fredbob

Yes martin was a big success , and a good singing by Shepard , but in the big picture is that really an achievement to substantiate the claim he was a good chairman? This was the same chairmen would paid £11m for Luque (nufc.com) £8m for Boum-shlong etc? it can all be flipped around, in fact i dont know why i'm even arguing that point, you've made it for me, why the hell under his chairmenship were we fighting relegation in the first place?? LEt me ask you this then, from when FS took charge, do you think we are where we could/should of been? Do you think that we have progressed as a club in the 10 years he has been in charge? Do you think that from when he took us over when we were title challengers (2nd) to where we are now (Uefa Cup hopefuls) shows a significant level of improvement? If yes then you're a fool, if the answers to theses questions are no, then you are forced to agree therefore that overall he wasn't a succes. Note i have generalised his tenure as Chairmanship and not picked out specific events to make my arguments. he was a signing by Roeder, not Shepherd, and from this point on your argument is pointless, as you clearly don't understand the management structure of a football club. Sorry like . lol, can you read? am not sure why that invalidates my argument, i was replying to someone elses query, in fact yet again, you miss the point of the entrie argument and pick out one tiny insignificant bit, you're embarressingly infuiriating. You seem to have ignored some of my others posts, ones that were directed to you.

Well its a pretty simple decision, yes he was right to sign martins, but how is that really relevant to the overall argument of him being a successful chairman?

Yes martin was a big success , and a good singing by Shepard, but in the big picture is that really an achievement to substantiate the claim he was a good chairman? This was the same chairmen would paid £11m for Luque (nufc.com) £8m for Boum-shlong etc? it can all be flipped around, in fact i dont know why i'm even arguing that point, you've made it for me, why the hell under his chairmenship were we fighting relegation in the first place?? LEt me ask you this then, from when FS took charge, do you think we are where we could/should of been? Do you think that we have progressed as a club in the 10 years he has been in charge? Do you think that from when he took us over when we were title challengers (2nd) to where we are now (Uefa Cup hopefuls) shows a significant level of improvement? If yes then you're a fool, if the answers to theses questions are no, then you are forced to agree therefore that overall he wasn't a succes. Note i have generalised his tenure as Chairmanship and not picked out specific events to make my arguments.

so ne5, have we, in your opinion progressed since FS took charge? are we overall in a better posiiton than we were when SJH was chairmaen, simple question, pretty much generalises this entire argument. Think carefully, dont refer to the past because for the 20th time thats exactly what it was the past. Now, i say this because its clear you were around in the dark days of this club and you seems intent on reminding us how bad you had it, just ike a grandad goes on about "how he got the cane in his days", and "you'd be lucky to get an orange for xmas in my day" well, noone is really interested in those type of arguments....if you continue to look at the less important past, you forget to look at the more important present and future. Think hard and answer honestly because if you think that we have progressed as a club financially and on the playing field then you honestly support your own argument, however, if you dont think we have progressed then it automatically means FS was a poor chairmen, simple as that....can you honestly say that he was a success, i have already acknowledged that SBR was a good move how many euro seasons did we get out of him? how many season was FS in charge and how many euro quals did we get, how many of those qulaifications we SBR and how many time did we qualify from positional qulaification i'e 5th, as opposed to FA cup losers? Tell me now, was FS a success? please just answer the question, with support for your answers and dont qutoe me on any tiny mistake i make and scrutinize the shit out of it? Sorry to sound like a teacher but its impossible to get a straight answer out of you...its like trying to nail diarroea to a fucking wall.

