FAC QF: Manchester City 2-0 Newcastle United (16/03/24) | Reaction: pg 34

[Gallowgate Toon]

Just now, Beren said:

 

Interesting post 

 

I don't think 50%+ average possession is the gloryland personally. I don't think any possession stat is isolation is the measure of success, or what I was getting at, but it's an interesting bit of data.

 

For example, I'd be more than happy to let Brighton pass it along their backline for 60 minutes while sitting on a 2-goal deficit vs Newcastle. Meaningful possession during meaningful parts of the game is less easy data capture though.

 

Also, I'm not surprised Villa's stat is reasonably low either and I'm not a big fan of their style of play either.

 

FWIW, I don't think NUFC are inherently "just runners" and they've showed on numerous occasions what they're capable of, which makes it all the more galling when the "running game" is leaned on too heavily.

 

I also strongly disagree that it's just about players. I think coaching/strategy have the biggest impact - especially when you're NOT in the position to a have a squad like Man City's or Liverpool. Evidence of this is what Howe did with the likes of Murphy, Longstaff and Almiron last year who under a different system were in a relegation battle. 

It's not but the wording of your post to me seemed to reduce us to harriers for limited possession return which I felt was an oversimplification. If that were the case, we'd see a net negative there, we obviously do try and retain the ball and build phases of play - we manage to be a threat with it too. I'm not saying there aren't ways we can improve though.

 

I always thought the focus on us out of possession last year was also too simple. There were a few sides who pressed more, had more sprints, covered greater distances each game iirc. We mostly just triggered and did it really well and there was great coaching method to it so it was very effective.

 

When you look at players that cover the most ground in the division, there are a lot of top 6ers. Passing and moving with more of the ball still requires a lot of intensity and energy. I think Rice is the top dog this campaign for it with Rodri not far behind.

 

Coaching/tactics obviously have an impact as they set the overall direction but it's ultimately down to players to actually enact it and that's where the complexity in football lies most weeks regardless of tactical tweaks. Imo there's also a natural shelf-life to coaching the same group of players if there are talent limitations, this is why even the best teams need to keep evolving. How often do you see a very similar team of players regularly outdo their actual level of quality year-in-year-out? We've effectively been the same team as last season but with more injuries - 3 of our 4 signings have barely played for differing reasons.

 

I think we have a lot of mentally fatigued players but it's got little to do with style of play.

[The College Dropout]

1 minute ago, Optimistic Nut said:

 

Mings & Buendia happened in August so they were able to get in Lenglet & Zaniolo. Doubt they'd have been there if those two weren't injured.

Agreed but both players have come in as backups to the backups. They’ve not replaced them in the starting lineup. 
 

Kamaras out. Ramsey has missed lots of the season. Carlos and Pau have missed chunks of the season.  
 

I think Arsenal are among the best at controlling a game in and out of possession. And so far they’ve had fairly minimal injuries.  Arteta isn’t a massive rotator either.  I think that control element has helped them keep players fit. I do think Arteta will eventually need to start rotating more. The likes of Saka and Rice seem to be bullet proof. I think Rice missed something like 9 league games in his last 4 seasons at West Ham. Thats crazy.  That’s an attritional style of play too. 

[Coffee_Johnny]

11 minutes ago, Gallowgate Toon said:

It's not but the wording of your post to me seemed to reduce us to harriers for limited possession return which I felt was an oversimplification. If that were the case, we'd see a net negative there, we obviously do try and retain the ball and build phases of play - we manage to be a threat with it too. I'm not saying there aren't ways we can improve though.

 

I always thought the focus on us out of possession last year was also too simple. There were a few sides who pressed more, had more sprints, covered greater distances each game iirc. We mostly just triggered and did it really well and there was great coaching method to it so it was very effective.

 

When you look at players that cover the most ground in the division, there are a lot of top 6ers. Passing and moving with more of the ball still requires a lot of intensity and energy. I think Rice is the top dog this campaign for it with Rodri not far behind.

 

Coaching/tactics obviously have an impact as they set the overall direction but it's ultimately down to players to actually enact it and that's where the complexity in football lies most weeks regardless of tactical tweaks. Imo there's also a natural shelf-life to coaching the same group of players if there are talent limitations, this is why even the best teams need to keep evolving. How often do you see a very similar team of players regularly outdo their actual level of quality year-in-year-out? We've effectively been the same team as last season but with more injuries - 3 of our 4 signings have barely played for differing reasons.

 

I think we have a lot of mentally fatigued players but it's got little to do with style of play.

Two great posts. Coaching and tactics, structure and style, if they are fit for purpose, create a solid foundation. If wrong, in general or for the opposition on the day, make a positive outcome harder. What really makes the difference between having a steady season and being an exceptional team, between competing and winning, is having high quality players who can in themselves change a game. Who can do the seemingly impossible at times. We, many of us anyway, have experienced the wonder of this with Keegan’s strengths of building the self-belief and bringing out the best in great players coupled with a ‘go out and chuck a few grenades’ style of coaching. The latter wasn’t a firm foundation for winning. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

3 hours ago, Beren said:

 

 

This got me. Does feel at times like he is a General just sending bodies over the top until they don't come back.

He should send the child soldiers who have no experience and don’t know how to load their rifles.  

[alexf]

The athleticism of Rodri and Kovacic against Longstaff and Bruno last night was such a problem. We couldn't get near Kovacic, he was just able to stroll past our midfields attempts at tackles at will. Sort of game we can see how far off we are especially without Joelinton smashing into people.

 

It's definitely an area I hope we focus on in the summer. I think Tonali should help if he's up to speed now ofcourse.

 

but you can see teams are starting to target that weakness. It's why they had Doku coming in off the left and making those surging runs through the middle as we have no one that can live with pace.

 

 

Edited March 17 by alexf

[El Prontonise]

I do think there's an issue with the general conditioning of our players in terms of fitness.  There's been all sorts of injuries.

[Thumbheed]

Really hope Howe sticks with this formation

[huss9]

on another note. did i just imagine that "wingman fa cup reverse" thing on the big screens at half time?

truly the shitiest, most forced,  cringiest thing i've ever seen at a game.

citeh hang ur heads in shame.

[Myleftboot]

2 hours ago, Thumbheed said:

Really hope Howe sticks with this formation

Would prefer Willock up front with Isak.

[McDog]

18 hours ago, Dr.Spaceman said:

 

I wonder if people who use this argument did the same when Pardew refused to pick HBA.

 

I think at the end of the day it depends on how you view the manager. If you think he is a competent PL manager who has shown what he can do you have more leeway and assume he uses his information well. If you think he's a moron then obviously you question everything and every decision. Sounds like you poor fellows had the latter alot the last several years before Howe.