Big Sam and Michael Owen

[captainhaircut]

It's become apparent to me in the last couple of weeks that Allardyce is blinded by having a world class player in Michael Owen at his disposal. This has led him due to move away from the system that made him successful at Bolton. The problem is that Owen can only play in a front two while Allardyce wants to play 3 central midfield players as its been so successful for him in the past. So he's trying a strange hybrid formation that has a central midfield player playing wide- Geremi, Barton and Emre have all done this of late. The Portsmouth match did little to support the cause of playing two natural widemen.

 

The same thing happened when Bolton first bought Anelka.  He began by moving to 4-4-2 but in the end played Davies wide right to maintain the shape of the side. Fortunately, Allardyce learned his lesson that time. Unfortunately, I don't see Viduka or Owen playing wide anytime soon. 

 

What makes the situation a whole lot worse is that Michael Owen looks nowhere near the sort of world class player you compromise your formation for.

 

For me, if Allardyce is to succeed he'll probably need to ditch Owen and bring in a centre forward who can hold the ball and battle with Viduka for a single central striker position. You could then play Martins/ Milner/ Duff/ N'Zogbia off this central striker.

 

In the end, after spending years at Bolton probably longing to manage top class players, the biggest player Allardyce will ever manage must be sold or will end up costing him his job.

 

 

[Tooj]

It's become apparent to me in the last couple of weeks that Allardyce is blinded by having a player with a World Class reputation in Michael Owen at his disposal. This has led him due to move away from the system that made him successful at Bolton. The problem is that Owen can only play in a front two while Allardyce wants to play 3 central midfield players as its been so successful for him in the past. So he's trying a strange hybrid formation that has a central midfield player playing wide- Geremi, Barton and Emre have all done this of late. The Portsmouth match did little to support the cause of playing two natural widemen.

 

The same thing happened when Bolton first bought Anelka.  He began by moving to 4-4-2 but in the end played Davies wide right to maintain the shape of the side. Fortunately, Allardyce learned his lesson that time. Unfortunately, I don't see Viduka or Owen playing wide anytime soon. 

 

What makes the situation a whole lot worse is that Michael Owen looks nowhere near the sort of world class player you compromise your formation for.

 

For me, if Allardyce is to succeed he'll probably need to ditch Owen and bring in a centre forward who can hold the ball and battle with Viduka for a single central striker position. You could then play Martins/ Milner/ Duff/ N'Zogbia off this central striker.

 

In the end, after spending years at Bolton probably longing to manage top class players, the biggest player Allardyce will ever manage must be sold or will end up costing him his job.

 

 

 

Subtlety fixed.

[KaKa]

It's become apparent to me in the last couple of weeks that Allardyce is blinded by having a world class player in Michael Owen at his disposal. This has led him due to move away from the system that made him successful at Bolton. The problem is that Owen can only play in a front two while Allardyce wants to play 3 central midfield players as its been so successful for him in the past. So he's trying a strange hybrid formation that has a central midfield player playing wide- Geremi, Barton and Emre have all done this of late. The Portsmouth match did little to support the cause of playing two natural widemen.

 

The same thing happened when Bolton first bought Anelka.  He began by moving to 4-4-2 but in the end played Davies wide right to maintain the shape of the side. Fortunately, Allardyce learned his lesson that time. Unfortunately, I don't see Viduka or Owen playing wide anytime soon. 

 

What makes the situation a whole lot worse is that Michael Owen looks nowhere near the sort of world class player you compromise your formation for.

 

For me, if Allardyce is to succeed he'll probably need to ditch Owen and bring in a centre forward who can hold the ball and battle with Viduka for a single central striker position. You could then play Martins/ Milner/ Duff/ N'Zogbia off this central striker.

 

In the end, after spending years at Bolton probably longing to manage top class players, the biggest player Allardyce will ever manage must be sold or will end up costing him his job.

 

 

 

Spot on.

 

As long as Owen is in the team we will continue to struggle and it's as simple as that.

 

 

[Liam Liam Liam O]

It's become apparent to me in the last couple of weeks that Allardyce is blinded by having a world class player in Michael Owen at his disposal. This has led him due to move away from the system that made him successful at Bolton. The problem is that Owen can only play in a front two while Allardyce wants to play 3 central midfield players as its been so successful for him in the past. So he's trying a strange hybrid formation that has a central midfield player playing wide- Geremi, Barton and Emre have all done this of late. The Portsmouth match did little to support the cause of playing two natural widemen.

 

The same thing happened when Bolton first bought Anelka.  He began by moving to 4-4-2 but in the end played Davies wide right to maintain the shape of the side. Fortunately, Allardyce learned his lesson that time. Unfortunately, I don't see Viduka or Owen playing wide anytime soon. 

 

What makes the situation a whole lot worse is that Michael Owen looks nowhere near the sort of world class player you compromise your formation for.

