fredbob

The people who ruin the forum are those who automatically post negatively against the opinion of certain individuals (not just NE5) based on who is making the post rather than the content of the post. If people would get their head out of their arse and read what he's posting they will find it makes sense. EG If you seriously believe that under the previous board, major decisions were made by one individual acting alone, then you (and others) are frankly a bit dim. I appreciate there is a dilemma here for some. Admitting that big decisions were made by a group of people is obviously going to mean some people can't continue with their childish pastime of slating one individual for everything. Think about it, before you blurt something out.... Agree completely fwiw. However i'm intrigued by certain posters questioning Mort's ambition, as if he were the only to do with the club who made any kind of decisions whatsoever. Well, at least you can grasp that he isn't the owner / major shareholder. But neither was Shepherd. If you are consistent in the way you look at things, you will accept that Shepherd wasn't solely to blame [or credit] for the clubs fortunes. Neither is Mort. But we are worried by the comments coming out of the club, although actions speak louder than words, some people have heard things like this before. They appear to be putting off spending money on the team, which indicates to me that it isn't on the agenda, and sadly this reads that they do not understand that if you want to match the top teams, you have to compete with them. Or maybe they have decided they aren't going to compete with these clubs, which the old board did to the best of their ability. Basically, if they have ambition to win things and compete in the CL, the sooner they get there the better. There is no point whatsoever in putting it off. Building the clubs profile asap increases the clubs attractiveness to these youngsters they say they want to bring in. Although we went down this road under Bobby Robson, so it isn't new even though some people are trying to imply that it is. We shall see. These are both massive assumptions. You have contrived the quotes negatively and i dont quite understand why? Maybe a precedent was set in the past whre the old old board went down a similar route and inevitably led to failure. If you were to scrutinzes his quotes positively, what positives would you draw? It seems to that you dismiss everything positive from his quotes as "PR, cliches and hype" but argue anyhting negative that can be contrived from his quotes with the commitment of a nufc chairman at a pie eating contest. Even though both scutinizations hold the same weight in water.

The people who ruin the forum are those who automatically post negatively against the opinion of certain individuals (not just NE5) based on who is making the post rather than the content of the post. If people would get their head out of their arse and read what he's posting they will find it makes sense. EG If you seriously believe that under the previous board, major decisions were made by one individual acting alone, then you (and others) are frankly a bit dim. I appreciate there is a dilemma here for some. Admitting that big decisions were made by a group of people is obviously going to mean some people can't continue with their childish pastime of slating one individual for everything. Think about it, before you blurt something out.... But surely the chairman has to bare the brunt of the decision? even if it is not actually his own? isnt that part and parcel of the job?

Not saying we dont need him, i just dont think he will be overly effective with the way we're playing, whats the point having someone who can play the important balls into advacned dangerous positions when the players wont be there to recieve it. We dont have the output because the movement from our wingers is s***. Cant rememeber the last time i saw Milner or Zog or Smith run behind the full backs, into the dangerous positions. If we had Elano i genuinely dont think he'd be very effective for us. Just my opinion

Dint think it'd be as one sided as that, I personally thought that Ronaldo has been the best player in the world. With Kaka in a very very close second. Its the CL semi which has swayed things, can understand that but Milan were pretty crap last year in the league, whreas Man U were quality in the league and quality in the CL bar 2 games. Messi should never have been voted second, no way in a million years has he achieved more than Ronaldo in the past year. Althoughthis year, he looks untouchable

scolari has come close enough

Defnintely, they effectively play 424 with there wingers.

I dont think we have the squad to play 433, and i think SA has realised that, he said in his Zoo column something along those words. I think the problem with us playin 433 lies with our forward line. Simple as that. I think the problem lies specifically with the wide forwards. For the 433 to be completely effective you need the forwards to be able to double up and become part of a 5 man midfield, while being able to be a sufficient threat in the box, I personally think that Smith could fit that role well, he seems like a very similar player to Diouf, but we also have Duff to return on the left, a player who is already comfortable playing on thw wide left of the fron t 3. This leaves us with Owen and Martins, arguably our most dangerous players, who are completely inneffective in a 433 situation. It also poses a problem for Zog, as he isnt the enough of a threat in the box to warrant a place on the left of the 3 forwards. The same can be said of Milner. This leaves us with 442, which seems like the best formation for our squad. One of the problems though that i think is hindering the 442 is the partnerships that the formation depends of to be effective, For the 442 to be completely effective it needs to be perfectly balanced with all the partnerships working well. The same dependence on partnerships isnt so important in the 433 formation. If SA gets all the balance and partnerships working well then i see no reason to try and change the team around too much.

To be honest, i actually dont think that having a class creative playmaker will make us any more creative. There isnt enough movement in the team for a "in the hole" creative midfielder to be effective in my opinion. I genuinely think that Emre could still be an important player for us. Its just the way that we play that stifles the effectiveness of creative players.

