Howaythelads

Some people can't tell the difference between facts and spin. Fact! On average, around seven clubs finish above us since Fat Fred took over. In some seasons it's as many as ten or 12. Fact! Your particular version of "lies, damn lies and statistics" also foolishly ignores that the situation has been steadily getting worse and worse for years. Fact! Another stupid post. I'm certain you can't read properly.

He's pulling £500,000 a year. I wonder what proportion that represents of our actual income from "international marketing"? Shirt sales, basically. Maybe a bit of web business. But that's surely it. Phew! When you mentioned pulling I thought you were back to your nob obsession. A little more maturity from you, please. That is mature, when compared against your classic nob rant.

What would Shepherd have done better than the old board? Better publicity? Appoint more trophy winning managers? Nice try at taking the heat off Shepherd, it doesn't make him any better than he actually is. Almost as nonsensical as the post you made a few pages ago.

That's as close as you'll get to admitting you were wrong, so cheers. Eh? It's my polite way of saying you're posting shite, buck up.

He's pulling £500,000 a year. I wonder what proportion that represents of our actual income from "international marketing"? Shirt sales, basically. Maybe a bit of web business. But that's surely it. Phew! When you mentioned pulling I thought you were back to your nob obsession.

Your second sentence makes no sense in English. Please clarify what you mean. Moving on to the second paragraph and the bit in bold. Why do you think it's impossible to go from solid finishes in the top 6 to consistent bottom half finishes? Good to know that once again you confirm your belief that the club MUST spend the money generated. That's your biggest mistake and comes from your odd reluctance to accept lessons from the past. A good Chairman and Board back their manager and then it's down to the manager to get it right regarding the playing staff. Souness got it wrong, which is why we are where we are and have gone backward. Here's where you come back with the copy and paste reply that Fred appointed Souness blah blah blah...... :roll:

It became that, when you decided to argue with factual information. However, the opportunity is still there to prove otherwise, so justifying your "opinion" I might as well be arguing with a creationist. You just sidestep arguments and bring up others that have no direct relevance to the core issue, play the 'facts' card and claim victory. Personally I think you regard yourself as a better fan for supporting the current shower in charge at NUFC against the masses of those that disagree with you; you're more faithful, longer-serving. Well done. Have NUFC declined, consistently, since the days of SJH/Keegan et al? Apart from a brief reawakening under Bobby Robson, yes, we have. More and more money spent on less and less return. Apparently no-one's truly responsible for our decline as we have no divine right to be better, and if you weren't around when football was played between Chinese villages with a pig's bladder on a stick than you don't know how good you have it now. "The masses" don't disagree. This forum is not representative of the match going supporter. You've just taken two words out of context and made an irrelevant point, surely? As no one person can say what 'the masses' may or may not think I don't claim to speak for them, it's disingenuous. While we're on the subject however: "The supporters have identified Glenn as the man they want. We have listened to them." Doesn't seem to bother him to claim to speak for us all now, does it? The irony will no doubt escape you. Look at the two bits in bold and the bit in italic then check who posted that tripe. Argh. There isn't any irony to be doing any escaping. "The masses of those that disagree". Does not equal "The masses" And I never said it did. 'Masses of those that disagree' is a subsection of 'the masses'. What do you want, a Venn diagram? Less waffle from you would do for starters.

It became that, when you decided to argue with factual information. However, the opportunity is still there to prove otherwise, so justifying your "opinion" I might as well be arguing with a creationist. You just sidestep arguments and bring up others that have no direct relevance to the core issue, play the 'facts' card and claim victory. Personally I think you regard yourself as a better fan for supporting the current shower in charge at NUFC against the masses of those that disagree with you; you're more faithful, longer-serving. Well done. Have NUFC declined, consistently, since the days of SJH/Keegan et al? Apart from a brief reawakening under Bobby Robson, yes, we have. More and more money spent on less and less return. Apparently no-one's truly responsible for our decline as we have no divine right to be better, and if you weren't around when football was played between Chinese villages with a pig's bladder on a stick than you don't know how good you have it now. "The masses" don't disagree. This forum is not representative of the match going supporter. You've just taken two words out of context and made an irrelevant point, surely? As no one person can say what 'the masses' may or may not think I don't claim to speak for them, it's disingenuous. While we're on the subject however: "The supporters have identified Glenn as the man they want. We have listened to them." Doesn't seem to bother him to claim to speak for us all now, does it? The irony will no doubt escape you. Look at the two bits in bold and the bit in italic then check who posted that tripe.

