Fulham 0 - 1 Newcastle United - 15/12/07 - post match reaction from page 15

[Crumpy Gunt]

I'm less concerned about attack as I am about our midfield  - it stinks!

 

It just goes over their head doesn't it?

[merlin]

He looked to be carrying something when he was taken off. Probably not serious like, he was whincing a bit beforehand though.

 

Furney's comment made me laugh though:"He'll score a goal and everyone will think he's done enough."

 

Well yeah, that's what i tend to expect from me strikers. 24 in 56 is ay-ok for me.

 

Martins can be abysmal all game but if he gets a goal or two he'll be forgiven. Such is the life of a striker.

 

It's fair enough, but you can both surely see that it severely hurts the team in general on days where Martins doesn't pull out a goal from somewhere, as he contributes pretty much nothing in terms of build-up play for the rest of the team.

 

I'd much prefer a player who scores less goals and can actually play a bit of football and improve the team with what he offers as a whole, rather than a headless chicken who scores the odd wonder goal here and there. Martins still has time to improve, but I'm really not seeing any development in his awareness sadly.

 

OK, but it sounds to me that you're not taking into consideration that he's being player out of position. And still doing alright with it anyhow.

 

When he's been deployed down the middle this season, he's been clinical and his movement have been much improved in comparison to last season. See the City goal for evidence of improved finishing, movement and touch. You can throw the Spurs goal in there aswell.

 

I'm tired of people saying he's not improving, because he is. And similarly with N'Zogbia, i think it'll help his development as an all-round player being played slightly out of position, because he'll have to learn new things. Where to move, when to time his runs, how to find a goalscoring position in the box (not that he's bad at that anyway), and so on.

 

His awareness isn't particularly great but it has and will improve over the course of the season, providing he's playing of course.

 

I'll never say he's a headless chicken because i just don't think he is.

 

Did you read what Sir Les said about him on Setanta ? This is on nufc.com today if you want to check...

basically, he says that Martins is NOT comfortable OR suited to playing 4-3-3, and enlarges on this by saying that he is not disciplined enough to fit the system as he keeps drifting inside...

This has been one of my biggest problems about Martins - he is an instinctive type of player and these`players do NOT have the right mental attitude to be a success at the top level ; every so often they will produce a moment of magic, but will then proceed to miss easy chances etc because they do not have the necessary discipline to either play within a framework or to keep a cool head when necessary - in the 70s, there was the case of Duncan Mckenzie, who had amazing skills but never reached the top even though he was given a chance in one of Leeds' best teams..there was also Stan Bowles who could undo teams like you've never seen when he felt like it, but then disappeared into obscurity because of his ill-disciplined private life...

 

Neither Owen NOR Martins are the answer to our striker problem - for entirely different reasons.

Owen gets too many injuries, but if he didn't, would  be one of the top scorers in the Prem, whereas Martins just hasn't got what it takes to be a top striker .

If Les`Ferdinand is prepared to say it, that's confirmation enough for me that my doubts are justified, and for all those saying that Owen doesn't fit the system, this is confirmation that neither does Martins ..

.

He cannot play as a target man either - too small and individualistic - may be that is why NUFC is never successful - the fans seem to prefer moments of brilliance from erratic players than a disciplined team, which is the only way to bring success.

 

the fans in general may prefer that, but lets be honest, how many players have we had in the last 5 years capable of moments of brilliance, maybe 3

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

[Ally]

Going back to what Wullie said before about Smith - I rate him as a striker in terms of holding the ball up and bringing others into things, but he poses absolutely zero goal threat.

[UV]

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

 

Show me just a couple of these many people please, I'd like to laugh at what else they say.

[merlin]

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

 

Show me just a couple of these many people please, I'd like to laugh at what else they say.

 

I've seen it said on this(and other)fans' Websites several times over the past few years...

[UV]

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

 

Show me just a couple of these many people please, I'd like to laugh at what else they say.

 

I've seen it said on this(and other)fans' Websites several times over the past few years...

 

Many times obviously as you said. You won't have any trouble finding a few examples then will you.

