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What the fuck has happened in the last 25 pages? :lol:

I'll admit I'm not too well informed on Everton's situation. Just so used to it being bad for years, I know you have money at times, and can and have spent, but overall the picture always seems to be struggling for stability, with the stadium issue also always hanging over you - but overachieving within that and frequently threatening the higher echelons. In essence, I see the money and success you have had as mainly resulting from Moyes and his making you a very efficient machine. Re: Villa, they've just sold their best player for stupid money. As for Young and their general approach to finances in the medium to long term future, I'm under the impression it may liberalise as a result of today's events. That there's Martin o'Neill's finances and there are the real finances - the stuff you don't especially want to resort to unless you have to or because there are big opportunities. Furthermore, a new manager will have a less stupid approach to signings, making things more amenable. Slovenian Emile Heskeys don't require £60k a week. The fact is both you and Villa need to move up at least a gear if you're gonna have a chance of moving beyond where you are. So far as I'm aware, and I've not got anything against you telling me why I'm wrong about you lot, only Aston Villa are likely to. They're the ones with expensive deadwood to shift, they're the ones with room to press down further on the accelerator.

Other differences are the standard of football, a couple of cups and Champion's League qualification, all of which always helps with the turnover...

Couldnt disagree more. Why's that? Because I wouldnt be happy if our chairman was talking about deals that havent been concluded yet. I much prefer the way it's now. The Board's approach to privacy over transfer negotiations is virtually the only thing it's got right in it's time. Essentially no complaints from me, would rather be satisfied by eventual success than have it scuppered by some nice headlines that are pleasing for a day or two.