I take it you haven't read Morts comments about spendign in January [/astonished] You must be someone else who can't accept bare facts laid out in front of you, when they don't suit your opinions ? Basically, if the club don't act to fill glaring hole in the team, and say they won't act, what conclusion do you draw ? We haven't been s*** for years either BTW. I thought you were one of the better posters, until you said that. yeah, i've seen his comments, it made sense to me, i'm giving him a clean slate so i'll wait until the end of the season to make my judgement on how their first season in charge went, given the circumstances bare facts? we're specualting over what the club MIGHT do in january, there are no facts yet, and facts change my opinions, so, eh, what? i'm not sure if its a break down in communication but as far as i'm aware by saying years that can class as 2 years at the least, and i feel pretty assured that we've been s*** for at least two years, i dont really mind what you think of me well, I suppose if you've followed the club for 5 or 6 years, then the last 2 years could seem a long time. And if you've only supported the club since 1992, then the last few years have been comparitively not too good. But if you've supported the club longer than that, they have been a long way short of s***, and for that, you'll have to take my word for it. no i wont, there are many other sources of information, i dont have to take your word for anything, you've never said anything thats changed my views, as i'm sure i've never said anything thats changed yours, might aswell just pack it in Aye, and other sources of information will confirm that we have been a damn sight worse in previous decades than in the last couple of years. oh you're joining in are you? i wasnt beamed into the planet 2 years ago, i have a decent understanding of our history, i still think we've been s*** for the last few years, i was simply saying i dont have to take his word for it because he tends to get a bit preachy if you dont nip it in the bud Where was the, "na na ni na na....." I'm sure it would fit in well after your hissy bit in bold. If you have any understanding of the history of the club you'll know that as poor as the last few seasons have been there have been far, far worse in the memory of MANY supporters who still go to matches today. Anyone who is remotely successful in there life, are never happy with what they achieve. What you're saying there is that many people are grateful becasue of what they had to see. Well, im saying that in 92 we were in a position to estabilish ourselves as a dominant force in the premiership, we were on a level playin field with everyone, infact come 95(?) we were in a position to estabilish ourselves as THE dominant team in the premiership, but becasue oft he ineptitude of the board , failed, we fell so far behind it seems like an impossible task to do but we did. So by the modern view, what has been achieved isnt good enough, we didnt take the oppurtunity we were given therefore we wasted a golden oppurtunity, there cant be any excuse for that. No matter how bad it was. You're quite clearly one of these "it'll do" people. You clearly have absolutely no idea of where the old board found the club, claiming they were "inept". Must admit, this has made me laugh. In 1995 Sir John was chairman, Keegan was manager, and it was the year before we nearly won the league. Such is your lack of knowledge, you put a question mark against it. Credibily destroyed, I'm afraid. Yeh i understnd that, i understand about the state of the club was abhorrent pre Fletcher, Hall and Shep, what im trying to say, and as you have correctly pointed out my knowledge basis isnt fantastic on the account of having a life etc, but from my point of view, irrespective of who was in charge of the club or the position we were in i feel we wasted a golden oppurtunity to be a huge club. Now i dont claim to be a SOOPAFAN, i wouldnt dare pass myself of as that, all im tryin to do is offer my views on the clubs recent history, not the past, becasues thats not strictly relevant. Supposing the club started was created in 92, and what happened in the past didnt exist, how would you view the current situation and handling of the club? Thats the point of view that i am using. but it wasn't, was it. Do you really think that qualifying for europe more than every team bar 4 over the last 10 years is s*** ? mackems.gif Right ok, finally, i'm starting to grasp your point a little, thankfully with you're help (ironically)! I beleive by the sounds of it HTL has the same opinion as you, its unformtunate though that he hasnt contributed anything remotely interesting or important. Im someone who is keen to see someone elses point of view and try to understand from different points of views and have actually asked for some of his views about something which i dont fully understand and havent really got anything interesting from him. Thats pretty pathetic if you ask me. I dont like the "i know more than you, little boy" attitude, its extremely frustrating for someone who is actually keen to get that knowledge. Im a relatvely new poster so while my views maybe simialr to others you've clearly argued with in the past, they arent the same so i'd rather not be painted with the same tar brush. So, to my point, i beleive and please correct me if i am wrong, that you are partially crediting Shepard for the massive revival of this club, and the past is relevant becasue its the past that Shepard dragged us out of. You're saying that Shepards achievement for this club would be akin to say Ken Bates getting Leeds back into the premiership and playing in Europe, or maybe even a side in a more perilous situation. As a younger person I genuinely dont know the exact situation of the club in the darker days. Would that be correct? Would i be wrong in saying that the crux of your argument for Shepard, is that you believe that his greatest achievement for this club wasnt his European qualifications, or the FA cup finals, or CL qualifiaction or even title contenders that we take for granted but that he was partly responsible for putting the club in a position to be considering these things as an actual possiblity? People dont understand the magnitude of what he actually achieved. If this is true, then i think i finally see where you're coming from, and i have to agree with you, as much as i hate to say it. Shepards achievements would be comparable to say someone getting Millwall into the premiership and then qualifying for Europe consistently even having a stint as title challengers and bulding magnificent facilite and a stadium for the club. I'm not sure if thats a good example feel free to me correct if im wrong. Finally i think i can see things from your point of view, although your condensending way of arguing is such a struggle to try and understand, almost as antagonistic and petulant as HTL but not quite. The flip side to this argumetn comes from people who werent around the dark days and so by no fault of there own arent fully able to grasp the magnitude of his achievements and so look at his recenet achievements as a Chairman which tey have every right to. i think they argue the fact that while he did help get us into the position that he did, he failed to get us to the next step, it sticks in the mind so much nowadays because before he took over as chairman we were in a fantastic situation, title challengers, and byt the end of his reign we were a mid table team. The reasons for this slump can be debated for ever, and noone will be right or wrong, however one thing that cant be denied is that by the end of his reign we werent in the position that we should/could of been even though we were in a fastastic position to do so, and that will forever be deemed as a failure in my book. When you have the means to achieve something and its a very real possiblity, when you dont progres to where you hoped to be, no matter how much you dress it up, or talk about the past it will always be deemed failure. He made some horrendous gaffs and they are the mistakes that will stick in mind. At the risk of using another crap analogy, will tony blair be remembered for bringin peace to the NI, ROIreland? (A massive achievemtn) or rememebered for the mistakes in Iraq? (In my opinion a massive gaff). Most people will remember him for Iraq, just like most people will remember Shepard for Souness, treament of SBR, Roeder etc. Thst pretty much presents both sides of the arguments, and i suppose i agree with both. One of your arguments is that under shepard we qulaified for europe more times than any other team outside the top4, you could say that.... OR you could say under Shepards stweardship we fininhsed in the top 10 only 4 times out of 10 seasons, and 3 of those 4, top 10 fininshes were achieved by one manager who was sacked. One of 5 shepard sackings. Both are contain correct stats, one paints the truer picture. If you understand this statment, then i am sure you will start to see the point of view of those people who are anti Shepard, not necessarily agree with them, but understand them. And bytheway, i dont think there is anyone who actually thinks that Shepard was the worst chairman ever.