[pinkeye]

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

 

Show me just a couple of these many people please, I'd like to laugh at what else they say.

 

I've seen it said on this(and other)fans' Websites several times over the past few years...

 

Many times obviously as you said. You won't have any trouble finding a few examples then will you.

 

 

Seriously, everyone on this forum would rather win an ugly 1 - 0 game and take three points.

 

The media would like to portray us all as simple folk who love their football and don't mind winning or losing, load of bollocks - I'll take the win every time.

 

I can accept a defeat if the team has given 100% on the field though.

[Dave]

Seriously, everyone on this forum would should rather win an ugly 1 - 0 game and take three points.

 

The media would like to portray us all as simple folk who love their football and don't mind winning or losing, load of bollocks - I'll take the win every time.

 

I can accept a defeat if the team has given 100% on the field though.

 

FYP.

[pinkeye]

Seriously, everyone on this forum would should rather win an ugly 1 - 0 game and take three points.

 

The media would like to portray us all as simple folk who love their football and don't mind winning or losing, load of bollocks - I'll take the win every time.

 

I can accept a defeat if the team has given 100% on the field though.

 

FYP.

 

I accept that.

[TRon]

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

 

Show me just a couple of these many people please, I'd like to laugh at what else they say.

 

I've seen it said on this(and other)fans' Websites several times over the past few years...

 

Many times obviously as you said. You won't have any trouble finding a few examples then will you.

 

 

Seriously, everyone on this forum would rather win an ugly 1 - 0 game and take three points.

 

The media would like to portray us all as simple folk who love their football and don't mind winning or losing, load of bollocks - I'll take the win every time.

 

I can accept a defeat if the team has given 100% on the field though.

 

I think this is one of the few games this season where the term "winning ugly" actually applies. We played dire from an attack point of view but we defended well enough against admittedly poor opposition. But I'll take an away win built on a solid defence any day of the week.

 

 

[Guest timw]

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

 

Show me just a couple of these many people please, I'd like to laugh at what else they say.

 

I've seen it said on this(and other)fans' Websites several times over the past few years...

 

Many times obviously as you said. You won't have any trouble finding a few examples then will you.

 

 

Seriously, everyone on this forum would rather win an ugly 1 - 0 game and take three points.

 

The media would like to portray us all as simple folk who love their football and don't mind winning or losing, load of bollocks - I'll take the win every time.

 

I can accept a defeat if the team has given 100% on the field though.

 

I saw Peter Beardsley claim this the other day on TV (before the Arsenal match), that the Newcastle fans would rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0.  Surely that's not going to help the club's image, is it?

[TRon]

Thank God he's off the coaching staff.

[Guest BooBoo]

 

Absolutely true, but it doesn't seem to alter the basic thinking by many fans('I'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 in a boring game' .... etc etc.).

 

Show me just a couple of these many people please, I'd like to laugh at what else they say.

 

I've seen it said on this(and other)fans' Websites several times over the past few years...

 

Many times obviously as you said. You won't have any trouble finding a few examples then will you.

 

 

Seriously, everyone on this forum would rather win an ugly 1 - 0 game and take three points.

 

The media would like to portray us all as simple folk who love their football and don't mind winning or losing, load of bollocks - I'll take the win every time.

 

I can accept a defeat if the team has given 100% on the field though.

 

I saw Peter Beardsley claim this the other day on TV (before the Arsenal match), that the Newcastle fans would rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0.  Surely that's not going to help the club's image, is it?

 

Thats one of the laziest and patronising NUFC cliches around. Who in their right mind would choose a defeat over a win? Give me a 1-0 at Fulham over a 3-4 at Liverpool every day of the week.

[Guest timw]

Is it right up there with the "Newcastle fans would rather win the FA Cup than the Premiership title"?

 

makes me cringe every time I hear these.  How did they start?

 

I guess the fans probably ignore them, but it goes to show how unoriginal, cliched and boring the commentators are...

[Dave]

The booing doesn't help.

[Guest K9]

I think we did ok to get the win, Fulham really aren't a bad team and in some patches our football was ok. If people complain about us getting a rare away win and a bloody rare cleansheet then i dunno why you bother!

