Signing Shearer - was it really a mistake?

[Guest fraser]

Should read 'Shearer signing - it was really a mistake.'

 

For him, not us.

 

If he really was the egoist many make him out to be then he would have gone to Man. U. Medals aplenty awaited.

[madras]

is everyone forgetting that ferdinand was 30 and was starting to get loads of back trouble when sold.so some might say we had a years transision and bought the best player in the country when we could afor a position that woukld need replacing a year later.

 

ferdinand getting old and picking up muscular injuries,asprilla never consistant,the problem was the injury to shearer at the start of the next season,don't forget asprilla picked up a lengthy injury aswell,like today if martins got injured how much do you want t pay for a back up striker.

 

also i wonder how much the shearer deal actuall cost in the end if we figure in the extra revenue(merchandise,advertising etc) he brought in)

[Guest Knightrider]

is everyone forgetting that ferdinand was 30 and was starting to get loads of back trouble when sold.so some might say we had a years transision and bought the best player in the country when we could afor a position that woukld need replacing a year later.

 

ferdinand getting old and picking up muscular injuries,asprilla never consistant,the problem was the injury to shearer at the start of the next season,don't forget asprilla picked up a lengthy injury aswell,like today if martins got injured how much do you want t pay for a back up striker.

 

also i wonder how much the shearer deal actuall cost in the end if we figure in the extra revenue(merchandise,advertising etc) he brought in)

 

Exactly. Yes we could have done with a GK and a CB at the time, but that team didn't let in too many given just how attack minded it was and as you state, we only really had Sir Les who was heading into his 30s and showing signs of becoming prone to niggly injuries. Huckerby was only 21 at the time while Kitson was average, Asprilla was inconsistent and Beardsley was nearing free bus pass stage so buying Shearer made a lot of sense team wise.

 

BTW I read somehwere that Shearer has earned the club over £100m

[Mr. Snrub]

Even considering that signing Shearer was a mistake is nothing short of ridiculous.

 

If he we had signed a GK then(defender, too) instead, we wouldn't have got our best ever keeper,  Given, in 97.

 

Where would we be now if we never had Shearer and Shay..

 

 

 

[tmonkey]

Even considering that signing Shearer was a mistake is nothing short of ridiculous.

 

If he we had signed a GK then(defender, too) instead, we wouldn't have got our best ever keeper,  Given, in 97.

 

Where would we be now if we never had Shearer and Shay..

 

Up until Shearer's retirement, we apparently would not be able to replace him with anyone good. Plenty of "we cant get rid of Shearer, who are we going to replace him with??".

 

Right now, weve got a replacement who has the potential to be one of the best forwards in the league.

 

There are, and always have been, alot of good players out there. Ive never bought into this "where would we be without XYZ??". Wed have signed someone who would have scored us goals, and with the right planning, wed have two or three players to do that. Weve proved in the past we could do that - some of our fans couldnt look beyond Andy Cole when we had him, yet we replaced him with a better forward.

 

Same goes for the "Ferdinand was aging and getting injury prone" arguements. If we had sorted out the defence that summer instead of buying Shearer, we could have concentrated on buying a forward later, or looked for a cheaper alternative with alot of class to boot. I remember well Stoichkov being desperate to sign for us in the same summer we got Shearer, a bloody great stiker still with alot to offer and had just had a good Euro 96 in a shiite side - he went for a low fee iirc - were we interested in a forward arguably as fine as Shearer? No, we were looking at the bigger fish. There were alot of possibilities and alternatives, its rubbish to say we had noone else we could get.

 

If we had got the defence sorted, wed have secured our position as a top, top side, because regardless of whether Ferdinand was getting more injured or not, we still have an excellent attack with goals from all areas, Ginola, Beardo, Rob Lee, Tino, and on top of this the attacking play as a unit was top class, its not just about the individuals - a good right winger was all that was needed for the attack itself, a good striker could have waited a year. Instead, we gambled everything on one player, and yes hes done well for us, but we still lost out overall because of that signing.

[OzzieMandias]

Barnes wasn't too bad from what I remember that season, chipped in with a fair amount of goals. Pearce also done a good job, Rush was shite though.

 

Barnes was shite, though not as shite as Rush. I hated us having those two. After waiting for some decent new striker, at the last minute we get these useless clapped-out scousers and suddenly it's crystal that all our cash is sunk into the injured Shearer. Bit like now, really, but we get Sibierski instead.

