madras Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 This past week has the air of Freddy Shepherd about it and that's what worries me more than anything. complete drivel. we sack an under performing manager and (if true) get in a replacement. no quotes about it being a top job and "not believing who wants to come". complete fucking silence really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I don't deal in assumptions. This fiasco could only have been substansiated if indeed a high quality coach had been secured. To say we had to do it cause this might have happenned or that or whatever is pointless. We're 11th and actually we had produced 2 or our best footballing performcances (Arsenal and Chelsea) recently. I could easily assume we would start picking up points again. That isn't the debate here. But there's no indication we would start picking up points (Arsenal and Chelsea were blips on a otherwise terrible season) and Mort/Ashley have to use there judgement (which includes assumptions) to best decide what to do. If they're sure Sam is going nowhere and will have us sitting somewhere in the bottom half at the end of the season then why shouldn't they act on it. Obviously they had already decided that Sam would be sacked, so it became a question of: A:- Leave him in charge until the end of the season and inevitably end up in the bottom half, possibly in a relegation fight (at which point we're a much worse proposition for the new manager they want and any new players they want). Or B:- Just get the manager we want now, give him some funds and a chance to get started early so he's properly prepared for next season. I know what you're saying, and my opinion was always keep sam unless they have the right manager lined up. But obviously if what's being said in the papers is true Harry is there right man and if they know they can get him now then why not? Apparently Ashley toyed with sacking Allardyce just after taking over, but decided to give him a chance, maybe he just didn't want to make that mistake again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 This past week has the air of Freddy Shepherd about it and that's what worries me more than anything. Agreed. The only reason for sacking Sam the way they did was if they had a top manager lined up and ready to step in. I'm not suggesting that they don't, but it's looking increasingly likely that they will, or indeed already have approached Redknapp. This just seems to show a lack of real ambition. Everyone remembers in the summer when Ashley and his millions blew through here with promises of making us a force in Europe. This is his chance to show his intent, or lack thereof... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sicko2ndbest Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him, this is how he will pass the first test Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPIB Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I'm going to reserve judgement until the new manager (Redknapp?) is officially appointed, until then I don't think it's possible to really say they have failed. So as soon as he's appointed, you can "really" say they've failed ?? Get a fucking grip man I am less than impressed myself, but will not throw anyone under a bus yet Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackyboy Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 The comments on Sky text by the Spurs Chairman/owner who is a big pal of Ashleys, summed it up. He said that 'mike has spent 250 mil on NUFC and he came here with a plan. That plan was to bring to Newcastle what he and the fans wanted, good attacking football. Sam wasn't appointed by Mike but he thought okay, lets see if he can deliver what we want' He went on to say that when Mike makes up his mind anout something he doesn't hang around. I was shocked at the sacking but to be honest, the football served up by Sam was some of the worst I have ever endured. One shot at goal against Derby sums it up. As far as comments about us not being in any trouble and 11th place is not bad is a joke. With the squad that we have they should manage 11th place without a manager. I am trying not listen to all of the crap that's flying around in the media. I keep telling myself that Ashley already has the man in his pocket who he wants. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 He's ended a nightmare a few month early, what's wrong with that? Sam Allardyce couldn't cut it, all he had to do was play 442, players in the right position, motivate them, and get some wins under his belt. That's all he had to do, that would of proved to the board he could do the job, instead the stubborn tit had to do it his way, which was the most boring crap, disjointed football thats been served up here in years. He had to go, he was a failure, he failed at everything on the pitch. pragmatic view of someone who didn't want him. Not saying I disagree though TT, because I do agree, and i was happy when we got him. Like many others I'm massively disappointed at what happened. All we wanted was a few better results and a feeling that he knew what he was doing. Surely that wasn't much to ask. I have got to say, that I honestly didn't feel that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him , this is how he will pass the first test so simple. so correct. Why does it take so long for people to understand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him, this is how he will pass the first test so simple. so correct. Why does it take so long for people to understand. I'd prefer he backed a manager that was significantly better than the one he just sacked. Why does it take so long for people to understand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sicko2ndbest Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him, this is how he will pass the first test so simple. so correct. Why does it take so long for people to understand. I'd prefer he backed a manager that was significantly better than the one he just sacked. Why does it take so long for people to understand. I don't understand who you are referring to though. Apart from Mourinho anyone else who came in from outside the premiership would be a