[Ally]

Is it right up there with the "Newcastle fans would rather win the FA Cup than the Premiership title"?

 

makes me cringe every time I hear these.  How did they start?

 

I guess the fans probably ignore them, but it goes to show how unoriginal, cliched and boring the commentators are...

 

Thats Shearer's fault.

[Slugsy]

I think we did ok to get the win, Fulham really aren't a bad team and in some patches our football was ok. If people complain about us getting a rare away win and a bloody rare cleansheet then i dunno why you bother!

 

Fulham were sh*t, we were sh*t, a lucky break at the end was the difference between two sh*t sides.

[Guest K9]

I think we did ok to get the win, Fulham really aren't a bad team and in some patches our football was ok. If people complain about us getting a rare away win and a bloody rare cleansheet then i dunno why you bother!

 

Fulham were sh*t, we were sh*t, a lucky break at the end was the difference between two sh*t sides.

 

So?

[Slugsy]

I think we did ok to get the win, Fulham really aren't a bad team and in some patches our football was ok. If people complain about us getting a rare away win and a bloody rare cleansheet then i dunno why you bother!

 

Fulham were sh*t, we were sh*t, a lucky break at the end was the difference between two sh*t sides.

 

So?

 

So we didnt play ok, Fulham were a bad team on the day and people aren't complaining about the result or the clean sheet but how sh*t we played.

 

Is that clear enough?

[Dave]

Good interview by SA

 

 

what did he say??

 

Dissapointed with the away win, would have prefered a draw.

 

I'm beginning to think some of our fans actally feel this way.

 

Since when has what teams deserve mattered a jot? If so, we'd have won some silverware a little more recently...

[Guest K9]

I think we did ok to get the win, Fulham really aren't a bad team and in some patches our football was ok. If people complain about us getting a rare away win and a bloody rare cleansheet then i dunno why you bother!

 

Fulham were sh*t, we were sh*t, a lucky break at the end was the difference between two sh*t sides.

 

So?

 

So we didnt play ok, Fulham were a bad team on the day and people aren't complaining about the result or the clean sheet but how sh*t we played.

 

Is that clear enough?

 

But it doesn't matter how we played since we won

[Slugsy]

I think we did ok to get the win, Fulham really aren't a bad team and in some patches our football was ok. If people complain about us getting a rare away win and a bloody rare cleansheet then i dunno why you bother!

 

Fulham were sh*t, we were sh*t, a lucky break at the end was the difference between two sh*t sides.

 

So?

 

So we didnt play ok, Fulham were a bad team on the day and people aren't complaining about the result or the clean sheet but how sh*t we played.

 

Is that clear enough?

 

But it doesn't matter how we played since we won

 

In the bigger picture I think it does, every further game that we play cr*p gives me less confidence for when we actually play a team that is good.  Secondly, I get no further confidence that Allardyce know what the hell is he doing.

 

Indeed it really doesn't matter how we play in a one-off game as long as we win it, in fact if we play sh*t all season and win all our games then fine, but that isn't going to happen, the longer you consistently play sh*t, the more likehood we will be in a low position in the league come the end of the season as we will get found out by better teams and there are quite a few out there - as we have already this season.

 

So by all means be happy for the result but not caring how we play isn't really seeing the wood for the trees.

 

 

[pinkeye]

Anyone who saw Liverpool v Man Utd on Sunday will have seen 2 teams playing far better against each other than they normally play.  It is the same with us (Usually) we tend to play a little better against the better quality teams, see Arsenal on 5th Dec for a recent example.

[Slugsy]

Anyone who saw Liverpool v Man Utd on Sunday will have seen 2 teams playing far better against each other than they normally play.  It is the same with us (Usually) we tend to play a little better against the better quality teams, see Arsenal on 5th Dec for a recent example.

 

I would say Arsenal was the exception rather than the rule.  My worry is more against the so called poorer teams, we may get the odd result i.e. Fulham but moreover we will get found out if we play sh*t - Man City, Reading, Blackburn.  Performances such as at Fulham gives me no confidence that we will consistently get results.