Guest firetotheworks Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 For reference sake the season we went down under McClaren we had 24 points at this time in the season, only 1 less than our current amount, I think its debatable whether the team was much better then, you would think for being not far off a world class manager he might be outperforming McClaren by more than a point. At the end of the day it comes down to points on the board, and on that evidence so far he is barely outperforming Schteve. You genuinely think that that team, the one that at one point or another had Wijnaldum, Sissoko, Thauvin, and Townshend in it, wasn't quite clearly better than what we have now? I honestly don't even known where to start with that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaydnNUFC Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 For reference sake the season we went down under McClaren we had 24 points at this time in the season, only 1 less than our current amount, I think its debatable whether the team was much better then, you would think for being not far off a world class manager he might be outperforming McClaren by more than a point. At the end of the day it comes down to points on the board, and on that evidence so far he is barely outperforming Schteve. You genuinely think that that team, the one that at one point or another had Wijnaldum, Sissoko, Thauvin, and Townshend in it, wasn't quite clearly better than what we have now? I honestly don't even known where to start with that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Figures 1-0 Football Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 For reference sake the season we went down under McClaren we had 24 points at this time in the season, only 1 less than our current amount, I think its debatable whether the team was much better then, you would think for being not far off a world class manager he might be outperforming McClaren by more than a point. At the end of the day it comes down to points on the board, and on that evidence so far he is barely outperforming Schteve. Your last line is the most ridiculous. What do you fail to comprehend about the huge difference in the two squads? According to transfermarkt, only one of our players in our entire squad is worth more than £10m in the current market. That player? Islam Slimani who arrived less than a week ago, hasn’t played a game for us and isn’t even owned by us. We’re going through a PL season with a pitiful squad, Rafa has done a remarkable job so far. In McClaren’s squad we had Wijnaldum (£25m now playing for a top 6 side), Sissoko (£30m player now playing for a top 6 side), Townsend (£12m). We also had the likes of Janmaat who is a regular starter for a team higher in the league than us. Thauvin who is playing well for a team competing at the top of the French division. That’s 5 players who are already significantly better than their counterparts, quite significant when you consider that is half of the outfield team. It speaks volumes that the team that finished the game away at Man City, all 11 players were playing in the Championship last season. We have a Championship squad and on that basis we should be 20th, when in actual fact we are out of the relegation zone and with as much chance of anyone as staying up. You could also then look at comparing the utterly dire performances served up under McClaren, whereas we’ve been in pretty much all of the games we’ve played this season, bar a few. Of course Rafa has made a mistake along the way, it’d be impossible not to - but if we had anyone else in charge we’d already be planning for our season in the Championship. You are talking utter shit and your anger is misguided, aim it towards the fat cunt who refuses to invest in the squad to allow us to compete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 The point seems to simply be 'we have x number of points, therefore Rafa's responsible to y degree' which is quite frankly utter bollocks. It's the sort of shit you see on RTG. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
YNGLEGIONNAIRE Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Surely we must see the bigger picture here. Rafa is not in it for the quick fix , and thank God for that . He is setting out his blueprint for " the Rafa way ".. which we found out in the Championship , can be frustrating at times... but with which he has won so much in the past . He wants this model to run through every fibre of the club... Which means he sees this as a long term project . The problem lies with how long it takes for him to be provided with the resources he needs to complete the task . As far as this season goes he has been shafted as far as the quality needed for the job in hand . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 My dig is more at the people who are saying he is working miracles, when in fact whatever way you swing it we are in serious danger of relegation, throwing away wins due to immediately retreating when going ahead, baffling and negative subs and tactics and IMO wasting most of admittedly mediocre budget he was given on players who mostly sit on the bench every week. We are just about keeping our heads above water and will more than likely be in the bottom 3 after the visit of Man Utd, I'm not for one second saying McClaren is a better manager than Benitez, I'm just saying so far his performance at corresponding points in the season are barely any different, and the proof is in the points hauls of both. I think he is the best we can get especially under this ownership, but he should not be above criticism, there was somebody before literally saying he should take no blame for anything ffs even if we go down Its madness. No one's above criticism, just try and apply some logic to it and follow it through so we can see you're not just venting for the sake of it. He's got the same amount of points as Schteve isn't criticism, it's just pointless bollocks with no context. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 He's the best we can get 'under this ownership' Jesus H, the guy just finished managing Real Madrid. He's the best we can get full stop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickthemagpie Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 I mean, as usual, I think the truth is somewhere in-between. As we all know, Ashley has dealt Rafa a s*** hand (yet again), but it would be stupid to suggest that Rafa isn't partly to blame for our league position. Of course he is. You all know that he has made quite a few mistakes this season with peculiar starting lineups, substitutions too late, negative tactics after going ahead, and the signings that he has been able to make have largely been poor. BUT, he is a class above anyone else we could hope to attract, has genuine quality when he has the right tools, is a revelation in his work off the pitch, and has brought pride back to our club. And I would hate to see us let him go without giving him a fair hand to play with. I wouldn't swap him for anything, but