Joint Statement from "The Mag" and "True Faith".

[PRL]

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

I'm pretty sure if i'd seen Alisdair Darling dancing on a stage in the States surrounded by morons looking for 5 minutes of fame whilst Northern Rock collapsed i'd have every right to be pissed off and you would be too, no?

[Theregulars]

As much as I loved Keegan here, and I hate Dennis Wise not because of his London background but because he was a nasty rat turd of a player, I find myself agreeing with their transfer policy. I love Keegan's ambition to get us going again very quickly by spending huge amounts, but that's a risky strategy, it's not guaranteed and there are not that many bottomless pits of wealth. Abramovich and City aside, it's still a rarity. Ashley isn't a limitless source of money. He has had the club analysed from a business point of view, and thanks to Shepherd we were going down the toilet. If ensuring that this doesn't happen means slow building and buying lesser known, still talented players then I hate to disagree with Keegan but I do - I agree that it's wrong to do so behind his back, if that's the case then he had every right to fight back, and Wise is an odious twat as it is. But if Keegan thinks we can just throw a ton of money and buy huge name players then he's sorely mistaken. I am behind the board's attempts to offload Smith and Barton. I understand Keegan wanting to keep them as the squad was not big enough, and I am also in support of those who argue that the board has not adequately addressed the issue of our thin squad. However, we need to build slowly to achieve in the future.

 

I don't despise Ashley, I think some of his actions are ill-informed and infuriating, but if anything I'm intrigued to see what his next move is. I think we are now being run as a business, as Ashley's business, but what's going to make him the most money? Buying young players and selling them on and alienating fans or slowly building a strong wide with prospects of success in the future? Our success = his financial success. He's not a tit, he knows that. While his methods are not popular at the minute, hate him or not Wise has bought some good young players to this club. The squad's still thin but it's better than it has been for a while. There are issues they need to resolve - Owen's contract for starters, as well as improving communication with the fans, not least securing a mutually acceptable and forward-thinking manager - but at this point to say we are relegation fodder and going down the toilet is unnecessary. If nobody gets hired for a while, we lose our next 5 games, players want to leave and nobody else is signed up in January, then I'll join in saying I have no faith in this set up whatsoever. As it is now, we have bought in 6 players who have made our squad look significantly more useful, although we've lost a manager we loved and trusted. There is clearly a downside and upside to the situation. I won't go to Shearer's Bar or buy club merchandise because it's a pile of shit anyway, the only thing I want is me shirt which I will continue to wear with pride at all games and everytime I play footy, and I agree with letting the board know that we are concerned with progress. But I'm prepared to wait until the new manager is bedded in and see how the team is playing. Who knows, in a few years, Wise's transfer policy could see us in the Champions League, you just don't know. I hate what they did to Keegan as much as the next man, I hate that he's not our manager. But I love Newcastle United more than both of those feelings.

[ChezGiven]

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

I'm pretty sure if i'd seen Alisdair Darling dancing on a stage in the States surrounded by morons looking for 5 minutes of fame whilst Northern Rock collapsed i'd have every right to be pissed off and you would be too, no?

 

Great post pete 

[PRL]

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

I'm pretty sure if i'd seen Alisdair Darling dancing on a stage in the States surrounded by morons looking for 5 minutes of fame whilst Northern Rock collapsed i'd have every right to be pissed off and you would be too, no?

 

Great post pete 

 

I'd actually started a long response to your main post but work got in the way unfortunately... I shall resume asap!

[TRon]

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

I'm pretty sure if i'd seen Alisdair Darling dancing on a stage in the States surrounded by morons looking for 5 minutes of fame whilst Northern Rock collapsed i'd have every right to be pissed off and you would be too, no?

 

Great post pete 

 

It strikes me that Ashley spends a lot of his time getting his jollies in while delegating the work to his minions. I don't particularly like Ashley, Jiminez  or Wise but Ashley is the owner and the other two on the surface at least, look very capable in their jobs. The big cock up has been trying to fit Kevin Keegan into all this and in hindsight it was a bad choice considering the direction they wanted to go in. 