I was going to ask if you were joking, but I've just had to remind myself how far we've fallen since I was pointing out o'Neill's was totally unproven as a top quality manager. I do think he's someone who can consistently achieve that top ten/UEFA hole with virtually any club, and that combined with his particular style as a manager mean it might not actually be a bad move for us just now. Still don't like him and don't much want him, though - would be happier to press on with Hughton. Same! Been waiting for something to laugh at Villa about since the horrible c***s acted like small time c***s about us going down. Hopefully they flog all of their best players and plummet. Don't count your chickens - unless Lerner's lost interest, which he hasn't really so far as I'm aware, I'd be over the moon if I were them and this could be the best thing to happen to them since o'Neill was appointed. The timing's pretty horrible of course... but nevertheless. Why the f*** would you be over the moon ? Are you insane ? The bloke totally transformed a strugglling prem club into one of the top clubs 8 clubs in the country, there's nothing better out there available for Villa right now. Randy Lerner transformed them. Any manager in the league could take a team that changes from one of the lowest budgets in the league to one of the highest in Europe from the bottom half to the top. He's still finished no higher than every Villa manager I can remember and looked clueless has to how to take them further. What is this nonsense about Liverpool ffs His tactics and transfer policy (What is it, 3 foreign signings ever?) belong in the bottom half. He barely bought anyone as he was brought in just before or after the window had closed, took over a team that had finished just above the relegation spots and suddenly they were top half of the table. He's worked wonders with the likes of Agbolohar (sp?), Milner and Barry. Lerner had a part to play in all that of course, but it's his manager that's transformed thm. As a side note, Lerner's Cleveland Browns have been one of the worst franchises in the NFL for as long as Lerner has been in charge, he's not thought of in great light on this side of the pond. Lerner is the man who has done most to transform the club, far far more than MON has. Anyone who thinks otherwise is talking nonsense, I'm afraid. Or appreciates the influence on the team on the pitch better. Look at us, we were backed to the hilt and probably beyond our means by Freddy, put a crappy manager in there like Souness and your strggling at the wrong end of the table. Have fun without O'Neill, you'll miss him more than you think, if Lerner doesn't get the appointment right, and trust me he doesn't always hit a home run with his appointments at other organisations. Look, who appointed o'Neill? And why did he do it? Because Lerner thought he was the best guy to approach at the time, and it wasn't too bad a move. I'd say his biggest mistake - especially if the money really has dried up, which I'm under the impression it hasn't - was showing too much loyalty when he first got disturbed by o'Neill's inadequacies, especially in spending the huge pots of money Lerner was apparently positively asking him to spend. Appointing managers isn't easy, but Lerner's short track record suggest he'll go about it in the right way, and even more to the point, everything else he'll do will be totally conducive to the success of that appointee. Our failure, along with that of other clubs/chairmen, is not so much found in picking the wrong CV from the application pile as from asking any new/prospective manager to work in f***ing nightmarish conditions. Moyes should go for it if he gets offered the chance, that's someone who deserves a chance at the big time and I think it could be a nice match. I don't know enough about the manager market and Aston Villa's position just now, so I don't know if they could make an obviously better appointment. Moyes has got better things going on at Everton, Villa would be a sideways step in my book (apart from having some money to spend, not alot). I'd disagree, with money being the single biggest factor. Like I say, I'm unclear about Villa's financial position just now, but I'm pretty confident they've still got a lot more around than Everton and even more flexibility. Also, as I was sort of saying about, the general atmosphere that Lerner has created seems to be great - intelligent management and ambition. Unless things will change at Everton any time soon, I think Moyes has taken them as far as anyone could, given the rest of the league (Man City, Spurs, Villa all spending big alongside the usual). I think he's shown he can spend big money, little money, can be tactically flexible, get the best out of players and generally keep all this going in very difficult circumstances for many many years. If Everton hadn't been in a mess overall, I think he would have had them in the Champions' League at least twice, and obviously quite probably far more afterwards as once you're in it's hard to get you out. Only bad fortune saw them drawn against a good Spanish team which was able to beat his unimproved team of over-achievers in the qualifiers after they finished 4th a few years back. LOL Lerner did not appoint O'Neill, it was the guy before him Ellis. Oh and Moyes, the big time You're kidding right ? Everton are just as big if not bigger than Villa, why would he move from the place where he's built up that is short on cash, to another that he hasn't built up, that are also short on cash. I don't think it's true about the cash, I also think what money they have is more fluid, will be more forthcoming and more positively applied. Do you honestly think Lerner had any clue who the hell Martin O'Neill was ? Ellis made the appointment. End of story. Lerner can take credit but he didn't make the appointment nor would know anything about him. Lerner knew and knows nothing about "soccer" trust me, he got rid of the hated Ellis and put up some money for transfers, he's also stayed out of the limelight, that's all gone down well, but his manager and the previous regime have made his job easy. Now's his test, he's got to get this appointment right, I hope he fucks it up But whatever he needs to get some advice from some experts because he can't make that decision himself. Everton have just as much chance of becoming more fluid than Villa, the signs are clearly there that the money at Villa has dried up. Which is why he appointed o'Neill, he took advice. Because his track record was as impressive as Souness', most of the footballing community thought o'Neill was the new Ferguson/Clough/Platini, so Lerner let the winds take him. He did this because he was self-aware enough to not presume he knew better. It was probably the wrong decision in my view, as I seem to remember there were better options available at the time (I forget who - maybe Jol?), but I appreciate the reasoning behind it. He was going for what he was told was the best. Like I say, Lerner (and his people, I keep referring to them because it isn't just a one-man team running things and you're right that Lerner didn't know much about football when he turned up) effectively used Ellis as a puppet during that period. It was a tricky period as all parties, o'Neill, Ellis and to a lesser extent the Americans, had to cover their backs in case the protracted deal didn't go through, while at the same time wanting to make the best decisions they could. Among other things, o'Neill didn't want to sign for stingy Ellis, Ellis was afraid of being left with a frantic bloke who he could never work with if the deal broke down, and the Americans wanted to make sure Ellis didn't appoint someone they didn't want and spoil their investment. I'll let brummie comment on the idea Ellis' time made Lerner's subsequent job easy. It's not a straight-forward story, admittedly, but not too many people look back on Aston Villa's pre-Lerner structure fondly. Re: finances, from what information I have, that just isn't the case. Only time will prove to us one way or another, neither of us are in a position to know for certain. Whatever is the case will obviously shape our other views.