[Stevie]

Whoever said his signing was a mistake is a cunt, there's no other word to describe them, whoever come out with such bollocks is indictive of the new age fan today, fuckin tossers, ashamed to be geordie with people like them around.  Aye it was a mistake 4fs, we should've signed Paul Rideout or Dean Windass.

[toptoon]

Whoever said his signing was a mistake is a c**t, there's no other word to describe them, whoever come out with such bollocks is indictive of the new age fan today, fuckin tossers, ashamed to be geordie with people like them around.  Aye it was a mistake 4fs, we should've signed Paul Rideout or Dean Windass.

 

Agreed!

 

People on here say that Shearer made a mistake coming here!! Only he could possibly answer that. Jesus wept man have you not heard of something called loyalty?? There are those of us who if we did manage to play for the club that we love and support would not leave and play for another club guaranteed trophy's or no bloody trophy's!! Loyalty is a dying thing in football and it sadens me big time seeing greed and disloyalty grow so unbelievably big its actually accepted by some . I admire the Shearers, Le Tissers and Steve Bulls of this world who stayed loyal to their clubs, when they could have taken the bigger club, better pay and trophy's. Players like them should be admired and congratulated for taking a stand.

[Guest alex]

Not replacing him earlier was the only mistake in my view. The signings since have proved we had plenty money to spend so I don't buy the 'it was putting all our eggs in one basket' - type arguments that are often made. For about the last 3 seasons here (and particularly the last couple) he played way too often and at various times looked absolutely knackered and in need of a rest. We still haven't replaced him tbh (even if Owen was fit).

[Cronky]

Whoever said his signing was a mistake is a c**t, there's no other word to describe them, whoever come out with such bollocks is indictive of the new age fan today, fuckin tossers, ashamed to be geordie with people like them around.  Aye it was a mistake 4fs, we should've signed Paul Rideout or Dean Windass.

 

Agreed!

 

People on here say that Shearer made a mistake coming here!! Only he could possibly answer that. Jesus wept man have you not heard of something called loyalty?? There are those of us who if we did manage to play for the club that we love and support would not leave and play for another club guaranteed trophy's or no bloody trophy's!! Loyalty is a dying thing in football and it sadens me big time seeing greed and disloyalty grow so unbelievably big its actually accepted by some . I admire the Shearers, Le Tissers and Steve Bulls of this world who stayed loyal to their clubs, when they could have taken the bigger club, better pay and trophy's. Players like them should be admired and congratulated for taking a stand.

 

Presumably this loyal player is the one who threatened to leave if he wasn't guaranteed a first team place, right?

[Guest eyeball_tickler]

this is almost as good as the "sell given" thread.

 

i doubt anyone was asking this when he was scoring the goals that got us to finals and into the champions league.

[toptoon]

Whoever said his signing was a mistake is a c**t, there's no other word to describe them, whoever come out with such bollocks is indictive of the new age fan today, fuckin tossers, ashamed to be geordie with people like them around.  Aye it was a mistake 4fs, we should've signed Paul Rideout or Dean Windass.

 

Agreed!

 

People on here say that Shearer made a mistake coming here!! Only he could possibly answer that. Jesus wept man have you not heard of something called loyalty?? There are those of us who if we did manage to play for the club that we love and support would not leave and play for another club guaranteed trophy's or no bloody trophy's!! Loyalty is a dying thing in football and it sadens me big time seeing greed and disloyalty grow so unbelievably big its actually accepted by some . I admire the Shearers, Le Tissers and Steve Bulls of this world who stayed loyal to their clubs, when they could have taken the bigger club, better pay and trophy's. Players like them should be admired and congratulated for taking a stand.

 

Presumably this loyal player is the one who threatened to leave if he wasn't guaranteed a first team place, right?

 

Pressumably this is a fact that you can prove and not half baked gossip/hearsay?? 

 

Who in their right mind would drop Shearer in his hayday anyway (bar Guillit)??

[toptoon]

this is almost as good as the "sell given" thread.

 

i doubt anyone was asking this when he was scoring the goals that got us to finals and into the champions league.

 

Agreed, there are definately some Mackem WUM's (wind up merchants) on here, brain washing some of the more fickle among us imo.

[NE5]

Barnes wasn't too bad from what I remember that season, chipped in with a fair amount of goals. Pearce also done a good job, Rush was shite though.

 

Barnes was shite , though not as shite as Rush. I hated us having those two. After waiting for some decent new striker, at the last minute we get these useless clapped-out scousers and suddenly it's crystal that all our cash is sunk into the injured Shearer. Bit like now, really, but we get Sibierski instead.