gamble. And before you throw Sven up, he knew English football. I was all for Big Sam, thought he deserved his chance but Ashley thought differently, so it didn't matter what he did he was going to go at some point or later he was going to go We have got a Billionaire English owner, who hates 2nd best, a chairman with the PR skills of Max Clifford, and a potential manager who the owner wants to back significantly and thinks the world of, and in fact isnt a bad manager. From my perspective things couldnt look much better Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him, this is how he will pass the first test so simple. so correct. Why does it take so long for people to understand. I'd prefer he backed a manager that was significantly better than the one he just sacked. Why does it take so long for people to understand. Agreed, but nothing is that simple. Dalglish had a track record better than Alex Ferguson at the time, and he flopped. Sometimes its a matter of the 2 pieces just being right for each other. Does he have the right personality for your club ? Is he good in front of the camera [important to Newcastle this one]. What sort of football does he play [important because its been proven AGAIN that managers who bore the pants off people don't last long when they aren't winning. I've never like Redknappy for being a cockney tosser etc etc etc but I can see some positives. Wenger has always been my number 1 choice though, and with hindsight although Allardyce had certain qualities that were right for a Newcastle manager, the fact that he couldn't shake off his small time club mentality, and try to play the right type of football that you must play at the high level if you want to succeed at that level, has been his downfall. I think that Redknapp does play this type of football. So it all rests on how much he is backed and how well he uses the money, and yes, how long he is given. But I think if he struggles in his first few months he will get some slack because it may be that we can that he may be on the right lines. Hopefully. If its Harry, he has my backing, and even a week ago I never thought I would say that about him. But thinking about it now ........ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him , this is how he will pass the first test so simple. so correct. Why does it take so long for people to understand. Not really. He has to get in a manager who is actually capable of delivering what he and the fans expect. What if he thought some tool like Steve 'Geordie Boy' Bruce could do that, and then proceeded to back him to the hilt? A ridiculous example, but you get my point. I think his appointment should reflect the ambition that his bank balance can support. Hopefully it will, but at the minute, most people are decidedly underwhelmed by all the press speculation surrounding Redknapp, and this is breeding bad vibes... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 How would people feel about Didier Deschamps? I've got an inkling he's been in touch with the club. Would he be a better appointment then Harry? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him , this is how he will pass the first test so simple. so correct. Why does it take so long for people to understand. Not really. He has to get in a manager who is actually capable of delivering what he and the fans expect. What if he thought some tool like Steve 'Geordie Boy' Bruce could do that, and then proceeded to back him to the hilt? A ridiculous example, but you get my point. I think his appointment should reflect the ambition that his bank balance can support. Hopefully it will, but at the minute, most people are decidedly underwhelmed by all the press speculation surrounding Redknapp, and this is breeding bad vibes... I'm not in the mood to go into this again just now. But any board who doesn't have ambition and doesn't stretch out for success through failing their managers to the best of their ability, are shite. Full stop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Ashley is about to employ a manager he believes in. The acid test comes with how he backs him, this is how he will pass the first test so simple. so correct. Why does it take so long for people to understand. I'd prefer he backed a manager that was significantly better than the one he just sacked. Why does it take so long for people to understand. I don't understand who you are referring to though. Apart from Mourinho anyone else who came in from outside the premiership would be a gamble. And before you throw Sven up, he knew English football. I was all for Big Sam, thought he deserved his chance but Ashley thought differently, so it didn't matter what he did he was going to go at some point or later he was going to go We have got a Billionaire English owner, who hates 2nd best, a chairman with the PR skills of Max Clifford, and a potential manager who the owner wants to back significantly and thinks the world of, and in fact isnt a bad manager. From my perspective things couldnt look much better It's not up to me to find and appoint someone tbf. All managers are a gamble, just ask Freddy Shepherd. I agree things aren't as bad as some are making out though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shak Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I'm finding all the mass hysteria a bit funny in all honesty. You'd swear we'd just appointed Souness again or something the way some people are going on. Can anyone really tell me that Sam Allardyce is in any way a significantly better bet than Harry Redknapp to build us a side capable of challenging for the Top 6? The general consensus for some time has been that Newcastle need to find a manager and properly back him and give him the time to build a good team. To me it's quite clear that Ashley just doesn't trust Sam to spend any significant money in rebuilding the team, and if that's the case then it makes absolutely no business sense for Ashley to invest in a man in whom he does not believe. I'd rather he get his own man in now, at least it may be an indication that he's not content to just let this season float by aimlessly, he wants to start improving things now. We'd have all loved to get Mourinho