Kevin Keegan

[Kid Icarus]

16 minutes ago, St. Maximin said:

I agree and I’ve clarified my view above but I just don’t think anyone has said that. You have to bear in mind the context here being Keegan’s recent comments, rather than someone just out of the blue having a rant about women commentators because he heard one on the TV and didn’t like them. 

They have like, 100%

 

Keegan's comments are an aside from this thread for me tbh, I just think he phrased what he meant poorly.

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

3 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

And the people who seemingly can’t handle the concept of women talking about football on telly are what exactly?

Who gives a fuck man

[Wullie]

1 minute ago, Dr Venkman said:

No preference based on sex.

 

Actually don’t have a preference based on anything, not arsed who plays football.

 

Fair enough. I'll leave it up to everyone else to make their mind up who actually believes that.

[Dr Venkman]

1 minute ago, Wullie said:

 

Fair enough. I'll leave it up to everyone else to make their mind up who actually believes that.

What are you on about?

 

Who has an internal list of preferences of who they prefer playing football? Based on what?

[huss9]

4 hours ago, Abacus said:

What about when they walk in front of the telly when the match is on as well.

[huss9]

leave KK alone man.

its an opinion.

no one got hurt.

[Kid Icarus]

4 minutes ago, RUHRLYASLEEVESUP said:

Who gives a fuck man

 All of the people posting about it, including you, obviously. Could say that about anything on here as well.

[Kid Icarus]

7 minutes ago, Wullie said:

 

Fair enough. I'll leave it up to everyone else to make their mind up who actually believes that.

 

Is this the same Wullie from Chat? 

[Dr Venkman]

@Wullie Is this supposed to be some sort of gotcha? The premise being that I can’t call out misogyny because I obviously have a preference for men playing sport based on sex alone and therefore people who have explicitly stated they are prejudiced based on sex can’t be misogynist? Is that what’s happening? And if I don’t agree with you that I have a preference based on sex alone then you just don’t believe me and no-one else should? 

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

 All of the people posting about it, including you, obviously. Could say that about anything on here as well.

Nah I don't, honestly I don't

[Thomson Mouse]

3 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said:

@Wullie Is this supposed to be some sort of gotcha? The premise being that I can’t call out misogyny because I obviously have a preference for men playing sport based on sex alone and therefore people who have explicitly stated they are prejudiced based on sex can’t be misogynist? Is that what’s happening? And if I don’t agree with you that I have a preference based on sex alone then you just don’t believe me and no-one else should? 

 

Yeah it’s very straw man.

 

The only defence for this is Keegan is ‘old school’, thats it. 

[Dr Venkman]

1 minute ago, Thomson Mouse said:

 

Yeah it’s very straw man.

 

The only defence for this is Keegan is ‘old school’, thats it. 

Not bothered about Keegan TBH, he’s a lost cause.

[GideonShandy]

6 hours ago, Dr Jinx said:

I also think for the most part, that women are not funny / lack a sense of humour / make absolutely shit stand up comedians. Prove me wrong.

 

[Kid Icarus]

19 minutes ago, RUHRLYASLEEVESUP said:

Nah I don't, honestly I don't

Cool, bye then

[Thomson Mouse]

11 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said:

Not bothered about Keegan TBH, he’s a lost cause.

 

He is what he is, I don’t agree with it at all

[Wullie]

23 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said:

@Wullie Is this supposed to be some sort of gotcha? The premise being that I can’t call out misogyny because I obviously have a preference for men playing sport based on sex alone and therefore people who have explicitly stated they are prejudiced based on sex can’t be misogynist? Is that what’s happening? And if I don’t agree with you that I have a preference based on sex alone then you just don’t believe me and no-one else should? 

 

Sorry not sure what you mean here exactly, probably my fault.

 

My point was that you took issue with @St. Maximin for saying that there was "nothing misogynistic about preferring male commentators to female ones" but I think you (and I, and everyone else on this forum) have a preference for watching male footballers over female ones. Why is it misogynist to prefer watching/hearing a male commentator but not a male footballer? My disbelief was your claim that you don't prefer watching men playing football. 