I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he's done an average job on the football side of things so far (last season included - our final league position certainly did mask how largely crap we were for large chunks of the season). No. Fuck off, that's a perfectly reasonable post. The blame is 95% Ashley but you still can't argue that Rafa has made some bewildering substitutions, or made them too late, and put out a few questionable line-ups. Just thought i'd post a list of managers that haven't- Yep, that's about it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themanupstairs Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 According to transfermarkt, only one of our players in our entire squad is worth more than £10m in the current market. That player? Islam Slimani who arrived less than a week ago, hasn’t played a game for us and isn’t even owned by us. We’re going through a PL season with a pitiful squad, Rafa has done a remarkable job so far. but subs Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_NUFC Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 According to transfermarkt, only one of our players in our entire squad is worth more than £10m in the current market. That player? Islam Slimani who arrived less than a week ago, hasn’t played a game for us and isn’t even owned by us. We’re going through a PL season with a pitiful squad, Rafa has done a remarkable job so far. but subs but his subs will be the forum version of #ButHerEmails Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanji Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Thauvin isn't just competing well, he's arguably one of the top 5 players in that league right now. His form is unreal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Thauvin isn't just competing well, he's arguably one of the top 5 players in that league right now. His form is unreal. I'm not saying this with the benefit of hindsight, but I did not like that sale at all. I know he wouldn't have wanted to stay with us when we went down, but he was clearly a quality young player who needed time to adapt. We could and should have still loaned him out last season, but not put in the silly "they must buy" clause in. They got panicked into doing that, he went for way under his market value in the end. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 For reference sake the season we went down under McClaren we had 24 points at this time in the season, only 1 less than our current amount, I think its debatable whether the team was much better then, you would think for being not far off a world class manager he might be outperforming McClaren by more than a point. At the end of the day it comes down to points on the board, and on that evidence so far he is barely outperforming Schteve. You genuinely think that that team, the one that at one point or another had Wijnaldum, Sissoko, Thauvin, and Townshend in it, wasn't quite clearly better than what we have now? I honestly don't even known where to start with that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paully Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 , I think its debatable whether the team was much better then It isn’t debatable - that squad absolutely pisses all over this one FFS! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinport53 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 , I think its debatable whether the team was much better then It isn’t debatable - that squad absolutely pisses all over this one FFS! Eh, we have loads of internationals and players worth 20mil + in this squad Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh74 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 For reference sake the season we went down under McClaren we had 24 points at this time in the season, only 1 less than our current amount, I think its debatable whether the team was much better then, you would think for being not far off a world class manager he might be outperforming McClaren by more than a point. At the end of the day it comes down to points on the board, and on that evidence so far he is barely outperforming Schteve. You genuinely think that that team, the one that at one point or another had Wijnaldum, Sissoko, Thauvin, and Townshend in it, wasn't quite clearly better than what we have now? I honestly don't even known where to start with that. Brilliant. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanji Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Thauvin isn't just competing well, he's arguably one of the top 5 players in that league right now. His form is unreal. I'm not saying this with the benefit of hindsight, but I did not like that sale at all. I know he wouldn't have wanted to stay with us when we went down, but he was clearly a quality young player who needed time to adapt. We could and should have still loaned him out last season, but not put in the silly "they must buy" clause in. They got panicked into doing that, he went for way under his market value in the end. 1 trillion times this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 He never wanted to be here though. He's obviously a much better player than he showed here but I had no issue with us cutting our losses on that one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemtizz Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Wasn't there a video of him looking distraught on their bench after a game when he was told OM had accepted a bid from us. There's no way he wanted to be here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Figures 1-0 Football Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Came here on the advice of his agent for £££, was never interested in playing for us and that was reflective of what we saw on the pitch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Didn’t we try to sign him about three times? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altamullan Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 , I think its debatable whether the team was much better then It isn’t debatable - that squad absolutely pisses all over this one FFS! Sorry, but by ‘that squad’ do you mean the 2015-16 relegation squad absolutely pisses all over our current relegation threatened one? Might have to go check, but really don’t think I would swap many of the ‘differences’ mind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xLiaaamx Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 When talking about the strength that year and mentioning townsend, it's worth noting he was here less than half the season. Whatever that's worth. In reality, the only clear upgrades in the team from august-january would be the waster twins, Sissoko and Wijnaldum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xLiaaamx Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Oh, and Mitrovic was better than Joselu has been. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 I'd have Janmaat over Yedlin and Krul over Darlow as well Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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