[Guest]

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

I'm pretty sure if i'd seen Alisdair Darling dancing on a stage in the States surrounded by morons looking for 5 minutes of fame whilst Northern Rock collapsed i'd have every right to be pissed off and you would be too, no?

 

Great post pete 

 

I'd actually started a long response to your main post but work got in the way unfortunately... I shall resume asap!

 

Apart from the fact NUFC hasn't collapsed...it's manager walked out.

[toptoon]

I support the statement of 'True Faith' and 'The Mag'. Since i'm not a season ticket holder, i'm not going to any more games either, until i'm alot happier (i suspect this maybe until Ashley and Wise go). I do not support Ashley's decision's (i'm livid actually) Dennis f***ing Wise director of football?? So all i can do is boycott and vocally protest about what they have done. If i had a season ticket and coulden't get my money back i'd go to the game and protest. One person doesn't make a difference but i'm sure when tens of thousands don't turn up and the tens of thousands that do hurl abuse at you and the value of your 200m+ investment starts shrinking they WILL be forced to think long and hard about what to do next.

 

Ashley and Wise seem interested in making money out of us and that is it.

 

I trust keegan, i certainly do not trust Ashley, Wise or LLambias. I hope someone buys them out and reinstalls Keegan. If Ashley, wise and co appoints someone who is a roaring success, then i'll have to admit i'm wrong and i certainly will do. But for now i really think they have f***ed up big time and i am not going to be hypocritical about it and support them in any way shape or form, especially financially.  Our future under this regime looks very very bad. Relegation is now a possibility as the players must be affected by this. At best i see us mid table mediocrity.

 

Its almost like they are taking the piss and want to piss us off.   

[NE5]

Although Colo is no Anton Ferdinand.

 

this must  be official.

 

Baggio is head of the Dennis Wise fan club.

 

Looking forward to Dennis matching what the club did under the despicable fat bastard.

 

What do you say ? They have a DOF ? Oh well, thats alright then. That means we are guarenteed to win everything going. SSHHHH........don't tell anybody else our little secret

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

still on Ashleys side of this are we, because he likes this DOF system you have long championed ?

 

By the way, I replied to your comments to me about Alan Smith, waiting for your response.

 

You're a smart lad, it isn't like you to opt out of this sort of thing and put these silly smiley things instead .........

 

 

[NE5]

NE5 back to old tricks I see.

 

getting a response from you Melanie 

 

The thread was a decent debate, but it's hit a brick wall because people are defending Ashley who is pretty indefensible now

 

 

[cp40]

Although Colo is no Anton Ferdinand.

 

this must  be official.

 

Baggio is head of the Dennis Wise fan club.

 

Looking forward to Dennis matching what the club did under the despicable fat b******.

 

What do you say ? They have a DOF ? Oh well, thats alright then. That means we are guarenteed to win everything going. SSHHHH........don't tell anybody else our little secret

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

still on Ashleys side of this are we, because he likes this DOF system you have long championed ?

 

By the way, I replied to your comments to me about Alan Smith, waiting for your response.

 

You're a smart lad, it isn't like you to opt out of this sort of thing and put these silly smiley things instead .........

 

 

 

 

seems to me there will be a lot of ashley supporters waving smilies at the match on saturday, no?

[Baggio]

Although Colo is no Anton Ferdinand.

 

this must  be official.

 

Baggio is head of the Dennis Wise fan club.

 

Looking forward to Dennis matching what the club did under the despicable fat bastard.

 

What do you say ? They have a DOF ? Oh well, thats alright then. That means we are guarenteed to win everything going. SSHHHH........don't tell anybody else our little secret

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

still on Ashleys side of this are we, because he likes this DOF system you have long championed ?

 

By the way, I replied to your comments to me about Alan Smith, waiting for your response.

 

You're a smart lad, it isn't like you to opt out of this sort of thing and put these silly smiley things instead .........

 

 

 

[PRL]

As promised, this may take a while as getting rinsed at work today, so apologies if about 1000 posts have preceded since i started this...

