Mort: I’m in charge

[nufcjmc]

We should not be trying match the big 4 in signing potential as all that does is result in in mega-inflated prices, we should move ahead of them & compete with progressive french clubs, PSV, Ajax, the big 3 in Portugal etc. We can beat all of these clubs with £££'s. We need some here & now players signed ASAP, long term plans are great for developing 'the business' but football clubs are about results of the first team & everything else functions off that.

 

Thing is if your willing to splash the cash you can get the best of both worlds as with the right ammount of money you can get great "here and now" talent who is still in their early 20's. It does not have to be 15-16 year olds nore does it have to be 30-33 year olds past their prime comming in to fill gaps.

 

I never used age in my post, here & now refers to ability. Just dont want a load of  Ben Tozer's signed during Jan even though they are needed due to shite at youth & resever level

 

sorry only quoted you as I was following on from your point really (everyone is so jumpy about their posts lately). I agree that it is a sad state of affairs that our academy lads dont cut the mustard in the managers eyes but this is something that alot of clubs have been doing for a long time. Although it is the only action we have seen so far this does not mean it is our only business this window as in the summer window many of our signings were made with little to no press knowledge.

[Parky]

I guess people are going to read the tea leaves how they may.  I, for one, am optimistic about things given the overall tone and content of the messages delivered by Ashley and Mort so far.  The odd one or two are ambiguous, there's no denying.  And it almost goes without saying though that talk is cheap.  It's  actions that speak louder than any "oh I'd like to win the league in 5 years and Europe would be nice too" statement. 

 

All that said I am, for better or worse, backing Mort and Ashley to match ambition to potential and if not establish us back in the upper tier than at least force the coining of the term "Big 5." 

Well unless they pull their fingers out of their arses, that can be put on hold till at least the 2009/2010 season.

 

Its really quite simple, without europe we wont attract top players. Without top players we wont get into europe. Any notions of a big 5 are thus miles away.

 

To break this conundrum you need large investments, good judgements and to ultimately not be scared to take a gamble. Like when Bobby bought Robert.

Right but I don't think they've ruled out any of that. 

 

Yes, Mort has said we won't be spending big in January.  But just as it's speculation for me to say they're waiting for summer for the big moves it's also speculation to say they won't be. 

 

I guess what I don't get is why you think prudence at an early stage is equivilant to self-administered colon massages.  You mention waiting till 09/10 and that doesn't seem so far fetched or unreasonable.  I certianly wasn't expecting instant success, were you?

 

Nae idea what that means 

 

This is one of the fiercest competitions in the sporting and business world. In fact, as a market its a pure out and out cut-throat, break-neck speed manifestation of the devil's invisible hand. We need iron balls and to take risks and we need to do it yesterday otherwise someone else will do it before us.

 

Patience is something i've got a lot of, i've defended Allardyce all season, saying we need to give it time. We also need to invest, its an incontrevertible truth of any competitive market. The manager needs time as he has the hardest and most complicated job at the club. The board have one of the simplest. Its called 'backing the manager'.

 

...and so the battle lines are drawn. 

[Lotus]

To answer NE5,

 

No idea if the new Board will be 'better' than the old. I believe the old Board did well enough to earn the right to make a few mistakes and were unfairly viewed by some fans. They appointed some good managers and backed them (not SBR straight away though which is point i keep making and you keep avoiding). They appointed some sh*te and backed them too.

 

Your view is biased though, no matter what you say. You were happy enough when we appointed Roeder, a relegation specialist, because you could understand the club wanting to do something 'different.' He only bought £15m worth of players, SA has bought more than that already. You can't retort that it wasn't prudent to let Roeder spend more because your opinion is that if you appoint a man you must back him, i.e. Dalgleish, Gullit and Souness.

Maybe this is the club trying something 'different' again, trying to start with youth as heavy investment in the 1st team hasn't cemented us a place in the top 4/6.

 

Do you really think that we'd be challenging for a CL place with SA as manager and FS as chairman? Because that's the only criteria you're using to judge the new Board so you must have believed we'd be in the hunt this seaason if FS had stayed.

 

Fwiw, i would like to see more spent on the 1st team in January but the players SA wants must be available for the right money, that's life! You don't always get the players you want, when you want. Sometimes you have to build a little slower. SBR wanted Zenden iirc but he didn't want to come and we bought Robert, Bellamy instead of Jeffers, etc.

Personally i think a better time to judge where we are heading will be at the close of the August 08 window.

 

I know we all want the same thing, and i hope we all get it.

[Parky]

To answer NE5,

 

No idea if the new Board will be 'better' than the old. I believe the old Board did well enough to earn the right to make a few mistakes and were unfairly viewed by some fans. They appointed some good managers and backed them (not SBR straight away though which is point i keep making and you keep avoiding). They appointed some sh*te and backed them too.