It became that, when you decided to argue with factual information. However, the opportunity is still there to prove otherwise, so justifying your "opinion" I might as well be arguing with a creationist. You just sidestep arguments and bring up others that have no direct relevance to the core issue, play the 'facts' card and claim victory. Personally I think you regard yourself as a better fan for supporting the current shower in charge at NUFC against the masses of those that disagree with you; you're more faithful, longer-serving. Well done. Have NUFC declined, consistently, since the days of SJH/Keegan et al? Apart from a brief reawakening under Bobby Robson, yes, we have. More and more money spent on less and less return. Apparently no-one's truly responsible for our decline as we have no divine right to be better, and if you weren't around when football was played between Chinese villages with a pig's bladder on a stick than you don't know how good you have it now. "The masses" don't disagree. This forum is not representative of the match going supporter. Are you sure about that? I don't know many fans that I talk to that go to the match that have that high an opinion of Shepherd. Everyone I know that goes to the match thinks the bloke is an incompetent. Ok, perhaps you're right and it is the masses then. Let's face facts here, to make progress the clubs needs revenue and needs to get people through the turnstiles, nowt wrong with that. Post-1992 we see regular crowds of over 50,000, yet for decades before that we often saw crowds of 15,000 to 20,000 hard-core supporters who went to matches through thick and thin. Perhaps it is only those people who understand what a shit Board really looks like? Gemmill, Do you think that someone who believes a successfull attempt to replace the current Board might result in the club ending up with an unambitious Board means they believe, "Fred is great", "everything is fantastic", "I'm happy with mediocrity?" If you do, I can assure you that it's not true. Nobody is saying those things. It's a good thing that expectations have been lifted by the current Board, but it's dangerous to allow those expectations to cause people to ignore the past. It seems there are a lot of people on here who believe the past to be irrelevant, they automatically treat with disdain those who mention the past. Well, the past of the club is very, very relevant and it always will be because that's where the lessons are. Nobody is saying the current Board is the most talented, and it may well be they have taken the club as far as they can, but they should be recognised for how far they have brought this club, and it should be acknowledged that replacing them with better will not be easy. We would all take a group of people replacing the current Board that are better than the current lot, a group of people who would show ambition, who would strive to take the club forward. Yes, we'd all take that, for sure. I imagine NE5 would take that more than most on here, if the truth be known. Let's face it, and the younger people won't want to accept this, but those of us who have witnessed the decades of true mediocrity are more desperate for success than those used to top 4 finishes, those used to top quality footballers wearing the black and white, players who fall short at the last hurdle by not performing to their true level in cup finals. Yes, the disappointment is huge, but let me tell you this, you don't become immune to these things, you don't become immune to the frustration and the disappointment, it just gets worse as the years go on and you become more desperate for success. However, I can also tell you that it is better when the club is trying to be successful than when it is happy with bottom half finishes. That is a Board settling for mediocrity whether they are competent or not. By ignoring the past people have the mistaken idea the club has always been ambitious, that it has always tried to win things, that is has always spent the money that comes into the club on top players to play in the black and white because they have to spend it. Have to spend it!! No, they don't. The reality is they don't have to do any of these things, they do it by choice. Those of us who have really witnessed the club under previous Boards know it is not that simple to improve on the current one. I believe it is far, far easier for the current Board to be replaced by people who would not show ambition and who would take the club back to the days I don't want to see again. Believe me, nobody would want to see those days again. For those of us who really have seen those times of a poor Board, it's a very scary thought.

It became that, when you decided to argue with factual information. However, the opportunity is still there to prove otherwise, so justifying your "opinion" I might as well be arguing with a creationist. You just sidestep arguments and bring up others that have no direct relevance to the core issue, play the 'facts' card and claim victory. Personally I think you regard yourself as a better fan for supporting the current shower in charge at NUFC against the masses of those that disagree with you; you're more faithful, longer-serving. Well done. Have NUFC declined, consistently, since the days of SJH/Keegan et al? Apart from a brief reawakening under Bobby Robson, yes, we have. More and more money spent on less and less return. Apparently no-one's truly responsible for our decline as we have no divine right to be better, and if you weren't around when football was played between Chinese villages with a pig's bladder on a stick than you don't know how good you have it now. "The masses" don't disagree. This forum is not representative of the match going supporter.

Unless it's a load of bollocks. It may be a load of bollocks to you, but it's no reason to slate it. Debate. It takes maturity. There isn't much of that displayed around here, I'm afraid.