I take it you haven't read Morts comments about spendign in January [/astonished] You must be someone else who can't accept bare facts laid out in front of you, when they don't suit your opinions ? Basically, if the club don't act to fill glaring hole in the team, and say they won't act, what conclusion do you draw ? We haven't been s*** for years either BTW. I thought you were one of the better posters, until you said that. yeah, i've seen his comments, it made sense to me, i'm giving him a clean slate so i'll wait until the end of the season to make my judgement on how their first season in charge went, given the circumstances bare facts? we're specualting over what the club MIGHT do in january, there are no facts yet, and facts change my opinions, so, eh, what? i'm not sure if its a break down in communication but as far as i'm aware by saying years that can class as 2 years at the least, and i feel pretty assured that we've been s*** for at least two years, i dont really mind what you think of me well, I suppose if you've followed the club for 5 or 6 years, then the last 2 years could seem a long time. And if you've only supported the club since 1992, then the last few years have been comparitively not too good. But if you've supported the club longer than that, they have been a long way short of s***, and for that, you'll have to take my word for it. no i wont, there are many other sources of information, i dont have to take your word for anything, you've never said anything thats changed my views, as i'm sure i've never said anything thats changed yours, might aswell just pack it in Aye, and other sources of information will confirm that we have been a damn sight worse in previous decades than in the last couple of years. oh you're joining in are you? i wasnt beamed into the planet 2 years ago, i have a decent understanding of our history, i still think we've been s*** for the last few years, i was simply saying i dont have to take his word for it because he tends to get a bit preachy if you dont nip it in the bud Where was the, "na na ni na na....." I'm sure it would fit in well after your hissy bit in bold. If you have any understanding of the history of the club you'll know that as poor as the last few seasons have been there have been far, far worse in the memory of MANY supporters who still go to matches today. Anyone who is remotely successful in there life, are never happy with what they achieve. What you're saying there is that many people are grateful becasue of what they had to see. Well, im saying that in 92 we were in a position to estabilish ourselves as a dominant force in the premiership, we were on a level playin field with everyone, infact come 95(?) we were in a position to estabilish ourselves as THE dominant team in the premiership, but becasue oft he ineptitude of the board , failed, we fell so far behind it seems like an impossible task to do but we did. So by the modern view, what has been achieved isnt good enough, we didnt take the oppurtunity we were given therefore we wasted a golden oppurtunity, there cant be any excuse for that. No matter how bad it was. You're quite clearly one of these "it'll do" people. You clearly have absolutely no idea of where the old board found the club, claiming they were "inept". Must admit, this has made me laugh. In 1995 Sir John was chairman, Keegan was manager, and it was the year before we nearly won the league. Such is your lack of knowledge, you put a question mark against it. Credibily destroyed, I'm afraid. Yeh i understnd that, i understand about the state of the club was abhorrent pre Fletcher, Hall and Shep, what im trying to say, and as you have correctly pointed out my knowledge basis isnt fantastic on the account of having a life etc, but from my point of view, irrespective of who was in charge of the club or the position we were in i feel we wasted a golden oppurtunity to be a huge club. Now i dont claim to be a SOOPAFAN, i wouldnt dare pass myself of as that, all im tryin to do is offer my views on the clubs recent history, not the past, becasues thats not strictly relevant. Supposing the club started was created in 92, and what happened in the past didnt exist, how would you view the current situation and handling of the club? Thats the point of view that i am using.

How can that possibly be a fact? Because Keegan says so. He said that Shepherd, Fletcher and Hall Jnr wanted him, and Hall Snr didn't. Unless you know better ... whatever misinterpretation others wish to say .... I'm sure i remember seeing a Keegan quote...something along the lines of...(on the phone to SJH) "there are only 2 people who can save this club now, and they're on the phone to each other now" Does that mean anything?

