Michael Owen

[Tooj]

One thing I've noticed as of late, especially after recently watching the 97/98 Season Review (Fuck knows why btw  ), with regards to Owen, for his label of being such a "top class" finisher he's missing a lot of half chances, that you would expect somebody at least of his reputation to slide away. There's a bit of comparison in when Shearer returned from his injury in the 97/98 season. During the league campaign he wasn't firing at all, but obviously carried us to Wembley. Except in the league he buried a truly awesome free-kick at home versus Palace. He was missing several half chances that you would expect someone of Shearer's calibre to have buried at the time, or at least taken a lot of them.

 

The same I feel at the moment can be said of one Michael Owen, whenever he's getting the odd half chance he seems to be not at the races when it comes to snatching these chances. Could it be down to the fact we aren't creating much, same in '98, so it's at the back of his mind about our lack of chances, were as if we were creating more chances he would be a bit more relaxed at times when he does actually seem to get a sort of a chance.

 

Could this possibly be due to the returning from injury/confidence factor and if we get some more creativity around him will we see anything like a decent goal return next season? Or is he plain and simply finished as a top level striker? 

 

There's no comparison btw of the Owen of now and Shearer even of '98 before people even think I'm saying there is.

[Dokko]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

[Yorkie]

Nah, i'm not 100% with Toon Taylor, but i'm edging toward that side of the spectrum. Not only has he been shite infront of goal, but he seems to have lost this instinct or whatever it was he had. I won't criticise him for his goal at the weekend, that was a very well taken header and quite encouraging because it was good movement, but that's just about the first i've seen of it this season. Well, atleast in his most recent run of games.

 

As i said in another thread the other day, i'm sick to death of him blindly, aimlessly running straight at the keeper whenever one of our wingers makes it into the box. On several occassions, all we're asking for is one of our strikers to drop off, and have the ball laid back to him. Smith hasn't got a clue but you'd expect better with Owen; he's really doing very little in the box on the whole.

 

Of course, it doesn't help that our midfielders, more often than not, hardly seem like they want to actually score a goal, and are afraid of taking up a decent position in the box on such occassions.

 

Maybe that goal will spur him on, but we've said that after each goal that he's scored this season. I hope he plays well on Wednesday. Owen re-finding his form would be brilliant. Not massively optimistic though; he looks painfully slow nowadays.

[Guest clownhat]

owen is poop... give martins a good run and see if he develops

[Dokko]

Nah, i'm not 100% with Toon Taylor, but i'm edging toward that side of the spectrum. Not only has he been shite infront of goal, but he seems to have lost this instinct or whatever it was he had. I won't criticise him for his goal at the weekend, that was a very well taken header and quite encouraging because it was good movement, but that's just about the first i've seen of it this season. Well, atleast in his most recent run of games.

 

As i said in another thread the other day, i'm sick to death of him blindly, aimlessly running straight at the keeper whenever one of our wingers makes it into the box. On several occassions, all we're asking for is one of our strikers to drop off, and have the ball laid back to him. Smith hasn't got a clue but you'd expect better with Owen; he's really doing very little in the box on the whole.

 

Of course, it doesn't help that our midfielders, more often than not, hardly seem like they want to actually score a goal, and are afraid of taking up a decent position in the box on such occassions.

 

Maybe that goal will spur him on, but we've said that after each goal that he's scored this season. I hope he plays well on Wednesday. Owen re-finding his form would be brilliant. Not massively optimistic though; he looks painfully slow nowadays.

 

You can go two ways after serious injuries, you can go Alan Shearer or Robbie Fowler, Owen is the new Fowler.

 

Lazy attitude, lazy professional, no nearly bothered enough about being on top of his game.

 

Passenger, an expensive one at that.

 

 

 

 

[Robster]

Owens skill was proved on Sunday.. when the rest are all struggling to get anywhere near the goal, he pops up and scores.

Thats his job, thats what he does. All he needs are a handful of opportunities in a decent side and he will always score.

Sadly,its the rest of the team that has made him look so poor during his time hear.