or Lippi in, but that's not exactly easy to do no matter what some people seem to believe. Once you get outside the really top class candidates like that, everyone is a risky appointment. Your best bet is to make your pick and back him until you feel that maybe he's taken you as far as he can. Ashley now has HIS man, the first real test for him is now whether he backs him or not. If anything maybe this will remove some of the Superman image that some people seem to have of Ashley, as if he's some sort of magical angel sent to lead us to our rightful promised land of glory after the tyranny of the evil Shepherd. He's just another chairman at the end of the day. Furthermore, people declaring this to be a 'Massive Sidestep' need to think about what exactly a sidestep is. Doesn't really matter how far sideways you step tbph, you're still the same distance from where you want to be. We have a manager the chairman wants now, one who is every bit as capable/uncapable as Sam of taking us where we want to be. Only crucial difference is that the chairman will back this man, or at least we would hope so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 We have a manager the chairman wants now, one who is every bit as capable/uncapable as Sam of taking us where we want to be. Only crucial difference is that the chairman will back this man, or at least we would hope so. Another difference is Redknapp doesn't have an incredibly stilted and negative Football philosophy that he sticks to no matter what. Though I have to admit that Portsmouth's shocking lack of goals at home does worry me a little bit.. But not too much given how well the team have played overall this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisJbarnes Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 We have a manager the chairman wants now, one who is every bit as capable/uncapable as Sam of taking us where we want to be. Only crucial difference is that the chairman will back this man, or at least we would hope so. Another difference is Redknapp doesn't have an incredibly stilted and negative Football philosophy that he sticks to no matter what. Though I have to admit that Portsmouth's shocking lack of goals at home does worry me a little bit.. But not too much given how well the team have played overall this season. did you see our shocking lack of goals at home? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Fucking hell again. Big Sam's failure doesn't mean he should be sacked NOW. You can never defend Mort and Ashley for this mess---tell me why we should sack him before we find a replacement? We have fucked this up again and again and again... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Fucking hell again. Big Sam's failure doesn't mean he should be sacked NOW. You can never defend Mort and Ashley for this mess---tell me why we should sack him before we find a replacement? We have fucked this up again and again and again... To be clear it isn't an unmitigated disaster (it isn't McClown) and there are good things about Nappy. The football might/probably will improve and we might get one or two gems and one or two donkeys...Who really knows. MA might feel better about giving Nappy the money and the relationship might be better.....But you know why jump for the stars if your keks are tied to a lamp post? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 f****** hell again. Big Sam's failure doesn't mean he should be sacked NOW. You can never defend Mort and Ashley for this mess---tell me why we should sack him before we find a replacement? We have f***** this up again and again and again... To be clear it isn't an unmitigated disaster (it isn't McClown) and there are good things about Nappy. The football might/probably will improve and we might get one or two gems and one or two donkeys...Who really knows. MA might feel better about giving Nappy the money and the relationship might be better.....But you know why jump for the stars if your keks are tied to a lamp post? at the same time...don't jump for the stars if you are on the edge of a block of flats ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 We have a manager the chairman wants now, one who is every bit as capable/uncapable as Sam of taking us where we want to be. Only crucial difference is that the chairman will back this man, or at least we would hope so. Another difference is Redknapp doesn't have an incredibly stilted and negative Football philosophy that he sticks to no matter what. Though I have to admit that Portsmouth's shocking lack of goals at home does worry me a little bit.. But not too much given how well the team have played overall this season. did you see our shocking lack of goals at home? Yes, but firstly I don't want the same s*** that Allardyce gave me and secondly Portsmouth's lack of home goals was even worse then ours. They haven't scored a single goal in there last 6 home games. Having said that I don't think its a major concern, just seems like one of those strange things that happens sometimes. Or does anyone know other reasons that have caused this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor Swift Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 The fact that they have not tried for any other manager bothers me. The fact that it seems that their criteria for appointing managers is 'pick a mate' bothers me even more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedudeabides Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 This was purely a business decision by Ashley and Mort. Another half season of absolutely garbage football, would have seen at least 10,000 fans jacking in their season ticket. They've merely made a move to address that......whether or not Rednapp is the right choice as replacement remains to be seen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 The fact that they have not tried for any other manager bothers me. The fact that it seems that their criteria for appointing managers is 'pick a mate' bothers me even more. The fact that successful managers are never appointed during season bothers me most. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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