STM Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 13 minutes ago, KDT said: Sorry like but until we actually start winning things regularly a league cup win should be on the same level as a league title for us. I think everyone's aware that any trophy for us would be mint. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Winning the European Cup puts you on a very small, very select list of clubs. Pretty much every English club of any significance has one league title in the bag in their history. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 5 hours ago, TheBrownBottle said: Nope European Cup Premier League UEFA Cup FA Cup Conference League League Cup The traditionalist in me wants to place the FA Cup much higher, but it’s been damaged badly over previous decades. I’m astonished by the numbers on here who’d take a PL win over the European Cup. I would swap five league titles for one European Cup I can understand City picking CL over the League, maybe even some other clubs Obviously we'd take anything at this moment but in this hypothetical scenario the PL easily over the CL for me Across 38 games there is very little doubt you are the best team but when it comes to the CL the best team doesn't always win, Chelsea weren't even the best team in England when they won it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, STM said: Premier League = Champions League Europa=FA League Cup = Conference League In my mind. Winning the CL without winning the PL with the same squad seems weird and devalues it somehow... just in my mind of course. However winning the PL multiple times and not winning the CL with a certain squad had its own mini asterix. It's all personal preference TBH. Would shag me dead granny for a League Cup. I don't necessarily disagree with this, there isn't generally much between them but if you had to separate them in a list I was interested to see what people would go with Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 11 hours ago, toon25 said: I caveat this by saying I'm a late-30s, bitter, cunt who drinks a pint if cynicism for breakfast, but genuinely dont want any other club from this country other than my own to do well I've not liked West Ham for a while now tbh, might have started with finding out Martin Samuels was a fan, then being led by Allardyce didn't help. For me it's not about the club, often it's the type of football they play. Never been a fan of David Moyes teams, and the one positive I take out of this is that he'll still be in charge of them next season as a result of winning this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummie Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, TheBrownBottle said: Winning the European Cup puts you on a very small, very select list of clubs. It certainly does. *wink* Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Debating the merits of winning the CL or the Premier League reminds me of this old advert - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DX3tnL3lMGs Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 55 minutes ago, brummie said: It certainly does. *wink* Well, for most clubs anyway Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, joeyt said: Both clubs have won European trophies before last night tbf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempiternal Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 13 hours ago, Kimbo said: You need to beat top clubs to win the league cup, surely it has more bragging rights. European cups have much more prestige to me, and PL teams largely treat league cups like they don’t matter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 34 minutes ago, Sempiternal said: European cups have much more prestige to me, and PL teams largely treat league cups like they don’t matter But the conference has zero prestige to big clubs. If the conference league is really a prestigious major trophy then really West Ham have had a better season than us. I wouldn’t swap a top 4 place for conference league personally. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempiternal Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Just now, Kimbo said: But the conference has zero prestige to big clubs. If the conference league is really a prestigious major trophy then really West Ham have had a better season than us. I wouldn’t swap a top 4 place for conference league personally. Roma not a big club? I’d class them as one personally. Big teams usually send out reserves in the league cup. Trophies >>> everything. Winning is a habit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempiternal Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Spurs took that Top 4 >> trophy attitude and it’s not worked out at all well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 (edited) 17 hours ago, Sempiternal said: Roma not a big club? I’d class them as one personally. Big teams usually send out reserves in the league cup. Trophies >>> everything. Winning is a habit. Roma are big, though not at their peak these days. This year it’s been won by West Ham, a club that has never finished in the top 2 in domestic football in its entire history. How would you feel if a 4th tier European competition was created? Or a 5th? At what tier would they stop being a major prestigious trophies? In theory we could get the whole league playing some form of European competition. Edited June 9, 2023 by Kimbo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 4 minutes ago, Sempiternal said: Spurs took that Top 4 >> trophy attitude and it’s not worked out at all well. You would swap seasons with West Ham? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 A third European competition is hardly ridiculous though. We had the cup winners cup for decades. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 5 minutes ago, Kimbo said: But the conference has zero prestige to big clubs. If the conference league is really a prestigious major trophy then really West Ham have had a better season than us. I wouldn’t swap a top 4 place for conference league personally. You mean it has zero prestige to a dozen or so clubs (of all the millions of clubs in Europe) whose target - realistically or otherwise - is to reach the latter stages of the Champions League. Like I was saying last night, defining the Conference League by how it compares with a far more prestigious competition is such a grim way to view it, imo. Not everything is about the tedium of the Champions League's annual rinse and repeat. A competition should be defined by its own competitors. I swear most of the derision is subconsciously borne out of that fucking awful name which is deliberately pitched to sound subservient to UEFA's cash cow tournies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big River Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 not sure I'd be classing the Conference league as a "major" European trophy, like the commentary team were relentlessly banging on about last night. but it's still a trophy at the end of the day, probably on par or slightly beneath the League Cup. nice to see them celebrating the win tbh. a refreshing change from the same old teams not giving a fuck when they win something! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempiternal Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 8 minutes ago, Kimbo said: You would swap seasons with West Ham? Loaded question imo, because the clubs are in two different states, but the top 4 thing is just a modern creation, classing it as trophy. West ham certainly wouldn’t swap their season for ours. What happens if you aim for top 4, bomb out of every comp, Chelsea, spurs, arsenal to a degree did this. Now spurs have no Europe, no trophies. I’m glad we finished in the CL, but on first consideration I’d take finishing in the top 10 and winning either the league cup or the conf 100 percent. No one cares that we finished in the top 4 in the 90s, but I do care we haven’t won a trophy for donkeys years Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempiternal Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 People were saying this same stuff about the EL. I don’t think Sevilla fans would agree Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 PS if we're saying that UEFA's third competition isn't a major trophy then we are genuinely downgrading our own historic achievements. The Fairs Cup's one city rule probably meant that competition had even fewer 'big' teams in it than today's Vana-euro-rama, even in the context of 1969. Ujpest Doza certainly hadn't pulled up any trees in Europe by the time they faced us, and never achieved anything notable thereafter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 minute ago, Yorkie said: PS if we're saying that UEFA's third competition isn't a major trophy then we are genuinely downgrading our own historic achievements. The Fairs Cup's one city rule probably meant that competition had even fewer 'big' teams in it than today's Vana-euro-rama, even in the context of 1969. Ujpest Doza certainly hadn't pulled up any trees in Europe by the time they faced us, and never achieved anything notable thereafter. They did get to the European Cup semis in 1974 tbf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempiternal Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 In a very simplified way, west ham fans are going to remember that for the rest of their lives, the noise when the goal went in. If they finish top 4 they won’t. That’s mainly how i see it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Just now, ponsaelius said: They did get to the European Cup semis in 1974 tbf. Fair enough, didn't spot that - what they did after 1969 is probably less relevant (to my point) than what they did before. The point I'm making is that a third competition isn't unusual and, if anything, today's is arguably comprised of more 'big' clubs (however you want to define that) than the iterations of yesteryear were. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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