David Beckham

[Guest JonnyRogers]

Anyone know if the Chelsea LA game is on telly? Please don't say its on f*****g setanta

[Dave]

Anyone know if the Chelsea LA game is on telly? Please don't say its on f*****g setanta

 

Chelsea TV i'd imagine.

 

Indeed:

 

02:00 Chelsea TV LA Galaxy v Chelsea Friendly

[Shearer9]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/6899670.stm

 

Looks like they're planning on turning the Galaxy soley into some sort of revenue source based on Beckham's name.  Yeah, this is good for football in the US, sends out the right message.

[Guest fatshaft]

While I'm thinking, don't know if it was posted on here, but there was a decent article in the Observer last Sunday about the state of English football from grass-roots level: http://observer.guardian.co.uk/sport/story/0,,2121414,00.html

 

It's a subject I'm always interested in reading about, why some countries produce talent like a conveyer belt and other countries produce absolutely f*** all, same for clubs too really to a lesser extent.

Wholeheartedly agree with the article's sentiments. While in the Isle of Man, my young lad got involved in football there at age 7. There is NO competitive football leagues until they reach 12 years old - high school age, but plenty of "skills" coaching at the training sessions.

 

What they do play it is 60 minute games with four 15 minute quarters. EVERY "coach" must have a coaching badge of some kind or they cannot take any aprt in running kids teams. Certainly in the team we went to, every player always got at least 15/30 minutes of play, depending how many turned up for every game, irrespective of ability, it was played for the fun of the game. It was always 7 a-side. He loved it there, and you could see most of the other kids did too.

 

Then we moved to Warrington, got him into another team there, all teams play competitive leagues from 6 years old, win at all costs for most but the most exceptional coaches (and usually they are the ones with badges). Of course our team didn't have a proper coach, but a volunteer, I got roped in to help as there were 2 teams and no one else would do it.

 

After 18 months, and one pre-season friendly for the new season, we stopped. He didn't enjoy it anymore, and the constant "you must win" mentality, even though in the Isle of Man he had been playing in the best team, there was no "win" pressure. I was glad as well, as post final game, the team's sponsor's son, stropped off without shaking hands having lost 4-1 I think it was. "Josh, get back and shake hands" says I. Of course Dad Sponsor was beside me, and said, he doesn't have to shake hands. I proceed to have a post match rant with all parents (most of whom agreed) and kids about sport coming first win or lose, and if they didn;t like it they should consider something else than football.

 

Luckily as my son was already sick of playing, it was an easy decision for me to say stuff it after the game.

 

I haven't missed a second of it even though they apparently won the league this year, like my wee lad, I used to love going to the games, but at pre-teen level the game comes first not the winning.

 

This country's grass roots has a lot to answer for.

 

[Northern Monkey]

I heard at the match once that his wife takes it up the 'rse. Some bigger boys were chanting it at him. I don't believe they'd even met her, so i don't know how they knew. I think it was made up.

[Guest fatshaft]

I heard at the match once that his wife takes it up the 'rse. Some bigger boys were chanting it at him. I don't believe they'd even met her, so i don't know how they knew. I think it was made up.

...or maybe she takes it up the arse? 50/50 chance when you think about it 

[Cronky]

Interesting that Beckham might not play against Chelsea. Apparently he aggravated an ankle injury on the flight over, which sounds a bit strange.

 

I don't imagine that the prospect of getting mullered by Chelsea on his debut was a particularly attractive one.

[Northern Monkey]

Interesting that Beckham might not play against Chelsea. Apparently he aggravated an ankle injury on the flight over, which sounds a bit strange.

 

I don't imagine that the prospect of getting mullered by Chelsea on his debut was a particularly attractive one.

 

he's always supposedly injured before big events, though.

[Cronky]

Interesting that Beckham might not play against Chelsea. Apparently he aggravated an ankle injury on the flight over, which sounds a bit strange.

 

I don't imagine that the prospect of getting mullered by Chelsea on his debut was a particularly attractive one.

 

he's always supposedly injured before big events, though.

 

I'm not sure about that. But he's been built up over there as some global superstar, and it'll become very obvious in the Chelsea game that there are better players around. If Mourinho had wanted him, he'd have bought him.

[Parky]

Interesting that Beckham might not play against Chelsea. Apparently he aggravated an ankle injury on the flight over, which sounds a bit strange.

