Thumbheed

Do you think that was the only reason he wasnt able to close out a cup win throughout all his time at Spurs? If not, then what was the reason?

Exactly. It's hard to imagine that the PL create more leverage when it comes to convincing the Saudis to crack down on beoutQ by telling the state PIF that they aren't fit to invest in a PL club. That would be ridiculous. They'd also be balancing the cost of piracy against the potential increase in revenue from having another huge team which will inevitably engages millions of new fans.

But his squad was already good enough for a cup win.

I think people have got to bare in mind that this takeover represents literally the most significant investment in the PL itself. They will not turn this amount of investment away. Better players = Better TV deals = More money for the PL EDIT: I have been wrong many times before

May I ask why? Not saying your wrong but Poch hasn't won anything so other than progressing teams and being younger than Rafa not sure how he out manages Rafa in any real area? Well one of the reasons as I said is I just wouldn’t go back, it very rarely works. Secondly I think if we were to have a shot at pochettino I think we’d be mad not to take it. He plays the type of football we’d all love to see, he’s a young progressive coach and it’s probably only a matter of time before he’s snapped up by a PSG/Man City/Real Madrid type elite club, we’d be mad not to execute the opportunity should it present itself. Rafa’s mint, we all love him and rightly so, but he won’t get another elite club and there’s probably a reason for that, so for those reasons I’d grab Poch ahead of Rafa should the opportunity arise. Are there any examples of returns to former clubs which mirror the situation we potentially find ourselves in? This is a start from scratch project with basically unlimited resources. Pochettino absolutely has the attention of the big clubs but that doesn't mean he's the best managerial option. I have no doubt he offers the best chance of getting us to the next step, as he has done with every club he's managed but he's yet to turn that into silverware which should be our ultimate goal. Why go for someone who has no evidence of the ability to win silverware over someone who has a proven track record of it? The top top managers win trophies anywhere, it's a skill. You either have it or you dont, I dont think Pochettino has it. To be fair to Rafa, he was literally at the biggest club in the world before Newcastle, that's a hell of a step down which makes a potential return all the more poignant. I'm not sure it's fair to assume he's done at the top level off the back of his time at Newcastle and the fact he's now in China (overseeing a $300m project), his CV is still right up there with the very best. Had his contract ended sooner, who knows which club he'd have been at, I dont seem to reme.ber too many vacancies around the time he left (baring in mind it was very very late in the summer). Just in case anyone not clear, I'd really like Rafa, but I'm very surprised at all those who'd even entertain Poch over Allegri who would be my number 2 choice for many of the reason I've stated above. Our situation is unique, granted, but managerial returns in the whole have a history of not working. I don’t know anywhere near enough about allegri to want him, as I said in my first post I’m just not familiar enough with him to say. Rafa’s great, I was a huge fan and still am, but there’s a reason his last two clubs have been a relegation threatened nufc and a club in China, the Real Madrid gig came largely out of the blue to him as he was on his way to West Ham. I’ll be surprised to ever see him amongst the elite again, but I could be wrong. Everything I’m saying makes me sound as if I don’t rate him, which couldn’t be more wrong, I would just take a fresh approach that’s all. Nah, that's all fair and well. It's personal opinions and preference at the end of the day and I can't prove any of that to be wrong tbf. Probably the first time in all my time supporting Newcastle where we've been in a win win situation no matter who we employ. *Bruce Signs new 8 Year Deal*

May I ask why? Not saying your wrong but Poch hasn't won anything so other than progressing teams and being younger than Rafa not sure how he out manages Rafa in any real area? Well one of the reasons as I said is I just wouldn’t go back, it very rarely works. Secondly I think if we were to have a shot at pochettino I think we’d be mad not to take it. He plays the type of football we’d all love to see, he’s a young progressive coach and it’s probably only a matter of time before he’s snapped up by a PSG/Man City/Real Madrid type elite club, we’d be mad not to execute the opportunity should it present itself. Rafa’s mint, we all love him and rightly so, but he won’t get another elite club and there’s probably a reason for that, so for those reasons I’d grab Poch ahead of Rafa should the opportunity arise. Are there any examples of returns to former clubs which mirror the situation we potentially find ourselves in? This is a start from scratch project with basically unlimited resources. Pochettino absolutely has the attention of the big clubs but that doesn't mean he's the best managerial option. I have no doubt he offers the best chance of getting us to the next step, as he has done with every club he's managed but he's yet to turn that into silverware which should be our ultimate goal. Why go for someone who has no evidence of the ability to win silverware over someone who has a proven track record of it? The top top managers win trophies anywhere, it's a skill. You either have it or you dont, I dont think Pochettino has it. To be fair to Rafa, he was literally at the biggest club in the world before Newcastle, that's a hell of a step down which makes a potential return all the more poignant. I'm not sure it's fair to assume he's done at the top level off the back of his time at Newcastle and the fact he's now in China (overseeing a $300m project), his CV is still right up there with the very best. Had his contract ended sooner, who knows which club he'd have been at, I dont seem to reme.ber too many vacancies around the time he left (baring in mind it was very very late in the summer). Just in case anyone not clear, I'd really like Rafa, but I'm very surprised at all those who'd even entertain Poch over Allegri who would be my number 2 choice for many of the reason I've stated above.