If you read what he is typing, you would realise he is not really arsed about Jan or summer, he is more bothered signing players that are better than the current players. Which once we take out some of the crap in your posts is exactly the same thing your saying. OH MY GOD, well if you read any of my f****** posts you'll realises im talking about the Jan period, do you know why? Becasuse its directively related to Morts quotes. I>E THIS WHOLE THREAD. You have to be an amazing spin doctor to be able to attribue those quotes to anything other than this immediate transfer window. AND for the 20th time, i ve openly agreed with NE5 and others that we should adress the weaknesses in our squad, ie the signing of Woodgate etc, but i dont think we should be filling the squad at this time. Seriously, some people are so stupid, ive tried to include as much generic detail, addressing as many issues as i can but it seems many people struggle at the first f****** step. In the post I quoted you definitely mention the summer. Who is being a spin doctor? Me? NE5? You? I know you keep agreeing with NE5 on points, that is why I find it strange you asked your 'hypothetical' question. Did I touch nerve hinny? For your own sanity dont reply to this post, because I reckon you may turn out like How old are you? I mentioned summer as part of a hypothetical situation, the aim was to try and look at the summer period in context to the jan period. If you were to ask the fans out there the same situation im sure most of them would opt for the summer. but why? Thats what i was trying to get at. Theres a reason why people prefer the summer, and im sure its the saem for the clubs. Thats all im saying. i dont think ive ever spoken to anyone so stupid that they cant see that. Nevermind eh! I've been able to see ne5 points about generally strengthening the squad, obviously in order for the club to progress we need to invest to strengthen goes without saying. Of course, generally speaking his views are correct, im not arguing contrare to that but the bits that i disagree with are the ones which are directly relevant to Morts quotes. Says that we should sign all the time, which i disagree with, hence the points about Jan window period, whcih i will reiterate again, is releavant to Morts quotes. do you see where the difference in our arguments lie? ....probably not I don;t think most supporters would say the summer - not that it makes any difference anyway. Why would you not want a player who will improve the team in asap ? I don't see why you should not always be looking to improve your team, thats what football is all about. We have half the season left, we could qualify for europe with a couple of good players for the right positions, so why do you want to write it off and why would you support the board if they took the same stance. As I've said, I find such an attitude from them to be very worrying. In fact, to coin a word you used yourself, its a s*** approach. And, you WERE losing your cool, as HTL pointed out. Which makes you look very childish, not him for pointing it out. - Well then we're gonna have to agree to disagree there. If £40m was available to spend in only one of the transfer periods, im sure people would rather go for the summer period. The reasons that they'd give are exactly the same reasons that i am giving to support my view that too much money shouldnt be spent in Jan. This might be a difficult concept for you, but i actuall agree with you on this point and have stated throughout my posts this view, but i guess your in selective reading mode so must of missed it. I just think theres 2 types of transfers, transfers which imporve the team, and transfers which improve the squad. Again, without sounding patronizing, do you know the diffrerence? Becasue i have already said that we should be using the period to adress the weakness of the team and not the squad. As a club we are continuosly looking for quick fixes, before the season, we were happy to finish in a top 10 position. By your logic arent you selling yourself short, really showing a bit of a lack of ambition. Why dont we just try and improve the squad to title challenges, we can afford it. By your way we should be doing that, which bit of compromise in your brain has acknowledged that that isnt a possiblity, it needs to be a slower process but why?? oh, nothing is a difficult concept for me. I've supported NUFC too long for that. I'm talking back to when we were really s*** mind, which is a concept that I suspect is too difficult for you. By your last paragraph, it would appear you are simply a victim of the current hype and cliches. I don't suppose you complained too much when we played in the Champions League, due to the quick fix of Bellamy and Robert massively improving what was a mid table team. One day your brain may realise that if you want to reach these heights, you set standards, and the quicker you get there the better. I am pleased for you that you are happy with mid table league positions, despite moaning that it is s***. Quick fix ? What a load of bollocks. I am pleased for you that you are happy with mid table league positions, despite moaning that it is s***. Talk about using cliches! I mean, what does that mean? What hype? What cliche? Im just merely agreeing with Morts views on the January transfer window, i think its a good idea saving money in the january period where it will be put to better use in the summer period. I agree with you that money needs to be spent inthe jan period, but i disagree of the amount of money, your view is that we shoudl spend as much money as possible as often as you can. After witnesing the club do that for the past 10 years and see not a single trophy and being left £80m in debt, i'm more than happy to try a different approach. I'd hardly call Robert and Bellamy an ironic "quick fix", how long had SBR been in charge before they were signed? Do you think the transofrmation of the club would of been even more dramatic had they been signed in the first year? honestly mate, after the past 4 seasons of dross, i am definitely happy with a stable mid table finish this season. Any improvement on that would be a bonus. Would i be happy with a mid table finish next season? Would i bollocks. Why? Becasue the foundations are set and we need to improve. I have reality on my side, and before the season started, even though i knew that with the squad we possessed European qualification was possible, i knew deep down with so much change it was asking just that little bit too much. By demanading Europe in the first season, your automaitcally expecting CL as the next progressive step. Now thats a target you have set SA and the current board fo CL qualification in 2 years. Maybe that is true, there are always 2 sides of the coin, and signing supposed quality isnt always a guaratee, we could stay static, which would be even more of a disaster. I tohught that the aquisition of Luque and Boumsong were testament to that.