aye, I expect by the same criteria, you think Arsenal have gone monumentally backwards since they finished the season unbeaten, or do you think they should have stayed there - and they haven't even changed manager Ne5 is impossible to argue with, he gives you so much to correct it becomes impossible to answer them all, by your reckoning then ne5, why was shepard a good chairman? Is it because of the excellent financial situation he left us in? (+£80m) Is is because of the sucessful appointments he made? (Souness, Dalglish...) Is it because of the unquestionable uninterfereing support he gave to his managers?(Gary Speed, Carrck, Prozone...) Is it the finacial backing he gave to managers, money which he didnt have? (Northern Rock sponsorship money-Chris Mort) What actually, in his tenurship as Chariman of Newcastle united football club was so damn important to this football club that makes you defend him so vehementely, something which 51, 999 people seemed to hae missed yet you have seen? You see, i struggle to see what impact he has had, his biggest achivement was SBR, and for 5 odd years, we were in a superb position, SBR was on the decline, i think its impossible to argue that point and it was time that we looked to a future with a manager that could of taken us to the next level, instead he single handedly destroyed those 5 odd years of excellent progress making the success SBR brought irrelevant, destroyed, pointless...by undermining SBR and saying by publically stating he wasn't going to have his contract renewed before even telling SBR he undermined SBR in the biggest sense, the dressing room was gone, by these actions he made one of the biggest jobs in england unwantable, how many chairmen are capable of doing this? Cue Souness and Roeder, a mess that we are starting to rectify now, i personnaly hold Shepard responsible for all these things this is the reason i feel he was terrible, the only thing that would of made me be less scathing to Shepard would of been if he handled the financial sides of the club well....did his job properly, but i personally dont think he did, its your call to criticise that fact but we are both clueless as the the true financial situation of the club and can therefore only specualte. I put it to you ne5 to try and justify your opinion,all without refereing to the 1920's please??? Please?

in fact mate, I'm sorry to say, but you are completely contradicting yourself. you say he should "protect and develop the clubs future", then complain about the debt, when the "manageable" debt is due largely to developing the clubs future. It is also due to attempting to "supporting the playing side of the club" is it not ? Do you condone it or not ? You also complain about the debt further, then say that he didn't support his manager in the summer of 2003. Apart from doing a little bit of research and working out that we spent a lot of money to qualify for the Champions League, including being the ONLY major spenders in January 2003, where exactly do you think the "80m" debt had came from, if he/they haven't tried to be successful in some form or other ? You seem very confused from where I'm sitting, and basically just looking for an angle to attack them, without looking at anything correctly and factually. As for "undermining the manager", I don't consider that in view of the huge backing that ALL the managers have had, not one of them has been hindered from doing their job and attempting to win trophies in any shape or form whatsoever. Again, the 80m quid "debt" which has been accrued, must have came from somewhere. Perhaps, you could tell us how it has been accumulated, if you say they haven't supported the managers "to build for the future" ? You never say anything quite articulated enough for me to understand, dont get me wrong im the exact same but you seem to get into alot of debates with people....there has to be some reason why??? Perhaps its your use of bolding to outline things to fit your argument....for example....you read whats in bold and interpret how you like....i dont understand this defence of Shepard, was he actually solely responsible for the redevelopment of SJP? if so, then some of your arguments have merits, you see im not bothered about anything which was under SJH chairmanship i want to try and breakdown what actually he did good for the club, the best thing he did was appiont SBR, but what else? i may be incorrect with some if not alot of my facts, but i stand by my view that he was incompenetent and has done very little good for this club. We could go down the route of assessing his appointments but i know that we'd have to agree to disagree because i am sure you will justify his appointments byt there CV, my only comment to that is that you are only as good as your last game if you are a player, and i cant rememebr Dalglish or Souness being particulry successful prior to there appointments. although please dont quote me, i judge a manager on the sucess of his team, how they play and there affects on individuals not just on how many shiny things they've won in an obscure league, to subjective. i shall carry on this "debate" later, but in the mean time i'd apreciate hearing your justification for Shepard being a good Chairmen, what has given you this impression? all without referrring to the 1930's would be nice as well. please

prpblem is, how often does he have "his day". He's a good player, but goes missing too often. i agree, 'his day' is often on every other match but a consistent emre will be needed to sort out our visionless midfield. its a pretty objective view to say he has off days, theres not been too many players we can really shout about for the last 2/3 seasons. Emre isn't much of a player without possesiion. FACT, but with 2 combative midfielders behind him allowing him to be more independent, would (in theory) do wonders for his game, last season was a joke for him, it was clear that he was much better with butt because butt could sit deep and allow him posession, put Geremi AND butt behind him i can see a very consistent team player for us...potentially very important player for us