[RUHRLYASLEEVESUP]

8 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

Cool, bye then

Zzzzzzzzzz

[Whitley mag]

King Kev could commit murder and he’d still be the King.

[huss9]

Just now, Whitley mag said:

King Kev could commit murder and he’d still be the King.

or a crown prince at the very least 

[Dr Venkman]

17 minutes ago, Wullie said:

 

Sorry not sure what you mean here exactly, probably my fault.

 

My point was that you took issue with @St. Maximin for saying that there was "nothing misogynistic about preferring male commentators to female ones" but I think you (and I, and everyone else on this forum) have a preference for watching male footballers over female ones. Why is it misogynist to prefer watching/hearing a male commentator but not a male footballer? My disbelief was your claim that you don't prefer watching men playing football. 

It wasn’t him, it was @Orphanage. We’ve already had the discussion about what misogyny is/isn’t, some tried to change the definition because they don’t like it, can’t think why. It’s just boring for everyone now.

Assuming a sex-based preference for anything, to everyone on this forum, is just bizarre. All I can tell you is that I don’t have a preference for anything which is based purely on sex. Not that I’m aware of, anyway. If I became aware of it I’d try to address it, maybe discuss it with people I trust, maybe have some therapy if I could afford it. Alternatives to that approach would be either owning it/coming to terms with it, or contacting the Oxford Dictionary to lobby them to change the definition of misogyny.

 

 

 

Edited October 6, 2023 by Dr Venkman

[loki679]

Wullie has a point though.  Women's football isn't a great standard which is an excuse given often for why people don't watch it.  Those same people will happily watch a bunch of League Two cloggers kick the crap out of each other for 90 minutes though.

[gbandit]

I’m with you on this entirely Venkman. I think the point Wullie is making though, although a little snidely in that post about “leaving it up to others to decide” is that in practice you consume a lot of football and that the vast majority of it will be men’s. You are a massive NUFC fan but that’s because of supporting the men’s team rather than being a big follower of the women’s team I imagine. So in practice, there is a preference based on your environmental experience, you’d likely choose to watch the men rather women play if they were both on at the same time. However, what you’re arguing is that having a more intrinsic feeling of “i could never enjoy women’s football or there’s no way I could enjoy it as much as men’s” is misogyny which I agree with because it’s all socially constructed

[Kid Icarus]

There's been a huge leap from one person saying

 

"we don't need women pundits and commentators in the men's game, it's a solution to a problem that doesn't exist"

 

to the next person saying "nothing wrong with a preference over women commentators if it's based on their commentating" 

 

to the next person saying "do you have a preference for men's football?"

 

From "women shouldn't speak" to "men's football is at a higher level to women's and it's okay to have a preference" as if the problem was with the last point not the first.

[Thomson Mouse]

28 minutes ago, Wullie said:

 

Sorry not sure what you mean here exactly, probably my fault.

 

My point was that you took issue with @St. Maximin for saying that there was "nothing misogynistic about preferring male commentators to female ones" but I think you (and I, and everyone else on this forum) have a preference for watching male footballers over female ones. Why is it misogynist to prefer watching/hearing a male commentator but not a male footballer? My disbelief was your claim that you don't prefer watching men playing football. 

 

Hugely straw man and very presumptuous. Again.

[Wullie]

1 minute ago, gbandit said:

I’m with you on this entirely Venkman. I think the point Wullie is making though, although a little snidely in that post about “leaving it up to others to decide” is that in practice you consume a lot of football and that the vast majority of it will be men’s. You are a massive NUFC fan but that’s because of supporting the men’s team rather than being a big follower of the women’s team I imagine. So in practice, there is a preference based on your environmental experience, you’d likely choose to watch the men rather women play if they were both on at the same time. However, what you’re arguing is that having a more intrinsic feeling of “i could never enjoy women’s football or there’s no way I could enjoy it as much as men’s” is misogyny which I agree with because it’s all socially constructed

 

Since you've accused me of being "snide", do you prefer watching men's or women's football? Venkman claims he has no preference whatsoever, would need therapy if he did, and that my assuming that people on this Newcastle United forum have a preference for one over the other is "bizarre".

 

I certainly think this thread has gone bizarre.