Whats so "funny"? I dont understand, me and you truly are on different wavelengths, i genuinely cannot understand where you're coming from no matter how hard i try.

Did you see him get his man of the match award yesterday? Doesn't speak a word of English! I think that's one of the biggest reasons Geremi got it, he speaks French, English, Spanish and Turkish, so he can communicate with everyone in the team. I thought he was already a popular guy around nufc. Surely in todays modern multicultural teams, language barrier isnt too much of an issue on the pitch? I do see your point though!

How can anyone criticize another person method of implenting success without the anyhting being completed? Anyone who criticizes Mort at this period of time is opening themselves for ridicule, 5 months. Shepards regime, as much as i would like it to be buried as history, cant be ignored as its still a heated topic, some people think that he was partly responsible for dragging the club out of dark times. And they are undoubtedly correct, however others, and this is my view thik that under Shepards stewardship wasted the golden oppurtunity to make a real success out of this club, some people point that making us the 5th most qualified team for europe in premiership is his claim for success, but the more ambitious of us think that we could of been a dominant team and therefore look back at his stewardship with great rue.

I take it you haven't read Morts comments about spendign in January [/astonished] You must be someone else who can't accept bare facts laid out in front of you, when they don't suit your opinions ? Basically, if the club don't act to fill glaring hole in the team, and say they won't act, what conclusion do you draw ? We haven't been s*** for years either BTW. I thought you were one of the better posters, until you said that. yeah, i've seen his comments, it made sense to me, i'm giving him a clean slate so i'll wait until the end of the season to make my judgement on how their first season in charge went, given the circumstances bare facts? we're specualting over what the club MIGHT do in january, there are no facts yet, and facts change my opinions, so, eh, what? i'm not sure if its a break down in communication but as far as i'm aware by saying years that can class as 2 years at the least, and i feel pretty assured that we've been s*** for at least two years, i dont really mind what you think of me well, I suppose if you've followed the club for 5 or 6 years, then the last 2 years could seem a long time. And if you've only supported the club since 1992, then the last few years have been comparitively not too good. But if you've supported the club longer than that, they have been a long way short of s***, and for that, you'll have to take my word for it. no i wont, there are many other sources of information, i dont have to take your word for anything, you've never said anything thats changed my views, as i'm sure i've never said anything thats changed yours, might aswell just pack it in Aye, and other sources of information will confirm that we have been a damn sight worse in previous decades than in the last couple of years. oh you're joining in are you? i wasnt beamed into the planet 2 years ago, i have a decent understanding of our history, i still think we've been s*** for the last few years, i was simply saying i dont have to take his word for it because he tends to get a bit preachy if you dont nip it in the bud Where was the, "na na ni na na....." I'm sure it would fit in well after your hissy bit in bold. If you have any understanding of the history of the club you'll know that as poor as the last few seasons have been there have been far, far worse in the memory of MANY supporters who still go to matches today. Anyone who is remotely successful in there life, are never happy with what they achieve. What you're saying there is that many people are grateful becasue of what they had to see. Well, im saying that in 92 we were in a position to estabilish ourselves as a dominant force in the premiership, we were on a level playin field with everyone, infact come 95(?) we were in a position to estabilish ourselves as THE dominant team in the premiership, but becasue oft he ineptitude of the board, failed, we fell so far behind it seems like an impossible task to do but we did. So by the modern view, what has been achieved isnt good enough, we didnt take the oppurtunity we were given therefore we wasted a golden oppurtunity, there cant be any excuse for that. No matter how bad it was. You're quite clearly one of these "it'll do" people.

I take it you haven't read Morts comments about spendign in January [/astonished] You must be someone else who can't accept bare facts laid out in front of you, when they don't suit your opinions ? Basically, if the club don't act to fill glaring hole in the team, and say they won't act, what conclusion do you draw ? We haven't been s*** for years either BTW. I thought you were one of the better posters, until you said that. yeah, i've seen his comments, it made sense to me, i'm giving him a clean slate so i'll wait until the end of the season to make my judgement on how their first season in charge went, given the circumstances bare facts? we're specualting over what the club MIGHT do in january, there are no facts yet, and facts change my opinions, so, eh, what? i'm not sure if its a break down in communication but as far as i'm aware by saying years that can class as 2 years at the least, and i feel pretty assured that we've been s*** for at least two years, i dont really mind what you think of me well, I suppose if you've followed the club for 5 or 6 years, then the last 2 years could seem a long time. And if you've only supported the club since 1992, then the last few years have been comparitively not too good. But if you've supported the club longer than that, they have been a long way short of s***, and for that, you'll have to take my word for it. no i wont, there are many other sources of information, i dont have to take your word for anything, you've never said anything thats changed my views, as i'm sure i've never said anything thats changed yours, might aswell just pack it in Aye, and other sources of information will confirm that we have been a damn sight worse in previous decades than in the last couple of years. oh you're joining in are you? i wasnt beamed into the planet 2 years ago, i have a decent understanding of our history, i still think we've been s*** for the last few years, i was simply saying i dont have to take his word for it because he tends to get a bit preachy if you dont nip it in the bud Where was the, "na na ni na na....." I'm sure it would fit in well after your hissy bit in bold. If you have any understanding of the history of the club you'll know that as poor as the last few seasons have been there have been far, far worse in the memory of MANY supporters who still go to matches today. i dont like the beatles, i've never disputed that there's been harder times, ever, irrelevant Exactly, noone is doubting the past of this club, but again, why is that relevant to the modern times, world history is littered with darker times, but you cant go through life justifying present life in context to how bad it was. This concept applies to all forms of life, there will always be worse times, be a a countries history, or a governemnt, but people dont go through life, comparing the modern fallacies of these governments and countries with the ones that occured in the past. Can you imagine a Black person complaining about the Governemnts treatment of the New Orleans disaster and being rebutted by being told "you should be glad, it was worse worse in the past for you folk" Thats basically the crux of your argument. "vYou should of been here during the McKeag days..." What you have described above is not even close to what people are on about. Having made your misinterpretation you won't be able to grasp what is really being said and no amount of posts trying to explain is going to make any difference to you. You do not understand what is being posted. So goodnight. Yeh, i guess i gotta agree with ya there, i have no idea what your on about, i know that we struggled immensly in the past, but i still dont know how thats enitrely relevant with the cureent regimes, i dont know where the direct link is, Can i just ask then, what is the link between the past decades and how should it effect the present regime in the present climate of football? I mean, i think the modern history of nufc started at 92 when we were in a position to estabilish ourselves as a dominant force. We'd concequered the difficult period, that was definitevely the past from that point onwards. We were in an amazing situation but we blew it. While it might sound condensending, i promise you i'm not but could you explain your point of view regardign the past so i can understand. As you might of guessed im not from that generation but would like to learn.