 

Your view is biased though, no matter what you say. You were happy enough when we appointed Roeder, a relegation specialist, because you could understand the club wanting to do something 'different.' He only bought £15m worth of players, SA has bought more than that already. You can't retort that it wasn't prudent to let Roeder spend more because your opinion is that if you appoint a man you must back him, i.e. Dalgleish, Gullit and Souness.

Maybe this is the club trying something 'different' again, trying to start with youth as heavy investment in the 1st team hasn't cemented us a place in the top 4/6.

 

Do you really think that we'd be challenging for a CL place with SA as manager and FS as chairman? Because that's the only criteria you're using to judge the new Board so you must have believed we'd be in the hunt this seaason if FS had stayed.

 

Fwiw, i would like to see more spent on the 1st team in January but the players SA wants must be available for the right money, that's life! You don't always get the players you want, when you want. Sometimes you have to build a little slower. SBR wanted Zenden iirc but he didn't want to come and we bought Robert, Bellamy instead of Jeffers, etc.

Personally i think a better time to judge where we are heading will be at the close of the August 08 window.

 

I know we all want the same thing, and i hope we all get it.

 

 

I think Ne5 is talking about 'the nature' of Morts comments reg purchasing players in Jan....Rather than availability or what not..

[biggs]

tbh there are not that many good quality players moving around in jan maybe players are shown the door because they are not rated by there manager or have fell out and are too heavy on the wage bill ,you can pick and mix in that lot imho

[Thespence]

tbh there are not that many good quality players moving around in jan maybe players are shown the door because they are not rated by there manager or have fell out and are too heavy on the wage bill ,you can pick and mix in that lot imho

 

We better make sure we sign the few good quality players then.

[nufcjmc]

http://www.shieldsgazette.com/nufc/Sam-targets-three-new-signings.3604524.jp

 

least the manager is making the right sort of noises even if we all cant agree what Mort means.

[ChezGiven]

"2 to 3 quality players" Cant disagree with that.

[nufcjmc]

"2 to 3 quality players" Cant disagree with that.

 

Just seen the chron article and as usual the spin + daggers are out no quotes from the big man himself regards budget but all of a sudden we have no money for this and no money for that. Although am I just hoping this is not true with rumours we wanted Brown on loan rather than an out right buy.

[Rich]

Exact same story in the Chronicle and will no doubt be on NUFC.co.uk as well at some point today.

 

These journalists have a hard life

 

The article does say we don't have "£6M" to spend on one player, though, which would be a worry if true.

[KaKa]

Sounds like we are looking at loan signings.

 

Some options would definitely be the likes of Gudjohnsen and even Cisse as thye are somewhat out of favour at the moment.

[nufcjmc]

Exact same story in the Chronicle and will no doubt be on NUFC.co.uk as well at some point today.

 

These journalists have a hard life

 

The article does say we don't have "£6M" to spend on one player, though, which would be a worry if true.

 

but again the only direct quotes from the manager is that he wants 2-3 quality in not how much we have which may be the papers doing a little of "padding out"

[Rich]

Exact same story in the Chronicle and will no doubt be on NUFC.co.uk as well at some point today.

 

These journalists have a hard life

 

The article does say we don't have "£6M" to spend on one player, though, which would be a worry if true.

 

but again the only direct quotes from the manager is that he wants 2-3 quality in not how much we have which may be the papers doing a little of "padding out"

 

You're not wrong, but in fairness I did say "if true".

 

I could personally see there being a few quid knocking around for someone decent, then a couple of the newly-titled "squad fillers" to see us through.

 

I'm not sure we should be buying any more defenders, at least unless it's a left-back, anyway. I personally wouldn't mind seeing David Edgar get a bit closer to the first team, he's only really had one off day (against Birmingham) and nobody else covered themselves in glory that night either.

[KaKa]

The Times says Rafa has to sell to buy in January after his meeting with the owners. apparently Riise is available with only 18 months left on his contract.

 

I would expect Sam to be looking at him for sure if this is indeed true.

[Optimistic Nut]

Riise's been poor the last couple of seasons.

[nufcjmc]

Exact same story in the Chronicle and will no doubt be on NUFC.co.uk as well at some point today.

 

These journalists have a hard life

 

The article does say we don't have "£6M" to spend on one player, though, which would be a worry if true.

 

but again the only direct quotes from the manager is that he wants 2-3 quality in not how much we have which may be the papers doing a little of "padding out"

 

You're not wrong, but in fairness I did say "if true".

 

I could personally see there being a few quid knocking around for someone decent, then a couple of the newly-titled "squad fillers" to see us through.

 

I'm not sure we should be buying any more defenders, at least unless it's a left-back, anyway. I personally wouldn't mind seeing David Edgar get a bit closer to the first team, he's only really had one off day (against Birmingham) and nobody else covered themselves in glory that night either.

 

sorry Janitor wasn't having ago.

