Frazzle

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. I think what either want is irrelevent, Pardew and Carr can identify who they like, its about how Fatty and Dekka see a deal, if they think its value for money then it gets the go ahead, if not nothing happens. is that not as it should be ? Well sometimes they should have a bit of faith in the manager/scouting team. Surely Fat Mike isn't the best judge of footballing ability/potential. So, no, its probably not how it should be but it is how it most likely is. and the manager/scouting team will have to think it's value for money. i'm pretty sure ashley/lambias wouldn't have heard of most of our signings and wouldn't have been personally to watch them but they, as you say, had faith in their manager/scouting team. You responded to bimpy who said it will be up to Ashley and Llmabias to decide whether a player is value for money and said 'is that not how it should be', so I'm not sure what your response to my comment is, there'll probably be loads of examples where they've dismissed Pardew's and Carr's advice. Since Colo what's our record signing? 5 or 6m? I'm sure the incumbent manager/scouting have recommended players costing more than that. and that always happens at every club (bar citeh) ,the manager will not get every player he wants. I can see other owners being slightly more flexible though. only within what they consider to be their financial constraints (and thats a whole other debate) or do you think ashley/lambias had a good look at tiote,cabaye,obertan,santon,jonas ? I doubt they scouted them no. Put it this way though, I'm sure if we were asked to pay much more for Tiote they would've said no, regardless of advice of the scouting team, even though he would still be worth it. That's an example of where stubbornness can be harmful. All conjecture of course but I wouldn't be surprised. using tiote as the example, he's only worth it if he produces when he gets here, it's not like he was playing so well in the netherlands that we all knew he'd be an instant hit. we paid what they wanted. What's that got to do with the hypothetical situation I proposed though? We're obviously looking back in hindsight and know that Tiote would still be worth it if he cost double that or more, even though its likely that Ashley would've pulled the plug. as you said thats conjecture, why would any owner of a football club pay up more than the opposition wanted ? i notice it's went from conjecture to "likely" Me saying its conjecture but that I think its likely isn't contradictory and we wouldn't pay more than they wanted, where have I said that. I was using the Tiote situation and creating a hypothetical situation, of course I wouldn't want us to pay over 3.5m if that's what they asked.

a) Where does the extra £1.5m come from? b) If we're seen to be happy to pay a bit extra to get a deal over the line, how does that reflect on future transfers - why don't all selling clubs whack an extra £1.5m on any player we go for? Why stop at £1.5m? c) Where does the extra £1.5m from all of these transfers (3 or 4 per season?) come from? Does it all add up to an extra player or freezing the wage budget? d) Agents often use the transfer fee of their player to justify asking for higher wages, if we're happy to pay an extra £1.5m to get a deal over the line with the opposition club, why not pay the player an extra £150k signing bonus and an extra £10k pw...afterall, it's to get the deal over the line, non? a) it was hypothetical b) using Tiote as an example, we might have paid £1.5m more than our original offer, you should bid up to what you believe the players value is (obviously taking into account the budget), obviously pay as little as possible but with Tiote we could've paid up to £10m and he would've been worth it c) the £1.5m was hypothetical and as I said in b) we may already have paid 'another £1.5m' d) true, but see b) and c) again It's not like every player we've bought under Ashley has been bought at an objective, perfect value as this doesn't exist. Edit- I didn't actually read bimpy's post properly but my general points still stand