If you read what he is typing, you would realise he is not really arsed about Jan or summer, he is more bothered signing players that are better than the current players. Which once we take out some of the crap in your posts is exactly the same thing your saying. OH MY GOD, well if you read any of my f****** posts you'll realises im talking about the Jan period, do you know why? Becasuse its directively related to Morts quotes. I>E THIS WHOLE THREAD. You have to be an amazing spin doctor to be able to attribue those quotes to anything other than this immediate transfer window. AND for the 20th time, i ve openly agreed with NE5 and others that we should adress the weaknesses in our squad, ie the signing of Woodgate etc, but i dont think we should be filling the squad at this time. Seriously, some people are so stupid, ive tried to include as much generic detail, addressing as many issues as i can but it seems many people struggle at the first f****** step. In the post I quoted you definitely mention the summer. Who is being a spin doctor? Me? NE5? You? I know you keep agreeing with NE5 on points, that is why I find it strange you asked your 'hypothetical' question. Did I touch nerve hinny? For your own sanity dont reply to this post, because I reckon you may turn out like How old are you? I mentioned summer as part of a hypothetical situation, the aim was to try and look at the summer period in context to the jan period. If you were to ask the fans out there the same situation im sure most of them would opt for the summer. but why? Thats what i was trying to get at. Theres a reason why people prefer the summer, and im sure its the saem for the clubs. Thats all im saying. i dont think ive ever spoken to anyone so stupid that they cant see that. Nevermind eh! I've been able to see ne5 points about generally strengthening the squad, obviously in order for the club to progress we need to invest to strengthen goes without saying. Of course, generally speaking his views are correct, im not arguing contrare to that but the bits that i disagree with are the ones which are directly relevant to Morts quotes. Says that we should sign all the time, which i disagree with, hence the points about Jan window period, whcih i will reiterate again, is releavant to Morts quotes. do you see where the difference in our arguments lie? ....probably not I don;t think most supporters would say the summer - not that it makes any difference anyway. Why would you not want a player who will improve the team in asap ? I don't see why you should not always be looking to improve your team, thats what football is all about. We have half the season left, we could qualify for europe with a couple of good players for the right positions, so why do you want to write it off and why would you support the board if they took the same stance. As I've said, I find such an attitude from them to be very worrying. In fact, to coin a word you used yourself, its a s*** approach. And, you WERE losing your cool, as HTL pointed out. Which makes you look very childish, not him for pointing it out. - Well then we're gonna have to agree to disagree there. If £40m was available to spend in only one of the transfer periods, im sure people would rather go for the summer period. The reasons that they'd give are exactly the same reasons that i am giving to support my view that too much money shouldnt be spent in Jan. This might be a difficult concept for you, but i actuall agree with you on this point and have stated throughout my posts this view, but i guess your in selective reading mode so must of missed it. I just think theres 2 types of transfers, transfers which imporve the team, and transfers which improve the squad. Again, without sounding patronizing, do you know the diffrerence? Becasue i have already said that we should be using the period to adress the weakness of the team and not the squad. As a club we are continuosly looking for quick fixes, before the season, we were happy to finish in a top 10 position. By your logic arent you selling yourself short, really showing a bit of a lack of ambition. Why dont we just try and improve the squad to title challenges, we can afford it. By your way we should be doing that, which bit of compromise in your brain has acknowledged that that isnt a possiblity, it needs to be a slower process but why??

