Mick

I hope not.

In alphabetical order, I'll add more later but it's done my head in trying to remember those. Anfield Ashton Gate, twice in the same season to see us play both Bristol clubs Ayresome Park Baseball Ground Bloomfield Road Blundell Park Boundary Park Bramall lane Brisbane Road Brittania Stadium Brunton Park Burnden Park Carrow Road City Ground Elland Road Ewood Park Filbert Street Gateshead Stadium Gay Meadow Goodison Park Highbury Hillsborough JJB Kenilworth Road Layer Road Leeds Road Loftus Road London Road Maine Road Meadow Lane Millmoor Molineux Ninien Park Oakwell Odsall Old Trafford Palmerston Park Plough Lane Prenton Park Pride Park Roker Park Selhurst Park SOS Stamford Bridge The Dell The Den The Racecourse Ground The Reebok The Riverside The Valley Upton Park Vale Park Valley Parade Vetchfield Vicarage Road Victoria Ground Villa Park Wembley White Hart Lane

You have flawed logic, I hope for your sake that you don't go on like this in person.

Where did I say that?

Fixed.

Exactly, and to think some people write him off before he has a chance to shine, we should be ashamed of ourselves.

I think Shola will start banging in goals once his injuries clear up and he'll become the regular England player we all know he's capable of becoming.

I'll stand by what I''ve said, especially in the context in which they were made. How do you feel about Ashley paying for the 52,000 stadium and the players that your mate brought to the club?

Ashley has personally kept the club in the black, he's paid for all of those golden years you brag about, and he's paid for that 52,000 stadium you now sit in.

That's a strange choice of words, we were already paying £8 million a year to service the debt, try sticking £30 million on top of that. I'm sure we'd paid something like £5 million trying to re-structure the debt in the last set of accounts before the takeover, all money bleeding out of the club. Income was less than expenditure so you then have to add to that every year at a time when money just isn't being loaned and you have a massive problem, that isn't hindsight, it's the state of the economy. I'm not even sure any of this is hindsight, the clubs finances have been discussed on here for years and in the main it's all been shown to be true.

True but they got in through my eyes.

A bill from the football club.

It's not season ticket money specifically although it could possibly include that. I'm not sure that any company would pay us for something that far ahead.

I'm sure that would be breaking the contract and if we did that the players could become free agents, at a guess.

Basically we have income from various sources and we get paid by a company (which could be a bank like Lloyds) straight away and the company who pays us gets the full amount from the creditor.

Newcastle United are now factoring payments, this isn't a good sign. They will get between 90 and 95% of money owed within 24 hours depending on who we are using. This tends to suggest that we curently have cash-flow problems.

I never understood how we were able to get money for Howey.

We as fans need to gain the trust of our owner as much as he needs to gain the trust of us. Trying to talk to him to take the club forward might be better than trying to tell him that we want him out. Getting rid of him doesn't solve our problems. Like it or not, whoever buys the club will probably need £250 million before even looking to invest in players, Ashley has already spent the £250 million. What we need is for him to turn the club around and stop making losses. Once that has been done then the club can look to spend on players again as long as he's not going to start taking his £100 million loan back. Personally, If I was him and in his position then I'd be looking to take my £100 million back ASAP. I'd think why should I try to help those ungrateful bastards when all they do is give me grief. That might change if he thinks he’s got a long term future at the club, whatever anybody thinks, he hasn’t bought the club to sicken us. That just doesn’t make any sense in the slightest and he didn’t need to make money when he bought the club, he had more money than he could reasonably expect to spend.

Agreed and that should be what is being said, I'm sure more would get involved if that was the case.

Good post, I agree with most of that.

So it's not Ashley out, it might be worth getting that message across. It might be easier to get a dialogue going with the club if it didn’t come across as Ashley out.

I can't see two wrongs, he's putting the money in, or has done.

It has turned out that way for him, he seems able to live with it.