 

I don't imagine that the prospect of getting mullered by Chelsea on his debut was a particularly attractive one.

 

he's always supposedly injured before big events, though.

 

I'm not sure about that. But he's been built up over there as some global superstar, and it'll become very obvious in the Chelsea game that there are better players around. If Mourinho had wanted him, he'd have bought him.

 

 

It's a tricky one for Becks and I'm sure it has crossed his mind to sit this one out.

[ohmelads]

Interesting that Beckham might not play against Chelsea. Apparently he aggravated an ankle injury on the flight over, which sounds a bit strange.

 

I don't imagine that the prospect of getting mullered by Chelsea on his debut was a particularly attractive one.

 

Was wondering this myself when he was unveiled, not surprised he's getting out of it.

[alpal78]

Think you guys are reading too much into the fact that he is missing teh Chelsea game. Although he might not be up to the standards of some of Chelsea's players, if he plays the way he did in the last 5-10 games for Madrid, don't think he is going to look awfully out of place either.

 

True, Galaxy might (most probably will) get a thumping but if he did play, that will be in spite of Beckham not because of him. Don't think he is the type of player who bottles under pressure, quite the contrary Beckham thrives in adverse circumstances and rise to the challeneges he faces, which is why he was able to make a 'come back' even after being dumped by both the club and national coaches.

[Guest brewer]

and was totally anonymous in Manure's flukey Champions League win. 

Apart from setting up both goals in the final.

[PCW1983]

To be fair to the lad he is prob gonna earn enough cash over there to keep the Beckham's comfortable for 5 generations or summit.  Good on the lad IMO

[CaliMag]

I am supposed to go to this game (I periodically watch Galaxy games anyway and I get free tickets) - if anyone is remotely interested I'll post some pics and write up a couple of observations. Typically MLS teams are underestimated by European teams and they tend to do better than expected. NUFC hardly has an excellent record overhere (0-1-1 iirc). That said the Galaxy is dire at the moment, the media circus will be overwhelming for the team as well so I expect Chelsea to hammer them.

[Guest Knightrider]

I wouldn't be too quick to write off football (or soccer) in America because it is the fastest growing amateur sport in the country these days IIRC and that is pivotal for any "new idea" to spread and become popular. Instead of turning to Baseball, American Football or Basketball, kids are now turning to football. And not because of David Beckham or the US national side doing well at World Cups, but because it is a simple game that anyone can play: by oneself or with others and with no equipment other than a ball. Importantly too, football doesn't discriminate like other American Sports such as Basketball (you have to be tall) or American Football (you have to be big and strong).

 

A kid I know was over there a while back on a youth coaching seminar and he raves about their set-up, the passion among kids for the game and the standard of coaching at that level, quite higher than here in the UK he reckons. With their numbers and resources they could become a force. More and more schools and colleges are putting out football teams and they are proving popular. As a sign of how popular football is becoming at street level, you have your Soccer Moms phenomenon, the celebrity culture of Tom Cruise et al whose kids play football (we all know how obsessed with and influenced by celebrity America is) and junior soccer in America is more abundant than any other form of junior sport (again IIRC, could be wrong).

 

In short if American kids are turning to the game, they will in turn become fans for life and in a few generations, football will take over from traditional sports as the number one sporting activity of the nation's people. Add in America's vulture like pursuit of the Dollar and it won't be too long before American football is more than just a retirement home for your David Beckhams, or plays second fiddle to Baseball for example.

 

You also have to remember America as a footballing nation is very young and you can't just become a footballing hotbed over night, it will take 50 years or more. But it's heading there, they aren't paying David Beckham all that money for nothing. Their research will show them that American kids are favouring football and the powers that be can see the mega money in it so will go all out to make sure that they can tap into this and sustain it. Unlike more traditional American sports which have little appeal outside of their own country, football is the world's number one sport on the streets and a truly global market, one of only a handful America doesn't have a large slice of. For now.

 

I read a brilliant article a few years back covering the 10 years on since they hosted the 94 World Cup and how much has changed since then. Professionally with MSL things have changed a lot, however it is on the streets, in classrooms and in kids' heads where the real changes are happening and what will give them a future in the game, in my opinion. Of course they will never ever be totaly 100% footy daft like our own country and others, but they'll overtake more traditional footballing nations as time passes.