This thread is full of so much ignorance it's barely believable. Yes, I agree that you appear unable to understand. Anything. The message over the months about FS isn't that he's great, it's that you and your ilk should be careful what you wish for. The Board isn't as bad as you believe and could easily be replaced by a really shit Board.

Still waiting for you to tell me the criteria upon which a prospective manager should be judged.......

If the right players weren't available and we bought no-one defensively, does that mean that Sibierski was the right player for midfield? Because i doubt that very much. Lets stop making excuses for him, Roeder biffed it up. Exactly. No matter how you look at the defender/striker cock-up, the Sibierski signing was so obviously a last minute "anyone going spare?" conversation that Shepherd and Roeder have had with Willy McKay. As far as I'm aware we have wasted a fee on him, and we will be wasting several hundred thousand pound paying his wages over the course of the year. Why add so unnecessarily to the wage bill? One reason: just to get SOMEBODY through the door. That's the sort of incompetence we are dealing with here. There is no football sense in this decision. He was just cheap and it's someone to point at and say "look, we signed HIM." Pathetic. if McKay is indeed Sibierski's agent then i can't imagine that the situation was anything but that. it shows how backward our entire approach to transfers is. the backwardness stems from Roeder's naivety & lack of knowledge as well as Shepherd's predilection for cronyism. Other clubs, Pompey and Wigan for instance, picked up free transfer and loan targets on the last day that are vastly superior to Sibierski - Todorov (who has been in good form), Andy Cole and Douala. I can't see Shepherd's approach ever changing, but Roeder has to learn from this. don't put all your eggs in one basket cos that leaves you desperate when your initial targets don't work out. try to get your signings done in good time. and have a back-up plan! Don't think I've read such speculative rubbish since your last post. You just make stuff up as you go along. Ignorant, tbh.

Time will tell. The juveniles were appeased by the club spending more money last summer than this summer, but it didn't work then, did it? Although some still claim that transfer dealings such as signing Luque were good. bluebiggrin.gif

Easy question for you, since it's so easy to get it right and so hard to get it wrong... Tell me the criteria you would use for making a managerial appointment at a football club? How do you explain the same Arsenal Board appointing a sucession of crap managers before they finally got it right with Wenger? How do you explain Souness being appointed by the same Liverpool Board? How do you explain manure going years without winning the league ( which was their aim ) and appointing a succession of shite managers before they got it right and appointed Ferguson? How do you explain Chelsea selling Gallas behind the back of their manager? How do you explain Chelsea not being able to appoint a championship winning manager until they were swamped with Abramovich cash? It's ironic that the manager who did the best for us in recent times is one you wouldn't have appointed anyway. HTL I expected better from you. You have done you're usual trick of not responding to the actual comments but asking a load of questions that are totaly irrelevant. We are talking about the period Shepherd has been in charge. During that period Arsenal, Liverpool, Man U (Ferguson was already there I know) and Chelsea have all had top quality Manages that were appointed by The Chairman and Board and have proved successful. During the same period Shepherd's record is as I stated above. So how do you explain that other than to agree that the appointments apart from Robson (for a period) were totallu unsuccessful. You can defend Shepherd until the cows come home but the buck stops there, you cant deny the facts, although knowing you, you probably will. By the way I'm not getting into a longwinded mindless debate, no doubt with patronising comments, which I know you like. I've stated my opinion based on fact, if you wish to not see it, fine by me. On the contrary, I think I addressed your points. It would be good if you can somehow justify your position.

Is NE5 happy that we've signed a shit player, because teams can't stay at the top forever and this move will help us fall To be fair, you have said that you hate it when we sign top players.

Easy question for you, since it's so easy to get it right and so hard to get it wrong... Tell me the criteria you would use for making a managerial appointment at a football club? How do you explain the same Arsenal Board appointing a sucession of crap managers before they finally got it right with Wenger? How do you explain Souness being appointed by the same Liverpool Board? How do you explain manure going years without winning the league ( which was their aim ) and appointing a succession of shite managers before they got it right and appointed Ferguson? How do you explain Chelsea selling Gallas behind the back of their manager? How do you explain Chelsea not being able to appoint a championship winning manager until they were swamped with Abramovich cash? It's ironic that the manager who did the best for us in recent times is one you wouldn't have appointed anyway.

Tosh, tbh. There can be all kinds of reasons why a player doesn't join the club. All kinds.

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It's been looking bad from the start. You were told. :winking:

Nobody forces you to look at the thread, so it's pretty idiotic that you continue to do so.

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Rubbish.