make bad decisions based on things like personalities, friendships, or pride. I often find that it's much easier to explain puzzling tactical decisions in these terms rather than "he's an idiot.")

 

Can you think of some examples of what information Pardew has that we don't, which might suggest that any of the following is a good idea when everybody else can see it failing during an actual match:

 

Moving to 4-4-2 at the begining of this season.

Bypassing midfield.

Cisse is better on the wing than through the middle.

Shola up front is a good idea.

Cabaye is a better footballer when the ball is launched over his head.

Jonas is going to perform during a match when everybody can see that he's not doing it.

Williamson is good enough to play half the season in central defence.

Spending 4 out of 5 days a week on defence is improving performances.

We should restrict a Championship team for 70 minutes before trying to get something from the game.

Virtually playing 2 teams a week then complaining that we have no continuity.

Virtually playing 2 teams a week then complain that out players are tired.

 

I know I've cherry picked a few examples but the list could go on and on and on.  We are where we are for a reason and the main reason is that this season, Pardew hasn't been up to the job.

 

You've claimed that "Alan Pardew knows infinitely more about football, tactics, and the personality, form, and physical state of every single one of our players than all of us."

 

I've seen nothing at all to suggest that he knows any more about football, tactics, form and physical state of our players than your average fan.  Our game play and results suggest that he hasn't got a clue and I would think that most fans could have come up with a more effective plan than Pardew has, especially this season.

 

Basically, he is an idiot.

 

We can bring in new players and they will give Pardew more options but he's had options for most of the season and more often than not he's got them wrong.  As far as I'm concerned the biggest improvement we could get this season would be to get rid of him and bring in somebody with fresh ideas, somebody who can get the best out of the players he has at his disposal.

 

The only way Pardew will be a success here is if he stumbles across something that works and actually sticks to it because I have absolutely no faith in him devising a style of play of his own that works.

 

I don’t even think our transfer policy has held us back with him because he doesn’t know how to get the best out of what he’s got.

 

Pretty much agree with all of that.

 

Aye, me too. Great post Mick .

 

But you have broken my heart not mentioning the set penises

[Paully]

"I don't think there's a problem with the playing style"

 

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2013/01/10/nufc-boss-pardew-insists-he-can-handle-the-heat-72703-32578736/

[Guest neesy111]

"I don't think there's a problem with the playing style"

 

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2013/01/10/nufc-boss-pardew-insists-he-can-handle-the-heat-72703-32578736/

 

Alan pls.

[ATB]

Whats the point to even play the game this weekend? Because seemingly Pardew can´t win without his "best players" 

[Alberto2005]

Press conference today?

[Mick]

"I don't think there's a problem with the playing style"

 

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2013/01/10/nufc-boss-pardew-insists-he-can-handle-the-heat-72703-32578736/

 

From that article:

 

Pardew believes that only against Sunderland in the Tyne-Wear derby at the Stadium of Light was he able to name his strongest team.

 

Krul, Simpson, Williamson, Coloccini, Santon, Tiote, Cabaye, Gutierrez, Ben Arfa, Ba, Shola.

[Rich]

Aye but he had Steven Taylor and Cisse available as well, just opted to stick them on the bench.

[Mick]

Aye but he had Steven Taylor and Cisse available as well, just opted to stick them on the bench.

 

I rest my case.

[Rich]

[Guest neesy111]

Shola did play when he was on during that match tbf.  Though Williamson ahead of Saylor.

[jimmymag]

Aye but he had Steven Taylor and Cisse available as well, just opted to stick them on the bench.

 

I rest my case.

 

GUILTY!!!