midds

Man U getting passed to death here like. Not looking too good for them atm. Fuck me that was close.

Great start by Man U but they can't keep this up. Bodes well for the goal if they can get an early one and put Barca under even more pressure.

2 wishes: 1. It's a good game. 2. Owen doesn't get a fucking kick.

Sounds like a goer I must admit. Fits with Pardew's comments with the international midfielder playing in Europe etc. Obviously a good player, modest fee, good age, sell-on potential... it ticks most of the boxes. Get him in.

The club's not falling apart but if they all decide to leave then it's a hell of a mess to sort out. Massive couple of months for us coming up.

Agree 100%. I think his mind's made up and he's off. I also think that us challenging for CL is a good few years off yet but he hasn't got the time to spare in his career. He wants it NOW and we can't provide what he wants and that's not the club's fault at all. All we can do is throw more cash at him. It's just unfortunate but that's the way it goes.

I think they'll offer him a decent contract and it will not be enough because I don't think money is a driving force for him. He's earning more than enough and he has ambition and we have nothing to offer on that front. He wants to play CL and for his country and probably realises that if he signs on again for 4 or 5 more years he'll be about 28 or 29 before his next contract rolls around. It's now or never for him to go as he probably feels he's not going to achieve his ambitions with us if he signs on. I respect his decision but hope he does things the right way and is honest about why he's going.

The Sunderland shirt would have been nice if they'd moved the white bit on the chest down a bit making it a solid band 3 or 4 inches lower. Bit like Sampdoria's kit. Leaving the sleeves all blue. Looks a bit wonky with the white bit continuing over the sleeve.

I know it's negative and cynical but I think the club will offer him a fabulous contract...... safe in the knowledge he's got no intention of signing it regardless. I think he wants to be away and playing in European competitions and for Spain are worth more than staying here and picking up about £10k a week more than he is now. If he doesn't want to be here then the club has to make moves to convince him to stay or get as much as they can for him. Can't see it being the former unfortunately but obviously I hope I'm wrong. I'd like him to stay as he's a fantastic LB.

Meaning what exactly? http://fc08.deviantart.net/images3/i/2004/134/7/7/Rough_Infinity_Snake.jpg We're back worrying about Barton's future and about to start going in circles... I got that, just wondering if it was something specific I said. We'll see how it pans out.

Meaning what exactly?

Depends what you mean by 'end well'. We're all within our rights to make certain comments about our employers, and he's always been a bit Cantona-esque in having/wanting a life beyond his 10-15 year career, so just avoiding hassle probably isn't going to be his main aim. He's said before he expects to live round here for the rest of his life after he's finished playing, so presumably/hopefully he's got that in mind as he makes his decisions now. I don't want him to wreck himself, but how many times have many people wanted comments from/criticised certain individuals like Keegan for not avoiding non-disclosure agreements and giving us more of a clue about just what the hell's been going on. I'd much prefer things like this to stay behind closed doors. I know it's McKay who's made it public, and he's got every right to, but making twitter accounts in the middle of things isn't helping things. I don't think it reflects particularly well on Barton or the club by making private contract talks public. Dirty washing indoors and all that. I sort of operate in a different world - don't want every bad feeling publicised for the sake of it, but in general I think things should be able to stand up in daylight and if they don't then it's more important that they're shown up. Thinking of it from Barton (or any player's) perspective, it'd be one thing if it was all gonna be quiet, but every previous experience with Ashley/Llambias says they're gonna air as much of his dirty laundry as they can as slyly as they can, and if it isn't dirty enough, they'll throw mud on it to make sure. If I was him I'd make my own plans with that in mind. But how are we ever to find out who's telling the truth when they, inevitably, give their own different versions of events. Nothing can be proved and it only damages the club itself. Not got a problem with finding out the truth at a much later date but I think it's best if it's all done in private until it's sorted one way or the other. Hopefully people listening will be bright enough to pick their way through the versions, but more importantly it's easier to hold people to things if they've made a statement - leaves a lot less room for them to be pulling tricks behind closed doors. Regarding privacy, it often (in or out of football) just seems to see the shits get away with it and make hay while the sun shines - especially when they're smart enough to know they don't have to play by the rules if everyone else does. Agree totally about the privacy issue and arseholes getting away with it. Still think these sorts of things are better off kept private regardless of the individuals involved. Hammer the contract out in private or make a clean break of things. Telling tales to the press and/or creating twitter accounts to spill the beans on the details of contract talks isn't my bag tbh. I hope they sort it out but the longer it goes the more untenable Barton's situation becomes. You can't possibly keep a player who's in open conflict publically with his employer. It just won't work. Have to say, 'if' this twitter/statements story does develop further, I'm assuming it's going to be bigger than just a squabble about contract lengths, and one way or another will touch upon the way the club's being run. I might end up disagreeing with it myself if it somehow proves to be just a "we'll give you £30k/I want £40k" story. If it was an ideal world I could see sense in a clean break, but as I say, half the point is I don't believe Ashley/Llambias would let it be. I... have difficulty looking at how this one goes with a view to whether Barton's position here is tenable because I've been waiting for this to happen for the past year, certainly since Hughton was finally sacked. His position here isn't tenable, it wasn't last month, and I probably expected him to go before Carroll, if anything. Goes back to the point I made earlier about the squabbling thing over the details - we'll never know who's telling the truth because we're not privvy to those negotiations. To be honest I'm not interested in how much brass he's after and/or how much they're offering; they either sort a contract or they don't. I do think if Barton goes public and criticises the hierarchy of the club then his career will suffer as a result. Not just in his remaining year here but I'm sure a fair few chairmen will look at what's happened and think twice about sanctioning a transfer to bring him into their club. He's already got a load of baggage without this shit to contend with. He needs to be very careful about how he plays this situation out.