In everyones opionins then, what is actually a chairmens job?? In my opinion, the job of a chairmen is to run the clb as a business, protecting and developing the clubs future whilst supporting the playing side of the Club ensuring a good chance of achieving something, now its laughable that people can defend Shepard by using the "I backed all my managers" crap, correct me if i'm worng but we were £80m in debt under his stewardship, he constantly undermined SBR when it was imperative that he didn't, he failed to back SBR the summer before we were knocked out of the CL to Partizan Belgrade iirc, an idiotic thing to do, and he "spent money that wasnt there yet" accoring to Chris Mort, which i assume is the Northern Rock money which was spent on Luque et al. He his appointemnts have been laughable at time, but i wont lambast him too much on this point as i can imagine it was near impossible to appoint anyone, which itself seems a joke. I just want to know what peoples justifications are for even attempt to defend him, i could go on and on about his inadequecies as a Cahirmen....anyone care to oblige

Ya see, i think 433 would suit him alot this season, i think we'd get alot of width with a 433 opening up alot of space between the channells between centre half and full back, this is ideal territory for Emre to slot his balls passes. The only real problems i can envisage this season with emre are injuries and how Barton and Smith, especially Smith could affect his chances in the team.

Bit early to say, but i think that Cacapa could have the same affect on nufc that Woodgate did. Also, i think Barton could turn out to be a very very good signing, i think he's the type of player who struggles to have a quiet game, which i like, sort of a poorm mans Keane. My only tiny concern with the transfers at the moment is the lack of any real attacking players. Which to me suggests that SA is keen to play the kind of football which grind out 1-0 wins, which isnt a problem but isn't exactly the most inspiring!! To me there isn't enough balance in the squad, it just seems very defensivly heavy.

ahhh.....bitter nufc fans, who'd of thought! Not being funy but thats exactly what i'd of done if i was in his posiiton, its just quick thinking, all this "rat faced cunt" business is a little embaressing!

Dont get it? Why is everyone anti Ole? I thought he was a good player, very intelligent and a bastard to mark. Shame he's retired cos he should have been seen more often

never thought in a millions years that Adriano to nufc was even a possibility, (not saying it is) but by the sounds of it he's very available i would absolutely love him here, hell i'd love it if he were any premierhip side, i think he'd be more suited to the premiership than Ronaldihono would love it LOVE IT if he came!

if i had to choose one player who's considered untouchable cos of the problems off the field he has it'd defeineitely be Adriano, i rate him so highly, i think he's one of a few players in the world who are actually able to single handedly destroy a team, i remember seeing him against Valencia a couple of years agao and he was immense. Got bags of ability and with his physique would be perfect for premiership, he's a very physical striker and uses his body very well. Unforntunaltey his willingess to leave Inter despite his several warning suggest he quite simply doesn't care, which is a terrible sign, posssibly irreversible.

Inever thought that he'd play straight away, i read an article on here a while back sayiin how Allardyce was extremely thorough in getting players adjusted to the english lifestyle and culture, stuff to help new players getting adjusted off the pitch before they get on it, like banks and churchs and housing, stuff like that, i can imiagine that with Enrique being a very young foriegn lad who has moved away from his honmeland family etc he'd get an bit longer readjustment period. Then again i could be wrong....he might just be crap...

is Cicihno still at Real? Worth a pop now alves is arriving??