 

 

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

I'll stick with the political analogy. Chancellor and Prime Minister (in the case of Gordon Brown, his role as both) live and die by their decisions. At the next election it's likely that Brown will get trounced as a result of his actions in both roles and I have no sympathy for him whatsoever. What makes the difference here is I can vote and essentially select a better option / punish him for his bad management. He should be held accountable and it isn't a long way apart to blame - If you are accountable for something it is your responsibility, if something that is your responsibility goes tits up you must shoulder part of the blame. To use a different analogy, if the guy who works for me puts some numbers together today and i fail to check them because i'm otherwise engaged on here, my boss is still going to be pissed with me, even though i didn't do the work, as it's my responsibility to check anything under my remit is correct. We're not talking a small admin matter here, we're talking about the loss of one of the key 'resources' of our 'business' (i hate describing football in such a way but seems it's the way it's going). Yes, Ashley must delegate, but when there is something that could have a massive impact on his business occurring, he needs to be on ground level and be involved. Either this did not happen, which makes Ashley incredibly negligent as a businessman and shows he grossly misread Keegan, or the information about what was going on wasn't communicated correctly, in which case the head of who is responsible must roll (my guess Llambias, but that's all it is, a guess), this has not happened, or he knew exactly what was happening and thought 'i know, i'll go out and get wasted and splashed about the papers, that'll go down a treat with all my customers'. None of those options really show him in the best light and i can understand why a lot of people are pissed.

 

He's also tried to be 'one of the boys', which is of no concern at all to me, but if he wants to act like that then he can't turn round when he fucks up and expect people to then see him as a disconnected owner. Facts are he told us KK was in charge of transfers, there was a decent budget available for players KK wanted and that he was here to have fun. What has happened would be very few people's idea of fun in this last week and people feel betrayed. Rightly or wrongly, they're going to be pissed off.

 

 

 

They also tried to keep hold of Keegan and offered talks to try and sort out the differences. Clearly they didnt want him to leave, or realised their mistake.

 

I really believe everyone's energy and focus should be on ousting Wise and not Ashley and i say this for some very important reasons. If ashley's position becomes untenable he will sell the club. Really. That means a new owner. In this case, we should all have a look at the history of the past 2 years and remember what happened the last time the club was sold and how that turned out.

 

Who will look to buy a club from a beleagured chairman being forced to quit the club? Long term investors looking to plough 200m into the club? That means they have 0.5bn at their disposal now? They would have bought it already if it was for sale.

 

 

I think Wise wouldn't actually be enough now. I don't honestly think that Wise going would have any impact on the backroom set up and most people have said they want a manager in charge of buying and selling with a scouting team helping him track down purchases. It's clear 'the system' has won out and a lot people don't want the DoF in charge of transfers, which it appears is the case. Wise would just be replaced and unless it was someone very special people wouldn't accept who came in.

 

A lot of people will be looking at the club exactly because the owner is beleagured and being forced out. It's not like it's an irrational reaction, Ashley made one of the mother of all fuck ups in his handling of this situation, it would be pretty difficult for anyone to repeat! I think many less eccentric owners wouldn't be put off. They'd be mad to reappoint Keegan though, I agree on that. They would realise they could come in on a tidal wave of goodwill and providing they used some sense could make a real difference.

 

 

 

I reckon the likes of Belgravia (one director dead in mysterious circumstances, the other now in prison??) who were after us at the same time as Ashley would be the type of candidates looking to opportunistically take the club at a low price.

 

Some of you have the seen the club change hands more than once, but the lesson of the last time is be very careful what you wish for. Its is fatuous and stupid to think that 'the trend has been set in the next 2 years all prem clubs will be owned by mulit-billionaires, get ashley out and its inevitable we will be the next man city' Thats the logic of a 6 year old on christmas eve.

 

Interesting about Belgravia - did not know that.