Are the Level 7 refugees really that surprised as to what's actually happened? Thought Baggio got it spot on earlier today. Misplaced trust in the people who run the club + assumption + convenient timing = meltdown.

Bingo. Needs obliterating from the face of the earth.

Simple & clean = nice shirt.

Depends what you mean by 'end well'. We're all within our rights to make certain comments about our employers, and he's always been a bit Cantona-esque in having/wanting a life beyond his 10-15 year career, so just avoiding hassle probably isn't going to be his main aim. He's said before he expects to live round here for the rest of his life after he's finished playing, so presumably/hopefully he's got that in mind as he makes his decisions now. I don't want him to wreck himself, but how many times have many people wanted comments from/criticised certain individuals like Keegan for not avoiding non-disclosure agreements and giving us more of a clue about just what the hell's been going on. I'd much prefer things like this to stay behind closed doors. I know it's McKay who's made it public, and he's got every right to, but making twitter accounts in the middle of things isn't helping things. I don't think it reflects particularly well on Barton or the club by making private contract talks public. Dirty washing indoors and all that. I sort of operate in a different world - don't want every bad feeling publicised for the sake of it, but in general I think things should be able to stand up in daylight and if they don't then it's more important that they're shown up. Thinking of it from Barton (or any player's) perspective, it'd be one thing if it was all gonna be quiet, but every previous experience with Ashley/Llambias says they're gonna air as much of his dirty laundry as they can as slyly as they can, and if it isn't dirty enough, they'll throw mud on it to make sure. If I was him I'd make my own plans with that in mind. But how are we ever to find out who's telling the truth when they, inevitably, give their own different versions of events. Nothing can be proved and it only damages the club itself. Not got a problem with finding out the truth at a much later date but I think it's best if it's all done in private until it's sorted one way or the other. Hopefully people listening will be bright enough to pick their way through the versions, but more importantly it's easier to hold people to things if they've made a statement - leaves a lot less room for them to be pulling tricks behind closed doors. Regarding privacy, it often (in or out of football) just seems to see the shits get away with it and make hay while the sun shines - especially when they're smart enough to know they don't have to play by the rules if everyone else does. Agree totally about the privacy issue and arseholes getting away with it. Still think these sorts of things are better off kept private regardless of the individuals involved. Hammer the contract out in private or make a clean break of things. Telling tales to the press and/or creating twitter accounts to spill the beans on the details of contract talks isn't my bag tbh. I hope they sort it out but the longer it goes the more untenable Barton's situation becomes. You can't possibly keep a player who's in open conflict publically with his employer. It just won't work.