 

[Yorkie]

Nah, i'm not 100% with Toon Taylor, but i'm edging toward that side of the spectrum. Not only has he been shite infront of goal, but he seems to have lost this instinct or whatever it was he had. I won't criticise him for his goal at the weekend, that was a very well taken header and quite encouraging because it was good movement, but that's just about the first i've seen of it this season. Well, atleast in his most recent run of games.

 

As i said in another thread the other day, i'm sick to death of him blindly, aimlessly running straight at the keeper whenever one of our wingers makes it into the box. On several occassions, all we're asking for is one of our strikers to drop off, and have the ball laid back to him. Smith hasn't got a clue but you'd expect better with Owen; he's really doing very little in the box on the whole.

 

Of course, it doesn't help that our midfielders, more often than not, hardly seem like they want to actually score a goal, and are afraid of taking up a decent position in the box on such occassions.

 

Maybe that goal will spur him on, but we've said that after each goal that he's scored this season. I hope he plays well on Wednesday. Owen re-finding his form would be brilliant. Not massively optimistic though; he looks painfully slow nowadays.

 

You can go two ways after serious injuries, you can go Alan Shearer or Robbie Fowler, Owen is the new Fowler.

 

Lazy attitude, lazy professional, no nearly bothered enough about being on top of his game.

 

Passenger, an expensive one at that.

 

The guy himself has had a go at the media and the fans respectively for people assuming that he doesn't care, but half the time, that is honestly what it looks like to me. It's just his body language to me. It'd be fairly inhuman of him, given his wage, for not care a jot about the club - but he has looked distinctly unarsed on several occassions this season.

 

There's a few players in our team who need a kick up the backside, put in the right frame of mind, and they could be very important. Owen's one. Barton's another. Then the likes of Viduka, N'Zogbia, Martins. I'm glad we've got Keegan to try and deal with this.

 

I wouldn't have been too bothered if Owen had gone in January, but while he's here, there's still a chance he can do a good job for us.

[Ally]

He does seem to have lost his composure when he does get the odd chance we create. Agree with 2J though that its on his mind that when he does get a chance theres a lot of pressure on him to finish it.

[9]

As much as i agree he's been shite, yesterday was the 1st time ive seen owen chasing balls and tracking back...almost looked as if he cared at times...

[johnnypd]

Shearer had his strength and power to fall back on when his pace left him. he was also, even after his injuries, a better finisher than Owen was at any stage of his career. Shearer could seriously compete in the air and bully defenders, well as drop back and link up, leaving players like Bellamy and Dyer to create space and stretch the game. there was a good line in one of the papers at the weekend about Owen and England, that he spends most of his games loitering about the half way line, that "Now, Owen plays more with his back to goal – and there is nothing more pointless in international football than a 5ft 8in targetman with no pace". i'd also add that Owen has little strength and the robustness of fibre glass.

 

Owen's game has been based on getting into good positions, not his actual finishing, which tends to be pretty weak and fairly imprecise. his best finishes are also instinctive and quick, when he has to think about things, or if he gives a keeper or defender chance to react, he's nothing special. contrary to popular belief his finishing was never, ever world-class, it was just that the quality of chances he could manage to get to due to pace and positioning left him with little to do but tap it in. the chances he is getting now are far less gilt-edged and leave him with more work than he is capable of doing. look at his shots from outside the area, he just meekly parries them. a 32 year old shearer would rip the net open given a similar chance. he'll end up doing this a lot more now as he struggles to get completely free of defenders. how many times can he bring it right up to the keeper? only when he catches defenders pushing up trying to play offside, like against man utd. even then he is relying on the opposition making a mistake more than anything. these chances come around say 3 or 4 times a season, and they are so marginal that there's always a chance of a linesman ruling you offside.

 

when he joined us he was quick around the pitch. he no longer had the pace to sustain a run over 50 yards, or the ability to go past players, but he could still, mixed with his anticipation, get 5 yards on a player. when he's tried to do this recently he's failed, even against some poor centre-halves. outpaced and outmuscled by Stoke centre-halves.