I was going to ask if you were joking, but I've just had to remind myself how far we've fallen since I was pointing out o'Neill's was totally unproven as a top quality manager. I do think he's someone who can consistently achieve that top ten/UEFA hole with virtually any club, and that combined with his particular style as a manager mean it might not actually be a bad move for us just now. Still don't like him and don't much want him, though - would be happier to press on with Hughton. Same! Been waiting for something to laugh at Villa about since the horrible c***s acted like small time c***s about us going down. Hopefully they flog all of their best players and plummet. Don't count your chickens - unless Lerner's lost interest, which he hasn't really so far as I'm aware, I'd be over the moon if I were them and this could be the best thing to happen to them since o'Neill was appointed. The timing's pretty horrible of course... but nevertheless. Why the f*** would you be over the moon ? Are you insane ? The bloke totally transformed a strugglling prem club into one of the top clubs 8 clubs in the country, there's nothing better out there available for Villa right now. Randy Lerner transformed them. Any manager in the league could take a team that changes from one of the lowest budgets in the league to one of the highest in Europe from the bottom half to the top. He's still finished no higher than every Villa manager I can remember and looked clueless has to how to take them further. What is this nonsense about Liverpool ffs His tactics and transfer policy (What is it, 3 foreign signings ever?) belong in the bottom half. He barely bought anyone as he was brought in just before or after the window had closed, took over a team that had finished just above the relegation spots and suddenly they were top half of the table. He's worked wonders with the likes of Agbolohar (sp?), Milner and Barry. Lerner had a part to play in all that of course, but it's his manager that's transformed thm. As a side note, Lerner's Cleveland Browns have been one of the worst franchises in the NFL for as long as Lerner has been in charge, he's not thought of in great light on this side of the pond. Lerner is the man who has done most to transform the club, far far more than MON has. Anyone who thinks otherwise is talking nonsense, I'm afraid. Or appreciates the influence on the team on the pitch better. Look at us, we were backed to the hilt and probably beyond our means by Freddy, put a crappy manager in there like Souness and your strggling at the wrong end of the table. Have fun without O'Neill, you'll miss him more than you think, if Lerner doesn't get the appointment right, and trust me he doesn't always hit a home run with his appointments at other organisations. Look, who appointed o'Neill? And why did he do it? Because Lerner thought he was the best guy to approach at the time, and it wasn't too bad a move. I'd say his biggest mistake - especially if the money really has dried up, which I'm under the impression it hasn't - was showing too much loyalty when he first got disturbed by o'Neill's inadequacies, especially in spending the huge pots of money Lerner was apparently positively asking him to spend. Appointing managers isn't easy, but Lerner's short track record suggest he'll go about it in the right way, and even more to the point, everything else he'll do will be totally conducive to the success of that appointee. Our failure, along with that of other clubs/chairmen, is not so much found in picking the wrong CV from the application pile as from asking any new/prospective manager to work in f***ing nightmarish conditions. Moyes should go for it if he gets offered the chance, that's someone who deserves a chance at the big time and I think it could be a nice match. I don't know enough about the manager market and Aston Villa's position just now, so I don't know if they could make an obviously better appointment. Moyes has got better things going on at Everton, Villa would be a sideways step in my book (apart from having some money to spend, not alot). I'd disagree, with money being the single biggest factor. Like I say, I'm unclear about Villa's financial position just now, but I'm pretty confident they've still got a lot more around than Everton and even more flexibility. Also, as I was sort of saying about, the general atmosphere that Lerner has created seems to be great - intelligent management and ambition. Unless things will change at Everton any time soon, I think Moyes has taken them as far as anyone could, given the rest of the league (Man City, Spurs, Villa all spending big alongside the usual). I think he's shown he can spend big money, little money, can be tactically flexible, get the best out of players and generally keep all this going in very difficult circumstances for many many years. If Everton hadn't been in a mess overall, I think he would have had them in the Champions' League at least twice, and obviously quite probably far more afterwards as once you're in it's hard to get you out. Only bad fortune saw them drawn against a good Spanish team which was able to beat his unimproved team of over-achievers in the qualifiers after they finished 4th a few years back. LOL Lerner did not appoint O'Neill, it was the guy before him Ellis. Oh and Moyes, the big time You're kidding right ? Everton are just as big if not bigger than Villa, why would he move from the place where he's built up that is short on cash, to another that he hasn't built up, that are also short on cash. I don't think it's true about the cash, I also think what money they have is more fluid, will be more forthcoming and more positively applied.