Depends what you mean by 'end well'. We're all within our rights to make certain comments about our employers, and he's always been a bit Cantona-esque in having/wanting a life beyond his 10-15 year career, so just avoiding hassle probably isn't going to be his main aim. He's said before he expects to live round here for the rest of his life after he's finished playing, so presumably/hopefully he's got that in mind as he makes his decisions now. I don't want him to wreck himself, but how many times have many people wanted comments from/criticised certain individuals like Keegan for not avoiding non-disclosure agreements and giving us more of a clue about just what the hell's been going on. I'd much prefer things like this to stay behind closed doors. I know it's McKay who's made it public, and he's got every right to, but making twitter accounts in the middle of things isn't helping things. I don't think it reflects particularly well on Barton or the club by making private contract talks public. Dirty washing indoors and all that. I sort of operate in a different world - don't want every bad feeling publicised for the sake of it, but in general I think things should be able to stand up in daylight and if they don't then it's more important that they're shown up. Thinking of it from Barton (or any player's) perspective, it'd be one thing if it was all gonna be quiet, but every previous experience with Ashley/Llambias says they're gonna air as much of his dirty laundry as they can as slyly as they can, and if it isn't dirty enough, they'll throw mud on it to make sure. If I was him I'd make my own plans with that in mind. But how are we ever to find out who's telling the truth when they, inevitably, give their own different versions of events. Nothing can be proved and it only damages the club itself. Not got a problem with finding out the truth at a much later date but I think it's best if it's all done in private until it's sorted one way or the other.

Depends what you mean by 'end well'. We're all within our rights to make certain comments about our employers, and he's always been a bit Cantona-esque in having/wanting a life beyond his 10-15 year career, so just avoiding hassle probably isn't going to be his main aim. He's said before he expects to live round here for the rest of his life after he's finished playing, so presumably/hopefully he's got that in mind as he makes his decisions now. I don't want him to wreck himself, but how many times have many people wanted comments from/criticised certain individuals like Keegan for not avoiding non-disclosure agreements and giving us more of a clue about just what the hell's been going on. I'd much prefer things like this to stay behind closed doors. I know it's McKay who's made it public, and he's got every right to, but making twitter accounts in the middle of things isn't helping things. I don't think it reflects particularly well on Barton or the club by making private contract talks public. Dirty washing indoors and all that.

Ultimately, he's an employee of the club and if he's going to slag his bosses/paymasters off in public then it's not going to end well for the bloke. It'll all be used against him and I'm not sure how he's impressing any interested clubs by doing it either. He seems a bit headstrong and certainly isn't afraid to say what he thinks but sometimes it's better to shut the fuck up.

This is going to get really messy really quickly. Fucking twitter accounts man.

Hopefully if any club would go for Enrique it should be City, even if that would suck as well. Would at least get us the most amount of money which is the important part here. Aye we took them to the cleaners when Given went there didn't we?

Me too. We lost that much just on Pardew's daft substitutions against WBA. I'd far rather he played another season and left for Spain or Italy. What if he's playing poorly because he doesn't really want to be here? Very hypothetical obviously. I think Enrique will have too many options abroad at the end of his contract to bother playing badly so he can get a move to a shit-hole like Liverpool. Not so sure. Guess we'll have to see. Still think the Ashley factor might come into play somewhere down the line when in gets down to brass tacks. We already know that if a good deal is on the table on deadline day then he'll do it. We'll see.

Me too. We lost that much just on Pardew's daft substitutions against WBA. I'd far rather he played another season and left for Spain or Italy. What if he's playing poorly because he doesn't really want to be here? Very hypothetical obviously. Would decrease his chances of a move to a top club, even on a free, if he had a poor season next year. He'll be playing for his potential suitors rather than us, but I don't see him playing badly as a cause of staying one more year. Was coming at it from Ashley's point of view tbh. The absolute worst outcome for him(/us?) is him walking away for nothing in 12 months. If he's playing poorly because he'd had his head turned and wants away then I think Ashley would let him go for less than he'd want imo. You're right in what you say though, poor performances won't do him any good.

Me too. We lost that much just on Pardew's daft substitutions against WBA. I'd far rather he played another season and left for Spain or Italy. What if he's playing poorly because he doesn't really want to be here? Very hypothetical obviously.

That's the whole idea.