Cronky

Having watched Football First, I didn't think our performance looked much different from many others this season, including Spurs. We don't pass the ball well through the midfield and struggle to keep possession. We therefore weren't able to cope with Reading's high tempo hustling. A related problem is that with Owen and Martins the ball doesn't really stick up front. I can see that Sam wanted to keep the same strikeforce after a 3-1 win, but Smith should have started up front. Barton looked like he really improved as the pace slackened and he had more space. Butt is a lousy passer and this aspect of our game won't improve as long as he's in the side.

A 4-3-3 today, yeah? Geremi- Butt - Barton in midfield. Emre - Owen - Martins up front (ish). I certainly think that's the best way of using Emre.

A big, big problem for Spurs is that they seem to be a very leaky club when it comes to information coming out. Being owned by a company, a lot of people seem to have inside information, and are probably keen to show it off by blabbing to their mates in London wine bars. The likes of MJ on here seem to have a lot of detail, and the first approach to Ramos became public knowledge very quickly. It didn't have the status of rumour or speculation - it was hard fact. That completely undermined Jol's position, and he was a dead duck from then on. On Wednesday, I spoke to a mate about the Monday game, and he told me that Jol had already negotiated a pay-off, and would go as soon as his successor had been secured. He's not particularly an ITK, or even a Spurs supporter. He just works in the City. I know rumours circulate about every club, but it seems to be on a different scale at Spurs.

More like wham bam thank you mam football, but I'm not complaining. Rome wasn't built in a day.

This has all the signs of one almighty fuck-up. I reckon they wanted Ramos at the start of the season, when Jol fell out with the Board, but he fancied a crack at the Champions League with Sevilla. They've had to persuade him to quit by offering him a vast salary, but he's now flying into a very different job to the one that he would have faced earlier. One that I don't think he's suited to.

Well personally I didn't think they looked all that good together on Monday. Barely managed to link up once, is my memory. Possibly an exaggeration, but not far off.

I'm not sure if they really believe it is a relegation scrap... that could be the thing that saves them or the thing that sends them down. I hear what you're saying. Personally, I don't think they're in a false position and there's a lot of work to be done. If Ledley King doesn't come back, they'll need to bring in a top class defender in January, and that might not be easy. I think you're right though - they think they're a great team in disguise and that could be fatal. People are quoting other managers who have been new to the Premiership, but Spurs are in a much more tricky situation. Mourinho took over a club who'd finished second in the league and he was given £100 million to spend. Benitez took over a top four club and hasn't really pushed them much further forward. Wenger did extremely well, but he inherited a superb defence that was the bedrock of his later success. All three were able to take over a club in the close season, with time to prepare and make their mark. Ramos will really have to hit the ground running. Spurs really need a fire-fighter, not a visionary.

From what I see, Ramos has never managed outside Spain, let alone in the Premiership. Is he the right person to take over a relegation scrap three months into the season?

Not in the least bit surprised. The players on Monday just didn't look motivated to play for their manager any more.

I agree. Spurs are in danger, because that really was a relegation performance. Half-hearted defending, no leadership, no confidence. This isn't a blip that's going to right itself. I feel sorry for Jol, but his position looks untenable. The problem for Spurs is whether they'll be able to get a top class manager in at short notice to replace him. Any manager will have seen that Jol has been undermined from above, and If they've got better options they might baulk at joining them.

You're going down with the Mackems! Wouldn't argue with that if we played like that for the rest of the season. Personally, I think things will improve but by how much is debateable. Firstly, well done for appearing on this board after a bad defeat. I was expecting your defence to be weak, but I wasn't expecting the total lack of any fighting spirit throughout the team. For whatever reason, the players didn't seem to be playing for Jol any more. I have some sympathy for the guy, because I think he's been undermined from within, but it looks like it's only the lack of a suitable replacement that's keeping him in a job, and that might change soon.

Yes, I would rather see us be boring and win than be entertaining and lose. But yes, we were a bit boring. We don't pass the ball through the midfield that well. I think a few people are being over-sensitive on this. Allardyce is laying the foundations of a good side, but right now the football is what you'd call functional.

thought we did a good job last ten mins... killed the game To me, killing the game means keeping possession and making the opposition chase round for the ball as you pass it about. We just immediately gave the ball away and invited them to play attack v defence. Against a better side or one that was playing with any kind of fighting spirit, we'd have probably conceded at least one goal.

Up front with Owen perhaps? Allardyce would be mad to leave Martins out away from home, with the home team having to come out and attack us he's the only one capable of getting in behind them. I haven't the slightest doubt that if Viduka is fit, he'll be in and Martins will be out. Smith will be back in midfield as well. We won today because Faye was magnificent and Spurs, apart from a 10 minute spell, were absolutely shit. It was the most spineless performance I've seen from any team this season, and a conclusive demonstration that the players just aren't doing it for Jol any more.

Owen's link up play was good. Martins really struggled in that area. Overall, the lack of a target man showed.

I really hated the way we played in the last 10 minutes. We're not a possession side, and with Martins alone up front the ball was never going to stick. Emre just doesn't play for the team. With Butt in the anchor role, he needed to get forward, but he wants to be a playmaker so they end up playing side by side. We were getting overwhelmed after Spurs scored. Barton looked unfit, but his arrival gave the team and the crowd a lift, and that led to the third goal, which was all important. Some lessons learned. Martins and Owen are not a combination, and Martins is not a £15 million player.

Got to make a change now. Just as I say that, Mr Barton appears. Phew.

We're not hitting them on the break at all, and wasting good possession. Spurs are the only ones who are looking positive right now. Bring on Barton.

Agreed. That's part of his game that needs ironing out.

Spurs have been unbelievably shit, and we haven't really punished them. They're playing without any belief or spirit. Still, I'm glad we've scored, because that may change in the second half, particularly if they bring Berbatov on. I'm really hoping to see Barton second half.

Not the wisest of words from Jol, considering we're 8th and they're 3rd bottom.

First touch? Second and third touches aren't that great either. Really, I don't think Martins is a difficult player to assess. He's a strong, quick athlete and as such he can cause defenders problems. However, you have to look at his overall contribution to the team, in comparison to what a more skilful and intelligent player could bring to the side.

Exactly what I thought. She seemed to be saying lines that she thought Motson or Davies would come out with. Nail head hit. If she's going to be a success, she needs to develop her own style. It's not as though the traditional male style of commentating is all that entertaining or interesting. More often than not, it gets on the nerves.

Joey Barton. He's the player that can add a bit of creativity to the midfield, and that would make a big difference to our performances.