Eddie Howe - Nominated for Manager of the Season

[HaydnNUFC]

From the most recent Athletic article. Would like to see the same but for across Howe's whole tenure here. A bit damning if there's a trend.

 

Newcastle United 1-0 Southampton - 22.2% possession.

Newcastle United 2-1 Tottenham Hotspur - 34.3% possession.

Newcastle United 1-0 Arsenal - 36.1% possession.

Newcastle United 1-1 Manchester City - 37.7% possession.

Newcastle United 3-3 Liverpool - 41.2% possession.

Newcastle United 0-2 West Ham United - 52.8% possession.

Newcastle United 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion - 59.9% possession.

[Andy84]

2 hours ago, Geogaddi said:

The league is so weird this year, the top 4 is likely going to be the 4 teams currently in it but after that is about 7 clubs that could finish anywhere between 5th and 11th. If we had been anywhere near our best this season we would pretty much be nailed on for top 5.

It really is, a woeful Wolves absolutely smash Fulham away from home, who then lose 4-0 at Everton while Fulham beat Brighton who are playing well. Spurs away at City vs last night at Bournemouth

[TRon]

2 minutes ago, HaydnNUFC said:

From the most recent Athletic article. Would like to see the same but for across Howe's whole tenure here. A bit damning if there's a trend.

 

Newcastle United 1-0 Southampton - 22.2% possession.

Newcastle United 2-1 Tottenham Hotspur - 34.3% possession.

Newcastle United 1-0 Arsenal - 36.1% possession.

Newcastle United 1-1 Manchester City - 37.7% possession.

Newcastle United 3-3 Liverpool - 41.2% possession.

Newcastle United 0-2 West Ham United - 52.8% possession.

Newcastle United 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion - 59.9% possession.

 

I read it this morning, just confirms our players are far better geared to playing on the counter where they have open space to run into rather than having to actually break defences down. Pressing high without goals to show for it is a dangerous approach.

[Lush Vlad]

7 minutes ago, HaydnNUFC said:

From the most recent Athletic article. Would like to see the same but for across Howe's whole tenure here. A bit damning if there's a trend.

 

Newcastle United 1-0 Southampton - 22.2% possession.

Newcastle United 2-1 Tottenham Hotspur - 34.3% possession.

Newcastle United 1-0 Arsenal - 36.1% possession.

Newcastle United 1-1 Manchester City - 37.7% possession.

Newcastle United 3-3 Liverpool - 41.2% possession.

Newcastle United 0-2 West Ham United - 52.8% possession.

Newcastle United 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion - 59.9% possession.

What trend are you thinking of here? That we can only win games when we have hardly any of the ball? 
 

I think we are much better when we have space in behind and room on the counter. We don’t have too many technicians capable of retaining decent possession high up the pitch. Whilst also looking threatening. But I do also think we are massively reliant on scoring the first goal or at least keeping it level. To ensure the game stays a bit more open for our style to work more effectively.
 

Too many games this season. We have conceded first and from memory, often quite early. I’d imagine most teams struggle to come from behind regularly to draw or win matches. But even more so in our case with how we like to play the game. 
 

 

[Holmesy]

12 hours ago, Matt1892 said:

Yesterdays performance was great, as was the home performance against Arsenal a month ago, and the home game against Man City just over a month before that.

 

What that demonstrates is that we are raising our performances for the big games, yet the games in between like Palace, West Ham and Fulham we have been terrible and look unmotivated.

 

Hopefully this is us turning the corner, and the December fixtures don’t look too bad with 2 promoted sides at home, but it does feel like we have been in a similar position a number of times this season and failed to build on it.

I know I sound like a broken record but this raises the plan B question again. Against teams that attack us and go out to win the game, we are very effective. Against lesser teams that sit back, nullify our strengths and then hit us on the break we are shite. If we can find a way to be more effective at breaking down stubborn defences we'll be flying.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2024 by Holmesy

[JEToon]

We weren’t really “good” against Man City in all honesty, what we did was efficient but it wasn’t close to as good a performance as we put up against Brighton when we patently had a load more chances to score goals, we were next to no goal threat against Man City really, we were a far greater goal threat against Brighton.

 

I would argue the same v Arsenal and contrast that to West Ham, we naturally really created a lot more chances v West Ham than against Arsenal.

 

I am realty not sold that this is as simple as some are trying to write it personally.

[HaydnNUFC]

32 minutes ago, Lush Vlad said:

What trend are you thinking of here? That we can only win games when we have hardly any of the ball? 
 