Sorry

Pochettino has all the qualities I'd want, except 1, and that's his individual game management, which all the top top managers are adept at. I just dont see him having a trophy laden career unless hes at a club which already dominates the league. His run in the CL came off the back of 2 freak results which kind of elevated his reputation, when in reality he got the 3rd best squad to finish 4th and probably deserved to go out in the CL at the QF. Edit: I'd obviously not be unhappy with him at all, or with any of the candidates but Rafa would be my number 1 option.

Is keeping Bruce for 5 points really worth it??! Just get rid. It would be such an anti climax to have him lead us out for our first game under new owners. He should be consigned to the history of Ashley's era. If I was Bruce I'd be sounding them out for an early exit. Tidy sum in his pocket for leaving and also avoids the chance of still getting relegated with the last games being played. Head held high. I am sure we will hear lots of "I have no doubt I am still the man for the job", "I'm going nowhere","the be owners have full faith in me" "getting on with the job" quotes soon. It really depends when the ownership is finalized in relation to the season restarting/ending. If they take over in May and season doesnt re-start until mid to late June (likely earliest) why waste a month or two that the new manager could use? Just to be nice to Bruce? f*** that. It could be more of a potential risk. All fair and well apart from the fact that Bruce would think he deserves a go. Clown of a man.

It's not hyperbole to say that the Saudis are one of the closest things on Earth at the moment to the Nazis is it? If you were going to pick the most brutal regime around, is there one worse? North Korea possibly but at least they're not bombing anyone. The UK had pretty good relations with the Nazi regime up until the outbreak of war, Edward VIII was a friend of Hitler. I don't think "our government likes them" is the most robust defence, you could say the same about Assad and Gaddafi, these people are always our "friends" until they're not. You missed the point. Take all that moral s*** stuff to the other thread, not this one. Jeez. This is the main takeover thread. It's going to be discussed whether you like it or not. Jeez. So what do you want to happen, Wullie? Another boycoutt? Not at all. A matter for the individual conscience this one I think. I don't think the FA/PL should be allowing any states to own football clubs but that ship's already sailed. So what will be your personal stance out of interest? Will you continue to support the club and would you go to games? Good question. Honest answer is I don't know. They've not even taken over yet so will just wait and see how things look once their feet are under the table I guess. Could be a long time before a ball is kicked at SJP but I don't have the aversion to giving them money that I had with Ashley. What would you anticipate happening that would sway you to boycott or not give them money? I'm struggling to justify taking a moral stance against the takeover when I do use things like Twitter and Uber which are both heavily invested in by PIF. For me, its essentially the exact same thing as it would be supporting the club. This "Sportswashing" moniker seems like a buzzword which ignores the actual reality which is that any investment the Saudi's make in anything is a form of 'image management.

It's not hyperbole to say that the Saudis are one of the closest things on Earth at the moment to the Nazis is it? If you were going to pick the most brutal regime around, is there one worse? North Korea possibly but at least they're not bombing anyone. The UK had pretty good relations with the Nazi regime up until the outbreak of war, Edward VIII was a friend of Hitler. I don't think "our government likes them" is the most robust defence, you could say the same about Assad and Gaddafi, these people are always our "friends" until they're not. You missed the point. Take all that moral s*** stuff to the other thread, not this one. Jeez. This is the main takeover thread. It's going to be discussed whether you like it or not. Jeez. So what do you want to happen, Wullie? Another boycoutt? Not at all. A matter for the individual conscience this one I think. I don't think the FA/PL should be allowing any states to own football clubs but that ship's already sailed. So what will be your personal stance out of interest? Will you continue to support the club and would you go to games?

aye, it is like Aye.

It's not hyperbole to say that the Saudis are one of the closest things on Earth at the moment to the Nazis is it? If you were going to pick the most brutal regime around, is there one worse? North Korea possibly but at least they're not bombing anyone. The UK had pretty good relations with the Nazi regime up until the outbreak of war, Edward VIII was a friend of Hitler. I don't think "our government likes them" is the most robust defence, you could say the same about Assad and Gaddafi, these people are always our "friends" until they're not. You missed the point. Take all that moral s*** stuff to the other thread, not this one. Jeez. This is the main takeover thread. It's going to be discussed whether you like it or not. Jeez. So what do you want to happen, Wullie? Another boycoutt?

Is keeping Bruce for 5 points really worth it??! Just get rid. It would be such an anti climax to have him lead us out for our first game under new owners. He should be consigned to the history of Ashley's era.