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. I think what either want is irrelevent, Pardew and Carr can identify who they like, its about how Fatty and Dekka see a deal, if they think its value for money then it gets the go ahead, if not nothing happens. is that not as it should be ? Well sometimes they should have a bit of faith in the manager/scouting team. Surely Fat Mike isn't the best judge of footballing ability/potential. So, no, its probably not how it should be but it is how it most likely is. and the manager/scouting team will have to think it's value for money. i'm pretty sure ashley/lambias wouldn't have heard of most of our signings and wouldn't have been personally to watch them but they, as you say, had faith in their manager/scouting team. You responded to bimpy who said it will be up to Ashley and Llmabias to decide whether a player is value for money and said 'is that not how it should be', so I'm not sure what your response to my comment is, there'll probably be loads of examples where they've dismissed Pardew's and Carr's advice. Since Colo what's our record signing? 5 or 6m? I'm sure the incumbent manager/scouting have recommended players costing more than that. and that always happens at every club (bar citeh) ,the manager will not get every player he wants. I can see other owners being slightly more flexible though. only within what they consider to be their financial constraints (and thats a whole other debate) or do you think ashley/lambias had a good look at tiote,cabaye,obertan,santon,jonas ? I doubt they scouted them no. Put it this way though, I'm sure if we were asked to pay much more for Tiote they would've said no, regardless of advice of the scouting team, even though he would still be worth it. That's an example of where stubbornness can be harmful. All conjecture of course but I wouldn't be surprised. using tiote as the example, he's only worth it if he produces when he gets here, it's not like he was playing so well in the netherlands that we all knew he'd be an instant hit. we paid what they wanted. What's that got to do with the hypothetical situation I proposed though? We're obviously looking back in hindsight and know that Tiote would still be worth it if he cost double that or more, even though its likely that Ashley would've pulled the plug.

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. I think what either want is irrelevent, Pardew and Carr can identify who they like, its about how Fatty and Dekka see a deal, if they think its value for money then it gets the go ahead, if not nothing happens. is that not as it should be ? Well sometimes they should have a bit of faith in the manager/scouting team. Surely Fat Mike isn't the best judge of footballing ability/potential. So, no, its probably not how it should be but it is how it most likely is. and the manager/scouting team will have to think it's value for money. i'm pretty sure ashley/lambias wouldn't have heard of most of our signings and wouldn't have been personally to watch them but they, as you say, had faith in their manager/scouting team. You responded to bimpy who said it will be up to Ashley and Llmabias to decide whether a player is value for money and said 'is that not how it should be', so I'm not sure what your response to my comment is, there'll probably be loads of examples where they've dismissed Pardew's and Carr's advice. Since Colo what's our record signing? 5 or 6m? I'm sure the incumbent manager/scouting have recommended players costing more than that. and that always happens at every club (bar citeh) ,the manager will not get every player he wants. I can see other owners being slightly more flexible though. only within what they consider to be their financial constraints (and thats a whole other debate) or do you think ashley/lambias had a good look at tiote,cabaye,obertan,santon,jonas ? I doubt they scouted them no. Put it this way though, I'm sure if we were asked to pay much more for Tiote they would've said no, regardless of advice of the scouting team, even though he would still be worth it. That's an example of where stubbornness can be harmful. All conjecture of course but I wouldn't be surprised.

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. I think what either want is irrelevent, Pardew and Carr can identify who they like, its about how Fatty and Dekka see a deal, if they think its value for money then it gets the go ahead, if not nothing happens. is that not as it should be ? Well sometimes they should have a bit of faith in the manager/scouting team. Surely Fat Mike isn't the best judge of footballing ability/potential. So, no, its probably not how it should be but it is how it most likely is. and the manager/scouting team will have to think it's value for money. i'm pretty sure ashley/lambias wouldn't have heard of most of our signings and wouldn't have been personally to watch them but they, as you say, had faith in their manager/scouting team. You responded to bimpy who said it will be up to Ashley and Llmabias to decide whether a player is value for money and said 'is that not how it should be', so I'm not sure what your response to my comment is, there'll probably be loads of examples where they've dismissed Pardew's and Carr's advice. Since Colo what's our record signing? 5 or 6m? I'm sure the incumbent manager/scouting have recommended players costing more than that. and that always happens at every club (bar citeh) ,the manager will not get every player he wants. I can see other owners being slightly more flexible though.

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. I think what either want is irrelevent, Pardew and Carr can identify who they like, its about how Fatty and Dekka see a deal, if they think its value for money then it gets the go ahead, if not nothing happens. is that not as it should be ? True, Frazzle put it so well i'll just add, sometimes a manager or scout can be taken at their word, pay a little more on their say so and take a little chance, your not talking £10m more but if a player is valued at £5m but the other club wants £6.5m, thats the kind of thing that bugs like. Exactly, that was my point as well.

