Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 He cuts infield a lot and does his best work there if you ask me, he carries the ball so well due to good dribbling technique and is very strong on and off the ball. He could be our "beast" of a midfielder in midfield, able to pass it, run with it, join attack and float too. He's good on the wing of course but I feel he'll soon get doubled up on down the flank and space is at a premium down there at times. If anyone watched Match of the Day 2 last night Lee Dixon gave a good analysis of Petrov's wing play against West Ham and while it was good from an attacking point of view, defensively the clips showed the way to defend against him, you simply cut him off and cover the space behind. Do that and as quick and as good as he is you nullify his game. The same applies to Jonas. Centrally is a different proposition though, you can't just square someone off in midfield, its much harder to do, especially to someone as leggy and as strong as he is, on the ball and off it again. He has the athleticism for that role. Could be an interesting switch in the same way Owen from up top to deeper proved. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 If we dont sign someone to do it then yes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 PS against Valencia, Man Utd and Bolton some of his best moments came from picking the ball up outside our box and running and running huge distances through the middle to the opposition penalty box. We badly lack that in midfield, he just opens up that whole area. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 We've nobody as good to play wide in his absence. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Should be played where Owen was played last season.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 He cuts infield a lot and does his best work there if you ask me, he carries the ball so well due to good dribbling technique and is very strong on and off the ball. He could be our "beast" of a midfielder in midfield, able to pass it, run with it, join attack and float too. He's good on the wing of course but I feel he'll soon get doubled up on down the flank and space is at a premium down there at times. If anyone watched Match of the Day 2 last night Lee Dixon gave a good analysis of Petrov's wing play against West Ham and while it was good from an attacking point of view, defensively the clips showed the way to defend against him, you simply cut him off and cover the space behind. Do that and as quick and as good as he is you nullify his game. The same applies to Jonas. Centrally is a different proposition though, you can't just square someone off in midfield, its much harder to do, especially to someone as leggy and as strong as he is, on the ball and off it again. He has the athleticism for that role. Could be an interesting switch in the same way Owen from up top to deeper proved. Might be like that for Petrov, but Jonas has shown that he can use both feet equally well and can cut inside effectively if his route down the wing is blocked up. He can attack through the middle as you describe without having him positionally assigned there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 no Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hikickry Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 If we dont sign someone to do it then yes we will sign someone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 We've nobody as good to play wide in his absence. I've been thinking of a 5 man midfield with N'Zogbia and Martins on the left and right, Guthrie sitting as the anchor, Owen playing at the tip of midfield, just off a mobile centre-forward who can play across the width of the pitch and Jonas in there centrally driving on from midfield, carrying that ball. Would involve some degree of fluidity to work like but KK did once say that good footballers in the right frame of mind can play anywhere as long as there is a mutual understanding between everyone. I mean Beardsley once played centrally from midfield and to good effect, he also played wide at times too. Shearer and Ferdinand were similar players and despite their own belief I don't think they were a great partnership as it wasn't how they played, they were just good footballers who both complimented the overal team, rather than one another. --- Guthrie --- Martins ---- Jonas ---- N'Zogbia | ------ Owen ------ | <----- Mobile CF -----> People will see that and think what about defending, but there is enough work rate, cleverness and pace and legs in there to help the defence out, plus Guthrie's role will be purely to pick the ball up off the back-four, spray it about, and sit and protect, kind of the last man like on corners, waiting just incase the ball comes back out. Could work IMO. Martins isn't someone to play on the last man, his strengths are ball carrying, twisting and turning and cutting in, same with N'Zogbia. Jonas and Owen would cause havoc deep, Owen with his running and positioning, Jonas with his energy, drive, close control and ball carrying skills. Then a mobiole CF to operate the width of the final third with skills to play with his back to goal, a focal point to ping the ball to and from for the foursome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EthiGeordie Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 To Agree on that we need a good solid Left back and Defesive midfelder so that he can roam around freely. With the current stricker crises I would play him as a second Stricker. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alberto2005 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 No, I think he's most effective on the wing where he can use his blistering pace, he wouldn't be able to do it as often from attacking midfield. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Absolutely not, his attacking game is built around the ability to run with the ball and there is no place better to do that than out wide. He also alows us to be stronger defensively by giving cover to the fullback. He's great out wide, I just wouldn't mess with that. If we need some creative spark in midfield, and we do, then buy it, fitting square pegs into round holes rarely works. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 No, I think he's most effective on the wing where he can use his blistering pace, he wouldn't be able to do it as often from attacking midfield. Totally agree. Really don't see the fascination on here with people wanting wingers through the middle. Last year people were talking about playing N'Zogbia in the centre, you see people wanting to see Milner in there, and now Gutierrez. Here's a novel idea, let's play wingers on the wing, if they're not good enough, drop or sell, and sign an actual centre-midfielder instead. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrette Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 No, I think he's most effective on the wing where he can use his blistering pace, he wouldn't be able to do it as often from attacking midfield. This. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 No, I think he's most effective on the wing where he can use his blistering pace, he wouldn't be able to do it as often from attacking midfield. I think he's better on the ball than off it. I don't think he's that type of player, i.e. Petrov to use pace to run into space, go past players etc. He's a dribbler, a ball carrier who needs to be on the ball and involved with it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colocho Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I don't think he's strong enough, or good enough in the air to play in the centre. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 A lot is going to depend on who we buy, three players would be a DCM to replace Butt, a new LB to replace Enrique and another striker. If KK is planning on a Owen & Martins Partnership then you can bet Jonas will be on the wing, Guthrie and a new players in the middle. Jonas-----Guthrie------? ? ?--------Zoggy ----------Owen---------Martins Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 No, I think he's most effective on the wing where he can use his blistering pace, he wouldn't be able to do it as often from attacking midfield. Totally agree. Really don't see the fascination on here with people wanting wingers through the middle. Last year people were talking about playing N'Zogbia in the centre, you see people wanting to see Milner in there, and now Gutierrez. Here's a novel idea, let's play wingers on the wing, if they're not good enough, drop or sell, and sign an actual centre-midfielder instead. Like I said he's good on the wing, but wing play requires a partner more often than not and good balls, I'd just hate to see this top player NOT be involved for long periods, which will happen. Its all good and well saying he can just cut in then, but what about shape, discipline and such? When you see him running centrally zig-zagging challenges and space just opening up over 40-60 yard distances as he did against Valencia, Man Utd and Bolton - all his best moments - I just think wow, we could be missing a trick here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I'd play him and Barton either side of Guthrie in a 4-3-1-2 if everyone was fit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I don't think he's strong enough, or good enough in the air to play in the centre. As a striker? I don't think he's a striker or even a support striker. Strikers are about space, timing and working an opponent positionally more often than not, he'd be wasted up there as he's an action many type player who needs to be running at players, dribbling, tackling and just being involved in the thick of it. Giving and going too whioch he does a lot of. I love that in a player. Too many get the ball, give it and retreat back or just stay where they first received the ball. Hate that, movement is essential to working the ball and opposition. Staticity is easily defended. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I'd play him and Barton either side of Guthrie in a 4-3-1-2 if everyone was fit. We did well with that kind of system towards the end of last season but I though Barton and Butt slowed us down too much which was most noticeable against Pompey away where had we had a quicker more urgent midfield, we'd have swamped them. Jonas in there obviously adds drive and pace to the system but its only one part. Personally I'd keep Barton as far away from the starting lineup as I could as I don't think he's what we need nor good enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRC Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 No Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Why mess with what's working? He's excellent on the left, leave him there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 ------------------? ? ? -----Guthrie---------------Zoggy---- -----------------Jonas ---------Owen----------Oba Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Why mess with what's working? He's excellent on the left, leave him there. He's good on the left but better when he comes infield in my opinion, we look stronger centrally when he does that. This is when Bolton started to lose their compactness at the weekend, I thought they contained him well out wide, although it allowed N'Zogbia more freedom, but whenever he came centrally he caused them problems. He was through before he got cut down and towards the end of the game he carried the ball infield and towards their right flank, before slipping Geremi in with a peach of a weighted pass between the centre-back and full-back and to top it off he didn't stop there, after passing he made his way to the edge of their box. I see that and again think, we could be missing a trick here. Of course this is all theoretical but its nice to be able to ask such questions of our players and indeed manager as we know KK is one for such things, rather than Owen vs Martins round 102 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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