Tl;dr: Other big brands have questionable ties too. They all do, and we buy them. That’s my point, try and life your own life as a nice person, with a sone conscience of others, the works etc and to what you can the most to make your own world a better world for you and others the most you can. That’s all you can do. If I was a billionaire, I’d buy NUFC to give away to the fans, that’s me. Or I could buy it to make even more money. Btw, there is a serious lack of insight, knowledge and realism when it comes to business and rich people if you like on here. Victoria Beckham has had to furlough her staff despite being worth x money. She can’t keep them on out of her own pocket though and has (I hope) contributed a lot more than others in taxes etc towards the stars so her money when tines are bad, the powers that be can help her staff out. It doesn’t help mind when people flaunt their wealth... After this, if you’re a good person, treat your staff like they are your family, treat everyone like they are your friends. Those that don’t, they are the true c***s. Footballers have actually done more than our own f***ing government lately who get their coffers filled off their taxes so they can help the needy out, again it’s all unfair, unjust, wrong and corrupt. And I’m part of the problem, you are, we all are, but I do try and be part of A solution too. Pissing in the wind though... Tl;dr Rich people aren't moral white knights.

Tl;dr: Other big brands have questionable ties too.

The other plus point for Rafa is I think this would be his last job (bar national sides). Can't see that being the case with any other manager. I want that.

I think Atsu and Yedlin are the only real examples of that strategy and I know I named Yedlin in my list of poor buys but I'd probably retract that irrespective of having the hindsight he didnt turn out to be a great player. The others 2 were players from average premier league teams and we've not even looked at what we could have looked at in other leagues. And I still think the point stands for the other players signed, they all turned out to be good championship players and poor/average prem players and you probably didnt need hindsight for you to come to that conclusion in most cases.

I fucking hope so.

Well, tell me why then? Give me a logical reason why it makes zero sense to you as it clearly does.

Loftus Cheek is literally one example of that ffs :lol: Edit: sneaky edit, Joeyt

I think there was enough, yes, and that's literally my only point. Such as who? We couldn't have signed Townsend instead of Ritchie I honestly dont know the answer to that because I dont have contacts in football who would tell me who was available at that time. I think youre taking this Ritchie vs Towsend comparative too literally. There's 10 top clubs in the Premier league, they have 25 man squad and 17 matchday players(?). That leaves a pool of 80 players who are on the books of a top 10 team who cant get into the playing squad. Chose 3-4 of them who are probably unlucky not to play, and that's just from the premier league only.

I kind of disagree. Like it was said earlier, we had deals lined up for Townsend and Loftus Cheek. There is a world of difference between Gayle/Ritchie and Townsend/Loftus Cheek. They were the type of players I felt we should have gone for. Given the choice now, who would you have taken? If players of the calibre of Townsend and Loftus Cheek were willing to come to is in the January window, wouldnt it have been likely that a similar calibre of player would have come in the preceding summer? Ashley pulled the plug on those deals and when we did go back for Townsend Fat head was being a c*** and wouldn't do a deal at the same price. Rafa was getting in his 5th-10th choices due to budgets and slow movement from the club. We'll be hitting the top end of the list this time round. It will be totally different. Again, it's not about the actual deals per se and why we didnt sign them, it's the fact that that calibre of player was willing to come to us and yet in the summer preceding that we signed players of a lower calibre. If you know you can sign higher calibre players, theres no real excuse not to. Those players would have not only lifted us out the championship but would have also been excellent in the premiership too. Ritchie and Gayle were excellent championship players but average prem players. Hodgson and Howe clearly thought the same as well... Agreed, but you're aiming that at the wrong man in this situation. Perhaps I am, yeh. My reading of it at the time was Rafa did have free reign at the time and so was fully accountable for what we signed in that particular window. I felt that way because he seemed pretty content (no murmrings of unrest in the media) and the transfer policy was basically scrapped for him. He could have said no to a signing, like he did with Joelinton but the club had said no to him about hist 1st few choices, so he's now taking chances on players further down the list. Next in line may have worked out better, who knows. but that's as far as control went. Hindsight: I'd rather we signed no one than Murphy and Muto, but it could have worked out well at the time they came in, that's the gamble. 100% agree with that, I have absolutely no idea if there were any constraints imposed upon him for that summer 2016 window, I just thought there was enough evidence to suggest all those signings were his first choice because I'm sure we'd have heard about it if he felt seriosuly restricted at that time.

I think there was enough, yes, and that's literally my only point.

I kind of disagree. Like it was said earlier, we had deals lined up for Townsend and Loftus Cheek. There is a world of difference between Gayle/Ritchie and Townsend/Loftus Cheek. They were the type of players I felt we should have gone for. Given the choice now, who would you have taken? If players of the calibre of Townsend and Loftus Cheek were willing to come to is in the January window, wouldnt it have been likely that a similar calibre of player would have come in the preceding summer? Ashley pulled the plug on those deals and when we did go back for Townsend Fat head was being a c*** and wouldn't do a deal at the same price. Rafa was getting in his 5th-10th choices due to budgets and slow movement from the club. We'll be hitting the top end of the list this time round. It will be totally different. Again, it's not about the actual deals per se and why we didnt sign them, it's the fact that that calibre of player was willing to come to us and yet in the summer preceding that we signed players of a lower calibre. If you know you can sign higher calibre players, theres no real excuse not to. Those players would have not only lifted us out the championship but would have also been excellent in the premiership too. Ritchie and Gayle were excellent championship players but average prem players. Hodgson and Howe clearly thought the same as well... What does Hodgson have to do with it? Ah little mistake, but what difference does it make to my point?