Cronky

You could look at it another way. Despite the fact that we've made a net spend of only £6 million, the squad has improved immeasurably. In previous years, our average yearly spend has been about £10 million, and we've been no better off.

Chelsea was the wrong club at the wrong time in his career. He was too inexperienced to hold down a place in a side that was chasing the league, and he lost his way a bit. But - his potential is huge. I'd back Sam to straighten him out. my only worry is that these posters'll murder him the minute he steps into the toon... still cant believe they're slating a potential rightback.. must be absolutely terrible i'm guessing hes a youngster, how old? He's 23. He was 18 when he joined Chelsea. Sir Bob was poised to snap him up, but then along came Abramovich.

Chelsea was the wrong club at the wrong time in his career. He was too inexperienced to hold down a place in a side that was chasing the league, and he lost his way a bit. But - his potential is huge. I'd back Sam to straighten him out.

A very talented player who I reckon will come good at one stage of his career. It could be us, and I'd take a punt on him.

See that's the interesting thing though, he doesn't mention the 4-4-2 and neither does he solely mention playing alongside another striker. He just talks about being played as an out and out striker even if it means being a lone striker. This is why I started talking about him being the out and out striker in the 4-3-3. I'm just interested to know if people think this might work. Taking into account the other players we have. Dont think it would work, because we dont have the players to afford him as the lone forward. If we were Barcelona, and Owen were to be playing the same role as Eto'o for example, hed probably excel because the rest of the team is great at keeping possession, building up play, and creating chances, whilst Owen could concentrate on making his runs and getting on the end of chances. This team under Allardyce's system, however, will most likely need that lone striker to be doing the much of the possession and build up work. We'll be playing it up to the lone striker first, and then things go from there. Some great points here. What if we played Alan Smith as one of the wide forwards, from where he could occassionally provide a physical presence upfront, and we had Geremi, Barton and Emre in midfield? That might have a better chance of working. I swear Sam played the 4-3-3 with Anelka up top and Kevin Davies out wide at times last season, and in these instances when they played it long it went diagonally to Davies. Maybe Alan Smith could be used in a similar fashion. Owen made a similar statement during the World Cup - effectively that he's an out and out striker and there's no point in asking him to play another role. The Barca point is a good one, but we have to face it that we can't play that way and we will have to use the main striker as a target man some of the time. It's a bit of a worry, because I think that Owen should be thinking of adapting his game, not sticking to what he knows and expecting the team to fit around him.

My guess is that there's a standoff which will get resolved in the last few days or hours before the deadline. We're not so desperate to land him that we're prepared to be ripped off, but in the end something will get sorted. Meanwhile, Lee is so desperate for a result that he's now prepared to pick a player who he knows is only half-committed.

Not a lot to choose between the options, but I voted for Owen - Shola. Viduka looks very unfit and in need of a shock to the system. If Shola had played like he did on Saturday, this board would be heaving with people demanding that he gets the boot, not complaining about 'the service'. I don't doubt his talent with the ball at his feet, and facing the goal, but he needs to work harder for those opportunities. Smith is tempting but he now looks very slow and has difficulty holding the ball up as a striker. I'd see his future in midfield. With Owen and Martins you have two finishers, and I don't think that can work as a combo. Owen plays with more intelligence, so I went for him. But Allardyce's 4-3-3 looks progressive to me, and ultimately I'd like to see him bring in the player or players to make that system work to its optimum.

Sorry if the point's been made before, but Ramos is bang out of order for going public about Spurs making that offer to him. That's unnecessary, and totally disrespectful to a fellow manager. Yes, the story was going around, but confirming it like that makes Jol's situation even worse.

Not on any of the Bolton forums yet. It wouldn't surprise me if it's true. I don't think Gartside wants to sell to us, and he's probably just been trying to jerk us around.

There has been a trend towards more flexible systems for a long time now, and that's meant a trend towards more flexible players. The specialist playmaker who can't tackle, or the defensive midfielder who can't pass, or the finisher who can't create for his team-mates - these kinds of players are becoming less and less useful for the top teams. Increasingly, they don't like defenders who can only defend, for that matter. 4-3-3 represents a move towards greater fluidity. In some ways, it's wrong to describe the formation in terms of 3 lines, because the wide men operate partly in the midfield, and at least one of the midfield players should be supporting the main striker through the centre. I'm sure this flexibility is the reason it's becoming more widespread. 4-4-2 can be stodgy and predictable, and sometimes feels like a retreat to the comfort zone of old fashioned wingers and centre forwards. We need variety in our play.