'Chance at the big time', I think he'd have a chance at the big time with Aston Villa, and that he has no chance with Everton. I also don't think there's a more established English team that will appoint him any time soon... though maybe Man United or Arsenal want to prove me wrong on that. Redknapp's ensconced at Spurs, Chelsea want superstar managers, Man City are mental and Liverpool are also from Liverpool. His only other option would be to go abroad, which is something Brits rarely do... although I do seem to remember something from a year or two back about him learning Spanish or something. I think Villa might well have missed their moment because of developments at Man City and Spurs - a better manager a couple of years ago and things could have been very different, I feel. When Man City break into the top four (which is inevitable), Spurs, Liverpool, Villa and Everton will all belong to the same bracket and the only chance of them joining the "big four" will be if they spend the money Man City have. Spurs have been fortunate this year that Liverpool were shite but they won't remain their long IMO (unless Arsenal slip, which i doubt). I don't entirely agree. Someone's always weak, there's always a chance. It could be Wenger's eventual departure from Arsenal, same goes for Ferguson if the debt-chickens come home to roost at the same time. It could be Man City just continuing to show no sense and getting far less bang for their buck than they ought to. It's hard to imagine them being a properly established member of any cartel at the moment. Aston Villa are literally ten times more likely to take advantage of that than Everton, in my view.

'Chance at the big time', I think he'd have a chance at the big time with Aston Villa, and that he has no chance with Everton. In pure prestige terms, I'd agree Villa would be a sideways step at best - probably slightly backwards in my view, even. But it doesn't have to stay that way forever and I know which club is more likely to add to its reputation in the vaguely near future. I also don't think there's a more established English team that will appoint him any time soon... though maybe Man United or Arsenal want to prove me wrong on that. Redknapp's ensconced at Spurs, Chelsea want superstar managers, Man City are mental and Liverpool are also from Liverpool. His only other option would be to go abroad, which is something Brits rarely do... although I do seem to remember something from a year or two back about him learning Spanish or something. I think Villa might well have missed their moment because of developments at Man City and Spurs - a better manager a couple of years ago and things could have been very different, I feel.

I was going to ask if you were joking, but I've just had to remind myself how far we've fallen since I was pointing out o'Neill's was totally unproven as a top quality manager. I do think he's someone who can consistently achieve that top ten/UEFA hole with virtually any club, and that combined with his particular style as a manager mean it might not actually be a bad move for us just now. Still don't like him and don't much want him, though - would be happier to press on with Hughton. Same! Been waiting for something to laugh at Villa about since the horrible c***s acted like small time c***s about us going down. Hopefully they flog all of their best players and plummet. Don't count your chickens - unless Lerner's lost interest, which he hasn't really so far as I'm aware, I'd be over the moon if I were them and this could be the best thing to happen to them since o'Neill was appointed. The timing's pretty horrible of course... but nevertheless. Why the f*** would you be over the moon ? Are you insane ? The bloke totally transformed a strugglling prem club into one of the top clubs 8 clubs in the country, there's nothing better out there available for Villa right now. Randy Lerner transformed them. Any manager in the league could take a team that changes from one of the lowest budgets in the league to one of the highest in Europe from the bottom half to the top. He's still finished no higher than every Villa manager I can remember and looked clueless has to how to take them further. What is this nonsense about Liverpool ffs His tactics and transfer policy (What is it, 3 foreign signings ever?) belong in the bottom half. He barely bought anyone as he was brought in just before or after the window had closed, took over a team that had finished just above the relegation spots and suddenly they were top half of the table. He's worked wonders with the likes of Agbolohar (sp?), Milner and Barry. Lerner had a part to play in all that of course, but it's his manager that's transformed thm. As a side note, Lerner's Cleveland Browns have been one of the worst franchises in the NFL for as long as Lerner has been in charge, he's not thought of in great light on this side of the pond. Lerner is the man who has done most to transform the club, far far more than MON has. Anyone who thinks otherwise is talking nonsense, I'm afraid. Or appreciates the influence on the team on the pitch better. Look at us, we were backed to the hilt and probably beyond our means by Freddy, put a crappy manager in there like Souness and your strggling at the wrong end of the table. Have fun without O'Neill, you'll miss him more than you think, if Lerner doesn't get the appointment right, and trust me he doesn't always hit a home run with his appointments at other organisations. Look, who appointed o'Neill? And why did he do it? Because Lerner thought he was the best guy to approach at the time, and it wasn't too bad a move. I'd say his biggest mistake - especially if the money really has dried up, which I'm under the impression it hasn't - was showing too much loyalty when he first got disturbed by o'Neill's inadequacies, especially in spending the huge pots of money Lerner was apparently positively asking him to spend. Appointing managers isn't easy, but Lerner's short track record suggest he'll go about it in the right way, and even more to the point, everything else he'll do will be totally conducive to the success of that appointee. Our failure, along with that of other clubs/chairmen, is not so much found in picking the wrong CV from the application pile as from asking any new/prospective manager to work in f***ing nightmarish conditions. Moyes should go for it if he gets offered the chance, that's someone who deserves a chance at the big time and I think it could be a nice match. I don't know enough about the manager market and Aston Villa's position just now, so I don't know if they could make an obviously better appointment. Moyes has got better things going on at Everton, Villa would be a sideways step in my book (apart from having some money to spend, not alot). I'd disagree, with money being the single biggest factor. Like I say, I'm unclear about Villa's financial position just now, but I'm pretty confident they've still got a lot more around than Everton and even more flexibility. Also, as I was sort of saying about, the general atmosphere that Lerner has created seems to be great - intelligent management and ambition. Unless things will change at Everton any time soon, I think Moyes has taken them as far as anyone could, given the rest of the league (Man City, Spurs, Villa all spending big alongside the usual). I think he's shown he can spend big money, little money, can be tactically flexible, get the best out of players and generally keep all this going in very difficult circumstances for many many years. If Everton hadn't been in a mess overall, I think he would have had them in the Champions' League at least twice, and obviously quite probably far more afterwards as once you're in it's hard to get you out. Only bad fortune saw them drawn against a good Spanish team which was able to beat his unimproved team of over-achievers in the qualifiers after they finished 4th a few years back.

