Ronaldo

Dyer's close control was excellent.

Yes, and i acknowledged one of them.

I think an excess of chinese food is slowly sending Icarus insane.

As I said once already, if he had stayed fit and kept his head screwed on he'd have been held in the same esteem. On the fringes of the England first Xl, very versatile and considered not quite top tier but a good option.

Complete and utter s****.

You didn't, but why would you pluck Joe Cole out of thin air? I don't see any comparable attributes, or qualities at all. Even hypothetical. Because, if you read the post again, you'd see that I said 'same esteem' - a different type of player, not world class but dangerous all across the midfield and generally a very good option.

When did I say they were?

Beattie, man.

Don't kid yourself, he had an awful lot going for him and would probably have been held in the sam esteem as Joe Cole had he kept his head screwed on and stayed relatively free of injury.

Had Torres been on form, they would have scored a fair few more.

I vaguely remember being in an internet cafe in New York after the game and logging into here to discover someone had written him off at HT.

Booing someone on their debut.

Whoever did that wants shooting with shite.

Didn't threaten anybody.

I do hope I meet you one day, Ash.

I still don't know just what exactly is indicative of an awful attitude. The fella was ignored for a year. He was faced with the prospect of another as a 5th choice striker in a Championship squad. I'd be willing to go to a few lengths to escape such a situation having been rated highly in my home country. That's of course if he actually said it. Not saying he should be commended. But give me someone who desperately wants first team football over someone happy to sit back and watch the cash come in.

I thought me using it would show the extremity of his poofishness. The extremity of poofishness is explored every time you start a thread about women (or any other subject) in General Chat. We don't need it spilling out into the footie talk.

Did Barton not hit that pass for Lovenkrands? Things like that change games. But he badly needs to get match fit, no doubt about it.

No I didn't, I said he made some good runs, stop exaggerating. In an ideal world, Xisco would be nowhere near the club. He's no favourite of mine and £5.7m is an absurd figure for a player with his limited ability to impose himself on a game. However, he's comfortably better than Nile Ranger and Leon Best. In certain games he'd probably be a better option than Lovenkrands and he's got the genuine pace than Shola and Carroll most certainly lack. That to me, suggests he shouldn't quite be the first out the door. And let's face it, we can't afford too many players using that door. In addition, far too many on here have jumped on the 'awful attitude' bandwagon without having anything other than a solitary (and probably fabricated) quote to justify it.

Purely on the strength of what other posters think? I'd need a little bit more than that before accusing someone of having an awful attitude. Do you normally comment on performances you haven't seen, Jon?

Not in the PL he didn't, get you facts right for once. In the Championship he was very good, I praised him on many, many occasions last season.

Nobody mentioned injury records, the arguement is about talent. I think Barton has more. And he's proved it, Guthries proved nowt, yet. Liverpool didn't want him, Bolton didn't, and we got relegated with him looking lost for large parts of the season. I like Danny, he's got a lot of creativity in his locker, but not a whole hell of a lot more than Barton. And Joey, as i've already stated, is far better equipped for the rigours of Premier League football.

I can't really comment because I didn't see any reserve games. What perplexes me are the posters who didn't see the games being accusatory.

ESPN do reserve stats?

There's a difference between a guru and a non-idiot who can follow the most simple of points. Here's the idiots guide: Guthrie hasn't been blessed with any athletic talent, he's slow, very weak and has a pretty poor engine. He's more talented with the ball at his feet, but as a footballer, Barton has the greater talent. He's a good passer, good cardiovascular endurance, average pace and average strength.