 

You do need to be careful what you wish for, but then i don't think it's totally absurd to think we'd be a great target for a buyout by a mega-rich type. I mean, Man City were hardly in a good position, with a fugitive owner and a history of recent instability. Not saying it will happen, but i'm a gambling man and right now i'd twist rather than stick.

 

 

The voices of those who released the press release should be heard and it should be made very clear that the fans are fucked off with the running of the club. However, untill its clear that the alternative is 'potentially better' (lets face it, the experience of the last year shoud have shown everyone you can never tell), then focus the energy against those who caused this situation. Ashley is not that man. I say that on the basis of my experience of managing large organisations.

 

 

Again, if you have experience of managing large organisations then would you let possibly the most important staff member quit without even tracking them down and meeting them? Without even coming back to the country? Would your boss not be really annoyed with you if you did this? I also think this whole organisation / business thing for a football club is a misnomer. Not all businesses, in fact very few, have the community aspect of a football club and particularly Newcastle United. Ashley said he wanted to buy into the passion of the fans, he either lied or didn't get it at all.

 

 

When it becomes clear that there is a better alternative then good work can be done applying pressure for him to sell if thats what people want. Until then i think all this is counter-productive and will do nothing but exacerbate the soul-destroying and pointless relationship between the club and the media. The circus is in town and is staying basically.

 

P.S. Merlin comparing the situation to Hitler and Nazi Germany just shows how out of perspective and out of touch from reality some people are

 

20,000 on the waiting list? Aye, when the ground held 36,000 but dont let reality get in the way.

 

 

When it becomes clear there's a  better alternative?! Will Anil Ambani / A N other Billionaire send an email to nufconline saying "hey lads, interested in investing some major wedge, now be good lads and get down and cause Ashley some bother"?! Virtually all recent takeovers have come totally out the blue, Chelsea and Man City especially, we don't have any idea what is potentially out there and how much impact some pressure now could have. As i said earlier, with the government there is a voting system in place to voice your displeasure; we don't have that luxury - if people want to protest in a legal manner and show their displeasure all power to them. Making a stand can make a difference and if it wasn't for those 'mongs' outside SJP last week i don't think any effort would have been made to get Keegan back. We all have different feelings as to whether protest can work positively, i feel in this case it can. Fingers crossed people get themselves organised, do it right and make a positive impact.

 

 

 

 

 

[PRL]

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

I'm pretty sure if i'd seen Alisdair Darling dancing on a stage in the States surrounded by morons looking for 5 minutes of fame whilst Northern Rock collapsed i'd have every right to be pissed off and you would be too, no?

 

Great post pete 

 

I'd actually started a long response to your main post but work got in the way unfortunately... I shall resume asap!

 

Apart from the fact NUFC hasn't collapsed...it's manager walked out.

 

Err yes, but the analogy was the Chancellor - Northern Rock crashing wasn't the equivalent of the entire financial network crashing, it was just a major component of his overall sphere of responsibility going ass up, as Keegan leaving NUFC was to Ashley. We still have an economy as we still have NUFC

[NE5]

Where was it stated by the club that all transfers were Keegan's choices? I personally was always under the understanding that Wise and co chose the players and KK just gave it his blessing which is what Keegan himself said. So if you're gonna blame people for this false pretense then Keegan is just as guilty as anyone.

 

Oh, come on, this should be common knowledge by now.

 

ASHLEY tells how he wants players with heart and passion for the club and that there is money for Keegan to spend.

 

“Yes, there is. If the deal is right – and that means it’s the right player who Kevin wants – then we will do that deal.

 

That's from the interview in that club magazine, hardly a press smear. Two lines, two fraudulent claims to make people buy season tickets.

 

The way it's worded still suggests that the players are being brought to Keegan and he's just giving his blessing to it rather than it being someone he's picked himself. After all who is deeming someone 'the right player' if it's not Keegan?

 

 

erm, Dennis Wise, Tony Jiminez.

 

Mike Ashley might not hve done that much wrong before hand, but by f*** is he making up for that now. It looks like he's trying to outdo Shepherd in the 'how to make the club look stupid' stakes.

 

Like the shirt idea.    