Wasn't he at Villa before the club was taken over? It was all pre-takeover negotiations. o'Neill joined on the condition that Lerner was coming, and Lerner told Ellis who to appoint.

I was going to ask if you were joking, but I've just had to remind myself how far we've fallen since I was pointing out o'Neill's was totally unproven as a top quality manager. I do think he's someone who can consistently achieve that top ten/UEFA hole with virtually any club, and that combined with his particular style as a manager mean it might not actually be a bad move for us just now. Still don't like him and don't much want him, though - would be happier to press on with Hughton. Same! Been waiting for something to laugh at Villa about since the horrible c***s acted like small time c***s about us going down. Hopefully they flog all of their best players and plummet. Don't count your chickens - unless Lerner's lost interest, which he hasn't really so far as I'm aware, I'd be over the moon if I were them and this could be the best thing to happen to them since o'Neill was appointed. The timing's pretty horrible of course... but nevertheless. Why the f*** would you be over the moon ? Are you insane ? The bloke totally transformed a strugglling prem club into one of the top clubs 8 clubs in the country, there's nothing better out there available for Villa right now. Randy Lerner transformed them. Any manager in the league could take a team that changes from one of the lowest budgets in the league to one of the highest in Europe from the bottom half to the top. He's still finished no higher than every Villa manager I can remember and looked clueless has to how to take them further. What is this nonsense about Liverpool ffs His tactics and transfer policy (What is it, 3 foreign signings ever?) belong in the bottom half. He barely bought anyone as he was brought in just before or after the window had closed, took over a team that had finished just above the relegation spots and suddenly they were top half of the table. He's worked wonders with the likes of Agbolohar (sp?), Milner and Barry. Lerner had a part to play in all that of course, but it's his manager that's transformed thm. As a side note, Lerner's Cleveland Browns have been one of the worst franchises in the NFL for as long as Lerner has been in charge, he's not thought of in great light on this side of the pond. Lerner is the man who has done most to transform the club, far far more than MON has. Anyone who thinks otherwise is talking nonsense, I'm afraid. Or appreciates the influence on the team on the pitch better. Look at us, we were backed to the hilt and probably beyond our means by Freddy, put a crappy manager in there like Souness and your strggling at the wrong end of the table. Have fun without O'Neill, you'll miss him more than you think, if Lerner doesn't get the appointment right, and trust me he doesn't always hit a home run with his appointments at other organisations. Look, who appointed o'Neill? And why did he do it? Because Lerner thought he was the best guy to approach in the circumstances, and it wasn't too bad a move. I'd say his biggest mistake - especially if the money really has dried up, which I'm under the impression it hasn't - was showing too much loyalty when he first got disturbed by o'Neill's inadequacies, especially in spending the huge pots of money Lerner was apparently positively asking him to spend. Appointing managers isn't easy, but Lerner's short track record suggest he'll go about it in the right way, and even more to the point, everything else he'll do will be totally conducive to the success of that appointee. Our failure, along with that of other clubs/chairmen, is not so much found in picking the wrong CV from the application pile as from asking any new/prospective manager to work in fucking nightmarish conditions. Moyes should go for it if he gets offered the chance, that's someone who deserves a chance at the big time and I think it could be a nice match. I'm not aware of anything which shows he's not up to going beyond 6th, as contrary to the case with o'Neill. I don't know enough about the manager market and Aston Villa's position just now, so I don't know if they could make an obviously better appointment.