 

Barnes was better, and scored more goals than your hero Arsprilla. Don't suppose you are aware of that though.

 

 

[Benwell Lad]

this is almost as good as the "sell given" thread.

 

i doubt anyone was asking this when he was scoring the goals that got us to finals and into the champions league.

 

Agreed, there are definately some Mackem WUM's (wind up merchants) on here, brain washing some of the more fickle among us imo.

 

The "sell Given" thread was actually "Sell Given ?" and debated the point that if we have three Premiership class goalkeepers does it make sense to sell the highest valued one ? Most people thought not.

Likewise this thread merely debates would we have been better off long term if the Shearer fee and wages had been invested elsewhere. It does not doubt his contribution to the club.

 

I'm neither mackem or brain washed, but I think in his last 2 years Shearer's prescence was detrimental to the club.

First going public in the Chronicle about not accepting a squad role (before either Dyer or Bellamy's spats) and then being instrumental in Robson's departure and Souness's arrival.

In fact I'd say in Newcastle it probably proves you're not brainwashed if you can rise above the "Shearer, Shearer" type adulation.

[Nobby]

is this thread a joke?

 

signing shearer a mistake?  mackems.gif

 

 

[Guest TrEe]

Shearer was one of the best things that ever happened to this club!!! Not only was he a great player, he improved our fanbase around the world alot.

 

How anyone can question if it was a good signing or not is insane mackems.gif

[Guest Knightrider]

is this thread a joke?

 

signing shearer a mistake?  mackems.gif

 

 

 

According to some aye.

[tmonkey]

Whoever said his signing was a mistake is a c**t, there's no other word to describe them, whoever come out with such bollocks is indictive of the new age fan today, fuckin tossers, ashamed to be geordie with people like them around.  Aye it was a mistake 4fs, we should've signed Paul Rideout or Dean Windass.

 

And your reason for saying all this is...?

 

Still yet to see a decent counter arguement that doesnt involve "ROFL YOURE A MACKEM" or "omg shearer mistake? wtf??", other than "Ferdinand was getting old and getting injury prone". To which ive replied about getting quality in that didnt require us to break the bank - Stoichkov was desperate to come to us, at a time when the Premiership was shiite and easy pickings for forwards with great technique, eg Zola who moved to Chelsea in the same summer and prolonged his playing career purely because of technique and intelligence on the ball.

 

On top of this, I think the "Ferdinand became injury prone" arguements are purely ones made in hindsight - he scored more goals than Shearer the season they played together iirc, at the time we signed Shearer these problems hadnt surfaced at all. Easy to look back now and say "yeah, Ferdinand's career was nearing an end", but that wasnt the case when we splashed out a world record 15mill - we signed Shearer irrespective of Ferdinand.

 

To win trophies and stay at the top, we had the firepower, we had the midfield, but not the defence or the keeper. Whats the logical thing to do? Blow EVERYTHING on one centreforward?

 

Call me what you want out of your own ignorance and blind faith, not only do the facts speak for themselves - no trophies, plummiting down the table, squad torn apart, following summer spent 7mill sold 16mill, etc etc - but so do "silly" things like common sense and logic.

[Guest Phil K]

Best player to ever pull on the Black & White shirt. Definetly not a mistake.

I can't believe some of the shit I've read here on Shearer.

The only thing that has been 100% right is that he was the one true world class player we had, and the idiocy of surrounding him with crap like Howey for example, beggared belief.

Averaging more than 20 a season, frequently carrying the team in some ludicrous one man shows - even after the injury that slowed him down a yard -  yet the number of "What have you done for me lately" dickheads have me shaking my head with disgust.

There was also the fair point he should have gone a season earlier, at the very top. Like Bobby R should have.

Yes.

Bobby should have gone the previous season all right. Preferably upstairs in an advisory role. Somechance with these bloody directors.

[Rich]

Best player to ever pull on the Black & White shirt. Definetly not a mistake.

I can't believe some of the shit I've read here on Shearer.

The only thing that has been 100% right is that he was the one true world class player we had, and the idiocy of surrounding him with crap like Howey for example, beggared belief.

Averaging more than 20 a season, frequently carrying the team in some ludicrous one man shows - even after the injury that slowed him down a yard -  yet the number of "What have you done for me lately" dickheads have me shaking my head with disgust.

There was also the fair point he should have gone a season earlier, at the very top. Like Bobby R should have.

Yes.

Bobby should have gone the previous season all right. Preferably upstairs in an advisory role. Somechance with these bloody directors.