 

For me, if Allardyce is to succeed he'll probably need to ditch Owen and bring in a centre forward who can hold the ball and battle with Viduka for a single central striker position. You could then play Martins/ Milner/ Duff/ N'Zogbia off this central striker.

 

In the end, after spending years at Bolton probably longing to manage top class players, the biggest player Allardyce will ever manage must be sold or will end up costing him his job.

 

 

 

Spot on.

 

As long as Owen is in the team we will continue to struggle and it's as simple as that.

 

 

 

Contributes very little IMO in general play, particularly when we are struggling.  If he's going to be solely a chance taker, then he has to take chances like that one which came his way from Harper's long clearance.

[Baggio]

Good post, I seen this being a problem when Allardyce came here.

 

http://www.newcastle-online.com/nufcforum/index.php?topic=39626.0

[Mick]

We've got a player who is probably the best of his type in the league and we're pissing away the good that he could do if used in the right way.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

We've got a player who is probably the best of his type in the league and we're pissing away the good that he could do if used in the right way.

 

Do you not think he has to take some of the blame for that himself though?  Players who are "the best of their type in the league" should surely be able to produce SOMETHING regardless of the system they are being played in.  He simply looks disinterested IMO, and is just as much to blame as the system

[Mick]

 

Do you not think he has to take some of the blame for that himself though?  Players who are "the best of their type in the league" should surely be able to produce SOMETHING regardless of the system they are being played in.  He simply looks disinterested IMO, and is just as much to blame as the system

 

Of course he should take some of the blame but he's hardly being given the service.

[tmonkey]

Owen can play in a 4-3-3. He did so for Real Madrid, and looked a good player.

 

What hes not good in is a long ball team. If we had a team that could pass it around and maintain possession, then the opportunities to slip Owen through on goal when hes making an intelligent run would increase tenfold. Instead, hes making these little runs and watching the ball get hoofed up towards Viduka, Smith, himself, Martins, etc, with nothing coming from them.

 

But its probably time to sell him anyway. Its asking alot to change to a difficult style of play to achieve in order to get the best out of him, and hes proven himself injury prone for too long now to be worth that effort, and it now seems that hes bulked himself up slightly to reduce those injury risks - which has resulted in even less mobility/speed on his part. Yet again today weve seen him being put through on goal, only to end up being easily caught by defenders who arent so quick. Hence, whatever his situation, whether hes still injury prone or not, hes just not as good as he used to be and has a reputation that outweighs his performances and ability levels.

 

Time to move on, and maybe bid big for a certain promising Dutchman who scored a cracker against us in a shit team not too long ago.

[Baggio]

The Owen we've got now and him at Real Madrid are completely different as far as I'm concerned.

 

 

[johnnypd]

the 3 up front at madrid was very different to the 3 up front sam envisages, with a target man and two wide players who make runs toward goal. at madrid owen and ronaldo played centrally, occasionally making runs away from goal when they needed width but mainly focused on getting into poaching positions, with raul playing in the hole, and the main width coming from the full-backs carlos and salgado. we could employ a similar system if we use viduka in this withdrawn position and martins and owen ahead of them, with our widthcoming from beye and enrique, and two defensive midfielders to compensate for them. not entirely sure it would work with our players though and as baggio says owen is a changed player, he's not got the pace to make runs in behind, needs other players to make space for him, and is best attacking crosses and set-pieces or when we have the opposition under siege in their box (ie never).

[Guest Gemmill]

As long as Owen is in the team we will continue to struggle and it's as simple as that.

 

 

  Comedy fucking gold.

 

 

[Superior Acuña]

We've got a player who is probably the best of his type in the league and we're pissing away the good that he could do if used in the right way.

 

  He simply looks disinterested IMO

 

That's absolute rubbish and based on nothing but his reputation.  Owen is one of the hardest working players in our team.  He was basically the only one still going at the end against Portsmouth, Reading and running everywhere today.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

We've got a player who is probably the best of his type in the league and we're pissing away the good that he could do if used in the right way.

 

  He simply looks disinterested IMO

 

That's absolute rubbish and based on nothing but his reputation.  Owen is one of the hardest working players in our team.  He was basically the only one still going at the end against Portsmouth, Reading and running everywhere today.

 

Poor against Portsmouth, worse than Martins against Reading, and was he fuck running everywhere today.

 

He just doesn't look like getting us out of the shit at the minute, and his contribution is so reliant on other people its becoming embarrassing.

[hallihg]

Put drogba/ibrahimovic/klose or any other striker instead of owen in the team and he wont do anybetter than Michael Owen because no striker will do well with a team full of CUNTS that play like shite every game.

 

Maradona/Pele may be the exceptions.

[fredbob]

Its a strange one this, to be fair, everything thats been said so far is true, he IS a world class striker i find it strange that peple are really questioning his abilty and his reputation. I think its been proven throughout the course of his career. However i have to agree with people who say he wont fit in a SA team. He needs the ball at his feet, its so frustrating seeing balls knocked up to him.