I was going to ask if you were joking, but I've just had to remind myself how far we've fallen since I was pointing out o'Neill's was totally unproven as a top quality manager. I do think he's someone who can consistently achieve that top ten/UEFA hole with virtually any club, and that combined with his particular style as a manager mean it might not actually be a bad move for us just now. Still don't like him and don't much want him, though - would be happier to press on with Hughton. He would be a massive step up, but considering the rumours why he's leaving Villa to how we are currently run there's no chance on earth he'd come here, it would be out of the fire and in to the sun. Heh, yeah pretty much. Only thing is Lerner's mob are intelligent and strong-minded. So far as I'm aware, they've always done what they think is best for the Aston Villa's future and it's usually been right. In contrast, our lot are short-sighted cowards who might actually respond to o'Neill's assuredness, funnily enough - I know at first sight he can appear like Keegan, but I think the dynamics would be different and could (not definitely would) turn out more in his favour... at least long enough for him to give us stable premiership mediocrity for 2 to four seasons. Of course, our board have shown they only need six months to turn that kind of position into relegation, but that's another story. I'd love a manger to come in to pressure the board, I thought Keegan was that man, not with threats of walking, but in terms of selling the club and the idea of spending to build quickly for a better future. I have doubts MON would make a difference to this lot, and the result would be the same, a club looking for a new manager. Thing is it is a daft move for MON, the offer for Milner is huge, and anyone would take it, so his reasons are flaky, but even worse is his timing, 5 days before the start of the season. I know there's no loyalty in football, and if results went against him his job is on the line, but leaving like this at this time feels like he's trying to do as much damage as possible, very Keegan like imo. Don't want to drag this on to talking about us too much... but I do disagree on the last bit about Keegan... I think part of the reason Keegan trying to sell the club to the board didn't work is that they just gave him no credibility from the start, and gave the club no real credibility either - they thought he and we were mugs. The more optimistic (not expectant or stupid, just hopeful) we were, they less respect they gave us. With regards o'Neill, because of the reputation he probably has in their eyes - not our actual view of him, plus the nature of his demands, plus the fact he expects hostility and so will be more aggressive and tenacious than Keegan was (Keegan ultimately wants and needs willing partners, o'Neill doesn't especially care), I think it might just work for him. I'd say one of the significant differences between him and Keegan is that o'Neill really is way more inclined to deliberately damage fellow figures at the club in public to further his own ends. He has more experience in that and is more comfortable with that game.

Same! Been waiting for something to laugh at Villa about since the horrible c***s acted like small time c***s about us going down. Hopefully they flog all of their best players and plummet. Don't count your chickens - unless Lerner's lost interest, which he hasn't really so far as I'm aware, I'd be over the moon if I were them and this could be the best thing to happen to them since o'Neill was appointed. The timing's pretty horrible of course... but nevertheless. Why the fuck would you be over the moon ? Are you insane ? The bloke totally transformed a strugglling prem club into one of the top clubs 8 clubs in the country, there's nothing better out there available for Villa right now. No, Lerner & co. did that, he's been holding them back in my view. The only thing you might be right on is the idea they can't get anything much better just at the moment.