 

I think another factor that is also helping their cause is their diverse mix of nationalities who have brought football into the States and are basically passing it on like how the English passed on the game to other nations.

 

As for Beckham, good luck to the bloke I say, we shouldn't be criticising him or knocking him, at least he has talent and is a nice guy and if anyone can help the game in America, he can, because I think people can see he's an ordinary bloke underneath it all who has worked hard to get to where he has, the ideal American dream type figure they should love, in many ways. Fair play to him for making all that money too.

[Guest Knightrider]

While I'm thinking, don't know if it was posted on here, but there was a decent article in the Observer last Sunday about the state of English football from grass-roots level: http://observer.guardian.co.uk/sport/story/0,,2121414,00.html

 

It's a subject I'm always interested in reading about, why some countries produce talent like a conveyer belt and other countries produce absolutely f*** all, same for clubs too really to a lesser extent.

Wholeheartedly agree with the article's sentiments. While in the Isle of Man, my young lad got involved in football there at age 7. There is NO competitive football leagues until they reach 12 years old - high school age, but plenty of "skills" coaching at the training sessions.

 

What they do play it is 60 minute games with four 15 minute quarters. EVERY "coach" must have a coaching badge of some kind or they cannot take any aprt in running kids teams. Certainly in the team we went to, every player always got at least 15/30 minutes of play, depending how many turned up for every game, irrespective of ability, it was played for the fun of the game. It was always 7 a-side. He loved it there, and you could see most of the other kids did too.

 

Then we moved to Warrington, got him into another team there, all teams play competitive leagues from 6 years old, win at all costs for most but the most exceptional coaches (and usually they are the ones with badges). Of course our team didn't have a proper coach, but a volunteer, I got roped in to help as there were 2 teams and no one else would do it.

 

After 18 months, and one pre-season friendly for the new season, we stopped. He didn't enjoy it anymore, and the constant "you must win" mentality, even though in the Isle of Man he had been playing in the best team, there was no "win" pressure. I was glad as well, as post final game, the team's sponsor's son, stropped off without shaking hands having lost 4-1 I think it was. "Josh, get back and shake hands" says I. Of course Dad Sponsor was beside me, and said, he doesn't have to shake hands. I proceed to have a post match rant with all parents (most of whom agreed) and kids about sport coming first win or lose, and if they didn;t like it they should consider something else than football.

 

Luckily as my son was already sick of playing, it was an easy decision for me to say stuff it after the game.

 

I haven't missed a second of it even though they apparently won the league this year, like my wee lad, I used to love going to the games, but at pre-teen level the game comes first not the winning.

 

This country's grass roots has a lot to answer for.

 

 

Give Us Back Our Game is the answer to our football development woes, some of the things in that article make me despair, Brooking admitting he wants to weed out the crap from the good (sending the good to academies) and wants to concentrate on physical issues and co-ordination. Fuck that, concentrate on skill and fun for kids and we may start producing more quality players and not more robots.

[ohmelads]

Think you guys are reading too much into the fact that he is missing teh Chelsea game. Although he might not be up to the standards of some of Chelsea's players, if he plays the way he did in the last 5-10 games for Madrid, don't think he is going to look awfully out of place either.

 

True, Galaxy might (most probably will) get a thumping but if he did play, that will be in spite of Beckham not because of him. Don't think he is the type of player who bottles under pressure, quite the contrary Beckham thrives in adverse circumstances and rise to the challeneges he faces, which is why he was able to make a 'come back' even after being dumped by both the club and national coaches.

 

Beckham's still a bloody good player. But there's a good chance Chelsea will win, perhaps even batter them. Large sections of the media would instantly pick up on this, regardless of Beckham's performance. I don't think "Beckham makes debut as Galaxy crash 4-0" would be a nice way to start his career over there, he's there to make an impression on people and first impressions count for a hell of a lot when you're dealing with an audience many of whom may be sceptical about football.

[ohmelads]

I am supposed to go to this game (I periodically watch Galaxy games anyway and I get free tickets) - if anyone is remotely interested I'll post some pics and write up a couple of observations. Typically MLS teams are underestimated by European teams and they tend to do better than expected. NUFC hardly has an excellent record overhere (0-1-1 iirc). That said the Galaxy is dire at the moment, the media circus will be overwhelming for the team as well so I expect Chelsea to hammer them.

