themanupstairs

“I think five points from our two home games will keep us up now.”   

good to know he's okay then

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/europe/8037118.stm

"We get a referee who has officiated in 10 Champions League games in his career. For me, for him to be given a semi-final at Stamford Bridge, that's not good enough," Terry told BBC Radio 5 Live.

 

In fact, the match official has been in charge of 28 Champions League games since 1999..

 

pwned

In discussing the final this morning, colleague of mine imparts this diamond of wisdom on me:

"team that scores more goals and concedes less will win. simple".

Took me a while to get it, but I think he's spot on 

Barca's midfield will destroy Man Utds. Biggest thing is, Messi Eto and Henry all track back and work hard to get the ball back, Nani Berbatove and Ronaldo don't.

eh? Berbatov was back in his own penalty area in open play (as in not defending a set-piece) at 3-0!!!

Also, kudos to dcmk and mrmojo for having a 3 page debate without resorting to insults. Good craic generally despite some repetition.

 

you mean i didn't call him a c***?  missed the boat there, s***

it's now or never mojo. Don't do it buddy. Don't. Do it  :colo:

Emotionally, it's great to see Chelsea get slapped round the face with a sucker punch in the last minute, absolutely loved it.

 

On a more rational level though, Chelsea did get robbed of a few things, the Pique handball being the main one. However, as has been mentioned, Barca have hardly been getting all the decisions over the 2 legs - the Henry pen that wasnt, constant hacking/diving from Chelsea players, and the ludicrous sending off of Abidal.

 

On one hand, a good defence seems to be vilified nowadays - it is a key part of the game and people defending well seems to be turning into another way of saying they're playing negatively. However on the other hand, Chelsea had it coming to them. Sitting back on a 1-0 lead, regardless of the chances they carved out the other end, was always a dangerous game. So what if Barca didn't have a shot on target? IMO they got all the encouragement they needed by being all over Chelsea, with one less man. In the end it was an excellent strike that got the goal that sent them through. Whether they deserved it is another matter, but on an emotional purist level, I'd agree they did.

 

The general argument about the final though seems to be slightly flawed (i.e. the opinion that a better final will be played out - which is different to 'the best footballing side got through'). On the face of it, you'd think it would. But I fear the final will not be dissimilar to either of the 2 matches these 2 played out last year; and quite similar to today's game. Don't rule out Man Utd adopting a rugged and robust style against Barca to stop them playing. I hope Man Utd try to play openly though. Ultimately I think it'll be Man Utd's attitude and style of play, that will determine how the final is played.

 

The tactics for a one-off final are totally different to those adopted for a 2 leg tie. I have no doubt in my mind that Man Utd will use their steam rolling attacking force as the best method of defence. What Ferguson will do is try to keep Barcelona busy defending, and expose their own defensive problems rather than worry about how they will attack. IMO Carrick, Scholes and Andreson will be key to whether they lift the trophy or not.

 

agree

 

carrick, scholes & anderson vs xavi, toure and iniesta

 

losing both full backs might well hurt Barca mind

Aye. Full back is the most important position tactically for a side as attacking as Barcelona. It will indeed hurt them. The players who will fill are certainly no mugs, but they possibly do not have the full season's momentum that Alves and Abidal have had. It will all depend on how quickly the scum's midfield can repossess the ball, especially Carrick, who if on form, has the fantastic ability to distribute play on par even with Xavi and Alonso.

The Premier League is where all the money is these days, and you only need to look at the dominance of English teams on the tournament over the last few years to see that, these days, the Premier League is the place to be.

 

As for which league is most entertaining, that's entirely subjective, but Premier League fans generally travel in big numbers, unlike fans in Spain, providing an element of home and away support at every game. When an away team scores in the Premier league there's a roar, but in Spain the fans hardly travel so if the home team concedes there is sometimes just a silence. Also, the Premier League is starting to become more competitive. Man Utd may win it again this year, but in the last few years we've seen it switch from Arsenal to Chelsea to Man Utd, with Liverpool threatening this year. Spain has been a two horse race for a while.

 

I do believe the Spanish league provides more flicks and tricks than the Premier League, for the simple reason that players have more freedom to 'try things'. In the Premier League there is little room or space and so even the great players will only do a few dribbles or tricks in a game. There can be a downside to having such a fast and physical league - it denies the freedom of expression. Robinho for example is a lot less exciting on the eye than he was in Spain. But for all the flicks and tricks, you also see a lot of passing it about in defence in Spain, something Premier League defenders don't have the luxury of doing. And lastly there's the element of diving and playacting which can make La Liga very frustrating to watch.

 

Right now there is no denying that the Premier League is top dog and looks like it will remain so at least for the new few years, because of all the money being poured into it. As for what kind of football you like to see, it's a purely individual choice. There are good and bad sides to each league, but they're both great leagues to watch IMO.

good to see you posting mate. That's very well put.