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. I think what either want is irrelevent, Pardew and Carr can identify who they like, its about how Fatty and Dekka see a deal, if they think its value for money then it gets the go ahead, if not nothing happens. is that not as it should be ? Well sometimes they should have a bit of faith in the manager/scouting team. Surely Fat Mike isn't the best judge of footballing ability/potential. So, no, its probably not how it should be but it is how it most likely is. and the manager/scouting team will have to think it's value for money. i'm pretty sure ashley/lambias wouldn't have heard of most of our signings and wouldn't have been personally to watch them but they, as you say, had faith in their manager/scouting team. You responded to bimpy who said it will be up to Ashley and Llmabias to decide whether a player is value for money and said 'is that not how it should be', so I'm not sure what your response to my comment is, there'll probably be loads of examples where they've dismissed Pardew's and Carr's advice. Since Colo what's our record signing? 5 or 6m? I'm sure the incumbent manager/scouting have recommended players costing more than that.

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. I think what either want is irrelevent, Pardew and Carr can identify who they like, its about how Fatty and Dekka see a deal, if they think its value for money then it gets the go ahead, if not nothing happens. is that not as it should be ? Well sometimes they should have a bit of faith in the manager/scouting team. Surely Fat Mike isn't the best judge of footballing ability/potential. So, no, its probably not how it should be but it is how it most likely is.

Real Madrid is the first one that he's starting to break the cycle, probably because he knows he can't really get a bigger job. Chelsea I sort of agree, it wasn't as bad as Inter, but I still reckon he could've done more. As I said though, he gets results and chairmen know what they're getting with him so you can't argue too much.

Elliot's pretty much given up on making the first team then

Its not that he's unable to settle its just that he can't stay any longer because of the teams he builds. He doesn't bring youngsters through and buys players at their peak and nearing their thirties. Its fair enough as he wins stuff but its not always ideal for the long term prospects of the club. If he stayed any longer at Inter he'd be stuck with the ageing, slightly unmotivated players that the following managers were lumped with.

Gets on my tits this Pardew=bad, Carr=good thing. They sign players as a team, they've always maintained this. I'm guessing Obertan and Ba were Pardew's signings and Santon, Cabaye, Marveaux (does any one else forget we have him by the way?) were Carr 'signings'. Just purely as I think Pardew prefers players with Premiership experience whilst Carr seems to always be scouting in Europe. Exactly Edit - especially on Ba, I feel he was more of a Pardew signing, kinda throws the Carr = good, Pardew = bad argument out of the water...

Its nothing to do with him being crap, the same way I don't think Tiote was really a Carr signing despite him being a top player (based on Hughton's information). Nothing to do with bias ffs All Carr's signings have come from abroad so I'm just surprised a Man U reserve was on his radar, we only ever hear about him catching games in France, Holland and Germany. I'm willing to be proven wrong but I can't remember quotes on Carr following Obertan tbh

Its easy to say pass it short but the fullbacks are too scared to drop too deep and the whole team is hardly set up to play it out from the back at the moment.

Throwing him in halfway through the season when Simpson is still fit is asking a bit much but come the start of next season it should be a straight duel between them, Simpson should be guaranteed nothing.

Pardew could string out the 'not ready to start' for months. He'll never get match fit if he never plays and if he's only gonna give him 30 mins max then he needs to play the next few reserve games. If he's not fit to start then he shouldn't have played Man C, Man U and Chelsea, regardless of our injury problems. We can all see he coped fine in those games though and should be starting now. fwiw I think Obertan was a Pardew signing rather than Carr and I reckon this is why he has a sort of blind faith in him (conspiracy theories...)

You don't understand the hype around a player who is considered by a lot of people in France to be the most talented player of his generation (which includes Nasri, Benzema and Menez)?

All things considered I think Pardew's had the better squad and is helped by the fact that we aren't newly promoted but he's also done much better with the squad so far and is on course to better Hughton's PL achievements.

One or two = one One = Jason Prior

Samba?

After he got elbowed he did it I think

They must feel like shop keepers who have just noticed the town they trade in has had a bypass built around it. Exactly, the partnership isn't the problem, its the s*** surrounding it at the moment/style of play.

Looks more like 'Welsh c***' to me. Which would be strange. Bit of self-reflection is good man.

Does he really need to say it on twitter ffs

Every part of his game looks worse than when he was with us.