The obvious way of using the four strikers is for either Viduka or Shola to pair up with either Owen or Martins in a 4-4-2. Personally, I'm not completely sold on that in the long term, because the best role for the second striker in a 4-4-2 is to link with the midfield eg Beardsley, Rooney, Bellamy. You have a target man and a creator, rather than two strikers side by side. I don't think Martins or Owen are well suited to that creator role, any more than the wider role in a 4-3-3. So yes, Houston we have a problem which Allardyce will have to face up to. The three best players for a 4-3-3 are Duff, Shola and Milner, but that leaves you with a lack of pace. That's what I'd go for if everyone's fit, but it's not ideal. Edit - the best bet at the moment for a 4-4-2 would be Owen and Shola IMO.

Okay, 'goal hanger' is harsh. Big Sam's description of 'predator' hits the mark though. Owen is great at getting on the end of chances in the penalty box, so if he plays nearly every game, it's not inconceivable that he'll get 15+ goals. Ultimately though, what counts is how many the team score, and how many games they win. Owen doesn't get very involved in the build up, and doesn't create much for his team mates. That's the dilemma that Allardyce himself put forward. Can you afford a player like that, or do you go for more of an all-rounder? I'm not saying Owen can't adapt. We've seen so little of him over the last two years, it's impossible to say. In fairness, he showed one or two nice touches on Saturday, even though they didn't ultimately come off. During the World Cup, it was clear that he was a bit at odds with Eriksson, who wanted him to do more work outside the penalty area. Owen publicly asserted that he was a specialist finisher. His injury saved Eriksson from a tricky decision. But I think Owen does have to adjust his game if he's to get back to the top again. As for Shola, he's a player who offers something entirely different.

mackems.gif

How does he know?

I'm not a fan of Martin Samuel. I think he sometimes talks crap just to be controversial. But this assessment of Owen is spot on, as is Allardyce's assessment of how Owen performed at the World Cup. I think Owen faces a challenge. The game is changing, and he has to show that he has the range of skills to adapt. Even in a 4-4-2, the top teams can't afford to have a specialist goal hanger.

The referees association have really made a rod for their own back with this. Every time a ref makes a mistake in relation to a goal, there's going to be a call for them to be suspended. A referee should only be dropped after demonstrating a pattern of incompetence. They shouldn't be punished for one error. Just because most managers behave like brats doesn't mean that the authorities should dance to their tune.

I remember that it was said at the time that Ashley had got himself a bit of a bargain. There wasn't any real competition from other buyers to drive the price up. Shepherd's attitude meant that the only way of taking over was to pay cash and railroad things through, and Ashley was the only one who could do that. It shouldn't then be a surprise if a few other people are making enquiries, just in case Ashley is interested in making a quick buck. There's nothing to suggest that either this or the Chinese story have got past the enquiry stage.

When everyone's fit - ........Given Carr...Rozenhal....Taylor....Enrique .....Barton....Geremi....Smith ..........Milner.......Duff ...............Ameobi I like the 4-3-3.