 

I agree I believe there is money there I just dont believe Mort will allow SA to spunk 10-15mill on someone unproven and high risk, I dare bet during his reivew that we have done that to death. So when I am putting 2-2 together (what else can a fan do when there is nothing concrete) I hope that we are looking to only add to improve the squad and not to fill and there are funds but for the right player and more importantly the right price.

[nufcjmc]

Riise's been poor the last couple of seasons.

 

still only young though isn't he although I guess some would say we have had plenty of "clear out" players from the bigger clubs.

[Mowen]

If we could get Diarra and someone with a creative spark/bit of pace in for midfield I'd be a happy bunny.

[Rich]

Can't disagree with anything there at all, nufcjmc. Should have made it clear that by "squad-fillers" I was meaning potential loan signings - see how they do and keep an option open for a future purchase as an incentive.

 

I think Kaka's spot-on in the sort of area he's talking about with players like Riise - those will be the sorts of players that we'll be looking at getting our hands on. I can't see Allardyce wanting to bring in many more players from abroad.

 

Riise wouldn't be cheap though, even with 18 months left on his deal. If he's good enough to be a regular starter for Liverpool (which he has been for over 6 years now) then I dare say he's good enough for us. He's got a bit of an "x-factor" (hate that term) about him as well with his shooting capabilities, and would provide an option on set-plays that we've lacked since Shearer/Robert departed.

[Guest shaun11177]

If you have a squad of 22, 4 leave for a month, really you dont buy another 4 because you then have a squad of 26, which is unworkable and breaks the wages budget.

You might buy 1,maybe get 1 loan and buy a youngster thats more likely.

What the club need to do in January is make a decision on Owen or are we going to let him run his contract down

[Rich]

If we could get Diarra and someone with a creative spark/bit of pace in for midfield I'd be a happy bunny.

 

It's very unlikely to happen, isn't it? Diarra alone would cost a fair whack, being only 6 months into a new contract. I'd be happy with Diarra + nobody, personally.

[nufcjmc]

Can't disagree with anything there at all, nufcjmc. Should have made it clear that by "squad-fillers" I was meaning potential loan signings - see how they do and keep an option open for a future purchase as an incentive.

 

I think Kaka's spot-on in the sort of area he's talking about with players like Riise - those will be the sorts of players that we'll be looking at getting our hands on. I can't see Allardyce wanting to bring in many more players from abroad.

 

Riise wouldn't be cheap though, even with 18 months left on his deal. If he's good enough to be a regular starter for Liverpool (which he has been for over 6 years now) then I dare say he's good enough for us. He's got a bit of an "x-factor" (hate that term) about him as well with his shooting capabilities, and would provide an option on set-plays that we've lacked since Shearer/Robert departed.

 

 

so used to  "squad fillers" being 30/33yr olds so just crossed wires. It is just so hard to second guess this manager and board which is what quite a few of the forum loved I for one hated the " we are going for him" or " we are looking at..." from the manager and chairman at times. I would rather sit back relax and complain when it has happened at the end of the day we can scream we can shout its the guys running the show that are going to do as they please. An trying to stay on topic if Mort is "in charge" as much as he seems to try and say he is then I hope he is in regularly consultation with the manager as although SA cannot sign the cheque he can point the chairman in the right direction.

[Mowen]

If we could get Diarra and someone with a creative spark/bit of pace in for midfield I'd be a happy bunny.

 

It's very unlikely to happen, isn't it? Diarra alone would cost a fair whack, being only 6 months into a new contract. I'd be happy with Diarra + nobody, personally.

 

Reasonably unlikely I guess, but I think Diarra only cost them £2m and has declared he wants out. Seems like he'd be the right signing at the right time with Butt looking seriously on the decline. Creativity is what we crave more than anything, imo, but it depends who's available. That's my ideal scenario though.

[nufcjmc]

If we could get Diarra and someone with a creative spark/bit of pace in for midfield I'd be a happy bunny.

 

It's very unlikely to happen, isn't it? Diarra alone would cost a fair whack, being only 6 months into a new contract. I'd be happy with Diarra + nobody, personally.

 

A loan option? With him voicing his "unhappyness" of being at the gunners.

[KaKa]

Exactly Janitor.

 

Quite a few think Riise is poor, but would you rather have N'Zogbia at left back? Besides there are hardly any decent left backs out there with premiership experience. He would certainly be a huge upgrade for us and better than we have had in years now at that position.

 

I would definitely expect us to bring in a speedy striker type on loan too as Oba is off. We will absolutely need that speed option upfront, as Owen isn't quick anymore and is always one mistep away from serious injury. Most quality strikers from abroad e.g. Castillo are unlikely to be made available on loan, so we will probably be looking at the likes of Cisse, who could do a similar type of job as Martins (share similar good and bad habits but can both be effective) and will certainly utilize his pace better.