 

on set-pieces when everyone starts from a static position and all you need is an inch of space to get a shot or header away in the blink of eye he will still be a massive danger, but in open play i think he's finished. unless of course he is playing in a team that completely dominates the territory and spends most the match attacking, putting in cross after cross, has a centre-forward alongside him with good movement and an ability to hold it up and slip Owen through. but then any striker will flourish in that kind of set-up. Keegan might create such a team tho. i wouldnt play Owen away from home as he's unlikely to ever get that kind of service and is useless on the break.

[Lenny]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

[Yorkie]

He does seem to have lost his composure when he does get the odd chance we create. Agree with 2J though that its on his mind that when he does get a chance theres a lot of pressure on him to finish it.

 

You're right... but that's not a good enough excuse for me (i'm not saying it is for you, Ally, btw). You don't get paid £100,000 a week to bottle a golden opportunity cos of a few nerves. Match after match.

 

I saw his interview after the game yesterday, and he was saying he hasn't really had chances of note. He's had several very good chances to score goals in his last few games. Stoke and Man City spring to mind where he either couldn't control or couldn't shoot. There was a chance against Man Utd too; Arsenal aswell, where Carr (i think) played a really nice low ball across the box and he wasn't sharp enough to get onto it.

 

I might give him the benefit of the doubt, and say that his Boro goal will spur him on, but if he's this striker he thinks he is, he should have converted those chances. They weren't particularly difficult.

[Yorkie]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

 

That's pretty over-the-top yourself, given his showings this season.

[Jamie]

I'm prepared to Owen many chances, he has th ability and would be wasted when not playing.

I mean who else would've scored a goal like his on Sunday ? no1.

Yes i like to call him all the time but the lad has ability to score a half chance that others wouldn't even get into the positions he does.

I'd just love it so much if Keegan could get Martins and Owen playing together, but that could only happen with bringing the right midfielders in

[Lenny]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

 

That's pretty over-the-top yourself, given his showings this season.

 

I cant recall him missing numerous sitters or good chances. Im not saying he hasnt missed any but you seem to be making out he's had lots of chances handed to him. Dont get me wrong I'm not the biggest fan of him and would sooner have a player that offers more to the team, but that post IMO was way over the top.

[Yorkie]

I'm prepared to Owen many chances, he has th ability and would be wasted when not playing.

I mean who else would've scored a goal like his on Sunday ? no1.

Yes i like to call him all the time but the lad has ability to score a half chance that others wouldn't even get into the positions he does.

I'd just love it so much if Keegan could get Martins and Owen playing together, but that could only happen with bringing the right midfielders in

 

Good point, Jamie. I'd be very keen to see those two paired together when Oba gets back.

[9]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

 

That's pretty over-the-top yourself, given his showings this season.

 

I cant recall him missing numerous sitters or good chances. Im not saying he hasnt missed any but you seem to be making out he's had lots of chances handed to him. Dont get me wrong I'm not the biggest fan of him and would sooner have a player that offers more to the team, but that post IMO was way over the top.

 

id like to know how many chances in the box he has had in the last 6 games, as you say cant think of many misses, except that one yesterday when it was cut back to him

[Yorkie]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

 

That's pretty over-the-top yourself, given his showings this season.

 

I cant recall him missing numerous sitters or good chances. Im not saying he hasnt missed any but you seem to be making out he's had lots of chances handed to him. Dont get me wrong I'm not the biggest fan of him and would sooner have a player that offers more to the team, but that post IMO was way over the top.

 

id like to know how many chances in the box he has had in the last 6 games, as you say cant think of many misses, except that one yesterday when it was cut back to him

 

If he'd used this so-called world class movement/pace he'd have had more chances. He's had plenty of chances anyhow.

[Lenny]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

 

That's pretty over-the-top yourself, given his showings this season.

 

I cant recall him missing numerous sitters or good chances. Im not saying he hasnt missed any but you seem to be making out he's had lots of chances handed to him. Dont get me wrong I'm not the biggest fan of him and would sooner have a player that offers more to the team, but that post IMO was way over the top.

 

id like to know how many chances in the box he has had in the last 6 games, as you say cant think of many misses, except that one yesterday when it was cut back to him

 

If he he'd used this so-called world class movement/pace he'd have had more chances. He's had plenty of chances anyhow.