I agree with that assessment...as did Sam apparently. It looked like he got fouled quite a bit and I'm not sure if either Villa center-half was whistled for anything in the entire game. Then when frustration set in he basically gave up. Also, do we have anyone else who can take a corner? Geremi has been weak to say the least in that area so far. Alex will say I am talking s**** about Viduka Geremi's corners were a let too on Saturday, I think he has been okay in the other games, but against Villa they were all over hit. Zoggy tends to under hit his and gets very little height, I suppose Milner will take them if Emre does not play. I think you're the only one who noticed we played a lot of long balls on Saturday, well done Despite his size though, humping it upfield to Viduka doesn't suit him, especially against two centre-halves like Villa have. I can't agree with any of that. There were plenty of balls played into Viduka's feet, but he was so slow off the mark, the centre backs invariably beat him to it. I didn't think the Villa centre backs fouled him any more than is usual in a Premiership game, and once or twice Viduka bought a free kick which he didn't deserve. Shola was far stronger and much more mobile. Viduka strikes me as a lazy trainer who has got by on his talent alone in the last few years. He needs to buck up his ideas or he'll lose his place. You can't agree we played a lot of long balls on Saturday? I'd say we played with a mixture of long balls and short, depending on the situation. There was variety. We played the ball through the midfield or out to the wings just as often as long, down the middle. Viduka struggled to get involved either way. I'm not suggesting for a minute he had a good game but the service to him was shit man. We definitely played a lot of long balls and if you're saying we played a variety of different good quality balls into him I can't agree with that for a minute. If you're not saying that, what are you saying? I'm saying that Viduka looked slow and played shit. The idea that there were too many long balls or the ref wasn't strict enough with the Villa defenders is just looking for excuses for him.

I can't see how it can work if you have one man in charge of player recruitment, and another in charge of coaching and team selection. In any line of business, staff selection is a very important skill. If the bloke who has to get results isn't the one who is selecting the staff, then you've got trouble.

I agree with that assessment...as did Sam apparently. It looked like he got fouled quite a bit and I'm not sure if either Villa center-half was whistled for anything in the entire game. Then when frustration set in he basically gave up. Also, do we have anyone else who can take a corner? Geremi has been weak to say the least in that area so far. Alex will say I am talking s**** about Viduka Geremi's corners were a let too on Saturday, I think he has been okay in the other games, but against Villa they were all over hit. Zoggy tends to under hit his and gets very little height, I suppose Milner will take them if Emre does not play. I think you're the only one who noticed we played a lot of long balls on Saturday, well done Despite his size though, humping it upfield to Viduka doesn't suit him, especially against two centre-halves like Villa have. I can't agree with any of that. There were plenty of balls played into Viduka's feet, but he was so slow off the mark, the centre backs invariably beat him to it. I didn't think the Villa centre backs fouled him any more than is usual in a Premiership game, and once or twice Viduka bought a free kick which he didn't deserve. Shola was far stronger and much more mobile. Viduka strikes me as a lazy trainer who has got by on his talent alone in the last few years. He needs to buck up his ideas or he'll lose his place. You can't agree we played a lot of long balls on Saturday? I'd say we played with a mixture of long balls and short, depending on the situation. There was variety. We played the ball through the midfield or out to the wings just as often as long, down the middle. Viduka struggled to get involved either way.

I agree with that assessment...as did Sam apparently. It looked like he got fouled quite a bit and I'm not sure if either Villa center-half was whistled for anything in the entire game. Then when frustration set in he basically gave up. Also, do we have anyone else who can take a corner? Geremi has been weak to say the least in that area so far. Alex will say I am talking s**** about Viduka Geremi's corners were a let too on Saturday, I think he has been okay in the other games, but against Villa they were all over hit. Zoggy tends to under hit his and gets very little height, I suppose Milner will take them if Emre does not play. I think you're the only one who noticed we played a lot of long balls on Saturday, well done Despite his size though, humping it upfield to Viduka doesn't suit him, especially against two centre-halves like Villa have. I can't agree with any of that. There were plenty of balls played into Viduka's feet, but he was so slow off the mark, the centre backs invariably beat him to it. I didn't think the Villa centre backs fouled him any more than is usual in a Premiership game, and once or twice Viduka bought a free kick which he didn't deserve. Shola was far stronger and much more mobile. Viduka strikes me as a lazy trainer who has got by on his talent alone in the last few years. He needs to buck up his ideas or he'll lose his place.

I've got a few, but one I'd recommend is Clough, by Tony Francis. An unauthorised biography that really takes you into the world of one of football's most unusual characters.

I agree with this. We could have done with a midfield player getting forward through the centre to support the striker, and that's where Barton comes in.

Agbonlahor was criticised on Setanta for that, but I'd really disagree. If you-re six yards from goal, with nothing but the keeper to beat, then you've got to have a dig. Anything can happen when you try to square it to a team-mate. This kind of situation is fairly common, and I tend to think the percentage decision is to have a go yourself.