Also, kudos to dcmk and mrmojo for having a 3 page debate without resorting to insults. Good craic generally despite some repetition.

Emotionally, it's great to see Chelsea get slapped round the face with a sucker punch in the last minute, absolutely loved it.

 

On a more rational level though, Chelsea did get robbed of a few things, the Pique handball being the main one. However, as has been mentioned, Barca have hardly been getting all the decisions over the 2 legs - the Henry pen that wasnt, constant hacking/diving from Chelsea players, and the ludicrous sending off of Abidal.

 

On one hand, a good defence seems to be vilified nowadays - it is a key part of the game and people defending well seems to be turning into another way of saying they're playing negatively. However on the other hand, Chelsea had it coming to them. Sitting back on a 1-0 lead, regardless of the chances they carved out the other end, was always a dangerous game. So what if Barca didn't have a shot on target? IMO they got all the encouragement they needed by being all over Chelsea, with one less man. In the end it was an excellent strike that got the goal that sent them through. Whether they deserved it is another matter, but on an emotional purist level, I'd agree they did.

 

The general argument about the final though seems to be slightly flawed (i.e. the opinion that a better final will be played out - which is different to 'the best footballing side got through'). On the face of it, you'd think it would. But I fear the final will not be dissimilar to either of the 2 matches these 2 played out last year; and quite similar to today's game. Don't rule out Man Utd adopting a rugged and robust style against Barca to stop them playing. I hope Man Utd try to play openly though. Ultimately I think it'll be Man Utd's attitude and style of play, that will determine how the final is played.

The tactics for a one-off final are totally different to those adopted for a 2 leg tie. I have no doubt in my mind that Man Utd will use their steam rolling attacking force as the best method of defence. What Ferguson will do is try to keep Barcelona busy defending, and expose their own defensive problems rather than worry about how they will attack. IMO Carrick, Scholes and Andreson will be key to whether they lift the trophy or not.

Would love us to win ad come out with the chorus:

 

YOUR GOING DOWN WITH THE BORO!!!!

The sports direct banner on SJP should be changed to  "f*** off you stupid idiot, Barton  ."

with a smily at the end?

Didn't pick this up via the telecast - as i was away from my viewing set, on a couple of occasions - but i refer to the The Independent's post match review.

 

This observation and i'm paraphrasing ,"Mike Ashley, in the directors box, chuckled as Shearer was teased by the home support with the 'You should've stayed on the telly' chant.

 

Disappointing to say the very least, if true.

 

why is it disappointing when Shearer himself acknowledged the kop, came out of the dugout, and gave them a wave and a smile?

 

  :omg: MIKE CHUCKLED!!

 

Shearer acknowledging, and taking the piss out of the opposition - whether it be The Kop etc - isn't that unusual. Top players & managers alike cop it all the time, they exchange in the banter exchange, and ironically enough they tend to come out on top. Witness Bellamy's performances at SJP amidst the groundswell of abuse and booing he's received since his forced departure. With an ambitious board/owner in tow Shearer - as manager - might just harness the opportunity of inflicting the last laugh. Can't see it happening during Wor Mikey's ownership though.

 

At least you can see the funny side with regards to that 'breath of fresh air' - Big Mike - still being able to enjoy his leisurely afternoon at the football, amidst the club's current predicament thanks to his running of it over the last two years. Much like the sight of him sporting a broad smile while out of harm's way in the protective custody of the director's box at WHL, with the score at 0-1. Funnily enough i don't.

Did you see the shots of Mike Ashley when Liverpool scored? He wasn't smiling then! And neither was Shearer. Outside of that though, I get the feeling that the club has collectively decided to put on a brave face in amidst all the chaos and perilous state we're in. You can see it in Shearer's body language before matches, his first press conference, and his latest.

Also, the taunts coming from the Kop, their timing, and considering the scoreline, were funny as fuck tbh. Having a sense of humor to acknowledge sporting banter isn't the end of the world. Ashley can only make top tier decisions to aid in keeping us up. He's made a last ditch tackle hiring Shearer, and we all hope he can do the job. Smirking at some Scouse humor when you're down in the gutter isn't the end of the fucking world.

nothing but disgust for any arsenal fan who would turn on Wenger but in all truth his time is surely coming one way or another?

 

how long can he ignore the glaring deficiencies in his team is the question - diaby, song, denilson, djourou, silvestre & gallas will never be able to form a good enough defensive unit to protect his attackers and it needs to be dealt with

 

the diarra deal(s) were bonkers, as was him not signing palacios and recommending him to bruce!!  both of them would improve arsenal a great deal

 

they'll probably continue to finish 4th by being better footballers than the rest of the league but unless he takes some action to steel the team up they're not winning any of the big prizes again soon, and that would be such a shame for a great manager who is so close to creating something fantastic

 

I don't think they're that far off being a great side again. They need another top class centre back to partner Toure - the loss of Gallas and the feuding that has surrounded him has been a real blow.