I think we are much better when we have space in behind and room on the counter. We don’t have too many technicians capable of retaining decent possession high up the pitch. Whilst also looking threatening. But I do also think we are massively reliant on scoring the first goal or at least keeping it level. To ensure the game stays a bit more open for our style to work more effectively.
 

Too many games this season. We have conceded first and from memory, often quite early. I’d imagine most teams struggle to come from behind regularly to draw or win matches. But even more so in our case with how we like to play the game. 
 

 

 

A trend that we often fail to win when we have the lion's share of the ball. Even when we finished 4th, drew 0-0 at home to 2 sides that went down. Score draws to West Ham and Bournemouth that season who finished in the bottom 6 (iirc).

 

Again, I don't know if there's a trend but if there is it suggests a lack of tactical evolution and/or a lack of incisiveness on the ball from players we have.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2024 by HaydnNUFC

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I understand this criticism, but also low blocks are hard to break down. That’s their purpose. Otherwise poor teams would just get smashed every week and finish the season on zero points. 
 

Particularly difficult if your team isn’t built for possession football of course. 

[Holmesy]

36 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

I understand this criticism, but also low blocks are hard to break down. That’s their purpose. Otherwise poor teams would just get smashed every week and finish the season on zero points. 
 

Particularly difficult if your team isn’t built for possession football of course. 

Low blocks work, that's why teams employ them. But consistently leaving yourselves vulnerable to counter attacks by throwing everyone forward against them clearly isn't the way. I've no idea what is the way with our current squad but it's not my job to find one, just to criticise 

 

[Kanj]

If having 40% possession means we play with that type of conviction, energy and execution im all for it. I couldn’t care if we have 30% or 70% possession. I just want to see us execute a game plan, minimize poor errors and pick up points. 

[Maggies]

I’d like to see a Isak/Wilson combo played against the low block teams.

Sometimes you just need bodies in scoring areas for the chances to fall to.

[TRon]

1 hour ago, Holmesy said:

I know I sound like a broken record but this raises the plan B question again. Against teams that attack us and go out to win the game, we are very effective. Against lesser teams that sit back, nullify our strengths and then hit us on the break we are shite. If we can find a way to be more effective at breaking down stubborn defences we'll be flying.

 

 

 

 

I don't know if we have the players to break down stubborn defences, but I think we need to make sure in these games we don't go behind through leaving gaping holes in the midfield. Hopefully moving Tonali into the 6 position will help with that in future games. It might not be as sexy as going at teams all guns blazing, but if we can keep it level for an hour, then take the chance when it comes, it's one way of coming away with points against teams with the low block. Just be a bit more patient with the passing and draw them out rather than let them sit back and close all the spaces off.

[Holmesy]

9 minutes ago, Maggies said:

I’d like to see a Isak/Wilson combo played against the low block teams.

Sometimes you just need bodies in scoring areas for the chances to fall to.

Isak proved in the last game that he has the craft we need around the box to capitalise on other player's movement. Controversial take but until we can sign a proper #10 (we may not even be in the market for one tbh) maybe Isak is our best option behind Wilson up top.

Thinking back to when Keegan dropped Owen deeper and played Viduka up top - that proved to be an inspired move.

[JEToon]

Is gaping holes in midfield an issue?  

 

West Ham we go behind as a consequence of pretty pathetic defending from a set play, Brighton the same.

 

Two situations where you would be expecting a lot better from a few individuals rather than tactical shape related IMO.

[Miggys First Goal]

Anybody had a chance to listen to the interview with Eddie and Simon Jordan yet?

[80]

23 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

Isak proved in the last game that he has the craft we need around the box to capitalise on other player's movement. Controversial take but until we can sign a proper #10 (we may not even be in the market for one tbh) maybe Isak is our best option behind Wilson up top.

Thinking back to when Keegan dropped Owen deeper and played Viduka up top - that proved to be an inspired move.

To me it's a fine idea, but Wilson is made of tissue paper so I think it would be irrelevant after one or two games... Really limits our options on that score.

 

Not that I'm overly worrying about the situation, but I'd be interested to know roughly when Eddie thinks Osula will be genuinely first team ready.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2024 by 80

[Kid Icarus]

15 minutes ago, Miggys First Goal said:

Anybody had a chance to listen to the interview with Eddie and Simon Jordan yet?

Yeah it's good. All the sort of questions and answers you'd expect like, but good nonetheless 

[Lush Vlad]

25 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

Isak proved in the last game that he has the craft we need around the box to capitalise on other player's movement. Controversial take but until we can sign a proper #10 (we may not even be in the market for one tbh) maybe Isak is our best option behind Wilson up top.