 

Completely agree with this, amazingly.

 

I dread to think how good Man Utd would have been if they had been allowed to buy Shearer... that's the key to this argument from my perspective. We wouldn't have fucking touched them with a twenty-foot barge pole if they had Cantona/Shearer up front with Scholes, Giggs, Keane and Beckham behind them... not to mention Andy Cole, Nicky Butt, Gary Neville, Peter Schmeichel, etc.

 

No matter how we diced that £15m (it's questionable whether we would have had that much cash to spend if it wasn't to be spent on Shearer as well) we would have been blown away. Maybe we would have still come 2nd every season, we might have even knicked a domestic trophy, but I'm not sure I would trade that for what Shearer brought to this club. He gave everyone some sort of hope, he was a symbol of Geordie pride and was a pleasure to watch.

 

Is it 100% fact that Stoichkov wanted to join? What if he got a career-ending injury on his debut, what then? It's all conjecture. He could have simply not been as good as you predict he would have. Granted we didn't even win a fucking raffle with Shearer, but we also didn't get relegated or go bust, and we had some fairly amazing days/nights with the great man wearing the number 9. I know these days it's all about success on the pitch, maybe that's what it should be all about, but I think there's still something to be said for seeing a Geordie wearing that shirt and playing like a demon for the majority of 10 seasons.

[OzzieMandias]

Barnes wasn't too bad from what I remember that season, chipped in with a fair amount of goals. Pearce also done a good job, Rush was shite though.

 

Barnes was shite , though not as shite as Rush. I hated us having those two. After waiting for some decent new striker, at the last minute we get these useless clapped-out scousers and suddenly it's crystal that all our cash is sunk into the injured Shearer. Bit like now, really, but we get Sibierski instead.

 

Barnes was better, and scored more goals than your hero Arsprilla. Don't suppose you are aware of that though.

 

 

 

I'm not aware of it because, even more obviously than most of your "arguments", it's utter bollocks.

 

Asprilla scored loads more goals for us than Barnes – 18 in 50 appearances, as opposed to Barnes' 7 in 33 appearances (one goal in 2.7 games as opposed to one goal in 4.7 games). And name me a Barnes performance in black and white that came close to Asprilla's game against Barcelona. He could do it once, but he'd lost it long before he pulled one of our shirts over his thickening paunch.

 

 

[tmonkey]

Is it 100% fact that Stoichkov wanted to join? What if he got a career-ending injury on his debut, what then? It's all conjecture. He could have simply not been as good as you predict he would have. Granted we didn't even win a fucking raffle with Shearer, but we also didn't get relegated or go bust

 

Yes, he basically made a public "come get me" plea to Keegan in an interview with the BBC iirc. Stoichkov was a top, top player who had passed his peak but was still a very good player, had more all round ability than Shearer but was of course a different type of forward with Shearer being alot more predatory and entering the peak of his career. He (Stoichkov) had had a good Euro 96, iirc all Bulgaria's games were at Newcastle and he absolutely loved the city, which is mainly why he was desperate to sign for us.

 

Of course its not possible to say for certain what would have happened had we got someone like Stoichkov, or anyone else. I personally think hed have been as big a success as Zola, similar calibre forwards, because he had the ability to punish Premiership defences and with our midfield and the likes of Ferdinand, Beardo, Tino etc around him, hed have been a quality addition in my eyes, especially considering how open the Premiership was back then.

 

Thats not the point though, whether Stoichkov wouldve been a success or not is iirelevant, the point was that we had money to spend on a side that only needed a strong defence to win trophies and establish itself as a top side, and if we needed cover for Ferdinand we could have gotten top class forwards for decent amounts and spent the bulk of that money on defenders and/or keepers.

 

I also think that if we did indeed sign Shearer to prevent ManU getting him, it was just a pathetic show of throwing the towel in. No matter what side the competitor builds, success will always come if you have a good team with solidity and ability in every department. Real Madrid were meant to be unstoppable when they signed Zidane on top of Figo, and then Ronaldo. Of course a team like that will remain in and around the trophies, but good enough teams will regularly challenge them, and depending on how the season goes, will sometimes win or sometimes lose out. Again, pathetic to just throw the towel in and gamble in such a big way just to prevent a top player who we didnt truly need go to our rivals.

 

All im arguing is that we should have spent the money in a way that befitted the team we had so that we could win trophies. Im not trying to deny that it was great for a local lad to come home, for him to lead the club to some good seasons, and to score heavily for us during his time here. What im looking at is what the right thing to do at that point in time was with regards to the club I support winning trophies and nailing its position down for many years to come as one of the realistic title challengers - and imo, it was just a bad decision to gamble all our money on one forward.