I take it you haven't read Morts comments about spendign in January [/astonished] You must be someone else who can't accept bare facts laid out in front of you, when they don't suit your opinions ? Basically, if the club don't act to fill glaring hole in the team, and say they won't act, what conclusion do you draw ? We haven't been s*** for years either BTW. I thought you were one of the better posters, until you said that. yeah, i've seen his comments, it made sense to me, i'm giving him a clean slate so i'll wait until the end of the season to make my judgement on how their first season in charge went, given the circumstances bare facts? we're specualting over what the club MIGHT do in january, there are no facts yet, and facts change my opinions, so, eh, what? i'm not sure if its a break down in communication but as far as i'm aware by saying years that can class as 2 years at the least, and i feel pretty assured that we've been s*** for at least two years, i dont really mind what you think of me well, I suppose if you've followed the club for 5 or 6 years, then the last 2 years could seem a long time. And if you've only supported the club since 1992, then the last few years have been comparitively not too good. But if you've supported the club longer than that, they have been a long way short of s***, and for that, you'll have to take my word for it. no i wont, there are many other sources of information, i dont have to take your word for anything, you've never said anything thats changed my views, as i'm sure i've never said anything thats changed yours, might aswell just pack it in Aye, and other sources of information will confirm that we have been a damn sight worse in previous decades than in the last couple of years. oh you're joining in are you? i wasnt beamed into the planet 2 years ago, i have a decent understanding of our history, i still think we've been s*** for the last few years, i was simply saying i dont have to take his word for it because he tends to get a bit preachy if you dont nip it in the bud Where was the, "na na ni na na....." I'm sure it would fit in well after your hissy bit in bold. If you have any understanding of the history of the club you'll know that as poor as the last few seasons have been there have been far, far worse in the memory of MANY supporters who still go to matches today. i dont like the beatles, i've never disputed that there's been harder times, ever, irrelevant Exactly, noone is doubting the past of this club, but again, why is that relevant to the modern times, world history is littered with darker times, but you cant go through life justifying present life in context to how bad it was. This concept applies to all forms of life, there will always be worse times, be a a countries history, or a governemnt, but people dont go through life, comparing the modern fallacies of these governments and countries with the ones that occured in the past. Can you imagine a Black person complaining about the Governemnts treatment of the New Orleans disaster and being rebutted by being told "you should be glad, it was worse worse in the past for you folk" Thats basically the crux of your argument. "vYou should of been here during the McKeag days..."

If you read what he is typing, you would realise he is not really arsed about Jan or summer, he is more bothered signing players that are better than the current players. Which once we take out some of the crap in your posts is exactly the same thing your saying. OH MY GOD, well if you read any of my f****** posts you'll realises im talking about the Jan period, do you know why? Becasuse its directly related to Morts quotes. I>E THIS WHOLE THREAD. You have to be an amazing spin doctor to be able to attribue those quotes to anything other than this immediate transfer window. AND for the 20th time, i ve openly agreed with NE5 and others that we should adress the weaknesses in our squad, ie the signing of Woodgate etc, but i dont think we should be filling the squad at this time. Seriously, some people are so stupid, ive tried to include as much generic detail, addressing as many issues as i can but it seems many people struggle at the first f****** step. Directively? What the hell is that? And what's with the gobbing off and bad language? It seems you're losing your cool, sunshine. I suggest you go and have a can of pop, or something. Grow up mate, and respond to the post. Not much point. From what I'm reading you're on automatic misinterpretation of everything put in front of you..... Go take a walk and come back later. Well said mate, really stepped up there didnt you "sunshine"! Talk about irony. Im talking about morts quotes relevant to the coming jan period, the rest aren,t yet im the one whose misinterpreting everything. Please,nforgive me for coming into a thread about Mort and his views about the coming trasfer period, are daring to talk about the relevant article. i.e Mort and the Janurary trasfer period.

If you read what he is typing, you would realise he is not really arsed about Jan or summer, he is more bothered signing players that are better than the current players. Which once we take out some of the crap in your posts is exactly the same thing your saying. OH MY GOD, well if you read any of my f****** posts you'll realises im talking about the Jan period, do you know why? Becasuse its directively related to Morts quotes. I>E THIS WHOLE THREAD. You have to be an amazing spin doctor to be able to attribue those quotes to anything other than this immediate transfer window. AND for the 20th time, i ve openly agreed with NE5 and others that we should adress the weaknesses in our squad, ie the signing of Woodgate etc, but i dont think we should be filling the squad at this time. Seriously, some people are so stupid, ive tried to include as much generic detail, addressing as many issues as i can but it seems many people struggle at the first f****** step. In the post I quoted you definitely mention the summer. Who is being a spin doctor? Me? NE5? You? I know you keep agreeing with NE5 on points, that is why I find it strange you asked your 'hypothetical' question. Did I touch nerve hinny? For your own sanity dont reply to this post, because I reckon you may turn out like How old are you? I mentioned summer as part of a hypothetical situation, the aim was to try and look at the summer period in context to the jan period. If you were to ask the fans out there the same situation im sure most of them would opt for the summer. but why? Thats what i was trying to get at. Theres a reason why people prefer the summer, and im sure its the saem for the clubs. Thats all im saying. i dont think ive ever spoken to anyone so stupid that they cant see that. Nevermind eh! I've been able to see ne5 points about generally strengthening the squad, obviously in order for the club to progress we need to invest to strengthen goes without saying. Of course, generally speaking his views are correct, im not arguing contrare to that but the bits that i disagree with are the ones which are directly relevant to Morts quotes. Says that we should sign all the time, which i disagree with, hence the points about Jan window period, whcih i will reiterate again, is releavant to Morts quotes. What has NE5 or you argued that can be attributed to anything that Mort has said. Where has he said that we wont be aigning any players in Jan? Ive seen him say that signing defenders wont be the answer, ive seen him say we will be looking to invest primarily in youth, and ive also heard him say that as of yet, no targets have been outlined becasue SA has pitched anything to him. do you see where the difference in our arguments lie? ....probably not