It's the immovable object aganst the unstoppable force and something has to give. Its a strange paradox because as long as Owen isnt scoring, that will be a measure of how successful SA will be percieved and how nice his football is,  i know it sounds silly, but i honestly think that the possiblity of Mort or Ashley, letting Owen go is unthinkable and wont happen....

[Guest justin99.]

comments like these (op) only come because Owen hasn't scored in a few games.

[NE5]

Viduka is a good player but goes missing a bit too much. Owen is a great goalscorer, he may have lost a bit of pace - not too sure about this just yet - but he's still got the goal touch. You don't lose that.

 

Trouble is, neither of them can create situations, turn defenders, or run at defenders or be support strikers for the other. Having said that, the backup from midfield is so poor they haven't had a chance.

 

 

 

[The College Dropout]

Put drogba/ibrahimovic/klose or any other striker instead of owen in the team and he wont do anybetter than Michael Owen because no striker will do well with a team full of c***s that play like s**** every game.

 

Maradona/Pele may be the exceptions.

 

The first 3 would probably win most of those long balls we pump. Drogba would offer us the ball over the top.

 

 

[Liam Liam Liam O]

Put drogba/ibrahimovic/klose or any other striker instead of owen in the team and he wont do anybetter than Michael Owen because no striker will do well with a team full of c***s that play like s**** every game.

 

Maradona/Pele may be the exceptions.

 

The first 3 would probably win most of those long balls we pump. Drogba would offer us the ball over the top.

 

 

 

Sorted then.  Just got to hope Ashley and Mort are reading this

[Optimistic Nut]

I don't think it's the fact Allardyce is blinded by having a top-class player, but not having a f*cking clue how to play a system with him playing. In fact, I think the only part of the side he had correct today was up-front. Picking a midfield to play to the strikers' strengths rather than Smith in the holding-role, Barton on the right,N'Zogbia full-back and a centre-back at right-back might be a starting point...

[Mick]

I don't think it's the fact Allardyce is blinded by having a top-class player, but not having a f*cking clue how to play a system with him playing. In fact, I think the only part of the side he had correct today was up-front. Picking a midfield to play to the strikers' strengths rather than Smith in the holding-role, Barton on the right,N'Zogbia full-back and a centre-back at right-back might be a starting point...

 

Agreed, Owen and Viduka would get more out of a game if we tried playing higher up the pitch and got balls into the edge of the box instead of having the two of them playing too deep.

[Guest evertoniansrmongs]

is owen getting into positions and has the pace deteriorated further.. he cant play on the right side

[timnufc22]

It's become apparent to me in the last couple of weeks that Allardyce is blinded by having a world class player in Michael Owen at his disposal. This has led him due to move away from the system that made him successful at Bolton. The problem is that Owen can only play in a front two while Allardyce wants to play 3 central midfield players as its been so successful for him in the past. So he's trying a strange hybrid formation that has a central midfield player playing wide- Geremi, Barton and Emre have all done this of late. The Portsmouth match did little to support the cause of playing two natural widemen.

 

The same thing happened when Bolton first bought Anelka.  He began by moving to 4-4-2 but in the end played Davies wide right to maintain the shape of the side. Fortunately, Allardyce learned his lesson that time. Unfortunately, I don't see Viduka or Owen playing wide anytime soon. 

 

What makes the situation a whole lot worse is that Michael Owen looks nowhere near the sort of world class player you compromise your formation for.

 

For me, if Allardyce is to succeed he'll probably need to ditch Owen and bring in a centre forward who can hold the ball and battle with Viduka for a single central striker position. You could then play Martins/ Milner/ Duff/ N'Zogbia off this central striker.

 

In the end, after spending years at Bolton probably longing to manage top class players, the biggest player Allardyce will ever manage must be sold or will end up costing him his job.

 

 

 

Spot on.

 

As long as Owen is in the team we will continue to struggle and it's as simple as that.

 

 

 

Contributes very little IMO in general play, particularly when we are struggling.  If he's going to be solely a chance taker, then he has to take chances like that one which came his way from Harper's long clearance.

 

Thats it, in a nutshell.

[Nobody]

We've got a player who is probably the best of his type in the league and we're pissing away the good that he could do if used in the right way.

 

  He simply looks disinterested IMO

 

That's absolute rubbish and based on nothing but his reputation.  Owen is one of the hardest working players in our team.  He was basically the only one still going at the end against Portsmouth, Reading and running everywhere today.

 

Poor against Portsmouth, worse than Martins against Reading, and was he fuck running everywhere today.

 

He just doesn't look like getting us out of the shit at the minute, and his contribution is so reliant on other people its becoming embarrassing.

He might've been poor, but he works his arse off though. His attitude on the pitch is spot on and he's not a bad shout for captain IMO.

However, loads of truth has been said in this thread, how he needs to take his chances (had Martins missed the same chances, people would be screaming that he's hit & miss) and that our formation and general play is not suited to him.