 

You gotta have the service in the first place, and no one said anything about pace.

[Yorkie]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

 

That's pretty over-the-top yourself, given his showings this season.

 

I cant recall him missing numerous sitters or good chances. Im not saying he hasnt missed any but you seem to be making out he's had lots of chances handed to him. Dont get me wrong I'm not the biggest fan of him and would sooner have a player that offers more to the team, but that post IMO was way over the top.

 

id like to know how many chances in the box he has had in the last 6 games, as you say cant think of many misses, except that one yesterday when it was cut back to him

 

If he he'd used this so-called world class movement/pace he'd have had more chances. He's had plenty of chances anyhow.

 

You gotta have the service in the first place, and no one said anything about pace.

 

I did.

 

There has been service. When he was out for a while, people were saying "Owen would have buried that had he been given the chance..." and he has been given chances. They were hardly on a plate for him, but if he's got brilliant movement, they don't have to be right there on a plate for him do they? He's fannied around with several half/good chances.

 

I'll say it again though. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, in the (slim) hope that he could still do very well for us if Keegan sorts him out.

[Dokko]

Owen is finished as a top level striker, he's an average premiership striker at best.

 

Said it before, Owen needs new legs, a new heart and to be made bankrupt before he can find himself as a footballer again.

 

That is way, way over the top, verging on the absolute bollocks to be honest. Im not his biggest fan, and dont think he offers a lot to the team overall, but in terms of predatory instincts he is world class. There arent any better than him in the game at timing his runs, and he does finish a lot of his chances. You only have to look at the past few games where he's been incorrectly ruled offside against Arsenal and Man Utd.

 

IMO he has been getting sharper with each game since his return, and will improve (as long as he stays fit). He's never going to be the type of player to take on men and run around all day, he's about waiting and timing, but that doesnt make him lazy.

 

That's pretty over-the-top yourself, given his showings this season.

 

I cant recall him missing numerous sitters or good chances. Im not saying he hasnt missed any but you seem to be making out he's had lots of chances handed to him. Dont get me wrong I'm not the biggest fan of him and would sooner have a player that offers more to the team, but that post IMO was way over the top.

 

id like to know how many chances in the box he has had in the last 6 games, as you say cant think of many misses, except that one yesterday when it was cut back to him

 

If he he'd used this so-called world class movement/pace he'd have had more chances. He's had plenty of chances anyhow.

 

You gotta have the service in the first place, and no one said anything about pace.

 

I did.

 

There has been service. When he was out for a while, people were saying "Owen would have buried that had he been given the chance..." and he has been given chances. They were hardly on a plate for him, but if he's got brilliant movement, they don't have to be right there on a plate for him do they? He's fannied around with several half/good chances.

 

I'll say it again though. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, in the (slim) hope that he could still do very well for us if Keegan sorts him out.

 

Martins gets bollocked for missing a chance he created by himself, Owen gets off scott free for not putting away chances simply because he cannot create his own anymore, though lack of ability and lack of effort.

 

That never used to be the case, he was a good provider for himself, when he could be arsed.

 

 

[Guest rebel_yell12]

You know, Yorkie-Geordie, you and a few like you on the board here are the only people I hear bleating on about Owen having lots of chances and missing them.  Everyone else -- even most of those criticising him -- admit that Newcastle haven't given him more than one good chance per match of late.  He's had a few "half-chances" or even "quarter chances" (Keegan's words) but not many good chances.  And he SHOULD have had two goals yesterday.  Even Arsene Wenger was praising Owen's runs and movement (after BOTH matches, before you point out the whole "not saying he's crap before playing his team again in 3 days" angle from the first match) and pointing out that the class was still there.  Has Owen looked rusty?  Yes.  Has he been snatching at his chances (and therefore fluffing them)? Yes, and probably because there are so few of them and so much pressure on him to score, plus he's had several wrongly disallowed this season which must be frustrating.