 

I don't think it's so much underestimating the MLS sides (though that's probably a factor) as it is going through the motions. Notice that when we played small teams from countries like Malaysia under Bobby Robson we still came away with draws/defeats. These teams often see this as a very big game, their only chance to play against the elite of football, and will obviously play with pride and run their socks off, while someone like Chelsea sees this as a practice game, to try things out, gain fitness and above all avoid injuries - it's essentially a pre-season kickabout for Chelsea.

 

PS. Some pics would be cool 

[ohmelads]

Give Us Back Our Game is the answer to our football development woes, some of the things in that article make me despair, Brooking admitting he wants to weed out the crap from the good (sending the good to academies) and wants to concentrate on physical issues and co-ordination. f*** that, concentrate on skill and fun for kids and we may start producing more quality players and not more robots.

 

It's an excellent article which raises some valid points but I can't help but think it's grossly dramatised for effect. If you look at the players who have come through in recent years there are some technically gifted and cultured footballers willing to try things out - Joe Cole, Rooney, Carrick. In many cases it's at an older age that these players are turned into more formulaic machines/robots, Rooney in particular doesn't take the risks he used to, nor does Joe Cole, it's all about possession football these days.

[Guest Alan Shearer 9]

There is something about football, the very core of the game which fundamentally is just not American. Think it's the idea of a team.

[Guest Strunz]

and was totally anonymous in Manure's flukey Champions League win. 

Apart from setting up both goals in the final.

 

Took a couple of corners.  They weren't exactly assists, defence splitting passes or pinpoint crosses.

I'm not saying he's crap, I'm saying that he's masively, MASSIVELY overrated.

The irony is that if he's wasn't hyped to buggery and back, his status as the game's first player with a cultured right foot

would be assured

[Guest Alan Shearer 9]

Romario?

[Guest Alan Shearer 9]

Figo the Portugese wonderstriker?

[Exiled in Texas]

Grassroots soccer in the Texas is very strong. My town which is part of the Dallas/Fort metroplex has a population of 36,000 and our local soccer association has 2,000 active kids playing. The majority are playing in the U9 and down range but the soccer is almost always the first sport that kids get into because it is very simple.  Games are small sided U6 is 3v3 (no goalie), U8 is 5v5, U10 is 7v7 and they don't play 11v11 till they go into U11 age. So they get lots of touches on the ball, space to play in and no-one gets lost on the wing or stuck playing defense. Soccer is also the main activity for the kids during lunch breaks at school now.

 

The challenge is to keep more of the soccer players in the sport as they get older. (American) Football is king in Texas,  -  with highschool football being the most popular of all. The stadiums the local highschool teams play in would shame most 1st Division teams. The highschool in the town next to mine pulled in 46,000 to watch one of their playoff games. So the lure of highschool football and the "friday night lights" is a huge draw to young kids and the outstanding soccer kids at aged 7-8-9 are then often moving on to the traditional US sports Football and Baseball.

 

But those that stay have good foundations to develop their talent and there is a good range of options for the kids to progress. U5 through U8 is non-competitive......small teams, scores not kept, teams randomly drawn from player pool, all players play at least 50% etc.  Once they hit U9 and U10 then the games become competitive and scores are kept but games are still small sided. At this age, the local Soccer Clubs start offering skills training and running their own teams. This is the first level where players (or parents) have to be serious about playing as the training schedule and costs start to increase - up from $80 for a 10 game season to $600+ for the year.

 

Once they hit U11 - then the talent pool gets split. The good players move to the Select clubs who have paid coaches and teams are built through tryouts etc. Costs are now anything from $2500-4500 for the year which pays for the coaching staff (many from traditional footballing countries), practice facilities and tournament fees. Training is now 3-4 nights a week plus weekend games/tournaments.

 

 

The point is........while American kids may not have a huge tradition of soccer to fall back on, the foundations are there for the US to develop a lot of good players, before handing them off to Colleges, MLS and maybe even overseas. 

 

What options exist for kids back in Britain.  Kick about with their mates, an hour of PE, and a lot of clogging the shite out of a ball in 11 a side games where effort and physical play overshadows technique and skill.

 

The challenge for the US is to keep their soccer players in the game rather than loose them to other sports. But the foundations are there for the US to create a lot of good players that may just need polishing off in other countries leagues.