Thinking back to when Keegan dropped Owen deeper and played Viduka up top - that proved to be an inspired move.

 

Or we just have him playing up front and he does what he did against Liverpool?  Looking to get runners from midfield and out wide beyond him? 

 

Not sure losing another midfielder and almost playing an extra striker is the answer.  Especially when Wilson is made of glass and looked way past it even when he played last season.  Who's to say he would find so much space when he's playing as an actual number 10, as well? 

 

His movement from being up top to going into channels, in behind, coming short etc.  Was what made it so effective.  It must be a nightmare to know who is responsible for picking him up and marking him.  Players having to constantly guess if he's going in behind, staying still waiting for it to feet, dropping off etc.   

[80]

27 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

I don't know if we have the players to break down stubborn defences, but I think we need to make sure in these games we don't go behind through leaving gaping holes in the midfield. Hopefully moving Tonali into the 6 position will help with that in future games. It might not be as sexy as going at teams all guns blazing, but if we can keep it level for an hour, then take the chance when it comes, it's one way of coming away with points against teams with the low block. Just be a bit more patient with the passing and draw them out rather than let them sit back and close all the spaces off.

The problem with this is Eddie has - in word and deed - demonstrated he's totally committed to the psychology of trying to achieve full system dominance in every game we play. He doesn't like taking what he sees as a step back in the slightest, which gets exploited by teams who know this and don't feel the same way.

 

It'd be a major change for him to stop doing it that way, and I can't see it happening. To his credit, it's a winner's mentality.

[mondonewc]

36 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

Isak proved in the last game that he has the craft we need around the box to capitalise on other player's movement. Controversial take but until we can sign a proper #10 (we may not even be in the market for one tbh) maybe Isak is our best option behind Wilson up top.

Thinking back to when Keegan dropped Owen deeper and played Viduka up top - that proved to be an inspired move.

Don't think it would be a good move to switch Isak's position when Wilson sadly highly likely will be injured again very soon, could also knock Isak's confidence moving him to fit in Wilson. Isak has to play in his best position and you build the team around him. 

[janpawel]

This talk of playing vs a high line and low block, just shows the insane advantage Chelsea have as a result of the bent FFP

 

They have players suited for any system, Mudryk and Neto against a high line, Sancho, Madueke, Fernandez, Felix etc if they think they will dominate the ball 

 

Really hope the next 1/2 singing we make in midfield / attack give us another dimension we lack 

[TRon]

36 minutes ago, JEToon said:

Is gaping holes in midfield an issue?  

 

West Ham we go behind as a consequence of pretty pathetic defending from a set play, Brighton the same.

 

Two situations where you would be expecting a lot better from a few individuals rather than tactical shape related IMO.

It has been yes, not talking about one or two individual games but over the course of the season. I presume that's why Tonali was moved into that space to plug the gaps as he has good recovery pace.

[JEToon]

10 minutes ago, TRon said:

It has been yes, not talking about one or two individual games but over the course of the season. I presume that's why Tonali was moved into that space to plug the gaps as he has good recovery pace.

 

I would question the logic of that thought to be honest, if you watched our full games might not have that same thought, we haven't been that exposed and leaving gaping holes for the most part really, the defensive shape has been fine.  

 

I would expect the alteration with Sandro is leaned heavier on generating a better level of creative spark. 

 

 

Edited December 6, 2024 by JEToon

[TRon]

23 minutes ago, JEToon said:

 

I would question the logic of that thought to be honest, if you watched our full games might not have that same thought, we haven't been that exposed and leaving gaping holes for the most part really, the defensive shape has been fine.  

 

I would expect the alteration with Sandro is leaned heavier on generating a better level of creative spark. 

 

 

 

 

I've watched just about all of them, I missed the Brighton game because I was at a wedding, and the first half of the West Ham game because I was travelling. You might not think there has been holes left by the midfield, but it's been commented on quite a lot by others in the media. Quite a few of our goals conceded this season have been when we've been caught in possession then hit on the counter.

[JEToon]

Just now, TRon said:

 

I've watched just about all of them, I missed the Brighton game because I was at a wedding, and the first half of the West Ham game because I was travelling. You might not think there has been holes left by the midfield, but it's been commented on quite a lot by others in the media. Quite a few of our goals conceded this season have been when we've been caught in possession then hit on the counter.

 

I haven’t heard it that much to be honest, depends who you listen to and how serious you take them I suppose.  

 

I would suggest our work from set plays has been a far greater issue than supposed gaping holes in midfield personally like.