 

Most people, without bias against Owen, admit that Newcastle's miserable form as a team is hindering Owen's chances to show if he's off-form or not as an individual.  I don't expect him to bury EVERY chance -- THAT'S inhuman.  I expect him to put more in the back of the net than he misses, that's a quality striker.  He had a 3 to 1 ratio yesterday.  Good enough for me, but clearly not for you.  You claim you're giving him a chance, "if Keegan sorts him out," but Owen isn't the one Keegan needs to be sorting.  And you aren't giving him a chance.  You're here slating him AFTER his best performance since returning from his latest injury.  Can Owen DO right in your world?  Or is he doomed to criticism because you don't like him -- because of his injuries, his pay, his stature in the game, whatever your reasoning is?

 

Fact is, Owen is the best Newcastle have got (except probably Given, whose form hasn't been impeccable of late either).  I just can't understand the hatred for him that some people spew at every conceivable, and the occasional inconceivable, opportunity.

[Jamie]

You know, Yorkie-Geordie, you and a few like you on the board here are the only people I hear bleating on about Owen having lots of chances and missing them.  Everyone else -- even most of those criticising him -- admit that Newcastle haven't given him more than one good chance per match of late.  He's had a few "half-chances" or even "quarter chances" (Keegan's words) but not many good chances.  And he SHOULD have had two goals yesterday.  Even Arsene Wenger was praising Owen's runs and movement (after BOTH matches, before you point out the whole "not saying he's crap before playing his team again in 3 days" angle from the first match) and pointing out that the class was still there.  Has Owen looked rusty?  Yes.  Has he been snatching at his chances (and therefore fluffing them)? Yes, and probably because there are so few of them and so much pressure on him to score, plus he's had several wrongly disallowed this season which must be frustrating.

 

Most people, without bias against Owen, admit that Newcastle's miserable form as a team is hindering Owen's chances to show if he's off-form or not as an individual.  I don't expect him to bury EVERY chance -- THAT'S inhuman.  I expect him to put more in the back of the net than he misses, that's a quality striker.  He had a 3 to 1 ratio yesterday.  Good enough for me, but clearly not for you.  You claim you're giving him a chance, "if Keegan sorts him out," but Owen isn't the one Keegan needs to be sorting.  And you aren't giving him a chance.  You're here slating him AFTER his best performance since returning from his latest injury.  Can Owen DO right in your world?  Or is he doomed to criticism because you don't like him -- because of his injuries, his pay, his stature in the game, whatever your reasoning is?

 

Fact is, Owen is the best Newcastle have got (except probably Given, whose form hasn't been impeccable of late either).  I just can't understand the hatred for him that some people spew at every conceivable, and the occasional inconceivable, opportunity.

Wouldn't argue with much of that. He should've scored at Man Utd Arsenal and at home to Boro, all were disallowed

[Yorkie]

Hatred? Get real mate. I've hardly been spouting hate-filled messages towards the guy. I've said i still have a bit of faith in the guy. I've said that he probably does care about the club, just not enough at times from the looks of things. Is that not a fair thing to say, given his colossal wage slip each week? And i'm hardly slating him am i? I praised him for his goal yesterday... (but on the contrary, if that was his 'best performance' yesterday, then i think my point about him being a bit pants this season is well justified). I've said i want to see him in the team alongside Martins. And i don't especially dislike the bloke, he seems honest enough, i don't really know where you've got that from. I've never said anything derogatory towards him because of his injuries or his 'stature in the game'. You're making things up now mate...

 

I've been against him this season because he's been poor in my opinion.

 

He has had good chances, i don't see how there's any denying of that. It's these people who have said he has brilliant movement and this brilliant strikers instinct who are just plain wrong in my opinion, simply looking at his form this season. If he did have all those things, he'd have converted the chances he's been given.

 

What top class striker MUST have every single ball played to him on a plate? Like i've said, if he was a really good striker, then he'd converted the half-to-good chances that he's had.

 

EDIT: Your opinion might be different to mine, but looking through what i've said in this thread, i really can't find anything that's strikingly unfair. But like i said, it's all opinions.

[The College Dropout]

Anelka, Bent & Johnson have all scored bucket loads for struggling teams.

 

the service is poor but he's had some chances that he should have scored.

 

How many top class strikers are as dependant on "service" as Owen.