merlin

'Can't' - 'Wood' & 'Trees' are 3 of the words in the sentence that springs to mind - if anyone believes O'Neill is in ANY way a bottler, let alone that he bottled NUFC & Boro, then the words 'Cuckoo' & 'Land' are 2 of the words in the NEXT sentence that comes to mind...! We don't even know if O'Neill was OFFERED the Toon job, let alone bottled it - my feeling is that he would have turned it down , but NOT because he was frightened of it - with a different regime in charge, my feeling is that he would have jumped at it, even if Villa had offered him too. You ALL know why O'Neill would have turned the job down.....!!

No use denying the facts - regardless of how Martins turns out(and the Jury is still well-out on that one), NUFC has become a Club to avoid for top players - look at Luque for example. He may be a sulker, or not really have his heart in it , but his treatment by Roeder has been appalling. Also, the Nigerian guy was merely voicing what most people outside the North East already know. Until the club is run professionally , with a LONG-TERM plan both on & off the field, the very best players will continue to avoid signing, or want to be away if they DO join. All the indignant huffing & puffing by so-called Loyal Supporters is just ostrich stuff to be honest. You ALL know what the answer is.....

That is correct - SJH wanted SBR, the Board(not just Shepherd, to be fair)were dragging feet, not convinced. SBR SHOULD have gone earlier than he did, but with more dignity - how much of that was down to him we'll never know, but if I'd had to make the decision, I would have tried to do it with his assistance, HOWEVER - if he had said he wouldn't move upstairs etc., I would STILL have made the decision - AT THE RIGHT TIME FOR THE CLUB, and not after the start of the season. That is what being Chairman is all about - any Chief Exec has to take hard decisions at times, that is what you get a very large salary for ; we DON'T operate in Disneyland(Bambi, etc.!?).

They were wrong - as far as I know, NUFC won the Championship in 1909 ; DESPITE a record 9-1 HOME defeat against the Mackems(this wasn't properly avenged until the 50's . when we won 6-1 at Roker Park). The mid-20s Championship was in 1927, and Wee Hughie was the star then, but the early 1900s side had a great defence, possibly the best we've ever had and it was marshalled by Bill McCracken, the legendary N.Irish full-back. He was so clever, they had to revise the Offside law to stop games becoming stalemates. What was that people said about Arsenal under Graham..!!??

Regarding the Halls & SBR - Bobby Robson was SJH's first choice to succeed KK in 1997, and it was SJH who pressured the board to appoint him in 1999 when they were having doubts about it. To be fair, quite a few of us wondered in Sir Bobby was getting too old for Premiership management by then , but SJH had no doubts.. As to his dismissal, we ALL know this was handled badly and he should have been given much better treatment from the club - his experience & contacts would have been invaluable behind the scenes, but he should have stepped aside at the end of 2003/4. He was apparently prepared to help in the choice of his successor.... Incidentally, agree with Knightrider & others that most of this thread has been very well-discussed and some good points made by all - we may disagree on the problems at NUFC, but everyone wants the best for the Club .

There will be an exodus of ALL decent players if the club is relegated - anyone who thinks differently is dreaming. Owen would be off like a shot, and who would blame him? Also gone would be Parker, Milner, N'Zogbia , Emre(no loss), Luque(ditto), Given - maybe even Taylor if anyone sees his potential as worth buying.As for Martins, would probably go at a big loss to the club. Relegation is going to provide a big wake-up call to all fans who haven't seen either what happens afterwards, or the type of football you will witness.

Some of this is ludicrous - if Shepherd inherited 250 mil from his father, it must have disappeared some time ago. If you remember, he was the JUNIOR member in the Magpie Group takeover - all the money to buy shares came from Sir John - NOT A PENNY from Shepherd. If he had access to that sort of money , he would have taken sole control of the club ages ago - why do you think the Halls own more shares than Shepherd..??

Would Ozzie have kept us up in 92 with the same players Keegan had.....??

Agree , Brummie - I think you WILL eventually get him, and that O'Neill will make him into a really good player, probably even for England in a few years. He's only 21, and playing in a crap side with no confidence or motivation, yet still tries hard. The mark of a good player..

If Shepherd is trying to play 'Chess' against Belgravia(or any other large Financial outfit/individual) he's more stupid than anyone thought - they'll eat him for breakfast. Simply buy up enough shares to prevent him taking control and refuse to sell to him - at ANY price. They would then continue to let him stew in his own juice(as he is now), and watch the club decline week by week. Failure on the pitch WILL eventually mean attendances falling, with attendant financial problems for the club. Shepherd is NOT rich enough to keep bailing the club out, share price will fall , his Investment will be worth NOWT. Eventually, the threat of bankruptcy will arise for the Club - this is what happened to Mckeag & Co back in 92 - the CLUB WAS GOING BUST. That is why SJH was eventually able to take control - he had more bucks than McKeag, and if anyone else IS seriously interested in taking over NUFC, you can bet your bottom dollar they've got more dosh than Shepherd. Big Fish get eaten by Bigger Fish.... In any case , were I still in the UK, there is NO WAY anyone would get me to pay for a Season Ticket if Shepherd DID manage to get control - I'd see him rot first. Many people would eventually take the same position, and the club would become just like it was in the late 80's/early 90s - just another run-of-the-mill Championship team , and maybe worse. Incidentally, if anyone REALLY believes that Shepherd will be a completely 'NEW MAN' if he gets total control, you're living in Cuckoo land. What possible reason would he have to behave any differently ??

If Wenger IS thinking of bailing-out from the Emirates Stadium, that name might be the very reason why - maybe Arsenal have bitten off more than they can chew with the costs of paying for it , and Wenger knows it will impact on his team-building. Certainly , it will take much more than a spat at WHU to make him think of shifting - he's a crafty operator....