 

I think ive made my points clearly, so will jump out of this "debate" because theres nowt else to say that hasnt already been said.

[OzzieMandias]

 

Of course its not possible to say for certain what would have happened had we got someone like Stoichkov, or anyone else.

 

 

He was a bit of a nutter, though, Stoichkov. I actually like the guy -- great player, great character -- but who knows what would have happened. Makes De Canio look sensible.

[Rich]

Is it 100% fact that Stoichkov wanted to join? What if he got a career-ending injury on his debut, what then? It's all conjecture. He could have simply not been as good as you predict he would have. Granted we didn't even win a fucking raffle with Shearer, but we also didn't get relegated or go bust

 

Yes, he basically made a public "come get me" plea to Keegan in an interview with the BBC iirc. Stoichkov was a top, top player who had passed his peak but was still a very good player, had more all round ability than Shearer but was of course a different type of forward with Shearer being alot more predatory and entering the peak of his career. He (Stoichkov) had had a good Euro 96, iirc all Bulgaria's games were at Newcastle and he absolutely loved the city, which is mainly why he was desperate to sign for us.

 

Of course its not possible to say for certain what would have happened had we got someone like Stoichkov, or anyone else. I personally think hed have been as big a success as Zola, similar calibre forwards, because he had the ability to punish Premiership defences and with our midfield and the likes of Ferdinand, Beardo, Tino etc around him, hed have been a quality addition in my eyes, especially considering how open the Premiership was back then.

 

Thats not the point though, whether Stoichkov wouldve been a success or not is iirelevant, the point was that we had money to spend on a side that only needed a strong defence to win trophies and establish itself as a top side, and if we needed cover for Ferdinand we could have gotten top class forwards for decent amounts and spent the bulk of that money on defenders and/or keepers.

 

I also think that if we did indeed sign Shearer to prevent ManU getting him, it was just a pathetic show of throwing the towel in. No matter what side the competitor builds, success will always come if you have a good team with solidity and ability in every department. Real Madrid were meant to be unstoppable when they signed Zidane on top of Figo, and then Ronaldo. Of course a team like that will remain in and around the trophies, but good enough teams will regularly challenge them, and depending on how the season goes, will sometimes win or sometimes lose out. Again, pathetic to just throw the towel in and gamble in such a big way just to prevent a top player who we didnt truly need go to our rivals.

 

All im arguing is that we should have spent the money in a way that befitted the team we had so that we could win trophies. Im not trying to deny that it was great for a local lad to come home, for him to lead the club to some good seasons, and to score heavily for us during his time here. What im looking at is what the right thing to do at that point in time was with regards to the club I support winning trophies and nailing its position down for many years to come as one of the realistic title challengers - and imo, it was just a bad decision to gamble all our money on one forward.

 

I think ive made my points clearly, so will jump out of this "debate" because theres nowt else to say that hasnt already been said.

 

Monkey, I think you're genuinely a top-class poster but that last line is pure bollocks. Smacks of nowt but ego to me and it basically alludes to you being 100% correct with this and everyone who disagrees with you being way-off. As for the "debate", I'd venture to say that there have been good points raised on both sides, but much like everything else that sparks interest on here the main protagonists are never going to agree. Anyone could simply sign-off by saying "agree to disagree", but wording it the way you did isn't the way to go about things.

 

You've made points based on not much more than personal opinion with a lot of guesswork/prediction interwoven, just like everyone else has in here. I came at you without calling you a Mackem (laughable that people have), or ridiculing you, and offered an alternative to your story of "what might have been", now you're bowing out of the "debate". Bad form.

 

At the time Shearer was arguably the best striker in world football and we brought him home. Do you genuinely think Keegan and that squad would have ever fully recovered from losing the title in 95/96? If you're not debating anymore, could someone else answer this for me?

 

Was our downfall buying Shearer instead of strengthening the defence or the other factors surrounding the club at the time? Things like the losing of the title, Ginola wanting away, Asprilla "upsetting" the balance or the PLC business? Was the defence even THAT bad in the first place?

 

Alternatively, what might have happened to NUFC had Keegan still left and Shearer hadn't have been around to bang the goals in for 9 years afterwards? Granted, things could have been brilliant, but things could also have been a hell of a lot worse than they are now, after Shearer.

 

Anyway, I think you make some excellent arguments, as do some others - the usual suspects.