If you read what he is typing, you would realise he is not really arsed about Jan or summer, he is more bothered signing players that are better than the current players. Which once we take out some of the crap in your posts is exactly the same thing your saying. OH MY GOD, well if you read any of my f****** posts you'll realises im talking about the Jan period, do you know why? Becasuse its directly related to Morts quotes. I>E THIS WHOLE THREAD. You have to be an amazing spin doctor to be able to attribue those quotes to anything other than this immediate transfer window. AND for the 20th time, i ve openly agreed with NE5 and others that we should adress the weaknesses in our squad, ie the signing of Woodgate etc, but i dont think we should be filling the squad at this time. Seriously, some people are so stupid, ive tried to include as much generic detail, addressing as many issues as i can but it seems many people struggle at the first f****** step. Directively? What the hell is that? And what's with the gobbing off and bad language? It seems you're losing your cool, sunshine. I suggest you go and have a can of pop, or something. Grow up mate, and respond to the post.

If you read what he is typing, you would realise he is not really arsed about Jan or summer, he is more bothered signing players that are better than the current players. Which once we take out some of the crap in your posts is exactly the same thing your saying. OH MY GOD, well if you read any of my f****** posts you'll realises im talking about the advantages and disadvantages of fully utilzing the Jan period, do you know why? Becasuse its directively related to Morts quotes. I.E THE POINT OF THIS WHOLE THREAD. I never intended to talk about the old regime and if you look you'll see the old board was mentioned not by me, but by......guess? You have to be an amazing spin doctor to be able to attribue those quotes to anything other than this immediate transfer window but that is exactly what has happened. People are intimating that he's showing no ambtion etc....what a load of bollocks. AND for the 20th time, i ve openly agreed with NE5 and others that we should adress the weaknesses in our squad, ie the signing of Woodgate etc, but i dont think we should be filling the squad at this time. Seriously, some people are so stupid, ive tried to include as much generic detail, addressing as many issues as i can but it seems many people struggle at the first f****** step.

What about Cacapa? Seems to tick all the boxes in my book.

We also bought Woodgate in the January, I hope nobody is saying we shouldn't buy a player of that calibre just because its the "wrong time" - a completely absurd view if ever you saw one. Mate, you're an idiot, I've never known anyone as selective as you. Can you point out anyone in this thread who says we shouldnt sign players of high calibre if available and essential. It's all about context mate, and the context that most people were trying to imply was that generally speaking, using the January period to try and build a squad isnt the most practical thing to try and do, both business wise, and importantly footballing wise. Not a single person in this thread has said we shouldnt sign any players in the Jan period but that seems to be the context your asserting in your posts. Without sounding patronizing, do you know the difference between squad strengthening and squad building? If you see the difference that i do, then you would understand that squad building(i.e adding depth and quality throughout the squad) in January is a bad idea for a number of reasons, whereas squad strengthening (i.e, addressignt the weaknesses of the team) is what is required. Thats the point im trying to argue anyway. there's only one idiot here mate. It doesn't matter a toss when you buy players if they are quality. Re-read your stupid comments. As for "building a team". It may escape your notice that we have a few pretty good seasons in the last 15 years, with a pretty decent team. You should at all times buy the best quality players you can. Any other suggestion is just plain daft. Well this is the crux of my argument, that in actual fact, there are many reasons not to go out and buy as many players you can as soon as you can, they are reasons which dont apply to the summer season and definitively show the disadvantages of the January period. One of the biggest reasons its quite clearly the lack of talent that is actually out there, come Januray, alot of the players that we require to progress are playing for biggers clubs, in bigger club competitions. How do we as a club with nothing but decent finances have to offer. Do you suggest we go for the Chelsea route and through silly moeny at players as well as there clubs? Where is the precedent of success for that approach in our history? This leads to my second point, the inflated price of players, average players at that, it makes no sense to try and sign alot of players who will cost the club more money than they are worth. I mean, the odd player whose worth £2m more than he's actually worth may not sound much, but if we were to sign 3-4 such players thats an excess of £6-8m. Wheres the justification of that? Thats £8m excess gone out the clubs finance just becasue of the time we've spent the money. Can you yet see the relevance of what we're trying to say? By all means, if there is a player who is available come januray who we desperately need, i.e a DM or even an AM, then go get him, by all means "strengthen" the squad, but dont go trying to build a squad in january, beasue invariably we'll end up onverspending. This is what i was trying to say in my post. Look mate, its when you say stuff like this that makes you look like an idiot, the first line, i mean what relevance does that have, im well aware of us having a good squad in the past, what relevance does that have to my post? As for the second line, i've made my points clear, i want this club to suceed, ive always wanted an element of intelligence about the way the club is run, and finally we have someone who has a bit a brains about them. I dont want to see mone spunked up the wall just to appease inflated ambitions expectations of a few narrow minded people who cant see the big picture. If you ignore the points ive made above fine, but please answer me this? If we had £40 million to spend, and it had to spend it in one of the transfer periods, either January or the Summer, which period would you we rather spent the money in? It completely hypothetical i understand. I just want your views to see where you stand. Just to reiterate, i do believel we should sign essential players, but i dont think we should be signing players just for the sake of it.