 

incredible statement.

 

I find it hard to believe that some numpties still don't put some value against a period where only 4 teams qualified for europe more than us

 

Credibility destroyed.

 

Shame we didn't even qualify for the intertoto with such a massively, massively better owner.

 

 

 

 

 

You've done it again, haven't you? It like an illness.

 

Before you go announcing my numptiness and destroying my credibility to everyone, try and sit back and relax. And read this.

 

What I was tring to get at was that just about everytime Shepherd opened his mouth in the press he made a complete prick of the club, just like Ashley is doing at the moment, in fact, it's as if Shepherd has never been away the only difference being that the club aren't embarrassing us with interviews, but written statments instead.

 

At no point in that post did I compare on field events (although if you were going to, you could only do over the same time period, not after ONE YEAR).

 

So to be honest with you, I can't see why I've been labelled a numpty for that post, unless you're saying that Shepherd didn't embarrass us in the press? The only other thing I can think of, is that you mis-read the post due to your head being stuck up Uncle Freddies arse and released one of your pro-Shepherd outbursts without thinking.

 

Can you let me know when my credibility has been restored?

 

its quite simple. I don't agree he embarrassed "us" half as much as people make out. I think people like you, probably, just more or less decided you were going to be embarrassed when he said stuff to the press, whether you were or not.

 

He embarrassed himself a few times, sure, but not at any time did I personally give a toss, nobody laughed at "me" and nobody even noticed hardly any of these so called "embarrassing things" anyway. By the way, I don't live in the area, so plenty of people could have took the piss if they had been the slightest bit interested.

 

As it happens, quite a lot of people in the past week have made comments about the club to me, and every single person bar one has said that Ashley is a prick, has behaved like a prick and only one person made the "Keegans walked again" comment.

 

The point I make about being "embarrassed", is this -  nothing, nothing has ever embarrassed me as much as supporting a team that sold its best players, spent years in the 2nd division, and was ritually humiliated for 20 years or so in the FA Cup and the League Cup by teams from lower divisions.

 

If anything, over the past 10-15 years, I have never met so many people who have been jealous of us and even liked us so much.

 

Thats true. I'm sorry if you disagree, or are imagining something else has happened, if you live in the area. I can assure you that your perception of people outside the area is largely incorrect.

 

I probably didn't mean the credibility comment, and you have my apologies for that, but this post is telling you precisely, in my experience, how I have found fans of other clubs all over the country, over many years, have viewed us as a football club.

 

 

[NE5]

Although Colo is no Anton Ferdinand.

 

this must  be official.

 

Baggio is head of the Dennis Wise fan club.

 

Looking forward to Dennis matching what the club did under the despicable fat bastard.

 

What do you say ? They have a DOF ? Oh well, thats alright then. That means we are guarenteed to win everything going. SSHHHH........don't tell anybody else our little secret

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

still on Ashleys side of this are we, because he likes this DOF system you have long championed ?

 

By the way, I replied to your comments to me about Alan Smith, waiting for your response.

 

You're a smart lad, it isn't like you to opt out of this sort of thing and put these silly smiley things instead .........

 

 

 

 

oh dear.

 

I'm pleased you've enjoyed the events of the past week, just what you wanted.

 

 

[Syrette]

Loads of people noticed these "so- called embarrassing things". The dogs/Mary Poppins comment was front page news if I recall correctly.

[Baggio]

Although Colo is no Anton Ferdinand.

 

this must  be official.

 

Baggio is head of the Dennis Wise fan club.

 

Looking forward to Dennis matching what the club did under the despicable fat bastard.

 

What do you say ? They have a DOF ? Oh well, thats alright then. That means we are guarenteed to win everything going. SSHHHH........don't tell anybody else our little secret

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

still on Ashleys side of this are we, because he likes this DOF system you have long championed ?

 

By the way, I replied to your comments to me about Alan Smith, waiting for your response.

 

You're a smart lad, it isn't like you to opt out of this sort of thing and put these silly smiley things instead .........

 

 

 

 

oh dear.