 

I also think they need a better striker. Adebayor and Van Persie are good players but I don't think they'll take them from the top four to the top two, which is what they're aiming for.

 

Apart from that, I don't think there's much wrong. Fourth place and a Champions League semi is a good platform to build on.

 

yeah, but if he goes out in the summer and buys another striker/winger/14 year old as he's done in the last couple of windows they'll not improve much and you have to ask how long should they carry on with that?

 

depends what they're in it for, if it's to build a team to be successful then let him keep at it, but if they want success in the very near future beyond an FA cup then forget it - man u, chelsea & liverpool are striking the right balance, arsenal are not

On the other hand there´s the small matter of one Andrei Arshavin, which at least gives them the extra edge needed in forward positions. All-in-all they're probably one CB and another striker short of assembling quite a stunning team...

Erm, they also need a couple of bastard midfielders in the mold of Vieira and Petit. The midfielders they have now pale in comparison to those two, and even to the Ray Parlour of the later years.

I wonder if it's been tried on the training pitch? The old Viduka/Smith duo.

Who knows anymore. Bah 

was considering making a thread about this so certain people could explain themselves but i'll ask in here:

 

WHERE THE f*** DOES ANYONE GET OFF HAVING A CHELP AT WHAT SHEARER'S "ACHIEVED" OR "DONE" SO FAR?

 

i mean, honestly, were these people even paying attention when kinnear was around?  or hughton?

 

for some reason, the barton thread and the one about criticism of his "harsh" methods, has just dawned on me like a slap in the face...laughable, truly laughable - for a club that supposedly idolises hero's plenty of people seem to be just willing the lad to fail

 

madness

 

Was half asleep, but pretty sure when listening to the Times podcast last night Patrick Barclay said Shearer as manager is a disaster for Newcastle. A DISASTER!!!!

 

 

/Also reiterated that Owen has been Newcastles worst ever signing also iirc.

//not sure i can argue to much with that one to be honest.

 

Patrick Barclay is one of the few journalists who smugly insisted Steve McLaren was the right man for the England job before he was apppointed. Hardly a fountain of wisdom then is he?

More like a wountain of fisdom tbh

Norfolk n' chance.

  That near Norfolk n' Clew?

Hmmm let me think....do these players need mollycoddling and a Glen Roeder jellfish spine approach, or would I prefer strict rules and Shearer sticking a large boot up their under-achieving well paid arses?

 

What a dilemma.

Delima surely 

http://timesonline.typepad.com/thegame/2009/05/joey-barton-an-apology.html

 

May 05, 2009

Joey Barton: an apology

 

 

George Caulkin

 

In the past, this newspaper, along with many others, may have inadvertently given the impression that Joey Barton should be granted a second chance. Subsequently, we may have acquiesced in the process of allowing him a third, fourth and fifth chance. Unfortunately, memory fails us and we can no longer remember which number of chances Mr Barton has now reached. But we apologise, unreservedly.

 

Furthermore, The Times has previously used quotes in which - to borrow from the Bumper Book of Football Cliches - Mr Barton has “opened his heart” or “bared his soul” regarding his latest indiscretion and we have printed them, albeit in good faith. If we’re being brutally honest, we’ll do it again, because that’s how this business works but, again, we apologise. The truth is that, to a certain degree, we fell for it.

 

Speaking of chances, we’re enamoured with the Sporting Chance clinic, the facility dedicated to helping sportsmen and women deal with addiction, which was founded by Tony Adams, the former England captain, and is run with dignity by Peter Kay (not that one). We have publicised their work with Barton and the work he has put back into it, because we think it has merit. Should we apologise for that?

 

We apologise for listening to a long list of managers at Newcastle United (five at the last count, although it may have changed by the time you read this), babble enthusiastically about Barton’s changed “character”. We held our noses and wrote the story, half convincing ourselves that all these football men must know something we don’t. That there must be more to it than self-interest.

 

We believe in humanity and we believe in redemption and we believe that there are different shades of right and wrong - in spite of Newcastle’s colours, not every issue is black and white - but we have always believed that the most self-destructive club in the country should never have signed it’s most self-destructive footballer. Never mind Barton, how many chances do Newcastle want?

 

We do not apologise for feeling nauseous at the way Newcastle has been utterly mismanaged. Even now, we marvel when we consider the arrogance of successive regimes - a club that has provoked such a widespread collection of corrosive headlines believing it is the appropriate home for Barton. And even last summer, when Barton was imprisoned and Newcastle perched warily on the moral high ground, they botched their attempts to tie him to a contract on reduced terms and then dismiss him.