To be fair, i dont think anyone in the premiership can trust any of there owners who arent part of the football tradition, (Abrahmovic, Lerner, Glazers) so i cant say i trust him, although his early signs have been ery very encouraging, i think the appointment of Mort could be one of the best things to happen to nufc because he seems like an intelligent articulated man who has a plan, the bottom line is that Ashley will only be in this for the profit and the fact that he hasn't cleared the debt but has made imore managable only sugges hat he wants the business to pay it off itself, and the only way he can do that is to make it a succes, which i think he will do. The early signs are very encouraging. I would much rather be in the position where we are now, then be throwing money around like Chelsea.

If there is one good thing to come out of this thread it is gonna be the newly acquired knowledge of who not to bother getting into a debate with because they quite clearly havent a clue what they're talking about! Ya can tell who they are because they're the ones bemoaning the teams efforts after 2 games! Couldnt believe it when i heard booing at FT.

This is such an ebarressing thread, how are we even thinking of forming these opinions after 2 games, ridculous. i had this down as a draw all over, it just looked like 2 well organized defensively sound sides cancelling each other out. I happened to think that that performance was better than 75% of anyhting we've seen the past 3 seasons, it was solid graft and was refreshing not seeing so many long balls being played from defense i thought zog and milner did alrite on the left but we were anonymous on the right. I liked the fact that despite not having the bit btween our teeth this game we still managed to finish the game not continuosly chasing shadows or being overly predictable and giving away cheap possession.

Yeh, thats what i think and i dont like it, i cant beleive we finally have the headache of keepind 3 maybe 4 "immense" CB happy. (i use the term immense in light of what we have had in the past) I just think Cacapa wont ant to stay, i think Taylor is dead cert to start. In fairness though we are trying to build a side to handle player injuries and resting over worked players before they break down, regardless if he does turn into a back up as many said I would rather be in a position as a manager to make these choices (or feel easier resting a player) than think s*** what kids can we throw into the mix which can potentially harm their development. Yeh mate, i agree, but i if cacapa does turn out to be class then its gona be such a wrench if he goes because of lack of oppurtnity, we aren't a good enough club just yet to keep a player with a rep like cacapa out the team, i think he's just too big a player at the mo to keep out the squad, i thin ksomeone like Roz would be more willig to sit out, but him and Stevie seems to have gelled well so...its just a point. I mean its sods law, you historically struggle to fill the CB with quality, then the oppurtunity to have 3 come at once.

Yeh, thats what i think and i dont like it, i cant beleive we finally have the headache of keepind 3 maybe 4 "immense" CB happy. (i use the term immense in light of what we have had in the past) I just think Cacapa wont ant to stay, i think Taylor is dead cert to start.

Out of all these posts i cant belive that only a handful of posters has pointed out the most important thing he said in that entire article...bollocks to the signings, its the quote above. It show how ignorant nufc fans are when they are unable to assess the effects of there booing on a players performnace. In the end, we're all supporters and thats exactly what she should f****** doing. In my humble opinion you support till the very last second. People are quick to point out how "we are the best supporters in the world" its the same people who seem to forget that at times, we can also be the most destructive. Read the thread title mate, it tends to happen that people post about what the thread title is actually about. Yeh mate thanks for proving my point, thats exactly what i mean, an entire thread has been made out of one tiny 'quote' and the most important part of that article has been missed by so many. How can you call yourself a supporter if ya dont fucking support?? As a nufc fan and as most intellignet fans realise this is far more important than us signing 2 more players.

Out of all these posts i cant belive that only a handful of posters has pointed out the most important thing he said in that entire article...bollocks to the signings, its the quote above. It show how ignorant nufc fans are when they are unable to assess the effects of there booing on a players performnace. In the end, we're all supporters and thats exactly what she should f****** doing. In my humble opinion you support till the very last second. People are quick to point out how "we are the best supporters in the world" its the same people who seem to forget that at times, we can also be the most destructive.

Top of the league anyone?!!!

To be honest, i dont rate him as a player, but i believe hes a good 4th striker, off the top of my head i cant think of any teams who can say that they have 4ths striker who'd they'd be happy to have in the starting line up, well no one out of the top 5 anyway, overall he's ample.