 

I'm pleased you've enjoyed the events of the past week, just what you wanted.

 

 

 

:lol:

[Alberto2005]

mackems.gif

[NE5]

Although Colo is no Anton Ferdinand.

 

this must  be official.

 

Baggio is head of the Dennis Wise fan club.

 

Looking forward to Dennis matching what the club did under the despicable fat b******.

 

What do you say ? They have a DOF ? Oh well, thats alright then. That means we are guarenteed to win everything going. SSHHHH........don't tell anybody else our little secret

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

still on Ashleys side of this are we, because he likes this DOF system you have long championed ?

 

By the way, I replied to your comments to me about Alan Smith, waiting for your response.

 

You're a smart lad, it isn't like you to opt out of this sort of thing and put these silly smiley things instead .........

 

 

 

 

seems to me there will be a lot of ashley supporters waving smilies at the match on saturday, no?

 

I don't think I know what you mean, but if I'm guessing right, then I've said earlier and elsewhere that this is the first time a manager has walked out on the club for lacking ambition and not supporting him since 1985, and the first time supporters have talked about boycotting the club since the 1970's and 1980's too.

 

Thats true. The very fact that no single person who is too young to contradict it, proves it.

 

Blimey. Why does it always come back to this .......

 

Read it and absorb it.

 

 

[NE5]

Loads of people noticed these "so- called embarrassing things". The dogs/Mary Poppins comment was front page news if I recall correctly.

 

Well, if Alan Shearer wasn't bothered, I don't see why you should be.

 

Sensitive soul.

 

 

[NE5]

mackems.gif

 

sensible discussion beyond you too ?

 

dear me.

 

 

[dinotheprehistoricgeordie]

im with them, all the way.

 

Take a stand for what you believe in,

 

or behave like scared sheep like the club wants.

 

 

 

The sheep tend to be the majority, people voicing their doubts about this action are not sheep in the slightest as they are going to be in for abuse.

[ChezGiven]

Pete, the point about accountability was to emphasise whether people should be directing their anger at Ashley or elsewhere. Ashley is accountable for what happened, doesnt mean he made it happen.

 

I'm not sure people are against the DoF position per se, i think they are 'against Keegan leaving the club' and that is it.

 

I do have experience of managing larger organisations and therefore know that they cannot work unless everybody is aligned around the strategy. If one of my people was working against the business strategy, i'd fire them at the first opportunity. Not sure thats what happened here either.

 

As for the last point, basing your potentially destructive decisions on the idea that we are bound to be next up for a multi-billionaire takeover is, i'm afraid, just like a 6 year old shouting 'Santa IS coming'. If Santa does exist, then believe me, it wont make a blind bit of difference what the fans think, say or do, or what the owner says or does (only what he thinks). If he does exist, they will buy the club no matter what goes on in pie shops around the ground.

[PRL]

Pete, the point about accountability was to emphasise whether people should be directing their anger at Ashley or elsewhere. Ashley is accountable for what happened, doesnt mean he made it happen.

 

I'm not sure people are against the DoF position per se, i think they are 'against Keegan leaving the club' and that is it.

 

I do have experience of managing larger organisations and therefore know that they cannot work unless everybody is aligned around the strategy. If one of my people was working against the business strategy, i'd fire them at the first opportunity. Not sure thats what happened here either.

 

As for the last point, basing your potentially destructive decisions on the idea that we are bound to be next up for a multi-billionaire takeover is, i'm afraid, just like a 6 year old shouting 'Santa IS coming'. If Santa does exist, then believe me, it wont make a blind bit of difference what the fans think, say or do, or what the owner says or does (only what he thinks). If he does exist, they will buy the club no matter what goes on in pie shops around the ground.

 

Wooo! I thought no one was going to reply, all the effort would have been wasted!

 

Ashley may not have made it happen, but he could sure as hell done more to stop it - again, good enough reason to be pissed off if you ask me. He's also at the top of the tree, like it or not the person at the top will always get external shit directed at them, then they'll run it downhill to those below them internally - worked my fair share in some pretty beasting organisations and have first hand experience of that.