Macdonald was a great CF, one of the most exciting players I've seen in a B&W shirt, which is just as well - he was definitely at the back of the queue when brains and conversation ability were handed out. He was persona non grata during SJH regime(not entirely fair), but he is only interested in keeping his current favoured status with the current regime at SJP - his comments on Century were ludicrous and he constantly interrupts fans if he thinks they are going to challenge the Club's regime on air..

Waste of Space ??

Roeder given time ?? 3 other Clubs made THAT mistake, & ended up paying the ultimate penalty..

Very, very good indeed, Kitman - you need to be careful, or the Fat Toad may want you to be his Publicity Agent on his next vessel.....!!!!

O'Neill will turn Milner into the player he already has the potential to be - the fact that so many fans accept the likely loss of either he or N'Zogbia(I reckon they'll BOTH be on the move unless a takeover happens) just shows how easily supporters accept second-best. There is no way that a Club like NUFC should be selling talented young players to rivals - could you have imagined Ferguson selling Scholes or Beckham to Arsenal or Liverpool when they were 21 ?? Oh sorry, I forgot - Ferguson & Man U board wouldn't have let their club get into the state NUFC are in now....!

Best post on this thread, Fox. I vowed I would NOT get involved in all this 'Yah-Boo, I know better than you stuff' after the last interminable rants over the running of the Club. Time to deal in that much over-used word , guys - FACT FACT 1. Club Unsuccessful for 38 years(YES, UNSUCCESSFUL - TROPHIES NIL, despite having most loyal fans in the country, based on what has been put in front of them). FACT 2. Club had best chance of sustained success over the past 10 years - THIS HAS BEEN WASTED. FACT 3. There has been no recognisable LONG-TERM PLAN for the development & future of the Club(Shilly-shallying over Academy for years, poor Scouting networks etc.). FACT 4. The club has made some APPALLING signings when the whole package of the deal is costed-out FACT 5, The club has been going backwards for at least 3 years since the lack of investment prior to Champs league campaign in 2003/4 FACT 6. The handling of the Bobby Robson situation (re; his stepping-down)was deplorably mis-managed., leading directly to the current, serious situation. FACT 7. THE BUCK STOPS AT THE TOP; THE CHAIRMAN HAS MADE(OR NOT MADE!) THE DECISIONS WHICH HAVE LEAD TO THIS(MANAGERIAL APPTS., TRANSFER POLICIES) AND SO SHOULD CARRY THE CAN. Anyone who can't(or won't) see this is now well & truly in the minority of the club's long-suffering support and doing the club no good by defending its position. As I said before, they are entitled to their views, but I recommend that as from now, no-one gets into a pointless debate about it - they are never going to change, so leave them to it. We have enough things to discuss & worry about besides those who insist the World is flat... Last word on the subject.

Couldn't agree more , Phil - spot-on.

That's the whole crux of the matter - he won't quit voluntarily, so yet ANOTHER pay-off because of the Chairman's bad judgement...

Both have to go ASAP, this club will decline more every day hes there. As someone at the match pointed out todays game should have been moved to tomorrow but Shepherd could only see the pound signs of Sky. Glenn has to go tomorrow and Fred as soon as possible, a change of ownership takes time it cant happen overnight but until it does we need out of this relegation battle and theres no way Roeder can take us out. What makes you think Shepherd is up to appointing a capable manager? You're spot-on Mick, but unless we get SOME sort of action soon, it will be too late - this boat is already beginning to move down the slipway and relegation would be a total disaster. Unfortunately, I cannot see a takeover happening quickly and at the very least, we need someone on a short contract who might steady the ship until the end of the season. What is needed now is someone who can somehow put some fire into the bellies of these under-performing players ; everyone will moan at the suggestion, but even Graham or Venables might be able to temporarily stop the rot - and it DESPERATELY needs stopping - QUICKLY.

If its omens you want ;- In 1977/78, we had just appointed a manager who had been caretaker the previous season, and got the club into the UEFA Cup We went to Corsica and got a result in a game we were expected to lose, just like Palermo last Thursday. We won our first home match We had a talented group of players ON PAPER(including 2 excellent full backs, but this is NOT the same today..!) We couldn't get results in crucial matches. WE WENT DOWN - HISTORY ONLY SHOWS THAT PEOPLE MAKE THE SAME MISTAKES TWICE.

Get your flint ready...!!

As I said about this before - since when did a contract make any difference ? Not worth the paper they are written on. I thought N'Zog would be off to the Emirates stadium as soon as we signed Duff, and said so a few months ago. Nothing has made me change my mind ; he keeps being dropped by Roeder, and this is just a softening-up exercise by the club to prepare for his departure. The same will happen with Milner ; quality young players being sold to raise money to pay for the club's financial cock-ups....

A very good result in a difficult venue - Krul has been excellent, esp for a young player, and Milner has shown that he will be a big loss if he is sold in Jan. However, this result has uncanny echoes of the famous Bastia game back in 1977 - we were having a bad season in the league(got relegated), yet went to another island close to Italy(Corsica), and beat Bastia 2-1 in the UEFA Cup. Unfortunately, we were ambushed by Johnny Rep , the Dutch World Cup star in the return match - they were 2-0 up in no time and we never looked like winning. Lets hope history doesn't repeat itself - Palermo are quite capable of winning at SJP.

Problem is that too many fans want change without making any sacrifice to get it - back in the 80's, I adopted exactly the same philosophy as our friend Fred - and eventually, the financial situation forced McKeag & Co out. The same action is required now, but too many people hide behind the 'I'm a TRUE fan' rubbish as an excuse for not withdrawing their money. There is NO WAY I would be buying a Season Ticket if I was back in the NE, until Shepherd & Co had gone..