 

Nor do we apologise for standing squarely alongside Alan Shearer in his attempts to impose some order on a club bereft of leadership. We support his decision to suspend Barton until further notice. We do so because after a lifetime of watching Newcastle and a decade of watching Shearer, we know what he has done for the club. We know that his instincts are sound, that his motivation cannot be questioned. We know that behind the scenes he is laying down a structure and discipline and the most amazing thing about it is not what is being done, but that it needs to be at all. We will accept his mistakes, because they will be honest ones. We will forgive him his inexperience as a manager, because he is one of us.

 

We do not apologise for thinking it is reasonable for professional footballers to report for training on time. To eat together. To spend extra hours on the training pitch or on the treatment table when injured, if it can help their cause against relegation. We do not care one jot if some Newcastle players - the same underachievers and vanity signings who have participated in the club’s demise - do not like it. If fact, we like it if they don’t like it. We believe that Shearer must be given the tools to do the job full-time and long-term, although we do not believe that Mike Ashley can be relied upon to take the correct decision.

 

Cards on the table time. We love Newcastle, just as we love Sunderland and Middlesbrough. And, no, that isn’t a cop out - we’re ferociously proud of the north east, a region often treated with disdain by the rest of the country, that has battled through economic deprivation to reinvent itself and now finds itself battling through deprivation again. We love the people, the geography, the passion.

 

We love the rhythms of Tyneside, the bustle of the city and the fact that its football club infiltrates every aspect of its life. We feel the history pressing in on us; we toast the achievements and reputations of men like Jackie Milburn, Kevin Keegan, Sir Bobby Robson and Shearer and shake our heads. We wonder how long supporters will continue to fill the stands, at St James‘ Park and also at the Stadium of Light and the Riverside Stadium, in the face of so much engrained disillusion. We love football, but we hate it, too.

 

We apologise if this column appears to wallow in misery; it doesn’t, but what else is there? We apologise for looking ahead to next Monday night’s fixture between Newcastle and Middlesbrough and feeling sick at the prospect. We apologise if the mixture of sarcasm and anger on this page, confuses or jars. We apologise if it feels as though there is no theme. Week upon week, there is only one: this has been an apology of a season.

 

 

 

  top post George Caulkin. top post.

Yeah Kinnear coming back for sure

He is man!! Fat blobby Mikey is a spuds fan and will bring in Gaz Mabbutt and Kevin Scott to assist JFK in the summer. Rumour has it that Tricky Ricky Villa will also be coming in to hold up Kinnear's IV bottle pitchside on match days. Part-time gig.

I would consider starting him if we're playing 4-4-2. He's our only real RW atm

can the fucker cross? If so I'd play Butt with Guthrie in the center, and plop the old Smith/Viduka partnership up front and watch them fly in.

Joey Barton always has been a c***, and always will be a c***, so it's about time someone treated him like a c*** and f***ed him.

Could have really been a cult hero up here if he'd mended his ways. What a disappointment tbh as he is a quality footballer. Twat

Sends out a clear message that Shearer is the main man, and will take no s*** - if the Sun story is true then it was the only decision to make IMO.

 

Shearer by nature is a larger than life character. This is the only trait I see in him that gives me hope that he could be a bloody good manager in time. The single most important man at any club is the manager, and he has that "I'm the main man, don't f*** with me" thing about him.

 

Graeme Souness also had that.

Yes that is true. Obviously I'm not saying it's a guarantee to make him a good manager. All I'm saying is that it's a trait of a successful manager, and Shearer already possesses it. We'll have to see what else he's made up of of course.

Silly really. It was a stupid sending off but it sounds like he's being made a scapegoat for the mess we're in.

Not if he caused bother in the dressing room. Many a player down the years have taken royal bollocking from managers like Ferguson, Clough, etc... The very hint of any of them talking back, let alone calling names and attempting to brawl would have seen them out on their arse at the snap of a finger.

Sends out a clear message that Shearer is the main man, and will take no s*** - if the Sun story is true then it was the only decision to make IMO.

Shearer by nature is a larger than life character. This is the only trait I see in him that gives me hope that he could be a bloody good manager in time. The single most important man at any club is the manager, and he has that "I'm the main man, don't fuck with me" thing about him.

I hope he's suspended without pay and we can claw something back for him.

 

Anything we get for him is a bonus, because I can't see many clubs being willing to take the risk. We were supposedly his last chance, and since he came he's been in all kinds of bother on and off the pitch.

 

As Gol says, I think we'll now look to terminate his contract.

Yup. I think Ashley will step in big time on this one. He wanted shot earlier, and I suspect as the owner of this business, he will not accept to pay the cunt a single penny more than he's already wasted on him.