 

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on the reason for people's continued anger. Of course, Keegan being Keegan has made a massive difference, but the concerns run far beyond that (well, to me and a lot of people on here at least) and relate to the entire set up at the club and the way it's been run these last few weeks, and potentially a long time since.

 

I'd hope if one of your key staff members wasn't aligned to strategy but you were working client site and knew he was very important to maintaining relations with client and customers then you would at least try to sit down face to face with the person in question and attempt to discuss the issue and compromise. Even if you could not do so then at least you'd shake hands at the end, say no hard feelings and not dredge it up with the client next time you speak, especially if you knew that the staff member who was leaving had really cared about the company itself and the client you were working for and the feeling was mutual. (Stretching this analogy now i realise).

 

Your last statement totally contradicts your statement in your previous post:

 

 

When it becomes clear that there is a better alternative then good work can be done applying pressure for him to sell if thats what people want

 

 

Either you can make a difference or you can't?

 

Peace out

 

 

[Mick]

Had no idea where to put this, here seems appropriate but i apologise if it doesnt flow from previous posts in this thread. Just some thoughts on the appropriateness of directing anger at Ashley.

 

I'm having real difficulty understanding what drives this blind frothing hatred of Ashley.

 

He's been tight in the transfer market, Freddy was better at understanding when to loosen the purse strings but all he did was say 'get on with it' to his management team months ago and stepped away from the day to day. Big mistake but then the problem was with Wise and not Ashley. Ashley should take the flak in the same way that the Chancellor of the exchequer should take the flak for the economy. Wise was the spurious lender, the driving force behind the creidt crunch, Ashley was far removed from the real problem but of course should be held 'accountable'. Accountability and blame are often a long way apart.

 

They also tried to keep hold of Keegan and offered talks to try and sort out the differences. Clearly they didnt want him to leave, or realised their mistake.

 

I really believe everyone's energy and focus should be on ousting Wise and not Ashley and i say this for some very important reasons. If ashley's position becomes untenable he will sell the club. Really. That means a new owner. In this case, we should all have a look at the history of the past 2 years and remember what happened the last time the club was sold and how that turned out.

 

Who will look to buy a club from a beleagured chairman being forced to quit the club? Long term investors looking to plough 200m into the club? That means they have 0.5bn at their disposal now? They would have bought it already if it was for sale.

 

I reckon the likes of Belgravia (one director dead in mysterious circumstances, the other now in prison??) who were after us at the same time as Ashley would be the type of candidates looking to opportunistically take the club at a low price.

 

Some of you have the seen the club change hands more than once, but the lesson of the last time is be very careful what you wish for. Its is fatuous and stupid to think that 'the trend has been set in the next 2 years all prem clubs will be owned by mulit-billionaires, get ashley out and its inevitable we will be the next man city' Thats the logic of a 6 year old on christmas eve.

 

The voices of those who released the press release should be heard and it should be made very clear that the fans are f***ed off with the running of the club. However, untill its clear that the alternative is 'potentially better' (lets face it, the experience of the last year shoud have shown everyone you can never tell), then focus the energy against those who caused this situation. Ashley is not that man. I say that on the basis of my experience of managing large organisations.

 

When it becomes clear that there is a better alternative then good work can be done applying pressure for him to sell if thats what people want. Until then i think all this is counter-productive and will do nothing but exacerbate the soul-destroying and pointless relationship between the club and the media. The circus is in town and is staying basically.

 

P.S. Merlin comparing the situation to Hitler and Nazi Germany just shows how out of perspective and out of touch from reality some people are

 

20,000 on the waiting list? Aye, when the ground held 36,000 but dont let reality get in the way.

 

 

Good post Chez, the only problem I have with it is about Ashley wanting to speak to Keegan, I've been told that Keegan received a letter inviting him to a meeting with Llambias, the letter stated that the transfer policy would not be changed to give him a veto on transfers but they were willing to talk to him.  That sounds like a one way conversation to me.