I was going to ask if you were joking, but I've just had to remind myself how far we've fallen since I was pointing out o'Neill's was totally unproven as a top quality manager. I do think he's someone who can consistently achieve that top ten/UEFA hole with virtually any club, and that combined with his particular style as a manager mean it might not actually be a bad move for us just now. Still don't like him and don't much want him, though - would be happier to press on with Hughton. He would be a massive step up, but considering the rumours why he's leaving Villa to how we are currently run there's no chance on earth he'd come here, it would be out of the fire and in to the sun. Heh, yeah pretty much. Only thing is Lerner's mob are intelligent and strong-minded. So far as I'm aware, they've always done what they think is best for the Aston Villa's future and it's usually been right. In contrast, our lot are short-sighted cowards who might actually respond to o'Neill's assuredness, funnily enough - I know at first sight he can appear like Keegan, but I think the dynamics would be different and could (not definitely would) turn out more in his favour... at least long enough for him to give us stable premiership mediocrity for 2 to four seasons. Of course, our board have shown they only need six months to turn that kind of position into relegation, but that's another story.

I was going to ask if you were joking, but I've just had to remind myself how far we've fallen since I was pointing out o'Neill's was totally unproven as a top quality manager. I do think he's someone who can consistently achieve that top ten/UEFA hole with virtually any club, and that combined with his particular style as a manager mean it might not actually be a bad move for us just now. Still don't like him and don't much want him, though - would be happier to press on with Hughton. Same! Been waiting for something to laugh at Villa about since the horrible cunts acted like small time cunts about us going down. Hopefully they flog all of their best players and plummet. Don't count your chickens - unless Lerner's lost interest, which he hasn't really so far as I'm aware, I'd be over the moon if I were them and this could be the best thing to happen to them since o'Neill was appointed. The timing's pretty horrible of course... but nevertheless.

You'd think people would learn...

Haven't read much of this thread, and don't much want Xisco back or hate Best that much, but it's a bit different. One disappointed as a new arrival in a new country to a club playing in the Premiership that was overseen by some of the most incompetent people in football. Best was playing in the same league for the best team with one of the most settled squads it had had in years and was given quite a few goes up front. How many starts has he made for us? He was also playing for a new time and alongside a partner who didn't compliment him at all. I am not expecting much of Best if I am honest but the way some go on is mental. Xisco has a fucking awful attitude, especially if he is earning as much as is being reported. I just don't see how he deserves a chance but Best doesn't. As I said, I am not expecting much of the lad but now he has had a bit of time to settle, will get a pre-season and then I think it's fair to judge. Sympathetic to most of that, as I say I'm not a Best hater or desperate to give Xisco another go. Based purely on my skill as a judge of aptitude and character, I'd have rid of both in the circumstances, and if there was one that I'd like to be given another go for personal reasons then it would be Best, but if some man came back from the future and told me one of the two ended up being useful servants for the club and asked me to guess which, I'd go with Xisco.

Haven't read much of this thread, and don't much want Xisco back or hate Best that much, but it's a bit different. One disappointed as a new arrival in a new country to a club playing in the Premiership that was overseen by some of the most incompetent people in football. Best was playing in the same league for the best team with one of the most settled squads it had had in years and was given quite a few goes up front.

He could be a politician with the amount of crap he talks to try and save face. Christ that's given me ideas... can just see the horrible little bastard becoming a tory mp.

Don't care too much. He screwed the club, but lots of players do and he gave reasonable service beforehand. I never expected anything of him as a man - never deserved the credit he originally got. He always wanted to look after himself, which is normal behaviour - only special players dont, and I never thought he was one.

Yeah, but that's just quoting a 'boardroom source' i.e. Llambias. There were plenty of quotes from managers like Alex Ferguson sympathising with Keegan's position and saying they would have done the same as him, as well as the LMA coming out in his support after hearing evidence. There was plenty of Caulkin-esque stuff going around too among the usual journalist blather. Furthermore, Ashley's regime hadn't been proven to be profoundly retarded YET, unlike West Ham's who managed it before they even owned that particular club.

I definitely can, to be fair.

There's still no money for transfers. If he's confirmed he's taking none out then presumably any additional money generated increases the chances of that not being the case. Something for those talking of boycotting again to think about? They have of course 'confirmed' a lot of things in their time, such as when they confirmed they had a policy of deliberately lying to interested parties. It's interesting that they've made this new statement, but still... 'confirmed'.

Surely someone - read Llambias - deserves sacking for the way the club without fail manages to only kick off shit storms whenever it attempts to communicate. I mean seriously, is there nothing this incompetent can't fuck up?

Conceivably worse for 3rd placed who'd lose some momentum? Interesting idea, though.